EU-Haderus Topic!

Lava_Croft

Share your awesome war stories here, don't be shy!

Garion

Blues run around in one huge zerg wiping noobs who keep going back and don't learn. When an emp keep is compromised, DC come in force. They then proceed to say they are always outnumbered and fighting against massive odds so they feel better about the fact that they are essentially defending a buff campaign.

/thread

Bashev

Garion wrote: »

Blues run around in one huge zerg wiping noobs who keep going back and don't learn. When an emp keep is compromised, DC come in force. They then proceed to say they are always outnumbered and fighting against massive odds so they feel better about the fact that they are essentially defending a buff campaign.

/thread

I cannot agree more.

Lava_Croft

I don't believe you people. I happen to know the single guy that is the entire guild that 'owns' Haderus and he said on multiple occasions that he only really likes good PvP.

Stop lying because you lost please.

Etaniel

I miss the good old days when Haderus was a yellow buff campaign.
I had the entire map for myself and could farm yellows PvE Heroes on a ressource without any DC to come bother me.
PvE Heroes that would turn up as soon as they were missing one single ressource out of the entire map, 24/7, and sometimes in large numbers (read 15+). Always made me laugh !

AbraXuSeXile

The sad thing about Haderus is that it was full yellow before we turned up with no DC presence at all, You start winning and turning the campaign into a balanced campaign then AD leave and more DC show up, Then shazam you have a buff campaign.

Sublime

Was wondering how long it'd take until this topic gets created. xD (Now we only need one for Azura and Blackwater^^)

OT: I really like Haderus for the stable server performance, it might be a bit stationary in terms of map layout, but that's nothing that can't be changed.

Legedric

Well you are complaining about DC being the big zerg? About DC having the numbers EP and AD don't have on Haderus at the moment?

There is little to nothing DC can change here, so get your ass up and tell your friends to join Haderus to raise EP and AD population.

As I am one of the DC guys I'd much appreciate a more competative map layout than this blue donut there, so go ahead, tell your friends to come over and stop queuing for Thornblade.

Etaniel

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

Legedric

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

Me neither... Haderus is providing much fun without queue times during prime time (even for DC) and with little to no lag at all. And you get a chance to grab a reard every week instead of waiting 30 days for it.

cazlonb16_ESO

Legedric wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

Me neither... Haderus is providing much fun without queue times during prime time (even for DC) and with little to no lag at all. And you get a chance to grab a reard every week instead of waiting 30 days for it.

I make more money through the guild trader every day than the reward for the 30 day campaign is and the items don't sell, because the market is flooded with them.

themdogesbite

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

People dont want to come and play on a fully blue/red/yellow map. Especially when there is sveral guilds camping you at the gates.

Etaniel

johan.danielsson1994b16_ESO wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

People dont want to come and play on a fully blue/red/yellow map. Especially when there is sveral guilds camping you at the gates.

Typically because when they join it instead of taking things in their own hands they go back to thorn and the map stays the same for the next guy who comes in. Don't tell me every other campaign has gate camping 24/7 ^^

iseko

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

Why would you want lag trains from thorn to come to other servers O.o?

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO

Looks like we need to visit haderus to return it into balance some time XD

Lava_Croft

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Looks like we need to visit haderus to return it into balance some time XD

And then EP will come to evict you, after which DC will claim they evicted you! A vicious cycle \o/

RoamingRiverElk

"The sad thing about Haderus is that it was full yellow before we turned up with no DC presence at all,"

This is simply not a factual statement.

While Haderus was a yellow buff campaign, there was definitely a blue presence there. Emp keeps kept switching from yellow to blue and back fast.

One time, the current emp faction was losing the last emp keep (Aleswell). My friend and I (EP) were at BRK, trying to take it, when the defending emp came there, killed us, and proceeded not to even try to take the keep with his faction mate or three. And then they lost Ales. Ta da!

Haderus started to change from a yellow buff campaign to a nice three faction campaign around Christmas time, and for a while it was indeed a lot of fun to play there. It was only later that a certain guild and other blues made it "theirs", effectively turning it to a buff campaign due to the unrelenting methods which suck the joy of PvP out of many members of the opposing factions, as we have seen.

Etaniel

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

"The sad thing about Haderus is that it was full yellow before we turned up with no DC presence at all,"

This is simply not a factual statement.

While Haderus was a yellow buff campaign, there was definitely a blue presence there. Emp keeps kept switching from yellow to blue and back fast.

One time, the current emp faction was losing the last emp keep (Aleswell). My friend and I (EP) were at BRK, trying to take it, when the defending emp came there, killed us, and proceeded not to even try to take the keep with his faction mate or three. And then they lost Ales. Ta da!

Haderus started to change from a yellow buff campaign to a nice three faction campaign around Christmas time, and for a while it was indeed a lot of fun to play there. It was only later that a certain guild and other blues made it "theirs", effectively turning it to a buff campaign due to the unrelenting methods which suck the joy of PvP out of many members of the opposing factions, as we have seen.

No, it was definitely a yellow buff campaign. Occasionnaly 2 or 3 times a week some DCs would come in hopes to get their former emperor passives, but every single morning the map was completely yellow, most afternoons, zero pop for DC and EP.
Meanwhile, soloing a yellow ressource and 10 minute later a 20 man yellow raid came to take it back because their OCD didn't allow them to loose a single ressource. I really really didn't understand the motivation of those yellows to stay all day on a campaign with no resistance.
Now, I don't understand the blues doing it now either...

Valencer

There just needs to be a bit more competition on this campaign. The blues arent legion... there's just no serious effort to take anything back. I can't blame the Covenant for that.

If you ask me the problem is that it was basically an emp farming campaign (with yellow dominance) until blue got some organisation going. Virtue of being a 7-day campaign with high emperorship turnover across all alliances. Now emp farming is impossible and all the AP farmers have given up. That has left EP and AD with very little manpower.

Was with a small group of EP yesterday, but we were mostly just goofing around. No way we could take Kingscrest or Farragut because DC outnumbered us within minutes and the empress usually arrived pretty quickly too. Luckily, she wasn't in a very serious mood and was mostly watching.

Sublime

Valencer wrote: »

There just needs to be a bit more competition on this campaign. The blues arent legion... there's just no serious effort to take anything back. I can't blame the Covenant for that.

If you ask me the problem is that it was basically an emp farming campaign (with yellow dominance) until blue got some organisation going. Virtue of being a 7-day campaign with high emperorship turnover across all alliances. Now emp farming is impossible and all the AP farmers have given up. That has left EP and AD with very little manpower.

Was with a small group of EP yesterday, but we were mostly just goofing around. No way we could take Kingscrest or Farragut because DC outnumbered us within minutes and the empress usually arrived pretty quickly too. Luckily, she wasn't in a very serious mood and was mostly watching.

There is some effort to take stuff back, I've left the campaign at least 3 times last weeks with 3/4 keeps on AD side, the problem is that no matter how many keeps AD/EP take in the evening, everything will be blue the next day because the base populations of AD and EP are too low.

Sotha_Sil

The sad thing with buff servers is that people don't play smart. Instead of trying to balance the map and pushing DC (or any dominant force of the map you are in) back to its keeps, AD will attack EP or the other way around and nothing will get done, DC will rule and laugh at those pitiful enemies fighting against each other. Sometimes you must take good opportunities and do something, but that's not how people play these days. +Nightcapping will most likely discourage anyone for trying anyway.

Legedric

Well, I am on this campaign for a week now (was on Thorn until queues started to skyrocket) and what makes me sad is the pure lack of alternatives.
I consider myself a casual player being able to play like 1 hour every day and some more on weekends but often I am online online for one houre, have to go off and be back sometimes for another hour etc.

This way I simply do not have the time to waste it queuing up for Thornblade or the other 30 day campaign. The only option besides Haderus is Chillrend but that campaign is also locked for most of the time on a weekend, so Haderus is the only campaign for me to hop into without losing too much time in a queue.

The downside is of course its overall low population and the fact that teher is no pvp at all on a business day until evening time or weekends.

I am not yelling for more campaigns, just for a better way to get players spread out to other campaigns.

For example:
When you try to join Thornblade with your faction having locked status you get the option to:
a) Queue up as usual staying where you are
b) Queue up but join campaign X (campaignw ith the lowest pop of your faction at that time) for the time being, no matter if it is your gues/home or unset campaign

This way some players may join Haderus as well. Of course many will leavy right away when Thorn opens up but some may notice: Hey, this campaign is actually quite interesting! I will stay here!

ShadowHvo

Legedric wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

We really need to make people understand there is life outside of Thorn. I don't understand what drives people to want to join that zerg/lag fest and even be ready to wait 2 hours to join it

Me neither... Haderus is providing much fun without queue times during prime time (even for DC) and with little to no lag at all. And you get a chance to grab a reard every week instead of waiting 30 days for it.

I can tell you why, quite precisely infact. But first, let me tell you of guilds experience this weekend.

After being disguisted by the many zergs in Thornblade, myself and my small guild decided to go to Haderus in the attempt to find better, and more enjoyable PvP. At first it looked promising, we had a handful on our hands at the very least as the entire map was covered in blue paint. We then proceded to leave the Northern Morrowind gate, though little did we know...

Myself, a vr14 fully legendary geared assassin-type character, as well as my whole team of low levels, (We're talking of 5 people who're between level 15 - 40) then rides through the maingate, only to have myself getting roflstomped by a total of 7 guys at the precise same time. I died within a single second, unable to properly respond. They then proceded to slaughter all of my members, who didn't stand a chance against 7 vr14'ens, who most likely has equipped full epics or legendaries too.

Oh buggers we thought, not a good start, but no less that should not ruin the begining of our weekend, so we tried to sneak past. Nope. The entire gate itself was camped by people using Magelight like there was no tomorrow. We managed to kill a single dude, yet saw another 8 Covernant soldiers join their 7 comrades, making it a total of 15 (As far as I could count) camp the very entrance.

We then make a run for the southern gate, and we barely managed to get past the gate before we were greated by the very same situation, just with even more covernant players gatecamping.

Normally I would not mind, I'm a stealther and can easily get by, but it was an entirely different matter for the guild mates which accompanied me that day, and the sigh of dissapointment were sound and clear a little too often. At long last, after two hours or so, we got by the the North gate without encountering players, so we could roam in Cyrodiil.

We then aim for the Kingscrest Keep, a nice keep no doubt! It all went smooth at first, we got the first door open and made our way inside, but the glory was short lived, as our group of 6 EP players quickly got roflstomped by not ten, not twenty, but a zerg of 32 covernant players. And that was before we even managed to take out the guards protecting the inner keep.

I'm unaware of what good PvP is for you, but being outnumbered, and gatecamped, yet alone Vr14'ens that does nothing but slaughter low level players is not fun for myself, nor my fellow guildmates.

We then went back to Thornblade, and we had an epic siege at Chalman, and the beautiful Alessia Bridge. We only had lag twice on an entire day, with the infamous lagmeteor spam. The rest of the evening, was 100% beautiful, with both wins and losses to all three factions, Aldmeri, Ebonheart and Daggerfall. Thornblade is good PvP because it is varied and constantly changes, and the entire map is not dominated by one single faction. The lag might be there from time to time, but the bad time on Thornblade does not even come close to the bad times on Haderus for the faction players who gets dominated by the one faction owning and zerging everything.

We gave Haderus a shot, but the players blew it by mindlessly farm fellow players, instead of incuringing good and fun action packed PvP. Sure, you could always tell them to go to the non-veteran campaign, but they would like to play with me. We could also "call for other ebonheart to join and take Haderus" but why would we do that? When the PvP is clearly superior and way more awesome on the other campaigns.

Thornblade is the best because people care and fight. Myself and my guild would rather sit in a que for 3 hours, waiting to get into good PvP, rather than join a campaign so we can allow our enemies to stroke their egos with their superior groups, which outnumbers the other two factions with at least three-times the member count.

That is my honest answer, take it or leave it at your own lesiure.

Legedric

Well, I totally understand you and I may even have been one of the DC guys being at the gates.

Of course this isn't what I'd call good pvp... but that's also nothing we of the DC are able to change. Noone would even listen if we say: Hey, there are 6 guys at Kings, please get there and defend it but with no more than 10 players.

So don't blame the player alone for this, it's the game that's not providing enough benefit for people to join low pop faction campaigns. I don't know why ZOS doesn't add AP or other buffs when you are fighting for the underdog...

But that's the reason why I want more EP and AD to join Haderus. Because as a DC player I want to stop being forced to gate camp to get fights AT ALL, I want a more competative campaign and not 32 DC guys steamrolling 6 EP, but this can only happen if more join Haderus and don't give up on it.

Sublime

There is already a lowpop bonus, but it's obviously way too small. Personally I really like to PvP within my own gate (Altadoon/Mnem in my case), simply because of the huge defensive ticks, the support of NPC's.

The real problem is, once you get out of the gate and try to capture a keep it's all about numbers. Yes you can take a keep while outnumbered, but the real fun comes when all the ungrouped players start participating. As long as the population of AD/EP does not go above ~50 I don't see a chance to cure this campaign.

On top of that you have to consider that this is a blue buff campaign, so the smurf PvE guilds will protect it to preserve the buffs. During that the emperor is probably also pretty demotivating if you don't know how to counterplay him.

@Legedric something I really like doing, when I try to get into TB but it's locked at that time is, I get into a worse campaign (Haderus in this example), and queue up for TB. This enables me to get some decent PvP until I can join the main campaign, and if my whole group wants to come along I simply use the group queue.

You will probably still spend most of your time on Haderus, but you'll get to play at least a couple of mins on TB.

Legedric

Yes, it is sad but true, although I don't see the "PvE" guilds you are talking about on DC. DC is mostly getting defended by a guild using some yellow tabards, dunno their name though (WTB guild tag behind target names!).

So at least I didn't see any call to arms regarding PvE guilds to defend it until now.

And if you ask me, I wouldn't mind trading these buffs for some competative pvp...
Everyone who needs these buffs to achieve something in PvE won't be able to achieve his/her goal on a long term basis even while having the buffs anyway... They are nice to have, ok - but nothing more. But of course that's just me saying that - others will have other views.

Sublime

Legedric wrote: »

Yes, it is sad but true, although I don't see the "PvE" guilds you are talking about on DC. DC is mostly getting defended by a guild using some yellow tabards, dunno their name though (WTB guild tag behind target names!).

So at least I didn't see any call to arms regarding PvE guilds to defend it until now.

And if you ask me, I wouldn't mind trading these buffs for some competative pvp...
Everyone who needs these buffs to achieve something in PvE won't be able to achieve his/her goal on a long term basis even while having the buffs anyway... They are nice to have, ok - but nothing more. But of course that's just me saying that - others will have other views.

I think the guild with the yellow tarbards is Exile, but yesterday I heard someone saying the leave Haderus, it that's actually true it will get a lot easier to take stuff back.

According to an Interview with Lead PvP Designer Brian Wheeler, removing the PvP buffs from outside of Cyrodiil is something "He'd like to do" but they struggle with the UI. I just hope they'll remove it as soon as possible, since it doesn't give a incentive to do PvP, but only an incentive to own objectives. (The focus is on the ownership not on the conquering itself!)

I personally am not sure if it's actually the UI or just the fact that they want to keep an incentive for PvP for PvEers, if they want to keep the incentive for PvEers. If that's the case I'd suggest them to replace the current boni with temporary ones that are gained by conquering a certain objective. They should however not have any Impact on endgame PvE scoreboards, something like a passive gold gain increase or so.

But I don't want to turn this thread into a "pls change AvA buffs QQ thread", so I'll close with: I'm going to try and motivate some stable PvP on Haderus, but lemme theorycraft some tactics first.

ToRelax

What I remember of Haderus' history:

- In the beginning pretty balanced, more players than on Chillrend, but AD had a lot more players on out of prime time, leading to nightcapping, stupid zerging and a yellow buffcampaign.
- Often times someone from EP or DC would nightcap emp, especially a certain DC guild started around October 2014 to farm emp there. It soon turned into emp trading, as described by @RoamingRiverElk .
- Around Christmas, more EP and DC started visiting the campaign, to crown emp as well as escape the lag from Thornblade. Other faction's presence grew stronger constantly with a few guilds homing there. EP eventually decided to seriously try to win the campaign, succeeded, but with doing so, many trains from Azura's Star and Thornblde joined on all faction, spoiling the fun.
- Some EP went to chillrend, were pretty much the same happened, Haderus became a yellow buff campaign once more.
- Another DC guild turned Haderus blue after 1.6 hit, instead Chillrend became the AD buff campaign. DC was gate camping both AD and EP then.

Why would anyone try to balance this campaign? It always ended in lagtrains invading the campaign and stupid gate camping, nightcapping, PvDooring keeps and exploiting the *** out of the game. First you have work, then a few days great PvP (if you don't count one of the factions desperately trying to defend there buffs with whatever ways possible) before it turns into a laggy campaign where no one seems to know why they are even there. Then it becomes a buff campaign again.

AbraXuSeXile

Sublime wrote: »

Legedric wrote: »

Yes, it is sad but true, although I don't see the "PvE" guilds you are talking about on DC. DC is mostly getting defended by a guild using some yellow tabards, dunno their name though (WTB guild tag behind target names!).

So at least I didn't see any call to arms regarding PvE guilds to defend it until now.

And if you ask me, I wouldn't mind trading these buffs for some competative pvp...
Everyone who needs these buffs to achieve something in PvE won't be able to achieve his/her goal on a long term basis even while having the buffs anyway... They are nice to have, ok - but nothing more. But of course that's just me saying that - others will have other views.

I think the guild with the yellow tarbards is Exile, but yesterday I heard someone saying the leave Haderus, it that's actually true it will get a lot easier to take stuff back.

According to an Interview with Lead PvP Designer Brian Wheeler, removing the PvP buffs from outside of Cyrodiil is something "He'd like to do" but they struggle with the UI. I just hope they'll remove it as soon as possible, since it doesn't give a incentive to do PvP, but only an incentive to own objectives. (The focus is on the ownership not on the conquering itself!)

I personally am not sure if it's actually the UI or just the fact that they want to keep an incentive for PvP for PvEers, if they want to keep the incentive for PvEers. If that's the case I'd suggest them to replace the current boni with temporary ones that are gained by conquering a certain objective. They should however not have any Impact on endgame PvE scoreboards, something like a passive gold gain increase or so.

But I don't want to turn this thread into a "pls change AvA buffs QQ thread", so I'll close with: I'm going to try and motivate some stable PvP on Haderus, but lemme theorycraft some tactics first.

It's true, We are moving away from Haderus. Yet again it's us who have had to make the first move out, After we put a hell of a lot of work into getting a foothold on the map then taking emperor then maintaining it through a lot of enemies on an enemy buff campaign, When we first started blues was non existant, As soon as emperor was stable a horde of blues turn up and enemies start leaving.

I fear as soon as we leave a new breed of foe will turn up and try flip the map, And our new campaign is not looking very promising as we flipped emperor on it yesterday and still haven't lost it, and barely a sweat broken to defend it, Which before was a yellow buff campaign.

Legedric

Well, let's see how Haderus evolves then

We at DRUCKWELLE had a fun evening yesterday as there was a very active EP group trying to attack Kings and Farragut and at least as far as I can tell we (DC) did not outnumber them during many fights. It was more the opposite that EP outnumbered us and we had much fun fughting them!

AbraXuSeXile

Oh look, the minute we leave ep plaster the map red.