More guild Traders are a must

Torment

Hi there, as now we have a load more guilds popping up as the footfall in tamriel has got bigger since the launch, but theirs only the same amount of traders to hire, i was wondeing if there was any plans to put more traders in Tamriel or at least give the smaller guilds a chance to trade it shouldn't be who has the largest bid, as small guilds just don't stand a chance out there bidding against a guild who has 500 members its just not fair, i think you should have spots just for the smaller guilds to trade, or at least put more traders in so we all can get a share

ashlee17

They added a whole bunch recently when they implemented the thieves refuge.

Nestor

Yep, we did get one more trader in each major city (that has a refuge).

However, I would not mind say a 50% increase, rounded up, in Guild Kiosks in at least the cities and towns. From the guild feedback I have seen, these kiosks are getting expensive, and to the point that sales are not supporting the prices needed to rent them for a week.Sure, the guild could subsidize the kiosk to some extent, but sustainable model would be built on being able to rent the guild for the same or less than the taxes the sales bring in.

redspecter23

I thought it might be a good idea to make the refuge kiosks rotate twice a week or rotate weekly but midweek instead of Mondays. It doesn't necessarily add more kiosks but adds more chances at a kiosk. It gives newcomers more chances while also giving established trade guilds a second chance weekly if they fail their main bid.

Athas24

I think the amount is fine really. It's just hard for the little guy to compete with big business both in RL and in VR lol.

FooWasHere

redspecter23 wrote: »

I thought it might be a good idea to make the refuge kiosks rotate twice a week or rotate weekly but midweek instead of Mondays. It doesn't necessarily add more kiosks but adds more chances at a kiosk. It gives newcomers more chances while also giving established trade guilds a second chance weekly if they fail their main bid.

I doff my hat to you Sir! A great idea that, it would take something of the do-or-die out of the Monday evenings.

Heishi

I have to disagree. As a "consumer" I don't want to run into traders that have some fishing bait and a couple armors from sets. From a guild perspective, less traders makes the market more competitive. Yes "new " guilds might not be able to get a trader, it does suck. If a guild successfully can manage itself well enough by selling internally to each other, they will have the money to competitively bid. Say hypothetically you want to make a 100,000g bid, not prime spot, but reasonable. If you have a full guild actively working together that's 200g each (for 500 people). Likewise if you have just 100 active people out of 500 donating or whatnot, that's 1k each.

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

FooWasHere

Heishi wrote: »

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

I more or less run 3 trading guilds (GM on one only ofc) on the EU, and it's not easy to get 100 out of 500 people engaged enough to contribute regularly.

s7732425ub17_ESO

I disagree. With how many guild traders there are already, there are really only 10 or so guilds that actually have decent shops. Everything else is usually crap that people should have vendored a long time ago.

Also, bids for kiosks can actually be quite low. We are talking 25-50k to get a spot in a less crowded city or lowbie zone. If you guild has 75 members, should you have a spot in a larger city? Probably not. Why? Your selection will likely be much, much worse than a 500 member guild, and you are wasting a good spot.

But like I said, bids for the less populated areas are dirt cheap. You just have to get lucky on which kiosk you bid on.

Nestor

FooWasHere wrote: »

I more or less run 3 trading guilds (GM on one only ofc) on the EU, and it's not easy to get 100 out of 500 people engaged enough to contribute regularly.

Tell me about it, when the two guilds that I am in run raffles, they get less than 50 people buying tickets, and the prizes are worthwhile too.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Heishi wrote: »

I have to disagree. As a "consumer" I don't want to run into traders that have some fishing bait and a couple armors from sets

Completely agree, this stupid 'economy' is a total PITA to buy in, I wish people would stop posting requests to try to fix a broken and un-fixable system and ZOS simply admit it's a failure, the numerous spurious arguments against an AH are simply shouted by those with a vested interest in fragmenting the marketplace, it's pathetic.

Divad Zarn

Torment wrote: »

Hi there, as now we have a load more guilds popping up as the footfall in tamriel has got bigger since the launch, but theirs only the same amount of traders to hire, i was wondeing if there was any plans to put more traders in Tamriel or at least give the smaller guilds a chance to trade it shouldn't be who has the largest bid, as small guilds just don't stand a chance out there bidding against a guild who has 500 members its just not fair, i think you should have spots just for the smaller guilds to trade, or at least put more traders in so we all can get a share

Small guilds can trade on small trading spots, there are enough of NPC traders already, low quality guilds will be never able to have decent spot anyway and you cant say that its UNFAIR only cuz your guild arent able to keep trader, its GM responsibility EVEN in small guild to keep at least small trading location NPC up especially since they doesnt worth much anyway.

Flaminir

There are often some traders that aren't taken when the bids swap over... that tells me that the number of traders is fine.

What we are really talking about here is that more people want a better spot for their guild by having more traders in major cities.

Its more about location than quantity.

& those who are a bit snobby thinking they want to be in X location because its a seemingly big city.... its worth thinking outside the box. Some traders my guild had in the early days were in less obvious (Cheaper) locations, and some did very very well for a fraction of the cost.

I'm not giving away locations... but just to say, think where players will/need to go. Quests, strategic locations of wayshrines etc. There are quite a few little gems out there!

Nestor

Flaminir wrote: »

I'm not giving away locations... but just to say, think where players will/need to go. Quests, strategic locations of wayshrines etc. There are quite a few little gems out there!

Also, if a Guild can grab an out of the way place, since it is near a wayshrine, then people will go to visit, if they have a reason to. So, specialize if you must. One of my favorite guild kiosks has a member that makes 5 stacks of every food and drink for L1 Writs. Favorite trader of mine. I know of another one that is pretty good for L2 foods in the second zone. Another one, and my guild has this spot now, was known for selling traited items for research cheap, another one sold bait. So, create a niche that serves a need and your customers will find you and keep coming back.

It does not have to be all guild sales for this, just figure the category that people need, keep it stocked and reasonably priced and the other stuff listed will sell too. Maybe be the guild that sells recipes cheap.

Gidorick

We just need an Auction Horse!



http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/159594/eso-needs-an-auction-horse-expanded-concept/p1

smacx250

Do you travel around and look at all the guild traders? Quite a few, even some of those in major cities very close to wayshirnes, are empty of product, or nearly so. What we don't need is more nearly empty kiosks that people need to look through. What we need is to increase the number of strong trade guilds so that the existing kiosks are more useful to both the consumers and the suppliers.

Endurance

what they need is a fan site to list up to date guild traders that are currently in the game (until maintenence).. no way im running around the game to search random guild traders and not find what im looking for.. because teleporting cost alot of money

redspecter23

smacx250 wrote: »

Do you travel around and look at all the guild traders? Quite a few, even some of those in major cities very close to wayshirnes, are empty of product, or nearly so. What we don't need is more nearly empty kiosks that people need to look through. What we need is to increase the number of strong trade guilds so that the existing kiosks are more useful to both the consumers and the suppliers.

What you describe is definitely a problem, but I think we disagree on the cause. Let's take an example from this week. There are 5 spots in Rawl'kha and any trading guild would love to be there. However this week, there are 4 top guilds in Rawl'kha and one spot has 0 items in their store. This has nothing to do with not having enough guilds at all. Quite literally any guild with even 1 item posted would be better off in that spot. It's about where people bid, not how many people bid. If 20 guilds all bid over 2 million on 4 spots in Rawl and only one midrange or low trade guild bids on the last spot they will win, not because they are a top trade guild but because they simply had no competition mostly out of sheer luck. Any of the 20 guilds that bid over 2 mil on the other 4 spots and lost would love that last location that went for 2500g but because of the system we have, that isn't a possibility. The guild with 0 items gets it.

F7sus4

No.

I don't want to waste my time traveling across Tamriel to find even more guilds that sell greedily overpriced white/green items and there are already too many of them.

You can successfully win a weekly bid with 30k, which is not too much for a single person, not to say for a casual guild that is willing to put a little effort into it.

Natjur

To fix the lack of traders, I would like to see the following

(1) Increase guild max size from 500 to 999
(2) Change the number of items you can list per guild from 30 to 50
(3) Change the bids on traders to only be allowed if you have at least 300 members.
(4) Remove the traders that are in the middle of no where

Drasn

There are too many traders already, just my opinion of course. Over half of the guilds that buy traders have no business bidding on them in the first place, as they try and sell a bunch of crap no one wants to purchase. I get tired of riding around and doing a blanket search on all traders and having the list populate as one page and all the listing are green dropped trash.

Adding more traders just makes the problem worse, go outbid one of the terrible traders (there is at least one in every city.)

smacx250

redspecter23 wrote: »

What you describe is definitely a problem, but I think we disagree on the cause. Let's take an example from this week. There are 5 spots in Rawl'kha and any trading guild would love to be there. However this week, there are 4 top guilds in Rawl'kha and one spot has 0 items in their store. This has nothing to do with not having enough guilds at all. Quite literally any guild with even 1 item posted would be better off in that spot. It's about where people bid, not how many people bid. If 20 guilds all bid over 2 million on 4 spots in Rawl and only one midrange or low trade guild bids on the last spot they will win, not because they are a top trade guild but because they simply had no competition mostly out of sheer luck. Any of the 20 guilds that bid over 2 mil on the other 4 spots and lost would love that last location that went for 2500g but because of the system we have, that isn't a possibility. The guild with 0 items gets it.

Yes, I "live" in Rawl, and search those stores every day. I've never seen zero, but I do admit I'm a bit puzzled how a trader with only ~600 items (I just counted) can justify that kind of bid for a kiosk there (maybe a well funded guild trying to make a name for itself - can it sustain?). That is really an anomaly though - the other guilds (and usually all of them) are all over 5K items each (and several over 7K). Bidding seems a reasonable way to give traders access to locations, since gold is the business. However, there are definitely flaws in the kiosk bid system, as other threads have pointed out. However, I don't think that "more" fixes those problems. If anything, it may make this particular problem worse - particularly in the absence of other bidding fixes.

AlnilamE

Endurance wrote: »

what they need is a fan site to list up to date guild traders that are currently in the game (until maintenence).. no way im running around the game to search random guild traders and not find what im looking for.. because teleporting cost alot of money

Considering that all guild traders are within steps of a wayshrine, if you are paying money to port, you are doing it wrong.

Flaminir

Natjur wrote: »

To fix the lack of traders, I would like to see the following

(1) Increase guild max size from 500 to 999
(2) Change the number of items you can list per guild from 30 to 50
(3) Change the bids on traders to only be allowed if you have at least 300 members.
(4) Remove the traders that are in the middle of no where

1. ZoS has already said they won't do this due to technical limitations.
2. Yes, yes & a hundred times yes!
3. Crazy idea... you are discriminating against the majority of guilds by doing this & forcing people into huge great super guilds. My guild has about 100 active people, we try & do a bit of everything including trade. We all know each other & its a great friendly place to be... we don't want to have to be a 300 person guild full of anonymous names just to get a trader.
4. The traders in odd locations are often the ones that have the best bargain... and are also cheaper allowing smaller guilds to get a slot. If all traders were in major cities then the price would reflect this and make it hard/intimidating for the smaller guilds to bid & get started with a trader.


I do think there should be some low level rules though... for example that you have to have at least 20 items listed in the store to be able to bid on a trader... just to avoid those annoying totally empty traders, whilst still allowing for the smaller niche store.

Dagoth_Rac

I think there should be bidding by general location, not individual guild traders. So, you could bid on "Rawl'kha" or "Belkarth" or "Wayrest". If there are 5 guild traders in Rawl'kha, the top 5 bids for Rawl'kha would be given spots. If there are 7 guild traders in Wayrest, the top 7 bids for Wayrest would be given spots, and so on.

Thymos

I don't think there needs to be more. If more were offered, it would diminish the value of certain vendor spots. Like the three capital cities are a good place to have one, and coldharbor. Adding more would just make the bidding process lower than it is. I do wish there was a way to bid on multiple vendors instead of just one at a time. Because sometimes you don't get one, but you may get another. Sure they can keep it so a guild can only have 1 still.

I do like @Dagoth_Rac 's suggestion.

SteveCampsOut

Thymos wrote: »

I don't think there needs to be more. If more were offered, it would diminish the value of certain vendor spots. Like the three capital cities are a good place to have one, and coldharbor. Adding more would just make the bidding process lower than it is. I do wish there was a way to bid on multiple vendors instead of just one at a time. Because sometimes you don't get one, but you may get another. Sure they can keep it so a guild can only have 1 still.

I do like @Dagoth_Rac 's suggestion.

You say these things as though they are bad things! I sure people would rather pay less on their bids than they are currently having to maintain through artificial means like guild dues and raffles!

Heishi

FooWasHere wrote: »

Heishi wrote: »

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

I more or less run 3 trading guilds (GM on one only ofc) on the EU, and it's not easy to get 100 out of 500 people engaged enough to contribute regularly.

Sounds like you maybe have the wrong kinds of people in the guild or lack incentivizing methods such as the very common raffles. I'm only a part of two guilds on US servers, both of which if the GM stated we were getting short on funds to get a trader, would flood the bank with money to help make sure we still get a spot. A guild is about working together to achieve something (for example obtaining a trader to be more profitable), not working against each other and undercutting to try to outdo each other.

Between the two guilds I'm in, I can easily pull in 25-50k a week. Even if I pull in 10k, it's nothing to kickback 1-5k into the guild bank to help ensure we keep our spot and profitability. Getting 20% of a guild to understand this really isn't difficult. There's a saying about spending money to make money. This holds true even in mmo economics.

wrlifeboil

Heishi wrote: »

I have to disagree. As a "consumer" I don't want to run into traders that have some fishing bait and a couple armors from sets. From a guild perspective, less traders makes the market more competitive. Yes "new " guilds might not be able to get a trader, it does suck. If a guild successfully can manage itself well enough by selling internally to each other, they will have the money to competitively bid. Say hypothetically you want to make a 100,000g bid, not prime spot, but reasonable. If you have a full guild actively working together that's 200g each (for 500 people). Likewise if you have just 100 active people out of 500 donating or whatnot, that's 1k each.

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

Fewer guild traders means less competition.

What big guilds with millions of excess gold should do is to make phantom affliliate guilds to buy up as many trade sites as possible. They would basically become the Walmarts and Targets of Tamriel in all but name.

SteveCampsOut

wrlifeboil wrote: »

Heishi wrote: »

I have to disagree. As a "consumer" I don't want to run into traders that have some fishing bait and a couple armors from sets. From a guild perspective, less traders makes the market more competitive. Yes "new " guilds might not be able to get a trader, it does suck. If a guild successfully can manage itself well enough by selling internally to each other, they will have the money to competitively bid. Say hypothetically you want to make a 100,000g bid, not prime spot, but reasonable. If you have a full guild actively working together that's 200g each (for 500 people). Likewise if you have just 100 active people out of 500 donating or whatnot, that's 1k each.

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

Fewer guild traders means less competition.

What big guilds with millions of excess gold should do is to make phantom affliliate guilds to buy up as many trade sites as possible. They would basically become the Walmarts and Targets of Tamriel in all but name.

In case you hadn't noticed it, there are already trade guild conglomerate on the NA server with multiple branches that bid on multiple kiosks!

wrlifeboil

SteveCampsOut wrote: »

wrlifeboil wrote: »

Heishi wrote: »

I have to disagree. As a "consumer" I don't want to run into traders that have some fishing bait and a couple armors from sets. From a guild perspective, less traders makes the market more competitive. Yes "new " guilds might not be able to get a trader, it does suck. If a guild successfully can manage itself well enough by selling internally to each other, they will have the money to competitively bid. Say hypothetically you want to make a 100,000g bid, not prime spot, but reasonable. If you have a full guild actively working together that's 200g each (for 500 people). Likewise if you have just 100 active people out of 500 donating or whatnot, that's 1k each.

1k's not that much and 100 people organizing to work together out of 500 people is not that bad. Really if you can't manage this, you really are not at a level where you are ready to have a guild trader anyway.

Fewer guild traders means less competition.

What big guilds with millions of excess gold should do is to make phantom affliliate guilds to buy up as many trade sites as possible. They would basically become the Walmarts and Targets of Tamriel in all but name.

In case you hadn't noticed it, there are already trade guild conglomerate on the NA server with multiple branches that bid on multiple kiosks!

Care to name names? I've been away from the game a while.