Lets Tell ZOS What These XP Potions Stats Should Be Like

Attorneyatlawl

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

onlinegamer1

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

Attorneyatlawl

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot. With a 60% buff to your earnings, two people playing the same way will never be close to eachother even if they both start at the exact same time, and absolutely never to anyone previously playing also using those boosts. It becomes a requirement to keep up with the joneses because if you don't, you're left in the proverbial dust. Without these cash shop bonuses, someone wanting to catch up can put in more time and improve their skill as well to get XP faster. While you could do that when potions are available, the people already ahead of you can do the same and just widen the gap that much further . I'll admit I actually thought your post was in jest originally.

onlinegamer1

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Attorneyatlawl

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Can't agree with that at all. The problem is having RMT be the defining factor of your character progress, rather than gameplay. VR14 is an easy mark to reach in a month's time, and everyone's on a level playing field in doing so. XP potions in the mix? You either plunk down cash or you may as well not bother: you'll always be an ever-growing amount further behind.

Also I have a pretty hard time taking the idea of saying people with VR14 character(s) are "no lifers" seriously, even if we disregard the concept of a hobby or the whole opinion factor of what a "life" is and take that at face value rather than an irrelevant insult (everyone has a personal way they enjoy living their own lives, for some that's a lot of family time, for others they plow into their work life, and for many they find a balance between leisure/hobby, work, and socialization, usually mixing them naturally. We're not in 1985 anymore where perhaps you could say the old "alone in the attic hunched over a glowing light on a keyboard tapping away on BBS impersonally" stereotype has any relevance to technology), given that if your concern is leveling you can literally already reach VR1 inside of 20 hours pretty easily on any class, and then get a veteran rank every 3.5 hours at a steady clip if you research where to play then. A total time spent on a hobby over the course of a couple of months of ~65-70 hours is hardly unrealistic.

onlinegamer1

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Can't agree with that at all. The problem is having RMT be the defining factor of your character progress, rather than gameplay. VR14 is an easy mark to reach in a month's time, and everyone's on a level playing field in doing so. XP potions in the mix? You either plunk down cash or you may as well not bother: you'll always be an ever-growing amount further behind.

Also I have a pretty hard time taking the idea of saying people with VR14 character(s) are "no lifers" seriously, even if we disregard the concept of a hobby or the whole opinion factor of what a "life" is and take that at face value rather than an irrelevant insult (everyone has a personal way they enjoy living their own lives, for some that's a lot of family time, for others they plow into their work life, and for many they find a balance between leisure/hobby, work, and socialization, usually mixing them naturally. We're not in 1985 anymore where perhaps you could say the old "alone in the attic hunched over a glowing light on a keyboard tapping away on BBS impersonally" stereotype has any relevance to technology), given that if your concern is leveling you can literally already reach VR1 inside of 20 hours pretty easily on any class, and then get a veteran rank every 3.5 hours at a steady clip if you research where to play then. A total time spent on a hobby over the course of a couple of months of ~65-70 hours is hardly unrealistic.

First, I didn't call "people with VR14s" no-lifers. Please re-read (and check my signature! ). I said "casual and no-life VR14s" not "casuals" vs "no life vr14s." i.e. (rewritten) "huge difference between casual vr14s and nolife vr14s."

Second, you admit that new players can "catch up to" VR14s without a lot of time invested. Then, you admit that they cannot catch up to people with 3200 CPs. This has nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions, and everything to do with CP gain rate and the Champion System itself.

Attorneyatlawl

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Can't agree with that at all. The problem is having RMT be the defining factor of your character progress, rather than gameplay. VR14 is an easy mark to reach in a month's time, and everyone's on a level playing field in doing so. XP potions in the mix? You either plunk down cash or you may as well not bother: you'll always be an ever-growing amount further behind.

Also I have a pretty hard time taking the idea of saying people with VR14 character(s) are "no lifers" seriously, even if we disregard the concept of a hobby or the whole opinion factor of what a "life" is and take that at face value rather than an irrelevant insult (everyone has a personal way they enjoy living their own lives, for some that's a lot of family time, for others they plow into their work life, and for many they find a balance between leisure/hobby, work, and socialization, usually mixing them naturally. We're not in 1985 anymore where perhaps you could say the old "alone in the attic hunched over a glowing light on a keyboard tapping away on BBS impersonally" stereotype has any relevance to technology), given that if your concern is leveling you can literally already reach VR1 inside of 20 hours pretty easily on any class, and then get a veteran rank every 3.5 hours at a steady clip if you research where to play then. A total time spent on a hobby over the course of a couple of months of ~65-70 hours is hardly unrealistic.

First, I didn't call "people with VR14s" no-lifers. Please re-read (and check my signature! ). I said "casual and no-life VR14s" not "casuals" vs "no life vr14s." i.e. (rewritten) "huge difference between casual vr14s and nolife vr14s."

Second, you admit that new players can "catch up to" VR14s without a lot of time invested. Then, you admit that they cannot catch up to people with 3200 CPs. This has nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions, and everything to do with CP gain rate and the Champion System itself.

There's no difference between people with vr14's that are "casual" versus ones that are "hardcore" other than skill and playstyle, generally. ESO doesn't require much of a time investment to get the gear to compete at a high tier in the first place. So labelling people who care more about playing videogames well "no lifers" is saying the exact same thing, and that's what I responded to that you wrote.

I said absolutely nothing about being unable to catch up to people who have more champion points. In fact, I said if you take XP potions out of the equation that you must buy with cold hard cash to progress at the base tier of XP gain for anything you do in the game (and let's get real, when a severely beneficial buy-to-win item like a 50-60%+ XP boost comes into play in a long-term progression system, you aren't choosing whether to pay up or not to have "convenience". You're choosing whether to smell the roses or be competitive at the baseline that everyone else is using.), it becomes essentially impossible to ever catch up due to the disparity in rewards you get for playing as a result.

If two guys are good players, and generally play an average of 3-4 hours a day as "softcore" competitors ie those who want to do as well as possible but don't have the time to sit there all day, unless the guy not paying up constantly for boosters plays an extra couple of hours a day, he will continually and perpetually fall further and further behind as time goes on due to that 60% gap. Using the 4 hour number, paying through the official RMT cash shop system would make the person not coughing it up have to play for around 6.5 (six and a half) hours just to make the same progress. That brings it from instead of playing a moderate amount and having a level playing field based on skill, to "who is both willing to pay for a constant XP boost with cash and is skilled" instead. There's no "improve my skill and maybe play a little more to get past this other guy", there's only "if I don't pay, no amount of effort is going to get me to par". Similar to those cutesy little mobile games with multiplayer that sell achievement unlocks and currency, the game integrity is out the window completely. It goes from "he played to earn that" to "That's pretty neat... but who cares since you can buy it anyway?".

onlinegamer1

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Can't agree with that at all. The problem is having RMT be the defining factor of your character progress, rather than gameplay. VR14 is an easy mark to reach in a month's time, and everyone's on a level playing field in doing so. XP potions in the mix? You either plunk down cash or you may as well not bother: you'll always be an ever-growing amount further behind.

Also I have a pretty hard time taking the idea of saying people with VR14 character(s) are "no lifers" seriously, even if we disregard the concept of a hobby or the whole opinion factor of what a "life" is and take that at face value rather than an irrelevant insult (everyone has a personal way they enjoy living their own lives, for some that's a lot of family time, for others they plow into their work life, and for many they find a balance between leisure/hobby, work, and socialization, usually mixing them naturally. We're not in 1985 anymore where perhaps you could say the old "alone in the attic hunched over a glowing light on a keyboard tapping away on BBS impersonally" stereotype has any relevance to technology), given that if your concern is leveling you can literally already reach VR1 inside of 20 hours pretty easily on any class, and then get a veteran rank every 3.5 hours at a steady clip if you research where to play then. A total time spent on a hobby over the course of a couple of months of ~65-70 hours is hardly unrealistic.

First, I didn't call "people with VR14s" no-lifers. Please re-read (and check my signature! ). I said "casual and no-life VR14s" not "casuals" vs "no life vr14s." i.e. (rewritten) "huge difference between casual vr14s and nolife vr14s."

Second, you admit that new players can "catch up to" VR14s without a lot of time invested. Then, you admit that they cannot catch up to people with 3200 CPs. This has nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions, and everything to do with CP gain rate and the Champion System itself.

There's no difference between people with vr14's that are "casual" versus ones that are "hardcore" other than skill and playstyle, generally. ESO doesn't require much of a time investment to get the gear to compete at a high tier in the first place. So labelling people who care more about playing videogames well "no lifers" is saying the exact same thing, and that's what I responded to that you wrote.

I said absolutely nothing about being unable to catch up to people who have more champion points. In fact, I said if you take XP potions out of the equation that you must buy with cold hard cash to progress at the base tier of XP gain for anything you do in the game (and let's get real, when a severely beneficial buy-to-win item like a 50-60%+ XP boost comes into play in a long-term progression system, you aren't choosing whether to pay up or not to have "convenience". You're choosing whether to smell the roses or be competitive at the baseline that everyone else is using.), it becomes essentially impossible to ever catch up due to the disparity in rewards you get for playing as a result.

If two guys are good players, and generally play an average of 3-4 hours a day as "softcore" competitors ie those who want to do as well as possible but don't have the time to sit there all day, unless the guy not paying up constantly for boosters plays an extra couple of hours a day, he will continually and perpetually fall further and further behind as time goes on due to that 60% gap. Using the 4 hour number, paying through the official RMT cash shop system would make the person not coughing it up have to play for around 6.5 (six and a half) hours just to make the same progress. That brings it from instead of playing a moderate amount and having a level playing field based on skill, to "who is both willing to pay for a constant XP boost with cash and is skilled" instead. Similar to those cutesy little mobile games with multiplayer that sell achievement unlocks and currency, the game integrity is out the window completely. It goes from "he played to earn that" to "That's pretty neat... assuming he didn't just pay to get it easily".

And there is your perception issue. You are so caught up in comparing these two "guys", that you are completely ignoring the new player who just bought the game. By the time 6 months goes by, any new lvl 50+ will be unable to "catch" the 500+ CP players, no matter how much they play.

That disparity is a disparity in the Champion System itself. It has literally nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions.

RealRobD

I am a subscriber, for now, and I feel 50% is not enough.
The one and only thing driving a wedge between me and this game is the ridiculous amount of xp needed.
When I pay $15 a month for WoW I don't feel as if I'm beating my face against an xp wall. It's actually fun to level alts.

Attorneyatlawl

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

50% XP boost:
- Enlightened CP = 66,666 XP
- Non-Enligntened CP = 266,666 XP

I think that's a little low. Should be a 100% boost (50k and 200k respectively).

You're right! I think we should just cut straight to the chase and buy 5,000,000 percent xp potions so we can stomp all those noobs! I mean, you can already earn xp in game! So by that measurement it's all good! (I'll take a matching gold earnings Booster too please.)

Anyone buying the game 6 months from now and getting to lvl 50 will be at the same disadvantage.

What you're complaining about is the disparity inherent in the Champion System itself, not in XP potions.

That's normal enough, in an MMO. The problem comes in when two people are doing the exact same thing now, but one is consistently coughing up cash to get a huge buff to their rewards, and thus character power over those six months to boot.

That is not an actual problem, that is a perception problem (on your part). You perceive them to be equal, when there is no such thing. There is already a HUGE difference in CPs between Casual and "no lif.." I mean "hardcore" VR14s.

Again, the problem you speak of is called "the champion system" not "XP potions."

edit: typo

Can't agree with that at all. The problem is having RMT be the defining factor of your character progress, rather than gameplay. VR14 is an easy mark to reach in a month's time, and everyone's on a level playing field in doing so. XP potions in the mix? You either plunk down cash or you may as well not bother: you'll always be an ever-growing amount further behind.

Also I have a pretty hard time taking the idea of saying people with VR14 character(s) are "no lifers" seriously, even if we disregard the concept of a hobby or the whole opinion factor of what a "life" is and take that at face value rather than an irrelevant insult (everyone has a personal way they enjoy living their own lives, for some that's a lot of family time, for others they plow into their work life, and for many they find a balance between leisure/hobby, work, and socialization, usually mixing them naturally. We're not in 1985 anymore where perhaps you could say the old "alone in the attic hunched over a glowing light on a keyboard tapping away on BBS impersonally" stereotype has any relevance to technology), given that if your concern is leveling you can literally already reach VR1 inside of 20 hours pretty easily on any class, and then get a veteran rank every 3.5 hours at a steady clip if you research where to play then. A total time spent on a hobby over the course of a couple of months of ~65-70 hours is hardly unrealistic.

First, I didn't call "people with VR14s" no-lifers. Please re-read (and check my signature! ). I said "casual and no-life VR14s" not "casuals" vs "no life vr14s." i.e. (rewritten) "huge difference between casual vr14s and nolife vr14s."

Second, you admit that new players can "catch up to" VR14s without a lot of time invested. Then, you admit that they cannot catch up to people with 3200 CPs. This has nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions, and everything to do with CP gain rate and the Champion System itself.

There's no difference between people with vr14's that are "casual" versus ones that are "hardcore" other than skill and playstyle, generally. ESO doesn't require much of a time investment to get the gear to compete at a high tier in the first place. So labelling people who care more about playing videogames well "no lifers" is saying the exact same thing, and that's what I responded to that you wrote.

I said absolutely nothing about being unable to catch up to people who have more champion points. In fact, I said if you take XP potions out of the equation that you must buy with cold hard cash to progress at the base tier of XP gain for anything you do in the game (and let's get real, when a severely beneficial buy-to-win item like a 50-60%+ XP boost comes into play in a long-term progression system, you aren't choosing whether to pay up or not to have "convenience". You're choosing whether to smell the roses or be competitive at the baseline that everyone else is using.), it becomes essentially impossible to ever catch up due to the disparity in rewards you get for playing as a result.

If two guys are good players, and generally play an average of 3-4 hours a day as "softcore" competitors ie those who want to do as well as possible but don't have the time to sit there all day, unless the guy not paying up constantly for boosters plays an extra couple of hours a day, he will continually and perpetually fall further and further behind as time goes on due to that 60% gap. Using the 4 hour number, paying through the official RMT cash shop system would make the person not coughing it up have to play for around 6.5 (six and a half) hours just to make the same progress. That brings it from instead of playing a moderate amount and having a level playing field based on skill, to "who is both willing to pay for a constant XP boost with cash and is skilled" instead. Similar to those cutesy little mobile games with multiplayer that sell achievement unlocks and currency, the game integrity is out the window completely. It goes from "he played to earn that" to "That's pretty neat... assuming he didn't just pay to get it easily".

And there is your perception issue. You are so caught up in comparing these two "guys", that you are completely ignoring the new player who just bought the game. By the time 6 months goes by, any new lvl 50+ will be unable to "catch" the 500+ CP players, no matter how much they play.

That disparity is a disparity in the Champion System itself. It has literally nothing whatsoever to do with XP potions.

The "joining late" thing is the same in any game you play, be it an FPS where you simply don't know the maps and sight lines until you've played a long time, to an RTS where you won't be skilled in the meta without playing a long time to catch up to speed. Leveling systems are fine and well-accepted in MMORPG's, and "soft resets" are pretty frequently made in them (for example WOW's expansions add hard levels making all of the gear previously earned basically irrelevant as it's all replaced or equaled with quest greens as you level to the new cap. ESO has done this arguably three times already in the year it's been live, between adding VR12, then VR14, and then the champion system itself while only back-crediting a very low amount for existing players (70 points, or around one endgame-leveled character, regardless of how long they'd had it, how many they had, or how much they'd done in-game previously).

If they go with this whole pay to win thing, they may as well have just kept the subscription requirement, which left everyone level on the in-game field of what they can do and was up-front with the fees. I don't think anyone had much problem with that or has in any game. Selling character power near-directly? Yeah, that's disliked enough there's a term for it and a commonly-known acronym: P2W. And those games get avoided by new players like the plague for good reason, leaving the existing playerbase withering and dying as people seek a better game rather than buying every new booster the company maintaining it dishes out. Life's not fair, of course; but that doesn't make selling an artificial gap-booster and progression gain not earned by gameplay okay.

ZOS_UlyssesW

Since we've had a large number of threads about P2W and/or XP Boosters, we're locking this and consolidating the discussion into this thread.