Forced to grind npcs?

onlinegamer1

dassneakereb17_ESO wrote: »

Forced to grind npcs?

This thread is not about what I thought it was about.

Brown Chicken, Brown Cow!

rager82b14_ESO

LonePirate wrote: »

OP, I hate to be the bearer of bad news but your dilemma is of no consequence to ZOS because you are not a console player. They have decided that it is more important to work on a new UI for the console players instead of providing new content for PC players or fixing game breaking issues like the lag in Cyrodiil. Follow my lead by accepting the fact that we are second class customers and try to enjoy the game as much as you can. Our complaints are fruitless so keep that in mind when you post. Have a good day, though!

I would have say that is true, but they did not really listen to us testers as well

MrGhosty

This has been bugging me quite a bit since I've started getting characters to the upper levels. Fortunately I am quite slow so I have adjusted my play style to include a mix of questing/grinding ear marked at certain levels to have stuff to earn me XP after I break the V11 barrier.

I think people need to get past the idea that a game genre must fit into a certain box with a list of features. MMO doesn't HAVE to mean group content for end game, it just happens to be how this game was designed. I am a firm believer in the idea that you should have multiple paths to complete the same objectives as everyone wins that way. I like doing duo content as this is the game I play with my wife, and I enjoy some group content to play with my guild but sometimes you just want to tune out and dive into the world on your own.

Hopefully in the gajillion months when they finally launch the new zones there will be enough variation to make leveling feasible at every stage, but this could well be a moot point depending on when they scrap vet levels entirely (if. I'll believe it when it happens)

Basically OP if you burned through all the quests and don't want to grind they only option is to group up for the craglorn content which seems to have paltry returns or do the daily quests in Cyro as well as the dungeons. They upped xp for the stuff there so you're best route is in Cyrodil it would seem.

Gix

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Running in a group of two gives you more xp from killing enemies. If you play the whole game solo, I can imagine you would be lacking a bit in XP.

But, what exactly do you want to do that requires you to be v14? You don't seem interested in grouping, and all the things that require v14 are group based, except going solo in cyrodiil, but that doesn't' require v14, it just requires a high tolerance for dying lots.

Group up, it's an mmo ffs.

Sounds like this game has more problems than I thought, If grouping is the center of end game. No wonder it is going on life support. *sighs* Well, they live and learn I guess. Funny how the mmos who have sub base respect end game content for soloers.

You should spend some time to reflect on the reasons why you're repeatedly getting the "mmo == multiplayer" argument. The outcome might surprise you.

I have a feeling you're going to be very upset in any future MMO releases as technology improves and allows more and more players to play together.

DogFaceInBananaPatch

I've been purposely taking it slow and have not done the Main Story, both Guild quest lines and all group dungeons. Currently I have outleveled all content (but no big deal as I just follow the other story lines and side quests) but plan on doing all these "main/guild" quests at level 50/VR1 being they stay con at whatever my current level is.

My question to anyone else that did it this way: how far will all these main storylines take me into VR levels?

Gix

DogFaceInBananaPatch wrote: »

I've been purposely taking it slow and have not done the Main Story, both Guild quest lines and all group dungeons. Currently I have outleveled all content (but no big deal as I just follow the other story lines and side quests) but plan on doing all these "main/guild" quests at level 50/VR1 being they stay con at whatever my current level is.

My question to anyone else that did it this way: how far will all these main storylines take me into VR levels?

Taking it slow will yield you roughly the same amount of XP; the main difference is the durability of the content available. By the time you reach late VR levels, VR levels might not even exist as they plan on abolishing the system.

You get to enjoy finding skyshards and lorebooks instead of running straight to it using an addon.

DogFaceInBananaPatch

Gix wrote: »

You get to enjoy finding skyshards and lorebooks instead of running straight to it using an addon.

Indeed. I still have yet to find one lorebook and one skyshard in previous zones but searching for them with only the Achievement clues is extremely fun for me.

Natjur

DogFaceInBananaPatch wrote: »

My question to anyone else that did it this way: how far will all these main storylines take me into VR levels?

The way it currently designed
Normal quests should get you to 50/V1
Cadwell Silver should take you from V1 to V6
Cadwell Gold should take you from V6 to V10
Craglorn should take you from V10 to V14 but it does not do that anymore and this is where its broken.

Even if you do get a group and do all the quests in Craglorn (doing the repeatable quests just once each) It will get you to V12, not V14.

Cirran

For those who are arguing that MMO stands for forced grouping, I am posting what I posted a few days ago else where on the forums.

"I am guessing that you believe that MMO (massive multiplayer online game) means forced grouping? I personally feel that means you will have the opportunity to see people from all over the world in the game you are playing, not that you MUST play with them. Massive in size that an offline game cant replicate. Multiplayer as in you wont see just NPCs in your game you will see PCs in game that represent folks from all over the world, again something an offline game cant replicate. Also, multiplayer means you are not playing the game alone, you will see other players in the game world. Online means you cant play with out an internet connection. Again, MMO does not mean you have to deal with complete strangers and their personal drama. One of the reasons I simply LOVE my ignore list. I don't play to listen to folks argue over what blend of pot is the best...."

This is how I view MMOs, different ideas for different folks. A good MMO has end content for both group and solo and it is as equal as possible.

Cirran

Natjur

MMO (massive multiplayer online game) does not mean forced grouping.
BUT Craglorn is a group only zone (by design) and that was also designed for leveling V10 to V14.

Never said it was a GOOD design, but that's how it was designed (as posted by the dev's when it was first released). Since you could almost solo anything else from all the other zones up to Craglorn, it was very strange that Craglorn was the first and only group only zone.

To solo from V10 to V14, you don't have many options and since we will not see any new zones for a long time..... around V10 you start to feel grouping forced on you.

rager82b14_ESO

Gix wrote: »

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Running in a group of two gives you more xp from killing enemies. If you play the whole game solo, I can imagine you would be lacking a bit in XP.

But, what exactly do you want to do that requires you to be v14? You don't seem interested in grouping, and all the things that require v14 are group based, except going solo in cyrodiil, but that doesn't' require v14, it just requires a high tolerance for dying lots.

Group up, it's an mmo ffs.

Sounds like this game has more problems than I thought, If grouping is the center of end game. No wonder it is going on life support. *sighs* Well, they live and learn I guess. Funny how the mmos who have sub base respect end game content for soloers.

You should spend some time to reflect on the reasons why you're repeatedly getting the "mmo == multiplayer" argument. The outcome might surprise you.

I have a feeling you're going to be very upset in any future MMO releases as technology improves and allows more and more players to play together.

I think you should look at some up coming mmos that respects and even understands that end game is NOT about force grouping. The ones that understand that is doing pretty well on the market right now. and future games coming out also understand it as well.

Time for us older gamers to get out of the group mindset of mmos.

Muizer

Natjur wrote: »

DogFaceInBananaPatch wrote: »

My question to anyone else that did it this way: how far will all these main storylines take me into VR levels?

The way it currently designed
Normal quests should get you to 50/V1
Cadwell Silver should take you from V1 to V6
Cadwell Gold should take you from V6 to V10
Craglorn should take you from V10 to V14 but it does not do that anymore and this is where its broken.

Even if you do get a group and do all the quests in Craglorn (doing the repeatable quests just once each) It will get you to V12, not V14.

I'm only questing Cadwell's and on my current character I'm V11, halfway to V12, with a zone and a half to go still. Expect to be V13 when I finish gold. I suppose I "spread out" my grinding by killing all the mobs along the way. Better imho than the mind numbing non-stop grind I had to do with my previous character.

vovus69

Yep, we need end game SOLO PVE content. We have a group end game content, but nothing for solo players. I hope it will be soon, but realistically we can expect it only after the consoles. Hope Murkmire (or whatever name will be) will be great for New Year present

DogFaceInBananaPatch

Muizer wrote: »

I'm only questing Cadwell's and on my current character I'm V11, halfway to V12, with a zone and a half to go still. Expect to be V13 when I finish gold. I suppose I "spread out" my grinding by killing all the mobs along the way. Better imho than the mind numbing non-stop grind I had to do with my previous character.

Thank you. This is great news to hear and I never thought once (despite all heated debates) it couldn't be done. I'll not only have all the post level 50 content but the entirety of the Main Story and Guild stories [in probably a few weeks] too.

Moonshadow66

vovus69 wrote: »

(...) Hope Murkmire (or whatever name will be) will be great for New Year present

Let's keep our fingers crossed for New Year 2020

Vahrokh

drogon1 wrote: »

LOL "endure" group content in an MMO. Jeez.

Do you consider "group content" strategically placing outdoor groups of mobs that require you to beg for help just to get something menial done?

Who sane of mind would want to waste his time to go help kill 12 linked orcs that shall give next-to-no-xp nor gold nor anything?

In fact, guess what: every single other zone, features group content (public and group delves, dolmens, outdoor bosses...) and are actually fun to play: you can go around and mind your business in all those areas nobody would care to come group with you, and you can group to do those group content areas.

Craglorn, instead, is the brigthest example in MMO history about how to NOT create a zone.

rager82b14_ESO

Vahrokh wrote: »

drogon1 wrote: »

LOL "endure" group content in an MMO. Jeez.

Do you consider "group content" strategically placing outdoor groups of mobs that require you to beg for help just to get something menial done?

Who sane of mind would want to waste his time to go help kill 12 linked orcs that shall give next-to-no-xp nor gold nor anything?

In fact, guess what: every single other zone, features group content (public and group delves, dolmens, outdoor bosses...) and are actually fun to play: you can go around and mind your business in all those areas nobody would care to come group with you, and you can group to do those group content areas.

Craglorn, instead, is the brigthest example in MMO history about how to NOT create a zone.

I think it is a classic issue of the developers listening to the wrong type of feedback.


People who want to force hardcore content, Force group play, and make mmos into some super social can't get any thing done by yourself are the people that have been kinda ruining mmos for the longest. Lucky for us, other developers are looking at ESO and Wildstar..they are understanding that a GOOD mmos has elements for all players, that has many paths to power, and it is about the flow of content/keeping people wanting more, instead of just here is a raid boss try to get strong enough for it.

MMOS are changing for the better, it is just going to take some more time.


When ESO release, a lot of us testers stated that it is very hard to make a come back after a bad launch, the first 3 months can be heaven or hell for a mmo. Sadly, ESO did not cut it.

Gix

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

Gix wrote: »

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Running in a group of two gives you more xp from killing enemies. If you play the whole game solo, I can imagine you would be lacking a bit in XP.

But, what exactly do you want to do that requires you to be v14? You don't seem interested in grouping, and all the things that require v14 are group based, except going solo in cyrodiil, but that doesn't' require v14, it just requires a high tolerance for dying lots.

Group up, it's an mmo ffs.

Sounds like this game has more problems than I thought, If grouping is the center of end game. No wonder it is going on life support. *sighs* Well, they live and learn I guess. Funny how the mmos who have sub base respect end game content for soloers.

You should spend some time to reflect on the reasons why you're repeatedly getting the "mmo == multiplayer" argument. The outcome might surprise you.

I have a feeling you're going to be very upset in any future MMO releases as technology improves and allows more and more players to play together.

I think you should look at some up coming mmos that respects and even understands that end game is NOT about force grouping. The ones that understand that is doing pretty well on the market right now. and future games coming out also understand it as well.

Time for us older gamers to get out of the group mindset of mmos.

I'd like to know of these up and coming MMOs and I would like to know how you know that they're not forcing grouping for their end-game since they haven't been released yet. I'd also like to know of any current MMO on the market that fits your bill because all of the MMOs I can think of offers the same features for the "solo crowd".

The difference is the quantity; at which point, just ask for more quests and spare us your solo-spiel.

Time for you to realize that you're criticizing an online game for prioritizing it's community-building features because you'd rather play by yourself.

Vahrokh wrote: »

Craglorn, instead, is the brigthest example in MMO history about how to NOT create a zone.

Tell me, how is Craglorn any different from raids or dungeons?

Mortuum

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

drogon1 wrote: »

LOL "endure" group content in an MMO. Jeez.

Do you consider "group content" strategically placing outdoor groups of mobs that require you to beg for help just to get something menial done?

Who sane of mind would want to waste his time to go help kill 12 linked orcs that shall give next-to-no-xp nor gold nor anything?

In fact, guess what: every single other zone, features group content (public and group delves, dolmens, outdoor bosses...) and are actually fun to play: you can go around and mind your business in all those areas nobody would care to come group with you, and you can group to do those group content areas.

Craglorn, instead, is the brigthest example in MMO history about how to NOT create a zone.

I think it is a classic issue of the developers listening to the wrong type of feedback.


People who want to force hardcore content, Force group play, and make mmos into some super social can't get any thing done by yourself are the people that have been kinda ruining mmos for the longest. Lucky for us, other developers are looking at ESO and Wildstar..they are understanding that a GOOD mmos has elements for all players, that has many paths to power, and it is about the flow of content/keeping people wanting more, instead of just here is a raid boss try to get strong enough for it.

MMOS are changing for the better, it is just going to take some more time.


When ESO release, a lot of us testers stated that it is very hard to make a come back after a bad launch, the first 3 months can be heaven or hell for a mmo. Sadly, ESO did not cut it.

So group players are ruining MMOs I see... You and your arguments are a joke, nothing else. Skyrim

---

> this way sir. Just because you are antisocial person who is not able to play in group and prefer to roam alone gathering flowers, doesn't mean all want to do it. SO stop with your silly anti-grouping crusade.
It is not mine, or anyone else fault that you lack both social and player skill to do group content. What gonna be next, solo trials because some nuubs want to see story but they are unable to play with 11 others? I have seen request for solo instances for same reason, so I would not be surprised about trial request.

Also please, show us those ''new MMOs'' who cater to solo players. Yet to see MMO with fully soloable endgame... But go on, show us.

crowfl56

dassneakereb17_ESO wrote: »

I completed everything (quests, dungeons, dolmens etc.) in every location except craglorn and i am only vr11, is my exp bugged or what? Even if its not bugged, i cant level up further without nobrain npc grind since nobody doing quests in craglorn and it is not possible to solo crag pve content

not to sure what game you are playing, but I leveled my vr14 templer up on quests and dungeons, no grinding, since most grinding is some sort of exploit no matter how you try to justify it.

Just don't grind, play the game as intended

rager82b14_ESO

Mortuum wrote: »

So group players are ruining MMOs I see... You and your arguments are a joke, nothing else. Skyrim

---

> this way sir. Just because you are antisocial person who is not able to play in group and prefer to roam alone gathering flowers, doesn't mean all want to do it. SO stop with your silly anti-grouping crusade.
It is not mine, or anyone else fault that you lack both social and player skill to do group content. What gonna be next, solo trials because some nuubs want to see story but they are unable to play with 11 others? I have seen request for solo instances for same reason, so I would not be surprised about trial request.

Also please, show us those ''new MMOs'' who cater to solo players. Yet to see MMO with fully soloable endgame... But go on, show us.

I can already tell I don't like you that much. Just with your tone of post. So i will take some pleasure in proving you wrong.

Final fantasy realm reborn is one example of things, While yes it has some force grouping for the storyline. Its end game you don't have to step foot into a dungeon to be able to craft and make weapons that are very close to raiding power. They also have tons of ways of gaining power, and release content at a pace and better than ESO has yet. With the gold saucer just coming out. Things is looking better.

Eve online, I have soloed my way, stealth my way through content. Was it hard? Yup? Did I lose at times? Yup, but I had so much to do as a solo player that it was easy to play and enjoy.

Black Desert Online is upcoming one that focus on solo content end game as well.



The whole raid or die, or group and die mmos are in the decline. It has already been proving by the failure of some "hardcore" group base mmos. Also the failure of this mmo for lacking of content for all player types is more proof in the pudding.

Options is key. Many paths to gain power, many carrots to chase for people, and content for the monthly fee=healthy mmo base.

Mortuum

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

Mortuum wrote: »

So group players are ruining MMOs I see... You and your arguments are a joke, nothing else. Skyrim

---

> this way sir. Just because you are antisocial person who is not able to play in group and prefer to roam alone gathering flowers, doesn't mean all want to do it. SO stop with your silly anti-grouping crusade.
It is not mine, or anyone else fault that you lack both social and player skill to do group content. What gonna be next, solo trials because some nuubs want to see story but they are unable to play with 11 others? I have seen request for solo instances for same reason, so I would not be surprised about trial request.

Also please, show us those ''new MMOs'' who cater to solo players. Yet to see MMO with fully soloable endgame... But go on, show us.

I can already tell I don't like you that much. Just with your tone of post. So i will take some pleasure in proving you wrong.

Final fantasy realm reborn is one example of things, While yes it has some force grouping for the storyline. Its end game you don't have to step foot into a dungeon to be able to craft and make weapons that are very close to raiding power. They also have tons of ways of gaining power, and release content at a pace and better than ESO has yet. With the gold saucer just coming out. Things is looking better.

Eve online, I have soloed my way, stealth my way through content. Was it hard? Yup? Did I lose at times? Yup, but I had so much to do as a solo player that it was easy to play and enjoy.

Black Desert Online is upcoming one that focus on solo content end game as well.



The whole raid or die, or group and die mmos are in the decline. It has already been proving by the failure of some "hardcore" group base mmos. Also the failure of this mmo for lacking of content for all player types is more proof in the pudding.

Options is key. Many paths to gain power, many carrots to chase for people, and content for the monthly fee=healthy mmo base.

Crafting is not an end game activity, besides you can craft very powerful sets in ESO as well, so you denying yourself now, saying that ESO has nothing/not enough for solo players.

EVE is a game that is different then anything else, and it is hard to compare it to any other MMO with raids, instances, and group activities.

Black Desert is open PVP game still in developement, and if you think it will be easy to play solo, when you can't even turn PVP off, you are very, very wrong. It will be more focused on grouping then ESO ever will be, unless you just run around gathering mats 10 meters from town walls.

From BD webside:

Black Desert will feature dungeons. Some dungeons are featured in quest and require objectives to be completed, such as guarding caravans, horse racing, finding lost cats, catching thieves, etc.
ESO don't even have dungeons which are required to complete to progress. Now, that is real forced grouping, so enjoy if you can't progress past level 10 because of unfinished group content.

Black Desert is a huge sandbox oriented MMORPG that provides a variety of unique experiences, including strategy-oriented action such as castle sieges and complex battle.
It has been confirmed that open-world PvP will take place in Black Desert, and new players that aren’t interested in PvPing will not have a choice to turn off the PvP option.
Upon dying, when you have karma items will drop from your inventory that only you can pick up – meaning that nobody can steal your valuable item, but you have to find it again in the world to retrieve it. This really sound like a lot of fun for solo players...Get killed, run back, rinse repeat.
Now, as said earlier, with forced PVP, and forced grouping, it really doesn't looks like a ''solo player heaven''. Good luck with it.

Try again.

rager82b14_ESO

The thing is Crafting is a huge part of end game for many players, oh and playing the AH (hey no global ah..what a shocker.)Realm Reborn crafting, keeps getting updated, and content that is focus around it. To even compare ESO crafting to FF is not even funny.

Eve is still a paying mmo.


Also with the black desert thing, It has already been stated by testers that solo content is just fine, and in fact the danger of non group play is exciting.

Soloers are not some anti social people who want easy content, What soloers enjoy is doing content at his or her own pace, and enjoys tough content just as much as the next person, but does not see why tough content has to be group content.

That is what MMOS are looking at. That is becoming more and more of the future of MMOS. Solo and group base content are just as much equal in terms of what a MMO needs.

This is also what us testers told the devs before it was release. Now, lets hope the console sells will give them a kick in the right way, but I kinda lost hope.


As a mmo vet, it will be very hard to beat me with knowledge of other mmos. As I play them all and tested most of them as well. (even play non na ones)

So I don't really need to try again, as my points still stand. Now time to go play some Aardwolf.

Mortuum

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

The thing is Crafting is a huge part of end game for many players, oh and playing the AH (hey no global ah..what a shocker.)Realm Reborn crafting, keeps getting updated, and content that is focus around it. To even compare ESO crafting to FF is not even funny.

Eve is still a paying mmo.


Also with the black desert thing, It has already been stated by testers that solo content is just fine, and in fact the danger of non group play is exciting.

Soloers are not some anti social people who want easy content, What soloers enjoy is doing content at his or her own pace, and enjoys tough content just as much as the next person, but does not see why tough content has to be group content.

That is what MMOS are looking at. That is becoming more and more of the future of MMOS. Solo and group base content are just as much equal in terms of what a MMO needs.

This is also what us testers told the devs before it was release. Now, lets hope the console sells will give them a kick in the right way, but I kinda lost hope.


As a mmo vet, it will be very hard to beat me with knowledge of other mmos. As I play them all and tested most of them as well. (even play non na ones)

So I don't really need to try again, as my points still stand. Now time to go play some Aardwolf.

From your previous post:

''you don't have to step foot into a dungeon to be able to craft and make weapons that are very close to raiding power.''

This is only reason I have put ESO and FF in same sentence, not to try to compare different crafting systems, which obviously can not be compared.

Still want to see solo players happy about forced instances, when they have to join 3-5 others to progress with their characters. Or getting constantly ganked while running alone, as PVP is forced on them. Both those things does not exist in ESO, dungeons are separated from main story, and are optional, so is Cyrodiil.

My point is, you come up with title which is far less friendly for solo players then ESO, yet you complain about it. It makes no sense at all. So yea, try again, obviously you are ''MMO vet'' for too short period of time if that is not clear. Bragging about how many games you played does not makes you an expert, as you clearly can not see obvious things.

Nadijeh

Fixing grind situations like this should be relatively easy, but it's up to the devs to actually listen and do something about it.

rager82b14_ESO

Mortuum wrote: »

[
From your previous post:

''you don't have to step foot into a dungeon to be able to craft and make weapons that are very close to raiding power.''

This is only reason I have put ESO and FF in same sentence, not to try to compare different crafting systems, which obviously can not be compared.

Still want to see solo players happy about forced instances, when they have to join 3-5 others to progress with their characters. Or getting constantly ganked while running alone, as PVP is forced on them. Both those things does not exist in ESO, dungeons are separated from main story, and are optional, so is Cyrodiil.

My point is, you come up with title which is far less friendly for solo players then ESO, yet you complain about it. It makes no sense at all. So yea, try again, obviously you are ''MMO vet'' for too short period of time if that is not clear. Bragging about how many games you played does not makes you an expert, as you clearly can not see obvious things.

Man you can't change the discussion to tailor to your facts. Talking about force pvp and things in that nature as Realm Reborn does not even have that. Also solo players are happy to have a carrot to chase and keep getting content updates that is why realm reborn comes out with a new raid, new crafting, and new solo content each content patch and they tie in with each other.

PVP is a require taste, solo or not, but it is still a game with solo player content. We will have to see if future updates will give content for all players. However it is a game that thinks about all player types not just group players. (black desert)

ESO has solo elements, but content updates for both group and solo playstyles?

My point is that I listed two mmos out right now that is consider a success on the pay monthly market, and they both focus on
Solo/Group play.

The mmos that has come out, that tried to force group and hardcore nature. Wildstar and ESO, both failed on the market, where ESO has a little more hope to recover thanks to console sells, but if they listen to wrong player feedback and can't adjust to the demand of the mmo market.

Gix

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

Mortuum wrote: »

So group players are ruining MMOs I see... You and your arguments are a joke, nothing else. Skyrim

---

> this way sir. Just because you are antisocial person who is not able to play in group and prefer to roam alone gathering flowers, doesn't mean all want to do it. SO stop with your silly anti-grouping crusade.
It is not mine, or anyone else fault that you lack both social and player skill to do group content. What gonna be next, solo trials because some nuubs want to see story but they are unable to play with 11 others? I have seen request for solo instances for same reason, so I would not be surprised about trial request.

Also please, show us those ''new MMOs'' who cater to solo players. Yet to see MMO with fully soloable endgame... But go on, show us.

I can already tell I don't like you that much. Just with your tone of post. So i will take some pleasure in proving you wrong.

Final fantasy realm reborn is one example of things, While yes it has some force grouping for the storyline. Its end game you don't have to step foot into a dungeon to be able to craft and make weapons that are very close to raiding power. They also have tons of ways of gaining power, and release content at a pace and better than ESO has yet. With the gold saucer just coming out. Things is looking better.

Eve online, I have soloed my way, stealth my way through content. Was it hard? Yup? Did I lose at times? Yup, but I had so much to do as a solo player that it was easy to play and enjoy.

Black Desert Online is upcoming one that focus on solo content end game as well.



The whole raid or die, or group and die mmos are in the decline. It has already been proving by the failure of some "hardcore" group base mmos. Also the failure of this mmo for lacking of content for all player types is more proof in the pudding.

Options is key. Many paths to gain power, many carrots to chase for people, and content for the monthly fee=healthy mmo base.

So Final Fantasy is okay because you can craft stuff that is "close" to raiding power. Take a look at what ESO's crafting has to offer compared to ESO's end-game item drops before making ridiculous claims like this. What good is that equipment for, anyways? Raiding? Dungeons? PvP? None of these are solo experiences.

EvE online... you're playing through content fine but what about end-game? I thought the entire discussion was about how MMOs can cater to solo players at end-game.

How do you know that Black Desert Online will cater for solo players at end-game?

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

It has already been proving by the failure of some "hardcore" group base mmos. Also the failure of this mmo for lacking of content for all player types is more proof in the pudding.

What are these MMOs you speak of? Nothing's been proving. You've showed nothing to prove your claim.

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

Also the failure of this mmo for lacking of content for all player types is more proof in the pudding.

ESO's been lacking content, yes. However, you're talking like the current content is badly thought out and does nothing to cater to solo players.

1) MMOs aren't for solo players.
2) Everybody's been asking for more content.
3) We get 1 zone that requires us to be in a group and somehow it's the end of the world.
4) Everybody's been asking for more content.
5) If the game was "failing", no one would be asking for more content.

Maybe I need to reiterate: Solo players aren't some special snowflake group that requires to be catered to in MMOs. Solo content certainly doesn't make or break those kind of games. MMOs are developed in such as way so that you have something to do when your friends aren't online or when you don't have much time to play on a particular day. ESO's been lacking new content for a while now but any failure that ESO has is completely unrelated to being obligated to be grouped in order to do content.

You know what the sad part is? Zenimax is actually building solo content and yet here you are claiming that Zenimax wants to shove grouping down your throat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqivTnEteG0

rager82b14_ESO

So Final Fantasy is okay because you can craft stuff that is "close" to raiding power. Take a look at what ESO's crafting has to offer compared to ESO's end-game item drops before making ridiculous claims like this. What good is that equipment for, anyways? Raiding? Dungeons? PvP? None of these are solo experiences.

That is very simple but yes, however Final fantasy comes out with content BASE around crafting, and updates it with story elements/gear that gives crafters more and more content. Can ESO say the same?

EvE online... you're playing through content fine but what about end-game? I thought the entire discussion was about how MMOs can cater to solo players at end-game.

I got the best ship for the type of game play I enjoy, and if I lose it. It is insured, but eve setup is that its end game is always ever changing, and its sandbox nature is the best. From the ground up. Eve is design for all types of players. It is the reason it is going strong as well, mind you the learning curve is a beep.

ESO's been lacking content, yes. However, you're talking like the current content is badly thought out and does nothing to cater to solo players.

1) MMOs aren't for solo players.
2) Everybody's been asking for more content.
3) We get 1 zone that requires us to be in a group and somehow it's the end of the world.
4) Everybody's been asking for more content.
5) If the game was "failing", no one would be asking for more content.

Maybe I need to reiterate: Solo players aren't some special snowflake group that requires to be catered to in MMOs. Solo content certainly doesn't make or break those kind of games. MMOs are developed in such as way so that you have something to do when your friends aren't online or when you don't have much time to play on a particular day. ESO's been lacking new content for a while now but any failure that ESO has is completely unrelated to being obligated to be grouped in order to do content.

You know what the sad part is? Zenimax is actually building solo content and yet here you are claiming that Zenimax wants to shove grouping down your throat.

You are wrong on so many accounts.

MMOS are for solo players just as much as group players.
That one zone that requires a group, with a lack of other stuff? Yes it is end of the world.


The proof is in the pudding. They had to go buy to play, and change things because they failed. They failed group players because questing with friends is a pain. The failed soloers because group zones, and lacking of story content. They failed both with a bad LFG tool, bad AH system.

The sad part is, I tested this game, and many of us told them this was going to happen. They are building solo content? So what? At what pace must players wait for it? It is not just about "solo" content, It is about content for all players NOT just group. I can argue for the group side also.

It needs to be a balance. Bugs need to be squish, feedback needs to be heard and communication needs to flow better. (some bugs still in this game from beta!?).It needs to happen at a pace that both sides feel happy about. This is "key" part of building trust and a better future. My fan of elder scrolls is the only reason I am even here. Any other mmo that pulls a stunt like this. I would not waste my time.

Pirhana7_ESO

dassneakereb17_ESO wrote: »

I completed everything (quests, dungeons, dolmens etc.) in every location except craglorn and i am only vr11, is my exp bugged or what? Even if its not bugged, i cant level up further without nobrain npc grind since nobody doing quests in craglorn and it is not possible to solo crag pve content

did you complete everything in Cyrodiil? its like 5 zones in one with all teh PVE you can do

dassneakereb17_ESO

Thanks for discussion guys, but this thread is not about social issues or other MMOs social models. It is about low reward for doing quests, what causes players to choose "wrong" but faster ways to levelup. Grinding in this game is like a spit in the soul of ESO series

Pirhana7_ESO wrote: »

dassneakereb17_ESO wrote: »

I completed everything (quests, dungeons, dolmens etc.) in every location except craglorn and i am only vr11, is my exp bugged or what? Even if its not bugged, i cant level up further without nobrain npc grind since nobody doing quests in craglorn and it is not possible to solo crag pve content

did you complete everything in Cyrodiil? its like 5 zones in one with all teh PVE you can do

50% of quests, some delves and dolmens (waiting for delve boss to spawn and quests on hostile territories are not worth the time)