Need More Classes!

CodyFurlong

I had a great idea for a Dark Templar Khajiit, but oh wait, there isn't any evil type of classes available. The four classes we currently have are all too shiny and 'good', I'd like to see more options for those of us that want to play more darker / evil characters.

Esther

To be honest, they should fix and balance the current classes first before they release new classes or go into more detail for each class. As example, templar is still pretty unbalanced and has bugged skills.

Zargorius

Shiny and good? Ever tried to play a Nightblade in heavy armour and with a two hander? There's your Dark Templar.

Zazaaji

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

ThatHappyCat

Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

In practice everyone would gravitate towards the same few restrictive builds. Potential is useless when it cannot be realised.

TheShadowScout

Is it time again to post my updated class morph idea? Yes? Well...

Personally I would think the best way to add more "classes" is to give each class, say, three different "class morphs", each with its own new skill/passives line. Perhaps becoming available after completing cadwells silver/gold... to reward people who do play through that - a variation of the idea was to let them do the class morph after silver, and let them pick a cross-class skill line (basic class skills only) after gold...

Some possibilities:

Dragonknight
- Berserker/Gladiator (offensive self buffs & warcries; color: red/orange)
- Pyromancer (flame resist and even more fire; color: yellow/blue - gas flame!)
- Warlord (defensive group buffs, AoE standards, color: purple/gold)

Nightblade
- Illusionist (illusion summoning, mind magic; color: red/black - NPC illusionist)
- Monk (melee support & assorted “matrial arts” magic; color: blue/purple)
- Ranger (animal summoning and nature magic; color: brown/green)

Sorceror
- Cryomancer (ice magic, color: white/clear - NPC cryomancer)
- Necromancer (death magic and undead summoning; color: cyan - NPC coldfire)
- Spellsword (melee support & buff magic; color: yellow/orange)

Templar
- Druid/Shaman (nature magic, totems, animal summons; color: green/brown)
- Paladin (melee support and aura-style buff magic; color: white/gold)
- Witch-hunter (counterspells, spell resistance/shields, silencing; color: purple/red)

Another possible idea was to not only have an added skill line with its own flavor of visual effects, but maybe even morph the existing effects to match.
So for example if a sorceror goes necromancer, their spells might be color-shifted to necromancer “coldfire” cyan, summons would be morphed from the daedric familiar/clannfear/twilight/storm atronarch set to necromancer stuff like skeleton, flesh atronarch, wraith, bone colossus... and if they turn cryomancer, their dark magic crystals will turn ice-ish in effects, spells will get color-shifted to white-blue or white-purple, and their summons will be something along the lines of wisps, ice wraiths and frost atronatrchs... or a nightblade going ranger would have their reddish effects recolored to something nature-ish green & brown... that sort of stuff. For more visual goodieness and varietee between classes.

...of course, all those quick ideas are just very rough concepts, without much consideration but character fluff. I merely tried to give some options, and went for three instead of just two "magica-specialization / stamina specialization" - It's supposed to be more for added character diversity then anything else after all.

Thus for example with nightblades, there might be one magica-caster based with "illusionist", one stamina melee based with "monk" (Yes, a nod at the old D&D class of the name, the first “martial arts” powered class I remember in fantasy gaming) and one pet based as "ranger" since nightblades mesh very well with bow, and giving them woodland creatures for the "hunter" playstyle would seem applicable.

Similar thoughts for the sorceror - spellsword for stamina sorcerors, cryomancer since ice staves have no matching skill line yet (while fire and lightning staves sort of have), and necromancer because all too many people really, really want that...

Templar... the druid/shaman is a very natural idea, between breton wyressess, argonian treeminders and bosmer spinners, nature magic meshes very well with Templar healing and sunlight-powered spells; paladin is for stamina templars and a nod at the old D&D class of the same name (possibly subject to TES-ification change), and my "witch-hunter" idea is kinda inspired by the spanish inquisition (Yes, I know noone expected that ), its "warhammer" imperial counterpart and also "Dragon Age", I admit it... seems logical to set up the aedric-flavored templars as natural enemies of the more deadric-flavored sorcerors...

Dragonknight I had the fewest ideas, since I kinda dislike that class. More fire magic for dragonknight magica-casters with pyromancer is a natural first thought... so then I went with "leader-style group play support" and "berserker-style single combatant" flavors, though there may be better ideas then those...

In any case, since more diversity is always something I would love to see... much more fun having more choices in realizing your “perfect” character, especially since the limited number of skills one can actually use at any one time (5+U) makes people having to think and choose anyhow, so adding more active skills only increases a characters choices, not exactly their power...

And yes, spellcrafting might be able to cover some of those... but spellcrafting won't give you passives, which these skill lines should.

BuggeX

@TheShadowScout simply no, the idea is somehow great. But Monks Shams/druids doesnt fit in eso. if i want this, i could go back to wow.

Frawr

ThatHappyCat wrote: »

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Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

In practice everyone would gravitate towards the same few restrictive builds. Potential is useless when it cannot be realised.

This is the same argument given every time 'no classes' is suggested and I can understand. Many people are sheep that simply copy the latest 'how to'.

In reality, many would gravitate to 1 build as you suggest but then others would find a nice op counter build and start wiping those non-thinking masses. Then someone will post the latest 'how to' and they will all change builds to the new op. Then someone will find another counter build.

There are always going to be a majority of copycats regardless of the system used. Best is to discount those players and design a system that allows the thinking people the room to move.


Ultimately, I think that the benefits of such a system (freedom) outweigh the fotming

BuggeX

the Problem about "no-class" is anybody has all skills.
I dont want to see 90% off all pvp Players boltescaping-cloaking-fearing-tallons-standard around

Danikat

Frawr wrote: »

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ThatHappyCat wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

In practice everyone would gravitate towards the same few restrictive builds. Potential is useless when it cannot be realised.

This is the same argument given every time 'no classes' is suggested and I can understand. Many people are sheep that simply copy the latest 'how to'.

In reality, many would gravitate to 1 build as you suggest but then others would find a nice op counter build and start wiping those non-thinking masses. Then someone will post the latest 'how to' and they will all change builds to the new op. Then someone will find another counter build.

There are always going to be a majority of copycats regardless of the system used. Best is to discount those players and design a system that allows the thinking people the room to move.

I agree.

Alternatively it could be something like Morrowind and Oblivion did - you have a selection of classes to pick from, but they're basically just pre-made templates for people who aren't sure what to choose. All the skill lines are available to all classes and can be combined in any way you choose. (Maybe with a cap on how many can be trained up or how many you can put points into at any one time.)

Obviously some choices would be better than others, but that's exactly what makes this kind of flexibility interesting. That and, as Frawr said, finding counters to those builds. If all skill lines were equally powerful and equally viable in all situations there would be very little point in thinking about your choice at all, beyond what colour effects you want on your skills.

LameoveR

They can't handle with those four and you askin for more?

leshpar

I like the idea of removing classes and adding more skill trees. When you start your character you can select 3 trees from the ones that are available and then maybe a 4th one once you hit VR10 or something.

PKMN12

Frawr wrote: »

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ThatHappyCat wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

In practice everyone would gravitate towards the same few restrictive builds. Potential is useless when it cannot be realised.

This is the same argument given every time 'no classes' is suggested and I can understand. Many people are sheep that simply copy the latest 'how to'.

In reality, many would gravitate to 1 build as you suggest but then others would find a nice op counter build and start wiping those non-thinking masses. Then someone will post the latest 'how to' and they will all change builds to the new op. Then someone will find another counter build.

There are always going to be a majority of copycats regardless of the system used. Best is to discount those players and design a system that allows the thinking people the room to move.


Ultimately, I think that the benefits of such a system (freedom) outweigh the fotming

You have clearly never played an mmo before and as sushn, do not understand what you are talking about. This would kill imagination and diversity.

olsborg

Remove all classes, put all class spells into their respective spellschool, release spellcrafting.

Do the same for stamina skills, call them techniques or whatever.

Tie both to mages / fighters guilds.

Shazzaam, open class/skill system, true freedom of build.

bertenburnyb16_ESO

skill lines yes
classes gtfo

BBSooner

Morality is not based on class. Sounds like you just want a brooding, eye-linered character ... which you can do.

idk

Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

Then we would have only 3 builds in the game making it the most boring game in the world. A tank, dps and heal build. Correction, I need to add the heal/dps build to make four.

They will never eliminate classes. Besides, how would they we'll additional character slots if they did.

Victus

Yeah I like the current 4 class system. More skills might be cool. If you want to play an "evil' character, then play one...someone suggested a 2H Nightblade, I'd say that sounds spot on.

Zorrashi

I am not for more classes, but I am, however, all for more skill lines. Or "Class Morphs" (as @TheShadowScout said) if there absolutely must be a certain amount of exclusivity. Hell, even add 'weapon skill line morphs' if you want to.

But no more classes.

Shunravi

Victus wrote: »

Yeah I like the current 4 class system. More skills might be cool. If you want to play an "evil' character, then play one...someone suggested a 2H Nightblade, I'd say that sounds spot on.

It's what I play. I chose the class for a 'shadowknight/dark monk' feel. It fits pretty well.

BBSooner

Victus wrote: »

Yeah I like the current 4 class system. More skills might be cool. If you want to play an "evil' character, then play one...someone suggested a 2H Nightblade, I'd say that sounds spot on.

It very much feels like a 'Bruiser' archetype, 2H Nightblade in heavy armor, questing with him has been a lot of fun.

Gidorick

@TheShadowScout. Amazing. Simply amazing. Who do we need to get this to?

Earelith

Frawr wrote: »

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ThatHappyCat wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

I have to disagree. I think they should remove all classes, add more skills, and let everyone just make/pick their own things. Potentially infinite classes that way.

In practice everyone would gravitate towards the same few restrictive builds. Potential is useless when it cannot be realised.

This is the same argument given every time 'no classes' is suggested and I can understand. Many people are sheep that simply copy the latest 'how to'.

In reality, many would gravitate to 1 build as you suggest but then others would find a nice op counter build and start wiping those non-thinking masses. Then someone will post the latest 'how to' and they will all change builds to the new op. Then someone will find another counter build.

There are always going to be a majority of copycats regardless of the system used. Best is to discount those players and design a system that allows the thinking people the room to move.


Ultimately, I think that the benefits of such a system (freedom) outweigh the fotming

Exactly...this is the argument of wow when they removed talent trees..that everyone just used a certain build but this was so wrong...I never used a copy build and many people had their own builts back then.

Robbmrp

CodyFurlong wrote: »

I had a great idea for a Dark Templar Khajiit, but oh wait, there isn't any evil type of classes available. The four classes we currently have are all too shiny and 'good', I'd like to see more options for those of us that want to play more darker / evil characters.

Why not create a couple more factions based on Molag Bal taking over certain zones turning people into daedra versions. This would give people more choices to be "good or bad". These would have different abilities based off their Daedric powers and what not. So a half Khajiti/Daedra....

MrGhosty

BuggeX wrote: »

the Problem about "no-class" is anybody has all skills.
I dont want to see 90% off all pvp Players boltescaping-cloaking-fearing-tallons-standard around

It seems like they could weight the various skills across all the lines so that while you can have skills from all of the former classes, you wouldn't be able to pick the best in class as your entire bar. Using your example bolt, cloak, and talons would all be classified as a prime skill so you could only have one of those. These restrictions would encourage creativity without giving people the ability to slot every OP class they can think of. Conversely you could allow this carte blanche slotting of skills but add immunities for people who have them slotted as well. So these skills would essentially be nullified and would then encourage players to slot a wide range of skills in order to avoid having every attack at their disposal nullified. It's not a perfect solution but I'm not a game designer just someone who would love to have a Dragon Knightblade (for thematic reasons, cba to worry about OPness when I only PvP every so often).

Yukian

TheShadowScout wrote: »

- Necromancer (death magic and undead summoning; color: cyan - NPC coldfire)

This, please. I actually bought the game intending to walk around with 2 undead to defend me... because, y'know. Bosses tend to kill mages quickly and i'd like to simply focus on casting while having a mostly reliable tank that isn't gonna randomly disconnect. :c

Kalifas

Don't think class overhaul is coming but here is what I would like to see. No class selection, the weapons,skills, spells, and armor you choose progress you down a certain path. There are four paths to building a class. The Knight(Two Hand/bow/crossbow), The Sorceror(Two Hand/bow/crossbow), The Nightblade(One Hand/Bow/crossbow), The Templar(One Hand/bow/crossbow). Each path has sub classes that are predetermined by how you build including some afflictions. Stats affect gameplay more. Heavy weapons and armor have slower swings, bigger impact, reduced movement, less damage taken. Light weapons and armor have faster swings, lighter impact, increased movement, more damage taken. Medium sits in middle. Think of Dark Souls, you are not going to be able to dodge in heavy armor as good as medium or light armor but guard/block will be more effective, especially if you put points into defense stats. Each sub class would have course have it's own passives and morphs.

The Knight Path:

Spoiler

Berserker- Requirements: Werewolf affliction. Skill Progression: Offensive Buffs and Warcries.
Blood Knight- Requirements: Vampire affliction. Skill Progression: Health Drains and magical defensive mitigation.
Wraith- Requirements: Zombie Affliction. Skill Progression: Mana Drains and physical defensive mitigation.
Dragon Knight- Requirements: Dragon blood ingestion. Magic progression depends on what type of dragon's blood you drink.

You would know which they were by the name, example Red Dragon Knight= Fire based,etc. Dragon Knights can summon a dragon in their respective skill line.

Skill Progression:
Fire Dragon Blood- Fire and DoT shouts.
Ice Dragon Blood- Ice and Crowd Control shouts.
Wind Dragon Blood- Wind and regenerative shouts.
Lightning Dragon Blood- Lightning and AoE damage shouts.
Water Dragon Blood- Water and HoT shouts.
Earth Dragon Blood- Earth and defensive buff shouts.

The NightBlade Path:

Spoiler

Swashbuckler- Requirements: Werewolf affliction. Skill Progression: Offensive Buffs and Warcries.
Assassin- Requirements: Vampire affliction. Skill Progression: Health Drains and magical defensive mitigation.
Shadow- Requirements: Zombie Affliction. Skill Progression: Mana Drains and physical defensive mitigation.
Ranger- Requirements: Shaman Medicine ingestion. Skill Progression: Animal Summoning and Nature Magic.
Illusionist- Requirements: Mechanism training. Skill Progression: Traps and other device mastery.
SpellBlade- Requirements: Elemental Weapon training. Magic progression depends on what type of elemental weapons infusing you study. One trained in Fire would be called Fire Blade, etc,etc. Nightblades can summon animals or dopplegangers in their respective skill lines.

Skill Progression:
Vampiric Blades- Health Absorbing weapons and vampire bats pets.
Ravaging Blades- Stamina Absorbing weapons and wolf pets.
Viral Blades- Mana absorbing weapons and poisonous pets.
PyroBlade- Elemental Fire Weapons and DoT fire projectiles.
CryoBlade- Elemental Ice Weapons and CC ice projectiles.
Tempest- Elemental Wind weapons and single target burst damage.
ShockBlade- Elemental lightning weapons and AoE damage.
AquaBlade- Elemental water weapons and HoT based heals.
StoneBlade- Elemental earth weapons and defensive buff AoE.

The Sorcerer Path:

Spoiler

Blood Mage- Requirements: Vampire Affliction. Skill Progression: Health Drains and magical defensive buffs, blood magic.
Frenetic Mage- Requirements: Werewolf Affliction. Skill Progression: Offensive Buffs and warcries, Moon Magic.
Necromancer- Requirements: Zombie Affliction. Skill Progression: Control/summon undead and mana drains.
ShapeShifter- Requirements: Arcane blessing. Skill Progression: Change into animals/demons and nature magic.
Mancer- Requirements: Elemental Mastery. Magic progression depends on what magic tomes you study in.

Skill Progression:
PyroMancer- Fire spells and fire based Dots.
Cryomancer- Ice spells and ice based Crowd Control.
AeroMancer- Wind spells and regeneration AoEs.
Storm Mage- Lightning based spells and AoE Burst.
AquaMancer- Water based spells and burst based heals.
TerraMancer- Earth Based spells and defensive AoE buffs.

Every mage in the sorcerer path can summon their respective skill line's Atronach or Golem which can fill a role of tank, healer, or dps.

Instead of listing a bunch of other classes for all paths. I will just say that this design could apply to all paths and classes and allow a player to pursue what they want their role to be regardless of the path they chose. Tank, Healer, Crowd Control, Single Target Dps, AoE Dps, damage over time, healing over time, etc, etc. Each skill line would be a different flavor depending on what path or class was followed.

Anhedonie

We have necromancers in game, they can raise dead and use some kind of twisted magic (game even contains featured set of gear!), but they aren't available to players. Why? I mean it's obvious why we can't use daedroth's cold fire breath and stuff, but necromancers are the same people as we are.
Also necromancy is very desirable thing since...um...well...launch of ESO.

Mortelus

Sry started my own thread

Natjur

Once they fix the current classes so every class skill is something worth using at some stage, then I would like them to look at 'sub-classes.

But at the moment, too many Templar skills are just broken or worthless

publicradioheadub17_ESO

Bards!