DK Whip with stamina morph

Gravord

DK getting 2 skills with option to be morphed into stamina, both damage over time. Cant see logic with not giving also Whip option to be stamina based. Those 3 skills are natural combo, either dont make any of them stamina or give that option to all of them.

Yuke

good luck reasoning with people regarding dk changes

Kaghei

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Armitas

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Yeah and the first person who makes a suggestion as to which one should go over to stamina is going to get it. I'll put a few quick thoughts down, no decisions so no burning is due.

Magicka users got moved out of unstable flame and into burning embers so they have an ardent flame heal. The stamina users still don't have an ardent flame heal so maybe they should get flame lash. The next question is, do stamina users have a good enough method to activate the heal mechanic? If not maybe the mechanic could change.

Xsorus

We use to have the root on Deep Slash, but they changed it, but you can still use things like Revert Bash and Shield Charge

DDuke

Stamina morph for whip would make sense from RPG perspective. It feels a lot more like a "stamina ability", than something like Burning Breath.

trimsic_ESO

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Laggus

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Are we calling DK skills and blocking exploits now?

Solanum

Laggus wrote: »

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Are we calling DK skills and blocking exploits now?

As a former Dragonknight I find that offensive as well. It takes a great deal of skill to time that ability right, it's not like we would cast it about 6 times in a row or something. Ooooh wait.

Orchish

Exploit? lol some of you are getting very bitter. It's only a exploit when DKs block cast i suppose? I mean you're fine with other classes animation cancelling and block casting but DKs are exploiters? Funny. Perhaps when ZoS them selves start banning players for exploiting every time they block cast i'll agree with you.

I also think lash should be stamina based, in fact i kinda wished that every skill would have had a 3rd morph allowing you to choose whether that skill is magikca based or stamina based so that we had more freedom with our builds.

Yuke

No1 needs lavawhip atm because it is broken. The should fix it or change it to a stamina version.

trimsic_ESO

@Laggus‌
I'm a DK.

Block casting lava whip is granting me, as a DK:
- The ability to mitigate a lot of incoming damage
- The ability to deal a lot of damage
- The ability to efficiently use two pools of resources

It's so OP that at the end it's boring...

Armitas

Just ignore it, don't let this get derailed over blockcasting QQ.

Panda244

Armitas wrote: »

Just ignore it, don't let this get derailed over blockcasting QQ.

If Flame Lash is turned into a stamina morph, Magicka DKs are gonna lose a tiny bit of surviability and gain a tiny bit of damage... You could imagine how well that'll boil over with the PvP community.

"ER MUR GURD?!? DK STEEL GOOD?!? UGH?!?!?! NERF IT?!?!?!"

TehMagnus

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Well both of the morphs that where used in PVE have been switched to stamina so logically, molten whip should also be switched to stamina. Because of those changes it is unlikely that magicka DK will be better than stamina DK in 1.6 so people will move away from magicka builds.

Panda244

TehMagnus wrote: »

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Well both of the morphs that where used in PVE have been switched to stamina so logically, molten whip should also be switched to stamina. Because of those changes it is unlikely that magicka DK will be better than stamina DK in 1.6 so people will move away from magicka builds.

If they launch 1.6 the way it already is, magicka builds won't exist anymore. A werewolf, stamina build, a WEREWOLF. Can pull 33K DPS lol... And then there's the ***-load of burst damage stam builds are pulling on the PTS, magicka is better for sustain sure but the burst from stam is doing 100k damage in no time.

Kaghei

Yuke wrote: »

No1 needs lavawhip atm because it is broken. The should fix it or change it to a stamina version.

i assume you mean molten whip, and they especially do now considering it is spell crit, that now makes it more dps that crushing shock so if you want to nerf pve dks then sure, make it stam.

xaade

I thought it was the melee morphs that were being switched to have a stamina morph.

*sigh*

We'd benefit from having more than one level of morph.

Domander

I don't understand why all these skills can only have *2* morphs.. why not 3 or 4?

Jacques Berge

I have never run a DK nor do I ever plan to do so. That said, I find it complelety absurd that the whip skill doesn't have a Stam morph. That said, I think they should just give us 4 morphs... A Stam and a magicka version for each morph.

BEZDNA

i want stamina morph for scales - the one which gives spell resistance

Gravord

Another pts update and this issue still not adressed.

Vanzen

Lava whip is the last advantage magicka DK has over stam Dk, that is becoming so op but lacks a burst ability. So ... No.
Am working real hard to make a Fire melee mag DK that is viable. If I loose flame lash, its over ...

xylena

stamina NB gets suprise attack for strong flat damage and power extraction for aoe... so it would be cool if stam DK got similar abilities in flame lash and maybe choking talons or deep breath

stam DK is really in a good place though, hoping they take a look at stam sorc abilities first

Dredlord

Laggus wrote: »

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

Kaghei wrote: »

Both morphs of lava whip are heavily used for magicka dk builds, flame lash for pvp and molten whip for pve. Would be hard to decide which one should become stamina.

Flame lash should be the one for the stamina morph. It is often exploited in PvP (block casting), so having it in a stamina form would limit the exploit. And it would make sense to have molten whip give a fire damage bonus for the magicka builds.

Are we calling DK skills and blocking exploits now?

an Eploit and exploiting something is not the exactly the same now is it?

Costismaros

Kaghei wrote: »

Yuke wrote: »

No1 needs lavawhip atm because it is broken. The should fix it or change it to a stamina version.

i assume you mean molten whip, and they especially do now considering it is spell crit, that now makes it more dps that crushing shock so if you want to nerf pve dks then sure, make it stam.

Why you are talking for pve dks and you are saying magicka ? I am stamina dk on pve with sustain 12k and i have seen so many ppl doing stamina pve builds.
That we have still alot of magicka dks on pve it is because they are what remained from early lunch of game, back then they was the only way.

Trayyacakes

I really don't understand everyone saying "NO LAVA WHIP CAN'T HAVE A STAM MORPH BECAUSE I USE IT AS MAGICKA DPS!" Both Morphs wouldn't be stam. You would still get one for your magicka dps. I don't understand this hate.

It is a MELEE ability. I want to use it with a MELEE weapon without having to gimp myself by going hybrid. If you want to use a Destro staff in melee range by all means go ahead. There should be a morph of lava whip for you to do that. If I want to use it effectively with my 2h or sword and shield I should be able to do that too.

Why so much resistance from Magicka Builds? I know that on the pts magicka builds don't keep up with stam builds dps wise. What does that have to do lava whip? There is a problem with balance between stamina and magicka. A lot of it has to do with 2h and dual wield giving more weapon power than staves give spell power. Magick lagging behind is a game issue and has nothing to do with this one ability.

As I said earlier if whip gets a stam morph and whip spam doesn't out dps wrecking blow spam everything will be ok except for the earlier mentioned balance issues between stamina and magicka.

Vanzen

Because the only tiny advantage that remains to a DK mag over a DK stam is this burst ! DK stam has to go weapon burst ! Atm, if a DK goes stam dps he must take 2H. If lava whip has a stam morph, you can go back to 1/S and beeing as OP as in 1.5.
While knowing that atm stam is superior to mag, I stay mag cause I just hate 2h and stam build. If flame lash goes stam, I wont have any other choice than to jump into the stam wagon.

Trayyacakes

Vanzen wrote: »

Because the only tiny advantage that remains to a DK mag over a DK stam is this burst ! DK stam has to go weapon burst ! Atm, if a DK goes stam dps he must take 2H. If lava whip has a stam morph, you can go back to 1/S and beeing as OP as in 1.5.
While knowing that atm stam is superior to mag, I stay mag cause I just hate 2h and stam build. If flame lash goes stam, I wont have any other choice than to jump into the stam wagon.

Sorry man but if you stay magicka even with a whip you are gimping yourself. This is a game balance issue that needs to be fixed, but stam med dps is outperforming every magicka build.

As for the 1h/s deal until you get a substantial amount of champ points you can't block cast like you can on live unless you build specifically for it, and you are giving up a lot of other things to be able to do that. You will have to go heavy armor with defensive posture to be able to block cast at all when 1.6 first hits. If you use a stam spam skill with that combo you will run out of stamina rather quickly.