Banana Squad - how to ninja a keep [Small Group]

Soulac · June 2015

Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjGq5z1UC-c

Link: click

Recorded in 21:9, so black bars are barely avoidable.. enjoy it anyway!

kkravaritieb17_ESO · June 2015

Those DC on Chill...coackroaches...must rez...must rez...must rez...

Sanct16 · June 2015

kkravaritieb17_ESO wrote: »

Those DC on Chill...coackroaches...must rez...must rez...must rez...

actually that video was made on Thornblade.

kkravaritieb17_ESO · June 2015

Oh really well its the same everywhere

Erondil · June 2015

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

WRX · June 2015

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

Oh god, you are great haha..

Also his name (not that it matters to EU) is "Epic PvPer"

Case solved.

Cinbri · June 2015

Witcher ost in clip?! Don't care what on video, i giving

I guess i played witcher too much, coz your style remind me of Cat School whirl style

symonator · June 2015

there are a couple of youtube tags to fix your black bars..
yt:crop=16:9: Zooms in on the 16:9 area, removes windowboxing
yt:stretch=16:9

try them - fixes most black bar issues, even if it's higher makes it look more watchable.

Soris · June 2015

Man I need to know your pc specs

Soulac · June 2015

Cinbri wrote: »

Witcher ost in clip?! Don't care what on video, i giving
I guess i played witcher too much, coz your style remind me of Cat School whirl style

Played in cat school gear until the end of the game.. :P

Soris wrote: »

Man I need to know your pc specs

i7 3770k@4,3GHZ | 4096MB MSI GeForce GTX 980 Gaming 4G

filmoretub17_ESO · June 2015

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

ToRelax · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

Yes, an equally skilled 24 man train will easily wreck them, and rightly so, it just doesn't exist. lmao

Garion · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

filmoretub17_ESO · June 2015

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

Soulac · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

Garion · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We don't run 24 man groups. There are only 25 people in our guild, 3 of them haven't logged in in over a month, so I have absolutely no clue what you are talking about in that respect. We wouldn't be able to reach that number and in I've never seen every member of our guild online at one time. The most online at one time is maybe 18. I didn't say that a 12 man group is better by default, but we don't feel the need to roflstomp everything with a 24 man group when we can do that anyway with ~12 players and have more fun doing it because it is more of a challenge.

If you have never seen a 12 man group take a keep vs larger forces in Chillrend NA, then the simple fact of the matter is that the 12 man groups that play there aren't good enough. Perhaps they play on other campaigns, or perhaps NA is even more of a zergfest than EU (is that even possible?). Either way, that doesn't negate that it is possible and everything you have been saying is codswallop.

I simply cannot be arsed to argue with you further. You are clearly inadequate, and are trying to suggest that every single player on the NA server is entirely inadequate right there with you. Well I don't believe that, so perhaps you should actually try to play better rather than coming on these forums and throwing around your ridiculous assumptions about the way PvP works.

The sad fact of the matter is yes, ZOS seems to have done everything possible to make the zerg the most viable way of playing. However smaller groups still exist and yes, they can be effective. By being so vocal about how useless small groups are you are only discouraging others to play in this way, and that's why we are making a point of responding to your bullshite about groups of 12 not being able to take keeps.

filmoretub17_ESO · June 2015

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Soulac · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

It´s not our problem if randoms are following us.
Our group contains roughly 12 people, mostly even less and the last time we had ~18 is months ago.

Erondil · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

cf94caf8a630c6b95b12f256c56cab66d196f1ae0bb4bae189a5af05e7cd510b.jpg

themdogesbite · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Still waiting for the moment of realasation..

Garion · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

If you watch the videos you can see the amount of people in the groups... We also play EU, so we've never fought you... You are a special person

Sanct16 · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Everyone who has posted in this thread except @WRX is playing on EU server.

So noone here has fought you, except him maybe.

Sanct16 · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

Quality > Quantity. In our group, everyone is an extremly experienced player with close to 100 days /played and an average Alliance Rank around 40 if you sum up AP gained on different chars on the same account. Everyone knows what to do, even if not called directly. Everyone knows when to maybe rather single target down enemy templars instead of mindless spamming aoe. Everyone contributes to making the best possible decisions in fight: Where are good choke points close by, what are enemies doing, is there a group coming towards us, etc. Still everyone listens to calls and stays together.

Sure, against equally skilled players, you can't win a 12v24. But the thing is that unlike any other guild I know, we do not invite randoms/unskilled players to our group. Everyone in our group is one of the best individual players while in those 24 man raids you usually have a fair amount of casual players who will probably make wrong decisions, waste ultimates on randoms and won't be reaction fast enough upon engagement or just panic. Usually the fight is decided only a couple of seconds after engagement and usually its most of the enemies being dead.

filmoretub17_ESO · June 2015

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

It´s not our problem if randoms are following us.
Our group contains roughly 12 people, mostly even less and the last time we had ~18 is months ago.

Sorry I think there's 2 different conversations going on here. I'll just leave you guys to the victory. It was a good fight and nice ninja cap.

Soulac · June 2015

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Do you mean this one? 10. We were 10.
I think you forget that you play on NA and we don´t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPFjzXfDVQ&feature=youtu.be

Cinbri · June 2015

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Do you mean this one? 10. We were 10.
I think you forget that you play on NA and we don´t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPFjzXfDVQ&feature=youtu.be

wtf it was on 0:22? You chose Nova from quickslot and droped it in front of yourself? Cheater...

Soulac · June 2015

Cinbri wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Do you mean this one? 10. We were 10.
I think you forget that you play on NA and we don´t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPFjzXfDVQ&feature=youtu.be

wtf it was on 0:22? You chose Nova from quickslot and droped it in front of yourself? Cheater...

lol

Poxheart · June 2015

That was some really good fight footage. Thanks for posting it.

Erondil · June 2015

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Do you mean this one? 10. We were 10.
I think you forget that you play on NA and we don´t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPFjzXfDVQ&feature=youtu.be

This Besmaster

Soulac · June 2015

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Garion wrote: »

filmoretub17_ESO wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

I agree with @filmoretub17_ESO such small group can't take a keep alone. Where is the AD 40-man raid hided?

IF you are gonna quote me at least get it right. I never said a 12 man cant backcap against a 24 man raid. I said they cannot capture a keep if the 24 man raid is defending it. There is a huge difference and if you cannot tell then stop applying my statements to your claims. Most people truly don't understand the scope of a battle. There are more factors involved in my statements then just a blanket 12 man vs 24 man. Yes everyone believes their superior pvp skills in the 12 man is epic yet against equally skilled 24 man its gonna get stomped. Take the battle yesterday my guild dies to WRX in open field because they outsmarted us. But it wasn't 12 people it was 30. You guys running around killing pugs thinking you are awesome. Really in a real pvp server there's a bunch of really good guilds and players. You cannot just run with 12 men and capture a keep because an equally skilled group of 24 players will show up and stop you. Sure you will be able to capture Drake if you hurry before an organized raid shows up. Yes you will get some good backcaps with 12 players but for every successful backcap I see 10 that fail. You can do lots of stuff on empty servers because there's really no one around to stop you.

You are deluded. That really is all there is to say.

If you are 12 vs just a group of 24 players in a keep you can still destroy them if you ensure your tactics and positioning is better than that of the opposing group. This has nothing to do with the individual skill of the players within each group, but a lot to do with the leadership of each group and how they respond to the dynamics of the fight.

In any event, I would go as far to say that in a lot (although admittedly, not all) of cases you will find that those who permanently run in a 24+ raid lack the same skill of players that play in small groups. You see, those that run in these huge blobs ("organised 24 main group", as you like to call them) become heavily reliant on that same group. Once just a few are lost the group dynamic starts to fall apart.When we run a 12 man, we can still remain effective after losing ~50% of our force if we remain focussed. That's because our group members have individual skill and use that skill in every engagement, rather than relying on the sheer brute force and meat shield of the zerg as you will find many of these zerg blobbers do.

It is very clear that no matter what evidence is thrown at you, you will continue to deny it is possible. I can only assume this is to somehow make yourself feel better about being unable to succeed in anything but a full 24 man raid. With that said I would simply encourage you to stop posting your nonsensical and - frankly - downright incorrect opinions because you are only making yourself look increasingly ridiculous.

Good luck, "Epic PvPer" (thanks for that nugget, @WRX!)

Why would you say that and yet run 24 main raids yourselves? If the 12 man is truly better then why are you running 24 man and even more? Everything you said can be overcome quite easily. Yes there's stupid groups of 24 main raids running around just as their are stupid groups of 12 main raids and stupid people in general. But you are automatically assuming the 24 man raid is stupid simply because they are running with 24 players and that's just wrong. Most of them have realized that 24 men capture maps much easier then 12. Everyone knows a 12 man can kill 24 men if they are better players and their leadership is faster. Yet in Chilrend NA we don't see 12 man raids capturing emperor keeps. Not because they are bad but because they united into larger groups.

We never had more than 18 people in a single group and even seeing more than 12 people in our group is quite rare.
No one of us is running in mindless zergs, no one.

So you won that fight last night with 18 people South of Sejuanis? Looked like 30 to me. Maybe it was 2 guilds?

Do you mean this one? 10. We were 10.
I think you forget that you play on NA and we don´t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InPFjzXfDVQ&feature=youtu.be

This Besmaster

Yeah.. quite tnkay

PS:
Come online, need you

frozywozy · June 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjGq5z1UC-c

Link: click

Recorded in 21:9, so black bars are barely avoidable.. enjoy it anyway!

This was one of the best keep capture I have seen in my 160days of playtime. Fantastic job guys!

If I can add : This is why we should have some kind of resurrect timer on player who died too often or a resurrection sickness system which reduces the attributes for x time. @ZOS_BrianWheeler.