@ZOS - any timeframe on Sorc changes?

Mystikkal

duplicate post

Mystikkal

Mystikkal wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

I know that Soon is trademarked around here and fully understand, but could the amount Soon be quantified in any way? I ask because my play time is limited and so is my in game gold and honestly, I've been waiting on these stamina/tank/healer updates for a couple of months now so that I can finally craft a set of fully pimped out gear. I've been rolling magicka focused ever since 1.6 and I am hesitant to use my gold tempers on any of my gear because I'd much rather play a stamina build and do not want to invest in magicka gear right before changes are introduced that make me want to switch back to a stamina build. There have been quite a few patches since 1.6 went live and quite a few class tweaks in those patches, none of which addressed Sorc in a stamina/tank/healer build. Are we waiting for the next major update for Sorc changes (2.1?) or are these changes something that can be sneaked in during these incremental patches?

I know with the console versions coming out that we won't be getting a major update for quite a while and I'm just wondering if I should expect Sorc stamina/tank/healer changes before or after the next major update?

Hey @Erock25! We're currently planning to have a lot of these Sorcerer changes accompany the next major update, which will be sometime after our console launch. No concrete details yet, though we can tell you that stamina Sorcs will have some more viable DPS options.

We'll continue to use the weekly incremental patches to address any broken abilities or particularly egregious balance issues.

@ZOS_GinaBruno I believe this "major update" concept should really be evaluated. You release a "major update", we have a ton of bugs/unbalances which then get fine tuned until the next "major update", at which point we need to restart the whole fine tuning process.

I get major releases when it comes to content. I even understand 1.6 because you wanted to make drastic changes. BUT, IMO you really need to start making balancing changes at a scale in between the incremental and major updates. That will allow the current live version to be in a better state.

Zheg

Wow, that's an absurdly long time. I don't even think sorcs need very many fixes, just a few minor tweaks, but waiting until after console release is certainly going to be a while. My concern is that there are other, pressing things that need fixing - and if the devs think that waiting until the fall is sufficient because they're busy with console, please communicate that they should be looking to throw small bones our way that won't divert too many resources away from finishing up console.

Because let's face it - you're probably going to have all kinds of problems once console releases that you aren't anticipating, and all of these other timelines are going to get pushed even further back.

If vet levels aren't going to be removed until after console release, then reduce the xp needed for each vet level/buff XP gains/do something.

Don't know what to suggest to you for lag, but that's also not something that can wait till September/October.

Fixes to the mess that the devs made to craglorn should not take 5-6 months from now before we see anything, especially given that they were able to #mileycyrus #wreckingball the zone in hotfixes over less than a weekend.

Not sure why small tweaks to the numbers for class skills and other items like XP would need to be abandoned until you pass the console mile-mark. Put in a few small fixes to improve quality of life while you shoot for your long-term timeline.

Anyway, I know you're just the messenger (and a fantastic one), but if the devs think a lot of these topics can just wait another 5/6 months before seeing any love, it's a big misstep.

Erock25

I'm very glad I got an answer but extremely bummed at what that answer was. I remember when I read the post I quoted at the beginning of this thread and thought to myself "Awesome. I hope it makes it onto PTS before 1.6 hits Live." How wrong was I? AT LEAST 8 months wrong, if not more.

Now should I craft Nirnhorned armor or will they change that soon .... I wonder.

jelliedsoup

I know sorcs don't like to hear it, but you need a nerf.

Very good tank and dps and BoL all of which use the same magicka resource.

I expect the sorcs will defend this but i only see sorcs and dks taking on multiple opponents.

I think the issue is shielding. You guys put the shield on and frag, curse or overload to your hearts content. If someone gets in melee Bol to stun then and escape and continue the dps. Granted you need some skill to do this bit this does not retract that your skills are too much.

Nutronic

Wow, after console launch is such a long wait. We don't even get minor tweaks? Harsh, maybe people should just stop playing sorc until those updates come out. /pettiness

deepseamk20b14_ESO

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

I know that Soon is trademarked around here and fully understand, but could the amount Soon be quantified in any way? I ask because my play time is limited and so is my in game gold and honestly, I've been waiting on these stamina/tank/healer updates for a couple of months now so that I can finally craft a set of fully pimped out gear. I've been rolling magicka focused ever since 1.6 and I am hesitant to use my gold tempers on any of my gear because I'd much rather play a stamina build and do not want to invest in magicka gear right before changes are introduced that make me want to switch back to a stamina build. There have been quite a few patches since 1.6 went live and quite a few class tweaks in those patches, none of which addressed Sorc in a stamina/tank/healer build. Are we waiting for the next major update for Sorc changes (2.1?) or are these changes something that can be sneaked in during these incremental patches?

I know with the console versions coming out that we won't be getting a major update for quite a while and I'm just wondering if I should expect Sorc stamina/tank/healer changes before or after the next major update?

Hey @Erock25! We're currently planning to have a lot of these Sorcerer changes accompany the next major update, which will be sometime after our console launch. No concrete details yet, though we can tell you that stamina Sorcs will have some more viable DPS options.

We'll continue to use the weekly incremental patches to address any broken abilities or particularly egregious balance issues.

You guys plan on fixing NB too right? It's not a mere coincidence it's usually at the bottom of all the polls in terms of strong and balanced classes. Sorcs are doing just fine. Everyone who is a sorc in my PvP guild will be first to say if you're having trouble playing a sorc you're bad. Sorc does not need anymore buffs. If people want some stamina versions for skills than so be it. But other than that, all these fools asking for no C/D or toggles on skills should quiet down and let ZoS worry about more important things. Like their servers.

felinith66

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Bfish22090 wrote: »

Sorcs need to be nerfed, hard

Crystal frags hitting for 20k+
Bolt escape
Shield stacking
Power surge

All of these skills need to be nerfed in some way

@Emma_Eunjung , there is so much WTH in some of these threads I don't know where to start. I especially like how the numbers keep going up, up, and away.

'Couple more of these and we'll be Trial Bosses, 'blinking' from Daggerfall to the Imperial City and back without ever crossing borders, all while we have 200k shields and, just by looking someone's direction, hitting for so much damage when someone rez's, they instantly die again.[/quote]

Reminds me of this movie quote:

Yes, I've heard. Kills men by the hundreds. And if HE were here, he'd consume the English with fireballs from his eyes, and bolts of lightning from his arse.

Laplace

felinith66 wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Bfish22090 wrote: »

Sorcs need to be nerfed, hard

Crystal frags hitting for 20k+
Bolt escape
Shield stacking
Power surge

All of these skills need to be nerfed in some way

@Emma_Eunjung , there is so much WTH in some of these threads I don't know where to start. I especially like how the numbers keep going up, up, and away.

'Couple more of these and we'll be Trial Bosses, 'blinking' from Daggerfall to the Imperial City and back without ever crossing borders, all while we have 200k shields and, just by looking someone's direction, hitting for so much damage when someone rez's, they instantly die again.

Reminds me of this movie quote:

Yes, I've heard. Kills men by the hundreds. And if HE were here, he'd consume the English with fireballs from his eyes, and bolts of lightning from his arse.
[/quote]

Pretty sure that's a troll.

Valymer

Guy posts about improvements needed for stamina sorc/tank issues in PvE

People instantly start QQing about magicka sorcs in Cyrodiil

Cuz logic

BrassRazoo

If you are getting hit for 20k from frags you are doing something wrong.

King Bozo

Wow I like reading the post of players that dont play as a sorc. Sorcs are paper and go down fast. Please roll a sorc and play the character before talking about a class you know very little about. Sorcs definitely dont need nerfed.

exiledtyrant

The timeline is disappointing but at least it feels more tangible than soon. Gives me a better window to figure when I should start getting things in order for a revamp. It's a heck of a lot better than some games stringing you along for 3-5 years.

Erock25

exiledtyrant wrote: »

The timeline is disappointing but at least it feels more tangible than soon. Gives me a better window to figure when I should start getting things in order for a revamp. It's a heck of a lot better than some games stringing you along for 3-5 years.

Yeah I'm very glad to hear this news, even if the time frame is disappointing. I just wish they could offer race change asap so I could finally ditch all remnants of my stamina built Sorc.

JD2013

It has a cast time. You can see it coming. Block or get out of the way.

Seriously all of these shouts for nerfs to everything. I have been hit by people spamming Jesus beam repeatedly. Do I cry for nerf? No. I did not get out of the way in time. I just rez and drop a storm atronach on them. Problem dealt with.

xSkullfox

Stop destroying the sorc class with that useless stamina casts, morphs, if you want use a stamina build go and play the other 3 classes.

The only reason they play stam/sorc is,was prior/now 1.6 crit surge buffed weapon dmg, if ZOS prevented this , spell dmg from start we had no f***** stam sorcs. These guys do only one thing and this is buff with surge and spamming the reverse cut and spamming with the bow. If ZOS removing the surge they cant playing this class anymore.

DONT CHANGE EXISTING SKILLS ADD NEW

Always changing skills is NO solution !!! People want more skills !!! this solution open a new view meaning skills that uses stam & mag at the same time.

Example casting a speedbuff cost (insane numbers now) 2000 stam + 750 mag duration scales with max stamina.

Switch a normal sword with a summon deadra fireblade or whatever( new skin ) costs 1500 mag + 500 stam duration scaling with max stamina and additional dmg with max mag.

...

if your changing more mag skills with stam more player will stop playing the sorc class, look into the trail leaderboards it should say enough.

And now something about the 12k HP Sorcs with 30k Mag.

Always the same, sorcs crying "aaaa im dead because im hit with 15k+ in pvp", the same with the trails .... . Guys ZOS nerfed the HP with 1.6 in comparison with the dmg. Stop crying it sucks, try and learn, i got it, my sorc (V14) have 24k life with 23k mag and i do 9K dps+ (single target), i can endless cast with the destro even in trails without pot !! . If you DIE your 30k mana pool is useless !!!


puhh cya

eventide03b14a_ESO

halfbadger wrote: »

Bfish22090 wrote: »

Sorcs need to be nerfed, hard

Crystal frags hitting for 20k+
Bolt escape
Shield stacking
Power surge


All of these skills need to be nerfed in some way

"Crystal frags hitting for 20k+" don't be disabled
"Shield stacking" not a skill
"Power surge" why on earth do you think this needs nerfing?

Because people complaining about sorcerers don't actually know anything about them beyond the spell descriptions and hyperbolic anecdotes. Posts like that only highlight their ignorance.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

I know that Soon is trademarked around here and fully understand, but could the amount Soon be quantified in any way? I ask because my play time is limited and so is my in game gold and honestly, I've been waiting on these stamina/tank/healer updates for a couple of months now so that I can finally craft a set of fully pimped out gear. I've been rolling magicka focused ever since 1.6 and I am hesitant to use my gold tempers on any of my gear because I'd much rather play a stamina build and do not want to invest in magicka gear right before changes are introduced that make me want to switch back to a stamina build. There have been quite a few patches since 1.6 went live and quite a few class tweaks in those patches, none of which addressed Sorc in a stamina/tank/healer build. Are we waiting for the next major update for Sorc changes (2.1?) or are these changes something that can be sneaked in during these incremental patches?

I know with the console versions coming out that we won't be getting a major update for quite a while and I'm just wondering if I should expect Sorc stamina/tank/healer changes before or after the next major update?

Hey @Erock25! We're currently planning to have a lot of these Sorcerer changes accompany the next major update, which will be sometime after our console launch. No concrete details yet, though we can tell you that stamina Sorcs will have some more viable DPS options.

We'll continue to use the weekly incremental patches to address any broken abilities or particularly egregious balance issues.

McDoogs

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

I know that Soon is trademarked around here and fully understand, but could the amount Soon be quantified in any way? I ask because my play time is limited and so is my in game gold and honestly, I've been waiting on these stamina/tank/healer updates for a couple of months now so that I can finally craft a set of fully pimped out gear. I've been rolling magicka focused ever since 1.6 and I am hesitant to use my gold tempers on any of my gear because I'd much rather play a stamina build and do not want to invest in magicka gear right before changes are introduced that make me want to switch back to a stamina build. There have been quite a few patches since 1.6 went live and quite a few class tweaks in those patches, none of which addressed Sorc in a stamina/tank/healer build. Are we waiting for the next major update for Sorc changes (2.1?) or are these changes something that can be sneaked in during these incremental patches?

I know with the console versions coming out that we won't be getting a major update for quite a while and I'm just wondering if I should expect Sorc stamina/tank/healer changes before or after the next major update?

Hey @Erock25! We're currently planning to have a lot of these Sorcerer changes accompany the next major update, which will be sometime after our console launch. No concrete details yet, though we can tell you that stamina Sorcs will have some more viable DPS options.

We'll continue to use the weekly incremental patches to address any broken abilities or particularly egregious balance issues.

ahahhaha, so not even 'soon'

Merlin13KAGL

xSkullfox wrote: »

Stop destroying the sorc class with that useless stamina casts, morphs, if you want use a stamina build go and play the other 3 classes.

@xSkullfox , agree that Stamina options shouldn't remove Magicka options and vice versa.

They need to either make a hybrid class or offer a single passive, when taken, that bases all/certain sorc skills off stamina, vice magicka.

Want stam sorcs to have their options, but not at the (further) expense of magicka sorcs and their options.

Paulington

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Why are you exaggerating? It doesn't help your argument.... at all. I'm currently running a 40000 Magicka Necropotence build, and my Wards are barely 15000 HP. And when I run a Regen build with 3500 Magicka regen, I still only can cast Bolt Escape around 10 times in rapid succession before running dry.

He isn't exaggerating when it comes to wards.

I play a Sorc and in Cyrodiil I can easily ward for more than my health (25-28k) when stacking, it's not difficult to keep them up either especially 1v1. However I don't believe this requires a nerf as wards are very magicka intensive and even with high regen we can be OOR quite fast.

But the whole "infinite Ball of Lightning" is an absolute myth, obviously. The cost of Ball of Lightning increases exponentially when you want to cast fast. You only need to cast BoL six times in rapid succession for it to cost 20,000+ magicka.

What people complain about is the fact that you can cast BoL, use the sphere as another ward against spell damage whilst you re-cast your actual wards, then BoL again when the "costs 50% more next time" debuff is gone, and that is why people think we can "infinitely" blink.

Honestly, at any rate, none of it is nerf worthy. If you can play correctly against Sorcs we are easy targets. We have zero stamina (as a Magicka Sorc anyway) and that is our weakness.

byrom101b16_ESO

Erock25 wrote: »

Even with all of this that you outline above ... what would you rank Sorcerer at for PVE Healer overall? 4th or 3rd? How about Sorc for tank.... 4th? So Sorc is #1 ranged DPS, #4 melee DPS, #4 heals + group utility, #4 tank in my honest opinion. Do you disagree?

In which alternate reality is Sorc. #1 ranged dps iin PvE?

jelliedsoup wrote: »

I know sorcs don't like to hear it, but you need a nerf.

Very good tank and dps and BoL all of which use the same magicka resource.

I expect the sorcs will defend this but i only see sorcs and dks taking on multiple opponents.

I think the issue is shielding. You guys put the shield on and frag, curse or overload to your hearts content. If someone gets in melee Bol to stun then and escape and continue the dps. Granted you need some skill to do this bit this does not retract that your skills are too much.

Yes - Sorc tanks are pretty good, they just use a very different skillset.

Erock wants more Stamina in a hybrid mix as the game goes more towards reqarding mono-resource builds. This will innevitably weaken the class, but he won't see it.

The reason would appear to be for PvP purposes, as the Stamina Sorc. with the right magicka skills morphed to stamina will be significantly more powerful than they are even now!! I've already stated exactly how in Erock's stamina Sorc thread.

Take a look at it - it's pretty shocking.

FAR more important is Zenimax using some of this time to find out what Sorcerer players REALLY want!

You'll find my thread on that on or near the top of the class design thread.

Please take a look at that too...

Kas

fine, make hardened ward scale off stamina...
only class with a stam damage shield now!

only makes sense, becaue all magicka user's use pets ofc and thus the pet morph is the magicka one xD

happy now, sorcs?

drackonir

Paulington wrote: »

He isn't exaggerating when it comes to wards.

I play a Sorc and in Cyrodiil I can easily ward for more than my health (25-28k) when stacking, it's not difficult to keep them up either especially 1v1. However I don't believe this requires a nerf as wards are very magicka intensive and even with high regen we can be OOR quite fast.

But the whole "infinite Ball of Lightning" is an absolute myth, obviously. The cost of Ball of Lightning increases exponentially when you want to cast fast. You only need to cast BoL six times in rapid succession for it to cost 20,000+ magicka.
.

Please please show me your build and some video documenting your wards. I am keen to learn how to improve further my Sorc and it looks like I can learn something from you.

Otherwise what are you posting are just numbers use for a purpose of nerfing Sorcs further.

b92303008rwb17_ESO

I didn't expect any major sorc change in the coming one or two months, but another 6 months is just outrageous. People at ZOS must have no shame.

LameoveR

But...weekly patches...are all about templars...

Morvul

jelliedsoup wrote: »

I know sorcs don't like to hear it, but you need a nerf.

Very good tank and dps and BoL all of which use the same magicka resource.

I expect the sorcs will defend this but i only see sorcs and dks taking on multiple opponents.

I think the issue is shielding. You guys put the shield on and frag, curse or overload to your hearts content. If someone gets in melee Bol to stun then and escape and continue the dps. Granted you need some skill to do this bit this does not retract that your skills are too much.

Sorcs are strong in PvP, noone is denying that.
personally, I don't think they are nerf-worthy strong - but regardless: Sorc in PvP = strong.

however, Sorcs in PvE are... better then useless. probably better then in 1.5, but still way behind most other classes possibilities.
Sorcs provide good DPS, but not even close to the best.
Sorcs are pretty much the worst healers, and while the "tanking capabilities" of all classes are relatively close, sorcs also rank behind DKs and templars in that department (wheter sorcs or NBs make worst tank depends on the specific encounter).
Sorcs also do not offer any support or utility to PvE groups.

So unless an PvE encounter specifically requires ranged-DPS (there are a few of those, but not that many), Sorcs are NOT in a good place in PvE.

Now personally, I would prefer if Sorc utility gets buffed more then Sorc DPS, but they do need something

hamon

to be honest it will be an utter disgrace if they give sorcs any more treats right now before they set about a proper fix for templars..

at least sorcs are very strong in pvp , (the strongest by far imo)

templars are just heal bots in pve and if they choose to do that (magika built) they are utter gimped in pvp.

if they roll stam to be able to function in pvp by ignoring all class stuff and just join the WB wrecking crews... they cant heal for *** in pve.

hamon

LameoveR wrote: »

But...weekly patches...are all about NERFS for templars...

fixed for you

LameoveR

hamon wrote: »

LameoveR wrote: »

But...weekly patches...are all about NERFS for templars...

fixed for you

You mean fixed LOS radiant destruction?
Don't see anything else, what Templars can count as "nerf".

I'd really like to see some, hm, fixes for sorcs in weekly patch. Like "we've removed Surge's healing cooldown".
And much more Templar fixes, of course.

RinaldoGandolphi

jelliedsoup wrote: »

I know sorcs don't like to hear it, but you need a nerf.

Very good tank and dps and BoL all of which use the same magicka resource.

I expect the sorcs will defend this but i only see sorcs and dks taking on multiple opponents.

I think the issue is shielding. You guys put the shield on and frag, curse or overload to your hearts content. If someone gets in melee Bol to stun then and escape and continue the dps. Granted you need some skill to do this bit this does not retract that your skills are too much.

of course another nerf Sorc Thread...should i expect anything less?