Shadow Cloak is still not fixed!

Yusuf

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

Grim13

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

Yusuf

Grim13 wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

I use it every day in pvp. if you're not smart enough to figure out what a detectionpotion is, that's not the devs' problem

Jacques Berge

Yusuf wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

I use it every day in pvp. if you're not smart enough to figure out what a detectionpotion is, that's not the devs' problem

Until they make a potion for a magic shield and allow for the use of poisons that REALIABLY reduce healing I say detect pots works againsts cloak is a load of BS... There is no other potion in the game that can be used to nullify another classes abilities. It is simply a matter of balance.

Stannum

What means 90% fixed? That's not furry logic. It can be either fixed or not.

Vizier

Sypherioth wrote: »

Use dodge roll then cloack with bow and haste retreat it saved my ass alot

What he said... Cloak typically works pretty well for me to disengage. And with use of a good magika pot I can 7 or 10 times get out of line of sight to grab some distance to get removed from combat. It's not nearly as bad as it used to be where I'd have to be 1/2 mile from the battle to restealth.

I can see having a harder time stealthing after cloak if I'm still in line of sight but once line of sight is broken cloak should instantly remove from combat.

But the guys acting like cloak doesn't work at all and stealth is totally broken need to get off that horse. Stealth/cloak is so much better than it used to be. I use it all the time to harass and escape the enemy. Very fun. There are those that from time to time just can't be avoided for some and is likely detect pots in action. Dodgeroll-cloak gets you distance and speed to further widen the gap. I've been getting away from players with mage-light with that technique. I also use Night Silence set so there is that.

Edit: I will say the after patch bug right now that pops stealth when switching weapons is pretty bad. That's gotta get fixed.

TheBucket

Speed pots are awesome for a quick getaway

And path or darkness

GreyPilgrim

Razzak wrote: »

Is invisibility supposed to work whenever you want? Meaning, if you attack someone from the cloak, and then cloak again, how is your opponent supposed to counter that? Wouldn't that make NBs OP?
I apologize If I am missing the point.

Invisible is not invulnerable. Pretty much any AoE breaks stealth, so it you're popping it in a toe-to-toe fight, all the opponent really needs to do is drop an AoE to break you out of it. and this game has just a few AoE's...

also, all DoT's break cloak, unless you use the morph which removes DoT's (which sacrifices the huge crit bonus that makes popping in and out of cloak in combat so valuable). So, once again, any opponent who DoT's you effectively blocks the functionality of Shadow Cloak and it's critical boost.

Basically, stealth melee approach in this game requires a lot of skill and practice to not die a lot, and it also requires opponents who haven't figured out its weaknesses, or are busy fighting someone else.

Fortunately, there are enough of these that I still gets ma kills

TheBull

Sorcerer Curse is ignoring cloak. It's not being removed and dealing damge, thus breaking cloak.
@ZOS_GinaBruno‌ I'm 100% sure of this. Plus look into this,

Jacques Berge

Dark cloak only removes DoTs... Curse is not a DoT... It is a status effect.... Status effects are not DoTs and are not removed by cloak.

TheBull

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Dark cloak only removes DoTs... Curse is not a DoT... It is a status effect.... Status effects are not DoTs and are not removed by cloak.

Cloak removes negative effects. It's always removed the damage portion of curse.

Jacques Berge

Read the tool tip... Dark cloak does not remove negative effects. I've never seen cloak remove the damage from curse.

TheBull

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Read the tool tip... Dark cloak does not remove negative effects. I've never seen cloak remove the damage from curse.

As of this patch it reads that way.

Jacques Berge

Hmm... Well that is an issue... He's a list of negative effects not removed by cloak

Disease- healing debuff
Weakness to elements
Impulse max hp reduction
Ambush increase damage debuff
Encase snare
Force siphon
Mark target!!!

I'm done listing these. Dark cloak has never remove NEGATIVE effects... On damage over time effects

Poison
Burn
Bleed
Cripple
Agony

TheBull

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Hmm... Well that is an issue... He's a list of negative effects not removed by cloak

Disease- healing debuff
Weakness to elements
Impulse max hp reduction
Ambush increase damage debuff
Encase snare
Force siphon
Mark target!!!

I'm done listing these. Dark cloak has never remove NEGATIVE effects... On damage over time effects

Poison
Burn
Bleed
Cripple
Agony

We all know what it does/did. Go ahead, look up any NB build video. Tell me how the tool tip reads. Again, curse never broke cloak. The damage portion was removed and you would stay cloaked.

Jacques Berge

I have experienced the opposite of what you're saying... Agree to disagree. Hopefully, a mod will comment.

GwaynLoki

TheBull wrote: »

Sorcerer Curse is ignoring cloak. It's not being removed and dealing damge, thus breaking cloak.
@ZOS_GinaBruno‌ I'm 100% sure of this. Plus look into this,

But this has been there before the latest patch. It's not something that was introduced with 1.5.

Vizier

I part of the confusion is that the tool tip used to indicate negative effects were removed. At least I'm pretty certain that's what I read when I first started playing.

Cody

Yusuf wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

I use it every day in pvp. if you're not smart enough to figure out what a detectionpotion is, that's not the devs' problem

it Is the devs problem.

the potion s

Vizier wrote: »

Sypherioth wrote: »

Use dodge roll then cloack with bow and haste retreat it saved my ass alot

What he said... Cloak typically works pretty well for me to disengage. And with use of a good magika pot I can 7 or 10 times get out of line of sight to grab some distance to get removed from combat. It's not nearly as bad as it used to be where I'd have to be 1/2 mile from the battle to restealth.

I can see having a harder time stealthing after cloak if I'm still in line of sight but once line of sight is broken cloak should instantly remove from combat.

But the guys acting like cloak doesn't work at all and stealth is totally broken need to get off that horse. Stealth/cloak is so much better than it used to be. I use it all the time to harass and escape the enemy. Very fun. There are those that from time to time just can't be avoided for some and is likely detect pots in action. Dodgeroll-cloak gets you distance and speed to further widen the gap. I've been getting away from players with mage-light with that technique. I also use Night Silence set so there is that.

Edit: I will say the after patch bug right now that pops stealth when switching weapons is pretty bad. That's gotta get fixed.

unless cloak no longer breaks while near enemy players in PvP.... its broken.

works well for PvE, that much credit I will give

Grim13

Yusuf wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

I use it every day in pvp. if you're not smart enough to figure out what a detectionpotion is, that's not the devs' problem

I'm not talking about being seen by detection pots... I'm talking about cloak breaking far more frequently then your 10%.

Many things still break it.

Hell, smartass, even invisibilty potions can be broken in PvP, ffs!

Stealth and Cloak are still broken in PvP and have been for 6+ months.

Until it's fixed 100%... we have every right to return here to remind the Devs that their work is not done.

Jacques Berge

I'm usually more positive in these forums but for Mara's sake this is bad. I'll be honest... I was feeling a little over powered for a minute, killing players with 3.5k hp in 3 hits and still able to win more brawly type fights. but come on!!! 35% Melee stealth attack reduction? Swapping weapons now breaks stealth AND cloak?... Thanks Obama

Don't even get me started on "detection pots"... Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but seriously, F**K you if you think it's balanced to have one class have its signature move countered by wormwood and f**king cornflower. Until I get poisons that reduce healing and can't be purged, fire resist pots, and reflect magic pots I say F**K your detect pots.

Vizier

Cody wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

Cloak is 90% fixed already. The only thing that's kicking you out of it even though it shouldn't are physical charges or gapclosers.

Every projectile that's shot at you misses and doesn't pop you out even if it hits.
Like i already said Invasion, Ambush and Stampede are the only skills left that kick you out even though it wasn't like that pre-patch.

A bit off-topic though but imho i think the npc-honour-guards are all a bit OP for seeing you even in cloak and THEY will pop you out too.

Hope this has cleared up a few things for the op.

90% fixed!?

bwahahahahahahahahahahhhhhhhhhhhahhhhhahhahahhahahh

Wrong.

I use it every day in pvp. if you're not smart enough to figure out what a detectionpotion is, that's not the devs' problem

it Is the devs problem.

the potion s

Vizier wrote: »

Sypherioth wrote: »

Use dodge roll then cloack with bow and haste retreat it saved my ass alot

What he said... Cloak typically works pretty well for me to disengage. And with use of a good magika pot I can 7 or 10 times get out of line of sight to grab some distance to get removed from combat. It's not nearly as bad as it used to be where I'd have to be 1/2 mile from the battle to restealth.

I can see having a harder time stealthing after cloak if I'm still in line of sight but once line of sight is broken cloak should instantly remove from combat.

But the guys acting like cloak doesn't work at all and stealth is totally broken need to get off that horse. Stealth/cloak is so much better than it used to be. I use it all the time to harass and escape the enemy. Very fun. There are those that from time to time just can't be avoided for some and is likely detect pots in action. Dodgeroll-cloak gets you distance and speed to further widen the gap. I've been getting away from players with mage-light with that technique. I also use Night Silence set so there is that.

Edit: I will say the after patch bug right now that pops stealth when switching weapons is pretty bad. That's gotta get fixed.

unless cloak no longer breaks while near enemy players in PvP.... its broken.

works well for PvE, that much credit I will give

Dude. Do you know how much time I spend around the enemy in PvP. I ROUTINELY extract myself from unwanted situations involving multiple enemies virtually crawling up my arse. I mean, face to face, taking damage, getting marked, sorcs with mage-light going. IT WORKS. I seriously get away with murder using cloak. it's awesome. I would recommend keeping good magika pots on hand and using purge for negating Marked Target. Very useful.

Cloak used to be fubar. It broke on everything. That is simply not the case now. it works very well.

Edit: Addition- unless I give the wrong impression. I'm not saying Cloak is totally working as intended. The weapon swap break of stealth and cloak is Bull CRAP. Cloak also needs to be able to put one back in stealth at least if they are out of line of sight of enemy that popped their stealth in the first place. Detect pots need to go away. (the reason is because we need to be able to rule them out as a reason cloak is breaking to actually identify the mechanical reasons it's breaking.) Then give them back when, as Jaques mentioned, poisons and such are introduced.

That said, my experience daily with cloak is it Works for 95% of what I need it to. And I spend a ton of time by myself watching the enemy and being very near them most of the time. I pass them or they pass me all the time in same exact foot steps but it's cloak that made it so they didn't see me...period. And of course the rest of times like explained above.

Yusuf

I haven't tested since 1.5 yet, is cloak being broken because of invasion and whatnot?

Jacques Berge

Yiiiiiiiiiuuuuuuuuuuuuuup!!!!

Sypherioth

Ye its annoying sometimes i can use it as escape but alot of times it break immediatly and im wasting only magicka to die anyways. It looks like if someone hits you and you cloak on same time the hit will break cloak which is crap.

Grim13

Just got chased around by pvp npcs while cloaked... yeah, it's functioning great.

Nihil

Jacques Berge wrote: »

*snip because I agree on most of this part*

Don't even get me started on "detection pots"... Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but seriously, F**K you if you think it's balanced to have one class have its signature move countered by wormwood and f**king cornflower. Until I get poisons that reduce healing and can't be purged, fire resist pots, and reflect magic pots I say F**K your detect pots.

Just to play devils advocate here and put in a different perspective. When we compare "signature" aspects of each class you have NB stealth, DK fire damage, Templars heal, and Sorcs CC (although some may argue bolt escape but the sorc has by far more CC). NB is countered by a potion that has a 30 second cool down, which if you are fighting some one that means that if they used it they now can't use one of their more combat efficient potions for a bit (arguably giving you an advantage). DK fire damage is constantly reduced by having a glyph on a jewelry slot if you choose to spec that way. Templars are probably the one with the least draw backs due to affects as the disease debuff only has a 10% chance of procing every few seconds... so that one I will give you (unless someone else can counter that). Sorcs hard CC's can be countered by an unmovable potion, or just blocking for the most case. So every class had some aspect put into the game that a player can spec to counter one of their major advantages.

Vizier

Nihil wrote: »

Jacques Berge wrote: »

*snip because I agree on most of this part*

Don't even get me started on "detection pots"... Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but seriously, F**K you if you think it's balanced to have one class have its signature move countered by wormwood and f**king cornflower. Until I get poisons that reduce healing and can't be purged, fire resist pots, and reflect magic pots I say F**K your detect pots.

Just to play devils advocate here and put in a different perspective. When we compare "signature" aspects of each class you have NB stealth, DK fire damage, Templars heal, and Sorcs CC (although some may argue bolt escape but the sorc has by far more CC). NB is countered by a potion that has a 30 second cool down, which if you are fighting some one that means that if they used it they now can't use one of their more combat efficient potions for a bit (arguably giving you an advantage). DK fire damage is constantly reduced by having a glyph on a jewelry slot if you choose to spec that way. Templars are probably the one with the least draw backs due to affects as the disease debuff only has a 10% chance of procing every few seconds... so that one I will give you (unless someone else can counter that). Sorcs hard CC's can be countered by an unmovable potion, or just blocking for the most case. So every class had some aspect put into the game that a player can spec to counter one of their major advantages.

Not to get too into this but your argument doesn't really work. Everyone can get Magelight which is the primary counter to stealth and cloak. From what I understand though, detection pots have an increased radius of detection. Then you factor in who sees who first and or when really a NB is trying to cloak. Typically when about ready to die and are WTF OH CRAP spamming cloak.

I don't think it's fair at all but ZOS IMHO is throwing the community a bone because they'd be QQ all the way home without it. Cloak all in all is just fine with a couple reliability tweaks needed.

Nihil

Vizier wrote: »

Nihil wrote: »

Jacques Berge wrote: »

*snip because I agree on most of this part*

Don't even get me started on "detection pots"... Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but seriously, F**K you if you think it's balanced to have one class have its signature move countered by wormwood and f**king cornflower. Until I get poisons that reduce healing and can't be purged, fire resist pots, and reflect magic pots I say F**K your detect pots.

Just to play devils advocate here and put in a different perspective. When we compare "signature" aspects of each class you have NB stealth, DK fire damage, Templars heal, and Sorcs CC (although some may argue bolt escape but the sorc has by far more CC). NB is countered by a potion that has a 30 second cool down, which if you are fighting some one that means that if they used it they now can't use one of their more combat efficient potions for a bit (arguably giving you an advantage). DK fire damage is constantly reduced by having a glyph on a jewelry slot if you choose to spec that way. Templars are probably the one with the least draw backs due to affects as the disease debuff only has a 10% chance of procing every few seconds... so that one I will give you (unless someone else can counter that). Sorcs hard CC's can be countered by an unmovable potion, or just blocking for the most case. So every class had some aspect put into the game that a player can spec to counter one of their major advantages.

Not to get too into this but your argument doesn't really work. Everyone can get Magelight which is the primary counter to stealth and cloak. From what I understand though, detection pots have an increased radius of detection. Then you factor in who sees who first and or when really a NB is trying to cloak. Typically when about ready to die and are WTF OH CRAP spamming cloak.

I don't think it's fair at all but ZOS IMHO is throwing the community a bone because they'd be QQ all the way home without it. Cloak all in all is just fine with a couple reliability tweaks needed.

I was mainly trying to point out that all classes had counters in the form of non skill abilities (as their are other skills to counter classes ability if players wanted to spec them), and if one is unfair all of them should be. To spec to counter a build you are taking on disadvantages be it putting potions on cool down or taking up a glyph spot (would nb complain less if there was a glyph that increased detection range by X?)

Stealth/invisability i would say is one of the trickiest abilitiest to balance correctly as it can easily become overpowered, or underwelming. I like how eso did it so far, well onc ethey fix the bugs and make it so tab locking goes away once someone goes invis (if that is still happening).

Jacques Berge

Nihil wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

Nihil wrote: »

Jacques Berge wrote: »

*snip because I agree on most of this part*

Don't even get me started on "detection pots"... Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but seriously, F**K you if you think it's balanced to have one class have its signature move countered by wormwood and f**king cornflower. Until I get poisons that reduce healing and can't be purged, fire resist pots, and reflect magic pots I say F**K your detect pots.

Just to play devils advocate here and put in a different perspective. When we compare "signature" aspects of each class you have NB stealth, DK fire damage, Templars heal, and Sorcs CC (although some may argue bolt escape but the sorc has by far more CC). NB is countered by a potion that has a 30 second cool down, which if you are fighting some one that means that if they used it they now can't use one of their more combat efficient potions for a bit (arguably giving you an advantage). DK fire damage is constantly reduced by having a glyph on a jewelry slot if you choose to spec that way. Templars are probably the one with the least draw backs due to affects as the disease debuff only has a 10% chance of procing every few seconds... so that one I will give you (unless someone else can counter that). Sorcs hard CC's can be countered by an unmovable potion, or just blocking for the most case. So every class had some aspect put into the game that a player can spec to counter one of their major advantages.

Not to get too into this but your argument doesn't really work. Everyone can get Magelight which is the primary counter to stealth and cloak. From what I understand though, detection pots have an increased radius of detection. Then you factor in who sees who first and or when really a NB is trying to cloak. Typically when about ready to die and are WTF OH CRAP spamming cloak.

I don't think it's fair at all but ZOS IMHO is throwing the community a bone because they'd be QQ all the way home without it. Cloak all in all is just fine with a couple reliability tweaks needed.

I was mainly trying to point out that all classes had counters in the form of non skill abilities (as their are other skills to counter classes ability if players wanted to spec them), and if one is unfair all of them should be. To spec to counter a build you are taking on disadvantages be it putting potions on cool down or taking up a glyph spot (would nb complain less if there was a glyph that increased detection range by X?)

Stealth/invisability i would say is one of the trickiest abilitiest to balance correctly as it can easily become overpowered, or underwelming. I like how eso did it so far, well onc ethey fix the bugs and make it so tab locking goes away once someone goes invis (if that is still happening).

Potion use has little to no draw back... considering you can have a detect/spell power/mana pot... invisibility is the class's only in-class mitigation skill and only lasts 3 secs tops... glyphs are different than potions... glyphs have large opportunity costs compared to potions... I would be fine with an increased detection area, as long as it didnt allow you to see through cloak. Magelight, and piercing mark are the only things that should see through cloak... mundane potions should not supersede magical invisibility.