Highest DPS as a Sorc

BigTone

So, what is the highest single target dps achieved by a sorc? Ran AA with some friends last week and pulled some good numbers. I'm posting a screen shot of my dps against the storm atro. It was only about a 35 second fight, and I had the bonus of a group member running elemental drain. Post some screen shots of 30 second or longer fights, and see if you could beat mine. [img][/img]

byrom101b16_ESO

It has been said so many times now - but you must have missed them.

WHAT is the point of posting sub 1 minute fight dps meters where the vast majority of your damage comes from Overload.

... and you are using a pet in a Trial...

That would make you the only one doing it pretty much.

BigTone

The point is doing damage
I want to see how my output with overload compares to others. Maybe there is something they are doing to get higher numbers than I am and I can learn from them. I usually don't run pets, but figured for this it would add a little damage while not taking away from my overload attacks.

byrom101b16_ESO

I don't like these kinds of posts because they feed the easily-led the lie that Sorc dps is competitive in PvE when it isn't.

However, for better results swap your toggleosaurs for Entropy and Velocitous Curse, and if someone else isn't running Elemental Drain - remember to apply it yourself for the boost to your elemental damage numbers, although it looks from those numbers as if they are.

BigTone

I agree with you that sorc pve dps doesn't compare to others. If you look at the leaderboards ther are very few sorcs near the top. I took off entropy and used spell power pots instead. The way I look at it every entropy could have been an overload attack. I really hope that they increse sorc dps somehow. Having a set that boosts lightning damage would help a lot. Not right that fire gets boosts from class passives, racial passives, and many set bonuses.

byrom101b16_ESO

BigTone wrote: »

I agree with you that sorc pve dps doesn't compare to others. If you look at the leaderboards ther are very few sorcs near the top. I took off entropy and used spell power pots instead. The way I look at it every entropy could have been an overload attack. I really hope that they increse sorc dps somehow. Having a set that boosts lightning damage would help a lot. Not right that fire gets boosts from class passives, racial passives, and many set bonuses.

Yes when you look at the insane prices of vet 12 'of the Sun' gear at the moment it's clear how valued and class-specific that set is.

DKs use a lot of fire and get a dedicated boost from a set, Sorcs use mostly lightning and get squat.

There should be an 'of the Storm' set that has the same stats but +5% lightning damage, and later, if and ever they introduce ice spells, an 'of the Frost' set too.

The_Saint

Overload 29k spindle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhICiLSgp10

BigTone

Oh dayum! Those are some heavy hits.

RoyJade

With a short fight, you can reach very large number, but that mean nothing. Try a sneaky uppercut with the empowered buff (just use magelight before to get it) with rally/surge and bound armament, you'll reach more than 40k dps in less than one sec. It's totally useless.

With less than one minute (like some other people said), a dps is falsified. And even after one minute, if you have less than 50% of your resource, your dps is not very good with less than 15-16k dps.

By the way, I've reached 14k9 against mantikora with aggressive horn and combat prayer. 12k without it.

BigTone

I am by no means saying that this is valid for long end game trials. This is not sustainable for fights like the mage, manticora, and the warrior (although it does have its usage in vet dsa). This is a complete gimmick but I wanted to see what kind of numbers others were posting.

I usually pull 12-14k w/o overload and with great sustain, but can't seem to break that number. That's without combat prayer. I've been trying to talk to other sorcs to see what they are doing to maybe improve my numbers.

byrom101b16_ESO

Every time the sustained dps of sorcerers is talked about, someone jumps on with a short burst Overload video that serves no purpose whatsoever, like it's important...

... and like NB can't beat it...

You'd think it would get old, or maybe they would start to understand sub-1-minute fights are an irrelevance to the issue, but... no...

Alcast

BigTone wrote: »

So, what is the highest single target dps achieved by a sorc? Ran AA with some friends last week and pulled some good numbers. I'm posting a screen shot of my dps against the storm atro. It was only about a 35 second fight, and I had the bonus of a group member running elemental drain. Post some screen shots of 30 second or longer fights, and see if you could beat mine. [img][/img]

With Overlad you can def go higher than 21k, 21k is not bad though.. Are you using Dualwield(Precise/Nirn)+Apprentice Mundus Combo? Will increase your Overload dps again.

That boss usually dies in 10s, seems your friends did a lot less dmg.


Sorc DD in Arena is acutally nice, it is just pretty hard to play.

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

It has been said so many times now - but you must have missed them.

WHAT is the point of posting sub 1 minute fight dps meters where the vast majority of your damage comes from Overload.

... and you are using a pet in a Trial...

That would make you the only one doing it pretty much.

It is actually pretty hard to find Bosses that last longer than 1minute. Only bosses that live long enough are prolly Mantikora, Serpent, Warrior, Mage.



Usually People test DPS on Mantikora.


Then again, people are too much focused on Single Target damage whereas they should focus on AoE. Who gives a f.. if you have 2k less ST but you have 20k more AoE

anitajoneb17_ESO

Alcast wrote: »

Then again, people are too much focused on Single Target damage whereas they should focus on AoE. Who gives a f.. if you have 2k less ST but you have 20k more AoE

True to some extent but still AOE damage is very hard to measure since, basically, it depends on how many mobs you have in your aoe zones. You can double output by just having double mobs without it having anything to do with your build or your rotation. And it's quite hard to reproduce a situation where you have precisely the same number of mobs around.

Where do you guys check your AOE output ? I use the Craglorn scorpions groups but they don't last enough... maybe the group of trash mobs before the Mantikora ?

Alcast

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Then again, people are too much focused on Single Target damage whereas they should focus on AoE. Who gives a f.. if you have 2k less ST but you have 20k more AoE

True to some extent but still AOE damage is very hard to measure since, basically, it depends on how many mobs you have in your aoe zones. You can double output by just having double mobs without it having anything to do with your build or your rotation. And it's quite hard to reproduce a situation where you have precisely the same number of mobs around.

Where do you guys check your AOE output ? I use the Craglorn scorpions groups but they don't last enough... maybe the group of trash mobs before the Mantikora ?

Usually check in Sanctum on trash.

But it is really easy to tell....

Steeltornado 12m range and crits up to 15k dmg.

Impulse 6m (LOL 6m WTF did ZOS think its ridonculous) even with Liquid or eruption not comparable to Steeltornado
Magicka Detonation: 25k crits. Its nice but 1.8s cast time.


high chances that Steeltornado will get a nerf because PvP ppl QQ too much about it doing too much damage. (same that happend to Impulse bc of PvP.)

BigTone

AoE dps is important for Vdsa, but my biggest focus is single target. I am using dual wielding nirn swords, but haven't leveled it high enough to unlock the twin blade and blunt passive.

In the video posted above he is getting some really high numbers, I'm not sure how to get my hits up that high.My unbuffed spell power sits around 2900 and I can't figure out how to get it any higher than that.

Alcast

BigTone wrote: »

AoE dps is important for Vdsa, but my biggest focus is single target. I am using dual wielding nirn swords, but haven't leveled it high enough to unlock the twin blade and blunt passive.

In the video posted above he is getting some really high numbers, I'm not sure how to get my hits up that high.My unbuffed spell power sits around 2900 and I can't figure out how to get it any higher than that.

On that test we used Aggressive Warhorns which boosts your critical damage by 30% + Combat Prayer 8%

EgoRush

Sorcs can do great sustainable DPS still. Overload builds won't last the entire fight, but sorcs can hit 14-16K on Manti/Serpent without Overload. So if they start out with Overload and sustain it for a portion of the fight hitting >20K, then swap to the usual 14-16K rotation when it runs out it will level out to a rather pleasant number. It's kinda like an extra execute period for initial burst damage.

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

BigTone

Alcast wrote: »

On that test we used Aggressive Warhorns which boosts your critical damage by 30% + Combat Prayer 8%

That makes a lot of sense, as I had neither when i did it.

EgoRush wrote: »

Sorcs can do great sustainable DPS still. Overload builds won't last the entire fight, but sorcs can hit 14-16K on Manti/Serpent without Overload. So if they start out with Overload and sustain it for a portion of the fight hitting >20K, then swap to the usual 14-16K rotation when it runs out it will level out to a rather pleasant number. It's kinda like an extra execute period for initial burst damage.

14k seems to be my ceiling. I think my gear is top notch so I just have to work on perfecting my rotations.
My current setup:
4 martial Knowledge
2 Adroitness
2 Cyrodil's Light
2 Worm Cult
2 Toroug's pact swords, nirnhoned
Master fire staff

Unfortunately I don't have pvp buffs atm, so that doesn't help.

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

rokrdt05

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

I don't like these kinds of posts because they feed the easily-led the lie that Sorc dps is competitive in PvE when it isn't.

However, for better results swap your toggleosaurs for Entropy and Velocitous Curse, and if someone else isn't running Elemental Drain - remember to apply it yourself for the boost to your elemental damage numbers, although it looks from those numbers as if they are.

The stereo type that sorcs cannot dps is way 1.5... This is 1.6 and sorcs can hold their own dpsing comparable to any other dps if they have a decent rotation/gear (without Overload).

BigTone wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

On that test we used Aggressive Warhorns which boosts your critical damage by 30% + Combat Prayer 8%

That makes a lot of sense, as I had neither when i did it.

EgoRush wrote: »

Sorcs can do great sustainable DPS still. Overload builds won't last the entire fight, but sorcs can hit 14-16K on Manti/Serpent without Overload. So if they start out with Overload and sustain it for a portion of the fight hitting >20K, then swap to the usual 14-16K rotation when it runs out it will level out to a rather pleasant number. It's kinda like an extra execute period for initial burst damage.

14k seems to be my ceiling. I think my gear is top notch so I just have to work on perfecting my rotations.
My current setup:
4 martial Knowledge
2 Adroitness
2 Cyrodil's Light
2 Worm Cult
2 Toroug's pact swords, nirnhoned
Master fire staff

Unfortunately I don't have pvp buffs atm, so that doesn't help.

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

Your gear is pretty sound. I would suggest swapping out the nirnhoned to precise as the build you are currently rocking as no crit. You will notice better results. I would also recommend putting 1 Elfborn 1 Spell Erosion and the rest into Elemental Expert until you reach 100 and the put 30 points towards Spell Erosion. After that I would start stacking the rest into Elfborn. You can place points into Thaumaturge for pvp as most sorcs use their magic based abilities over their elemental.

Unfortunately I don't have videos of my sorc that are current (still 1.5 stuff) as I am mainly been focusing on my Templar for the same stereo type that they cannot do dps. But seeing forum post like this and the comments it generates makes me want to prove people wrong yet again.

BigTone

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Your gear is pretty sound. I would suggest swapping out the nirnhoned to precise as the build you are currently rocking as no crit. You will notice better results. I would also recommend putting 1 Elfborn 1 Spell Erosion and the rest into Elemental Expert until you reach 100 and the put 30 points towards Spell Erosion. After that I would start stacking the rest into Elfborn. You can place points into Thaumaturge for pvp as most sorcs use their magic based abilities over their elemental.

Unfortunately I don't have videos of my sorc that are current (still 1.5 stuff) as I am mainly been focusing on my Templar for the same stereo type that they cannot do dps. But seeing forum post like this and the comments it generates makes me want to prove people wrong yet again.

I use my sorc for both pvp and pve. I have most of my champ points in elemental expert, but a good amount of them in Thuamaturge for pvp moves like curse, frags, etc. I was torn between precise and nirn, but figured the nirn would be better off. I'll give that a shot and see how it goes. If you do bust out that sorc again, I'd love to see some videos.

violetarc

Interesting thread.
+1 for videos, rokrdt05

rokrdt05

BigTone wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Your gear is pretty sound. I would suggest swapping out the nirnhoned to precise as the build you are currently rocking as no crit. You will notice better results. I would also recommend putting 1 Elfborn 1 Spell Erosion and the rest into Elemental Expert until you reach 100 and the put 30 points towards Spell Erosion. After that I would start stacking the rest into Elfborn. You can place points into Thaumaturge for pvp as most sorcs use their magic based abilities over their elemental.

Unfortunately I don't have videos of my sorc that are current (still 1.5 stuff) as I am mainly been focusing on my Templar for the same stereo type that they cannot do dps. But seeing forum post like this and the comments it generates makes me want to prove people wrong yet again.

I use my sorc for both pvp and pve. I have most of my champ points in elemental expert, but a good amount of them in Thuamaturge for pvp moves like curse, frags, etc. I was torn between precise and nirn, but figured the nirn would be better off. I'll give that a shot and see how it goes. If you do bust out that sorc again, I'd love to see some videos.

Yes, precise (at least in my testing) has produced much better results over Nirn. I think someone said this earlier, but I would remove Entropy in favor of using a Spell Pot instead (Assuming you have the alchemy passive that has it last longer). Right now my sorc is fully specced for PvP (look me up in game if your not DC, always down for duels). I may bring her back into PvE content soon, but can't make any promises... my Templar is just too fun right now.

Though you guys, I do post my dps within my groups chat and we stream our runs on a lot of them. @Moezilla usually will have his stream running during raids at twitch.tv/esomoezilla

So you can always check in and watch and see what's posted.

BigTone

I run DC as well so no duel

I do have the alchemy passive, but there still is about a 5 second period where you will not get the spell power buff. Would you recommend using an alchemy glyph on jewelry or stay with spell power/cost reduction?

When do you guys run? I'd love to check it out, especially considering I always see you near or at the top of the leaderboards.

I've been tempted to run a PvE based alt so I can fully spec my sorc for PvP.

Tankqull

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

rokrdt05

BigTone wrote: »

I run DC as well so no duel

I do have the alchemy passive, but there still is about a 5 second period where you will not get the spell power buff. Would you recommend using an alchemy glyph on jewelry or stay with spell power/cost reduction?

When do you guys run? I'd love to check it out, especially considering I always see you near or at the top of the leaderboards.

I've been tempted to run a PvE based alt so I can fully spec my sorc for PvP.

I would worry about the 5 sec downtime. I would keep your cost reduction/spell dmg enchants. We normally run Thursday/Saturdays 8 Pacific. So you can catch the streams then.

And yes it is a pain to have to respect my sorc for pve and pvp lol.

rokrdt05

Tankqull wrote: »

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

Sadly, the reason for a lack of sorcs at the top of the leaderboard is due to not many people able to do content at the skill level required for those type of raids. Very few sorcs can actually pull the dps required and have the skill set not to stay in red and die.

Tankqull

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

Sadly, the reason for a lack of sorcs at the top of the leaderboard is due to not many people able to do content at the skill level required for those type of raids. Very few sorcs can actually pull the dps required and have the skill set not to stay in red and die.

yeah sorcs must attract the mentaly handicaped playerbase whiule every other class does not...















or could it be i know that sounds heretic that bringing the sorc up to competetive values requires extremly good players wich is the reson for the few PvE-sorcs?

Alcast

Tankqull wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

Sadly, the reason for a lack of sorcs at the top of the leaderboard is due to not many people able to do content at the skill level required for those type of raids. Very few sorcs can actually pull the dps required and have the skill set not to stay in red and die.

yeah sorcs must attract the mentaly handicaped playerbase whiule every other class does not...















or could it be i know that sounds heretic that bringing the sorc up to competetive values requires extremly good players wich is the reson for the few PvE-sorcs?

Problem of sorcs is instead of theorycrafting they like to spam forum and QQ about nerfs When you remember 1.6 PTS you know what i mean.

Thelon

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

... and you are using a pet in a Trial...

That would make you the only one doing it pretty much.

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

rokrdt05

Alcast wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

Sadly, the reason for a lack of sorcs at the top of the leaderboard is due to not many people able to do content at the skill level required for those type of raids. Very few sorcs can actually pull the dps required and have the skill set not to stay in red and die.

yeah sorcs must attract the mentaly handicaped playerbase whiule every other class does not...















or could it be i know that sounds heretic that bringing the sorc up to competetive values requires extremly good players wich is the reson for the few PvE-sorcs?

Problem of sorcs is instead of theorycrafting they like to spam forum and QQ about nerfs When you remember 1.6 PTS you know what i mean.

Yes this is unfortunate. I only know 2 sorcs on the DC (excluding myself) that actually theory craft and test rotations and what not. It is sad that most sorcs don't want to put in the time to make themselves better.

Tankqull

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

BigTone wrote: »

EgoRush wrote: »

Judging from the top trials scores in EU currently, sorcs are a massive factor (4-5 in the top groups sometimes).

There are very few sorcs on the top of the leaderboard for any trials in NA, strange.

have never seen a 12 man group with more than 3 sorcs yet on the european leaderbords, normaly its two at most if one at all...

Sadly, the reason for a lack of sorcs at the top of the leaderboard is due to not many people able to do content at the skill level required for those type of raids. Very few sorcs can actually pull the dps required and have the skill set not to stay in red and die.

yeah sorcs must attract the mentaly handicaped playerbase whiule every other class does not...















or could it be i know that sounds heretic that bringing the sorc up to competetive values requires extremly good players wich is the reson for the few PvE-sorcs?

Problem of sorcs is instead of theorycrafting they like to spam forum and QQ about nerfs When you remember 1.6 PTS you know what i mean.

Yes this is unfortunate. I only know 2 sorcs on the DC (excluding myself) that actually theory craft and test rotations and what not. It is sad that most sorcs don't want to put in the time to make themselves better.

i´m not blaming nerfs or what not nor am i not theory crafting actually sorcs are pve wise in a misarable state, reasosns for that are easily recognizable.

1) only 1 dot ability - liquid lightning while other classes have 2-5
2) all instant abilities have tied in ae effects either decreasing its dmg to balance the ae effect or adding significant delays crushing their dps potential (outside of DSA)
3) to many useless toggle abilities no one is using as they are either to weak, or simply do not work at all like pets in boss fights...
4) aboslutly no class filler ability that can be spammed while every other class has at least one that significantly outdmges force shock restricting you to only destro staff as weapon of choice wich has a significant spelldmg disadvantage vs every other weapon choice
5) absolutly no usefull stamina synergies
6) overpotent overload making any adjustment in other areas impossible.
7) next to no grp utility

in the end it summs up to the point where you can do as much dmg as other classes but you have no room for mistakes while they can play with "broken fingers" still doing as much dmg as you do (outside of overload phases)