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Official Discussion Thread for “Your Guide to ESO Plus™ Premium Membership”

  • Nijjion
    Nijjion
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    I don't mind too much... I just want to laugh at all the people who argued with me when I said this would happen at launch.

    Though I did say 8-12 months when this will be 13 months... so 1 month out.
    NijjijjioN - DK - AR27
    NijjioN - NB -
    Daggerfall Covenant
    The Nice Guys Guild
    EverQuest -> Dark Age of Camelot -> Ragnarok Online -> Cabal Online -> Guild Wars 1 -> Warhammer Online -> Vindictus -> SWTOR -> Tera -> Guild Wars 2 -> Elder Scrolls Online ->

    Eagerly awaiting Camelot Unchained.
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  • Rashishane
    Rashishane
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    If you are going to force us to play nice with the pre-pubescent masses at least keep this little "crown" market full of nothing but fluff content (costumes, pets, etc.), if we ever reach a point where you can P2W you might as well give each person a toilet brush free with each copy because the game will be poo. I have been with this game since beta, please listen to your loyal players and don't pull a SWTOR. The way you have this set up currently doesn't seem so bad but you're still walking a fine line and if you fall there is a good (almost definite) chance that none of your loyal players will be there to catch you; we will have all left. We still need you to keep listening to us ZOS, get on here and ENSURE us that we may be going F2P B2P but we aren't going P2W. Tell us that our craftables will still be better than anything purchasable on your "crown" market, tell us that we still have to work hard to get what we want and need in the game, tell us our communities won't collapse and that the game itself won't suffer (updates/bug fixes/etc.); Here is the challenge though...MEAN IT. Now I am going to cry at work, I hate break ups.

    EDIT: Changed F2P to B2P to reflect the actuality of the current situation.
    Edited by Rashishane on January 22, 2015 4:32AM
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  • Cydone
    Cydone
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    Oh and if things bought from the "Crown Market" or whatever are bound to your account and cannot be sold, then what's the point?? TOR's cash shop is bad enough, but at least after 1 1/2 days the items you buy aren't bound to your character and you can sell them. If you can't sell the items you buy from the "Crown Market", your F2P model isn't going to work at all.
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  • malthol
    malthol
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    ForsakeMe wrote: »
    Every game I have played with a f2p with or without paywall has been unenjoyable because of the immature community chats

    Umm, have you been to the lowbie zones in ESO? It is some of the worst, most offensive zone chats I have ever experienced (outside of WoW). This sort of stuff is the result of having an audience in an anonymous setting, happens in various areas or global channels in all MMOs, & there is no data or indication that it increases with a change in payment model (there is much better evidence that some people become more sensitive to it, though, when they are already disgruntled).

    There is lots of hyperbolic predictions of doom here, that really just don't hold up to examination. B2P is better than F2P, and has been a successful model elsewhere. Some games have implemented the store/sub-optional model better than others. I have read the FAQ completely, and this one seems better than any I have experienced yet. The only serious concern I have at this moment is that the store is said to include healing potions. This is a problem. There is a craft skill that makes these, and thus these are part of creating player interaction with other players & with the in-game guild store system. This is exactly the type of item that should NOT be in the store.
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  • sebban
    sebban
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    So ESO Plus is basically the subscription we all have been paying for so far, and then you add a cash-shop on top of that? And you will spend precious development time on crap in the cash-shop instead of real content? No thanks. I've seen this before. I didn't want it then, I don't want it now. I was hoping to stay with ESO for many years to come, but that hope was just destroyed. This is a really *** move. My subscription is canceled. There is no way this will improve things at all. Might as well call it "ESO FU".
    Edited by sebban on January 21, 2015 4:42PM
    PC EU
    Dweia Ceban - StamDK
    Adara Ceban - MagBlade
    Daewa Ceban - MagSorc
    Tick-Tock Tormentor

    Chimaira.eu

    Friskyttarna.eu
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  • Iluvrien
    Iluvrien
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    So, if you are already a subscriber (If you are reading this you are, or your a troll that is just registered on a game site that you dont play) nothing is changing for you.

    ...except from the Developer's priorities. If the cash shop is what is continuing to make them money after the initial box price then where is it logical to expect that their focus will be placed? Solo quest zones? New endgame content? Both of these may well need a fully levelled character to enjoy. I think it more likely that the focus will be on idiotic vanity items that new buyers will want, and have access to, from day one.

    I expect content releases to slow even further (if possible) even if they don't just stop.

    This change will affect us all, even if it isn't something that slaps everyone directly in the face.
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  • joanne.dobson1b16_ESO
    joanne.dobson1b16_ESO
    Soul Shriven
    I haven't seen a single game that has suffered negatively from a F2P model. As far as I can see you continue to pay your sub, have access to the whole game AND they give you tokens for in game store.
    Worked for STO, works for SWTOR and it'll work for this.
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  • istateres
    istateres
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    Can someone explain to me WHY I would pay to play from now until the game goes FTP (for me)??

    Why would I pay the sub for these next 5 months or so? I see no benefit as I can do my playing later for FREE. Plus maybe by then all the Champion systems bugs will be worked out.

    Someone, talk me off the ledge!
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  • FoxyKitten
    FoxyKitten
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    You mentioned that the Crowns are not tradable. Are there any exceptions to that rule? I have 2 accounts. It sounds as if I will not be able to trade Crowns between those 2 accounts? Is this correct? : (
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  • Turelus
    Turelus
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    Another question.

    Q: Normally when you buy higher teirs of subscriptions you gain a small bonus in cash shop money, the ESO plan doesn't seem to support this, will this be a change considered in future?
    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
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  • sparafucilsarwb17_ESO
    sparafucilsarwb17_ESO
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    Canceled me and my wife's sub.
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  • ZOS_JessicaFolsom
    ZOS_JessicaFolsom
    Community Manager
    Cydone wrote: »
    So basically you guys have taken the TOR route of F2P? Gimp everyone that isn't a sub with less XP, gold, access to content and give "cash shop" currency for being a sub. Why can't you guys take what Guild Wars 2 did with their F2P system?? It is the best, least restrictive, F2P model around. TOR's is BAD.

    We are not decreasing the current progression rates (XP, gold, etc.) like some other games have chosen to do in the past when their business model changes. ESO Plus simply provides a little extra XP and gold on top of what the current rates already are.
    Jessica Folsom
    Associate Director of Community - ZeniMax Online Studios
    Facebook | Twitter | Twitch | Tumblr | Instagram | YouTube | Support
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    Staff Post
  • Epsilon_Echo
    Epsilon_Echo
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    Cydone wrote: »
    So basically you guys have taken the TOR route of F2P? Gimp everyone that isn't a sub with less XP, gold, access to content and give "cash shop" currency for being a sub. Why can't you guys take what Guild Wars 2 did with their F2P system?? It is the best, least restrictive, F2P model around. TOR's is BAD.

    We are not decreasing the current progression rates (XP, gold, etc.) like some other games have chosen to do in the past when their business model changes. ESO Plus simply provides a little extra XP and gold on top of what the current rates already are.

    Like the extra exp in 1.5? *srs face*
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  • Tyr
    Tyr
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    One negative effect of a system like this is that more time is spend creating new stuff for the cash shop than to fix bugs with stuff that have already been sold.

    So the fixing of problems in the game will slow down.

    Well I disagree here. Sub players will be getting everything from the cash shop with the free currency you get with the sub. The only way the devs are making content for the cash shop exclusively is if you can't afford all of it with the currency they give you or with gold to crowns conversion.

    For example: You've got 20 cosmetic items in the cash shop and 2 mounts.
    You get your 3000 crowns every month which can buy you 5 or 6 of the cosmetic items and they release 3 or 4 more each update. Eventually you can buy all the cosmetics and pets without paying any more real money or you can spend some real money to get it all right away and spend the rest of your crowns on boosts or gold.

    Of course if the development of cash shop items outpaces the sub players ability to buy it without spending more money, then you can say they are shafting the sub players. At this point it's an a la carte model with the sub players getting everything developed anyway.
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  • smrthiefx
    smrthiefx
    Soul Shriven
    Very disappointed!!!
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  • TX12001rwb17_ESO
    TX12001rwb17_ESO
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    Zenimax take the hint NO-ONE wants this stop it now your killing your game
    I agree fully, if only Zenimax thought like that we wouldn't be in this ugly predicament.

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  • PSDB
    PSDB
    So its out of the closet!

    But how do we know if its bad or good or better? Its all still speculation. The Crown shop is not online, we do not know the prices within it. Let me write down some lines:

    F2P? B2P?
    Its Buy 2 Play first. Not Free to Play. So those people who we are afraid of are not becoming a part of our community. And I mean those toxic people who go for free to play and spit out the absolute worst nonsense and trying to destroy a game from within. They have to pay at least 50 to 60 Euro. I think that is a great barrier for those poor toxic trolls.

    Example of 180 days ESO Plus sub:
    I have a 180 days sub. Always had and I love it.

    But what do I get from a 180Days ESO plus (god what a bad marketing name, roast the dude who came up with that name): Do we know what it costs? The same, less? or more?
    1. 9000 crowns at the start of each 180-day membership period
    2. Access to all downloadable content for the duration of membership
    3. Exclusive character progression bonuses for the duration of membership
    4. 10% bonus to experience point gain
    5. 10% bonus to crafting research
    6. 10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
    7. 10% bonus to gold acquisition

    So in those 180 days I can buy for my trials, Vet. Dungeons all kinds of potions, food?
    This means that having a sub to ESO Plus I don't have to grind flowers, cook up food and make potions anymore. So more quality time for raiding and playing the game like I do.

    But as it sits for now, I don't know if 9000 is enough for 180 days. If you do trials, vet. dung daily I don't think so. So you still have to grind later on in those days. Or get them from your guild members ofc. But still someone needs to grind and make the food or potions.

    10% increase in Char Progression is nice, but the gold thingy probably makes everything more expensive. There is more gold in the game, and more gold in the game makes the prices go up. So that 10% is relative. Everyone in the trading guilds are aiming their prices to the Super Rich % gamers in ESO. I know I would...

    For those who have a addict to Alting, that is good. You get faster to lvl50, yah! 10% XP gain incl crafting inspiration is nice to have.

    But only have access to DLC when ESO Plus is active raises some questions:
    If its a B2P game, I think and hope all the dlc's are also B2P. As soon you want to play the game free after the initial pricetag of ESO you still can play the DLC's if you bought them.

    Example: ESO is 60Euro, 30days ESO plus with all the dlc's. Its so good fun, I want to play the dlc's but i don't want the eso plus sub. Cause..yeah I am hardcore like that... :) Can I buy the dlc's and still play it?

    Can you buy additional Crowns in the shop? This makes the game for raiding super easy if you have the money to spent.

    My personal opinion on this move of ESO:
    1. Crown Shop sounds really scary because "shop" within a MMO is a metaphor for P2W. I hope it will never be the case!
    2. ESO Plus, wtf...marketing manager...get your arse shaved and kicked! So much lore within ESO / Tamriel and you come up with Plus...lol...
    3. The new Sub: give me more quality time gaming for hopefully the same amount of euro's spent.
    4. Its B2P, like GW2, this is still viable and not prone to get overrun by the poor toxic F2P Trolls.
    5. We need to know asap how much a potion costs on VR14 and beyond. Food can also be bought? This way we can make calculations.
    6. DLC's must be B2P also...if you are not a Eso plus sub. So you can play too!


    my two cents...its dinner time here...so no more..time to write up...more...details...and questions :)

    Cheers,
    Rhomark VR14 Sorc.











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  • daswahnsinn
    daswahnsinn
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    Cydone wrote: »
    So basically you guys have taken the TOR route of F2P? Gimp everyone that isn't a sub with less XP, gold, access to content and give "cash shop" currency for being a sub. Why can't you guys take what Guild Wars 2 did with their F2P system?? It is the best, least restrictive, F2P model around. TOR's is BAD.

    We are not decreasing the current progression rates (XP, gold, etc.) like some other games have chosen to do in the past when their business model changes. ESO Plus simply provides a little extra XP and gold on top of what the current rates already are.

    So now you'll get 336 gold after a quest, pre-vet and 636 for vet.
    | | daswahnsinn | Vet 16 Nord Dragon Knight | Bow/Dual Wield/Two-Handed Sword| DPS | | Warrior of the EbonHeart Pact | |
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  • reften
    reften
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    ok, i'm slow.

    So ESO is going ftp?
    Reften
    Bosmer (Wood Elf)
    Moonlight Crew (RIP), Misfitz (RIP), Victorem Guild

    VR16 NB, Stam build, Max all crafts.

    Azuras & Trueflame. Mostly PvP, No alts.

    Semi-retired till the lag is fixed.

    Love the Packers, Bourbon, and ESO...one of those will eventually kill me.
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  • Desdemonte
    Desdemonte
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    ZOS has done nothing but lie to their fan base. I will not be getting involved with another game if Matt Firor, etc are involved again. Ever.

    /sub cancelled.
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  • FoxyKitten
    FoxyKitten
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    As I see it, this is not Buy To Win, the stuff you will buy does not grant you better skills, it's probably just more fluff stuff for appearances like those silly vanity pets, pretty costumes, etc..
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  • MrGhosty
    MrGhosty
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    ForsakeMe wrote: »
    I have 30-days left on my prepaid sub, I'm not going to renew it. Every game I have played with a f2p with or without paywall has been unenjoyable because of the immature community chats and elitists groups that don't help anyone. Sorry but I'll go back to Bethesda's single player games now and wait for other MMOs to come out this year.

    Sad, I never figured ZOS would go f2p option.

    I hate to break it to you, but that already exists. Buy 2 Play could very well be of great benefit to this game, if the company has to earn your money for every bit of DLC we may see it happen more consistently. It is entirely possible that we'll see greater turnaround in development times if it is successful as they'll be able to bring more people on.

    That said, while I am prepared to wait and see before flipping out I am extremely disappointed in ZOS. I'm not concerned about the change, a game company will of course change it aims to remain productive and it is expected of a business. What bothers me is the double talk, quiet dealing, and terrible communication about the state of the game.
    "It is a time of strife and unrest. Armies of revenants and dark spirits manifest in every corner of Tamriel. Winters grow colder and crops fail. Mystics are plagued by nightmares and portents of doom."
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  • TX12001rwb17_ESO
    TX12001rwb17_ESO
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    Imagine how many children will now be ingame whining that the level 3 skeleton killed them...I am currently unsure of the date please tell me it is april fools and this is one big joke.
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  • TX12001rwb17_ESO
    TX12001rwb17_ESO
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    Dekkameron wrote: »
    This only happened i think because of the console players whining about having to pay a subscription...
    they ruined everything now we have even more reason to hate them.

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  • Siluen
    Siluen
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    I have a question: I'm a Dutch person that buys sub with iDeal, therefore it is not recurring. A few months ago I bought a 180 day sub that will not yet be over during the transition. The FAQ is giving me mixed signals, one part saying that without a recurring sub you'll attain the amount of Crowns as described above (9000 for 180 days), and another saying that I'll receive Crowns as per the amount of subscription I will have -left- on my account. I am wondering what it is going to be. :)
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  • DerAlleinTiger
    DerAlleinTiger
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    This makes me so sick right now. So much time and love put into this game. All of it meaningless with a single article post. Going to enjoy ESO as long as I can until this update hits. At that point... Probably going to be moving back to Skyrim and the backlog of games I've had piled up thanks to the wonder ESO has been. As for what it will be, I sincerely hope it's something I could possibly enjoy, but I'm keeping a realistic view and thinking "Not really..."

    To think that throughout my classwork for game design, I've been looking up to ZOS and thinking "Man, I want to work for them when I get through this." Now? Forget that. Respect lost.
    Edited by DerAlleinTiger on January 21, 2015 5:03PM
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  • Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO
    :-( Free To Play ;-( soon to be Pay to Win...

    I have seen this with Everquest 2 and Dungeons and Dragons Online. First they promise that for VIPs / Abo-Users nothing will change.
    That you cannot buy anything at the shops that "helps" managing quests / dungeons faster/better/easier.

    After the second or third DLC, you could buy stat, skill, exp-gain and equipment enhancing stuff.
    And on top of that, quest and dungeons became so hard and difficult, that you could only manage them at the harder difficulty when having bought certain extra stuff - classic pay to win.

    On top of that you always had problems with Free-To-Play people, because you could not see that they were FTP... and when you were looking for people to fill your groups, you wasted a lot of time ... "Oh sorry, did not know that dungeon belongs to a DLC... sorry I am FTP..."

    Or parasites that begged you to buy guest-tickets, so they can go into that dungeon for free - making you pay for them.

    I am not looking forward this.
    Edited by Rhian-Skybladeb16_ESO on January 21, 2015 5:12PM
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  • Jitterbug
    Jitterbug
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    All things being equal it sounds interesting. I kinda like cash shops, and the game in and of itself is fun, just plain fun.
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  • jwboudreau1b16_ESO
    jwboudreau1b16_ESO
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    Sure, you'll get a lot of short term subscribers, but the game is going to lose so many long term subscribers. I'm so sad that a game that I love is dying :(
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  • TX12001rwb17_ESO
    TX12001rwb17_ESO
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    I write this poem in memory of Elder Scrolls Online........

    ESO you were such a good game, but you failed when all the Free 2 play came, Zenimax has nothing to gain oh ESO you may never be the same,

    Can't you leave it be? I would rather pay the fee then play alongside thee who play for free, I would rather pay the part then play with those who lack heart and mine feels as if it was pierced by a poison tipped dart.

    Is this the end? they say time will mend but
    does Zenimax Listen who do they think they are Dissin?

    We are not fools yet you treat us like stools, you said this game would never be free 2 play you once made a promise that never would give us this day and we abide by your trust but you broke that promise and now the game seems to rust and if this keeps up shall be nothing but dust oh pray greatly this does not happen we must.

    You decided to give in and make it Free to Play, this is indeed a very dark day for the kel and must I end this poem with the words this will not end well.

    Incase anyone forgot KEL means Elder Scroll in the Dovah language.
    Edited by TX12001rwb17_ESO on January 21, 2015 6:57PM
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This discussion has been closed.