swarm is being nerfed soon?

jelliedsoup

So sick of bats in PvP. If you really lucky you can get it coupled with bolt or talons. This has been going on for months in PvP, cheap and easy kills.

Vizier

Ya, it is. The pre-nerf whining has already started. Get your pop-corn ready. Going to be a good show.

jelliedsoup

Had a front for seat for a while. Looking forward to the whining.

Gillysan

IDK, not into the whole emo vampire thing although I might make my Achievement farming character one for a little while. 5 of us in pvp killed this vampire emperor over and over again, we all got the Emperor achievement. It's hard to avoid these empeoror bats in a zerg because of everything that is on the screen, but in smaller group action they are easy enough to deal with.

The issue isn't just the batswarm, it's a combination of things. If anything the unending stunlock and shield stacking exploits(?) are a much bigger concern IMO.

Welka

Vizier wrote: »

Ya, it is. The pre-nerf whining has already started. Get your pop-corn ready. Going to be a good show.

Link? I could do with s good laugh please :P

Voodoo

..another day. another anti-swarm post.

briandivisionb16_ESO

Dying to batswarm? #YoureDoingItWrong

jelliedsoup

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Dying to batswarm? #YoureDoingItWrong

Love to hear how you stop it.

You get talons, fear or bolt escape then swarm. Given the lag, by the time you break the stun and roll clear you'll be either dead or about 20% health left, if the vamp doesn't follow you.

#hashtagsarelame

MornaBaine

Batsward has ALREADY been recently nerfed. They need to leave it alone now.

Tapio75

Who stays in the swarm of bats? Indeed.. You know it hits you and you know you will not hit the target for damage so just run away and have a healer with you like its supposed to be. Please do not ask to destroy great abilities since you can not handle defeat.

Actually, how many vampires there are in PVP anyways? Never encountered one myself but some statistics would be nice.. I find it hard to believe that they are as big issue as complainers want to believe.

Lunerdog

Would you stand in a swarm of bees ?

Would you stand in a swarm of wasps ?

Would you stand in a swarm of flying weresharks ?

No ?

So why do you stand in the bat swarm ?

The problem isn't batswarm, the problem is you...

Goibot

Why does ZOS hate vamps so much? In 1.5 they are nerfing our swarm heal and of all stupid things going to make us glow in PVP.

I think all they are going to accomplish is pissing off a lot of players and guilds.

You need to rethink this one ZOS

Jitterbug

Lunerdog wrote: »

Would you stand in a swarm of flying weresharks ?

someone should make that into a movie...

Jitterbug

Goibot wrote: »

make us glow in PVP.

huh? how does that work?

Goibot

Jitterbug wrote: »

Goibot wrote: »

make us glow in PVP.

huh? how does that work?

Quotes from 1.5 patch notes on the PTS:
•Vampire •Devouring Swarm (morph of Bat Swarm): Reduced the healing on this ability by 30%.

Guild •Fighters Guild
•Evil Hunter: This ability now highlights vampire player characters in Cyrodiil

This is too much hate on the vamps and will just result in lost subs

Jitterbug

Yeah that does appear to suck. Both of them - I rarely use bats in PvP but they are incremental to my leveling. And the highlight just seems stupid... Will players with Evil Hunter equipped also glow if you are a vampire then?

OrangeTheCat

Goibot wrote: »

Jitterbug wrote: »

Goibot wrote: »

make us glow in PVP.

huh? how does that work?

Quotes from 1.5 patch notes on the PTS:
•Vampire •Devouring Swarm (morph of Bat Swarm): Reduced the healing on this ability by 30%.

Guild •Fighters Guild
•Evil Hunter: This ability now highlights vampire player characters in Cyrodiil

This is too much hate on the vamps and will just result in lost subs

In my case what it means is saving my sub (and . Maybe others' as well).

Sharee

Tapio75 wrote: »

Who stays in the swarm of bats? Indeed.. You know it hits you and you know you will not hit the target for damage so just run away and have a healer with you like its supposed to be. Please do not ask to destroy great abilities since you can not handle defeat.

Typical situation: keep siege. Two zergs near each other firing every spell in their arsenal at each other. Fireworks going off everywhere around you. You can barely see your own character in the middle of the screen through the blinding effects.

When in this situation a sorcerer activates clouding swarm, streaks into the middle of your group, and starts spamming pulsar(a pulsar without any visible effect, mind you) you have zero chance to see where he is, hell, only an experienced player will even realize he is there in the firstplace. Everyone else will just see their HP drop for no apparent reason(or too many apparent reasons, due to the fireworks going on around them).

The bats you say people should avoid are next to invisible in this situation, and even if you somehow catch a glimpse of the small black shapes for a second to realize what is happening, they are moving so chaotically it is impossible to say what direction the whole whirling cloud is moving in. Often the only hint that you are under attack is the pop-pop-pop sound of the bats hitting you.

1v1, in an open terrain, with no other effects interfering, sure, you know it hits you, and you can make out the swarm and avoid it. But in situations like above, not so much.

jelliedsoup

@Lunerdog‌ Not sure if you PvP much, but 3 or 4 emps spam swarm. Just makes it a bat fest.

Coupled with a aoe cc + lag makes it just painful.

jelliedsoup

@Sharee‌ well said. I'm not sure if vamps play ignorant to this as it suits their purpose. Simply saying get out of the way is not a solution.

WraithAzraiel

Sharee wrote: »

Tapio75 wrote: »

Who stays in the swarm of bats? Indeed.. You know it hits you and you know you will not hit the target for damage so just run away and have a healer with you like its supposed to be. Please do not ask to destroy great abilities since you can not handle defeat.

Typical situation: keep siege. Two zergs near each other firing every spell in their arsenal at each other. Fireworks going off everywhere around you. You can barely see your own character in the middle of the screen through the blinding effects.

When in this situation a sorcerer activates clouding swarm, streaks into the middle of your group, and starts spamming pulsar(a pulsar without any visible effect, mind you) you have zero chance to see where he is, hell, only an experienced player will even realize he is there in the firstplace. Everyone else will just see their HP drop for no apparent reason(or too many apparent reasons, due to the fireworks going on around them).

The bats you say people should avoid are next to invisible in this situation, and even if you somehow catch a glimpse of the small black shapes for a second to realize what is happening, they are moving so chaotically it is impossible to say what direction the whole whirling cloud is moving in. Often the only hint that you are under attack is the pop-pop-pop sound of the bats hitting you.

1v1, in an open terrain, with no other effects interfering, sure, you know it hits you, and you can make out the swarm and avoid it. But in situations like above, not so much.

Better spatial awareness. There's not only visual queue's but audio queue's as well. Hell there are times I don't even look at the screen, I watch my health bar and listen. I hear squeaking and see my health start to go down, I'm dodge rolling in every direction until my health stops draining or I'm dead.


Would you all feel better if they put a red ring on the ground?

THE ONLY PROBLEM with Bat Swarm is how cheap it costs and how EASILY some builds (normally Sorcs and DKs) garner enough Ultimate to use this skill again and again and again.

Nerfing the health it gives you isn't going to do anything, people are still going to use it and abuse it because as I've stated TIME AND F*&KING TIME again. Vampire was never the problem.

Broken Ultimate generation.

WraithAzraiel

jelliedsoup wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Dying to batswarm? #YoureDoingItWrong

Love to hear how you stop it.

You get talons, fear or bolt escape then swarm. Given the lag, by the time you break the stun and roll clear you'll be either dead or about 20% health left, if the vamp doesn't follow you.

#hashtagsarelame

Immovable.

WraithAzraiel

Personally I'd rather see nerfs to Impulse than nerfs to Bat Swarm. Cuz holy hell is it broken.

oldRagespell

Impulse's radius is gonna be nerfed too
Oh and i love when these Vamps are posting the "NERF US AND I WILL UNSUB" crap.

ShadowHvo

I just don't get this, I use Batswarm for my ranged bow build, but I never get the high results as everyone seems, or rather claims to be done.

Neither am I one who abused the batswarm ultimate stacking or any form of combination with ult decrease cost gear when worn

But what the hell am I doing wrong, when I barely take 5 - 10% of someone's health with batswarm (Which without doubt gets healed as soon as it's done, if not even while it's going on!) When I can take someone out easily with only three attacks normally with my assassin build.

EDIT: Don't get me wrong here, I ain't actually looking for tips since I'm doing fine without batswarm. But I just don't get how some people see this big high results, and I have yet to see ANY single batswarm, take ANYONE down to 20 - 30% health, as a previous poster claimed. The max I've seen someone been taken down to is around 65% and that was a Vet 12 (At the time) using it on a level 21 I believe.

I gladly admit that the stacking of Batswarms was overkill, and it was good they removed the ability to do that. I believe that PvP should be nice and balanced. But people keep whining and whining about vampires, yet they don't do anything to counter it.

Come on, use silverbolt and expert hunter and you'll kill any of my fellow kindred if you're smart and not being dumb.

Also, neither do I care about the decrease in health returned with the batswarm, it's just silly that so many keeps whining because they don't know what to do with themselves, when expert monster hunters out there takes us out as easy as mere critters.

starkerealm

Ragespell wrote: »

Impulse's radius is gonna be nerfed too
Oh and i love when these Vamps are posting the "NERF US AND I WILL UNSUB" crap.

"NERF ME AND I WILL UNSUB... as soon as I get vampire to a level where I can actually use batswarm?"

Vizier

Main problems with Bat Swarm are that in moves with the caster allowing for damage on top of impulse, turns them invisible, generates health and ultimate AND is difficult to see.

Most of the time I see "Bat Swarm" on the death recap I never saw the bats.

Some of the posters saying swarm isn't the problem have a point. The synergy between swarm and things like the endless stun lock on talons combined with impulse and the ability to move with whoever might make a decent attempt to get out of the AOE to put the nail in the coffin, can be rightly OP.

The thing is. They have to nerf some aspect of the combination and are focused on the Vamp abilities.

They should just make the BS a stationary ultimate then deal with the endless stun lock of talons.

Gillysan

Tapio75 wrote: »

Who stays in the swarm of bats? Indeed.. You know it hits you and you know you will not hit the target for damage so just run away and have a healer with you like its supposed to be. Please do not ask to destroy great abilities since you can not handle defeat.

Actually, how many vampires there are in PVP anyways? Never encountered one myself but some statistics would be nice.. I find it hard to believe that they are as big issue as complainers want to believe.

I call BS on this observation. Do you really pvp? Every Emp I have fought uses this. Also, as stated by others, it's not so much just this ability that is the killer, but the synergy created with some other things that makes it quite deadly. I see it employed quite frequently.

An Emp can be killed, I have the achievement to show for that, mainly thanks to others because I purposely like to level slow and am a lowly v5. I still think the main issue is during a moderately sized fight to a big zerg, the batswarm becomes increasingly hard to see. Sometimes the vamp is on you before you can react. I can keep myself alive a few more seconds by dodging a few times but then I'm out of stamina and I was never able to move far enough away. Sometimes I survive because as I was dodging someone saw people being injured and tossed out a few heals. The main problem in pvp as I see it is actually seeing the batswarm activated.

So maybe instead of tying red balloons to all vamps writs they should consider an easier to see ability activation animation or particle effect so people have a chance to see it coming. (yeah, saw that comment and all I could picture was 9 year old mall vampires running around after mommy tied a red balloon to their wrist and sent them off with a pat on the head)

jelliedsoup

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

jelliedsoup wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Dying to batswarm? #YoureDoingItWrong

Love to hear how you stop it.

You get talons, fear or bolt escape then swarm. Given the lag, by the time you break the stun and roll clear you'll be either dead or about 20% health left, if the vamp doesn't follow you.

#hashtagsarelame

Immovable.

Sadly I thought you would say that.

ZeroTheCat

jelliedsoup wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

jelliedsoup wrote: »

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Dying to batswarm? #YoureDoingItWrong

Love to hear how you stop it.

You get talons, fear or bolt escape then swarm. Given the lag, by the time you break the stun and roll clear you'll be either dead or about 20% health left, if the vamp doesn't follow you.

#hashtagsarelame

Immovable.

Sadly I thought you would say that.

The thing is that it doesn't help. The vamp just follow you and you die anyway! All other powerful ULTs are stationary. Make bat swarm stationary and Im fine with it.

Elvikun

Just on a sidenote, when you say "Haha, batswarm is getting nerfed, L2P!" you do realise that "L2P" is just as well or even more so applied to you if you are getting killed by batswarms in the first place, right? ... Right? This is all just satire, no?

Nevermind.

On a serious note, I think the bigger issue is that batswarm and other things need adjustment, especially in the mechanics department and how they work together, not nerf. This "New update brings you nerf of <...> sponsored by people hurt on feelings over losing." leads to a bad rabbithole noone really wants to go in.