So...you nerfed sneak speed stacking of item sets. But not shield stacking?

Grim13

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Every person I hear on these forums crying about class imbalance is a nightblade and most of us are sick of hearing about it

Listen, the reason you keep hearing about NBs being broken is because Zenimax haven't fixed them yet.

Many of us are far more sick of complaining about the broken, and lack of fixes, than you are reading about it.

..But we're not talking to you. We're venting to each other for a little commiseration... AND, more importantly, hoping that ZOS will one day pay attention and come good on their promises if they're forced to read enough disgruntled forum posts.

So, instead of QQ'ing about our "QQ'ing"... maybe you should take your pablum-fueled illogic somewhere that we can't bother you with our valid complaints.




PS- I don't give a rats behind if a few NBs have found success after becoming pseudo-Sorcerers... I care about the fact that several of my class's abilities have been broken since BETA...

Rylana

Nearly all of the broken/imbalanced NB skills/passives have already been fixed.

The only one that still is borked, and only under certain conditions, is the dark cloak morph. Otherwise, they all seem to work and function exactly as listed.

Mauz

Rylana wrote: »

Nearly all of the broken/imbalanced NB skills/passives have already been fixed.

The only one that still is borked, and only under certain conditions, is the dark cloak morph. Otherwise, they all seem to work and function exactly as listed.

Ah no thats not true.

- Fear which does allow to continue to block
- Shadow Cloak. There's the problem with the latency. I cast it, turn invisible-> my opponent cast a spell -> I'm visible again. In addition to latency the flight time of a projectile isnt taken into account. It's just the time spell is castet. This isnt actually a bug, it's simply doesnt work the way ZoS made it. Its broken.
- Concealed Weapon morph, weapon switch, cast of shadow cloak->speed buff disappears, youve to leave stealth and restealth again.
- For me most annoying, I cast ambush, doesnt work, I start to spam button, finally it works but now I cant stop it, it casts over and over again until my magicka is depleted. But it only appears for Ambush, not for other skills so no idea whats going wrong here, maybe input lags of server
- Ambush+Funnel Health gave 600+ healing per tick BUTONLY IF Funnel Health killed the enemy. But sometimes it only heals 8 or 12 per tick, did not found a rule for that. But if its once like that youve to wait until the hot is over otherwise you just refresh the low tick. They did not really fix it, they just capped the max possible healing but they did not fix the low tick problem. Its just a workaround.
- Soul harvest needs 500 ultimate to get max dmg. And its not 300% dmg and I would expect max dmg at 150 ultimate not at 500 for such a weak ultimate.

I could continue that list. Everything I start to test to the ground doesnt really work as soon as more than one dimension is taken into account. Abilities, passives, armor traits and bonuses. Nothing works as intended. I mean for me its fine that I cant burst everybody but I expect spells to work which I could use to not be defeated 100% of all times in case of I cant burst down someone in 2 secs.

Btw sneak speed stacking was a problem of multiplying buffs. I did sneak 10 times faster than normal. This cant be explained by +60% sneak speed from set. Same is for the sharpening trait bug. Everything ZoS made seems to multiply or even expotenciate instead of taking the sum...whyever. Simply taking the sum and you could have all bonuses together without breaking the game.

Apart from that I cant believe that the only way PvP can be played in ESO is to stand there 360° blocking and stacking shields while enemies are killed exploiting the sharpening trait bug. Btw to escape I could block cause than dmg doesnt break invisibility. Oh yeah, or I could exploit mist form + harness magicka bug after shadow cloak. That works 100%. But that cant be true, right?

This whole system is in my opinion broken not the NB. If everything would work I would be fine with my NB.

DDuke

Look, anyone with some knowledge in basic mathematics should know that there are serious problems with damage shields.

How can a skill with no cooldown make you immune to crits & absorb 1k dmg while costing below 300 magicka? It takes double the amount of resources to get rid of a shield than it does to cast one, so you can basicly just spam one button & make your opponent run out of magicka/stamina.

Now, this would pretty much require you to slot a dmg shield yourself (which is a problem in itself), but how are you going to do that if you are playing a stamina build for instance?

Simple solutions would be:

1. reduce their strength
2. make them crittable
3. increase their magicka cost

Bottom line is, it should cost less stamina/magicka to get rid of a shield than it does to cast one.

Skizer78

I kinda wish I would have had the chance to try the speed bonus but unfortunately I did not have my vampire at the level to attain the Dark Stalker ability. So I don't really have personal experience with how fast it was or was not, but I do know that if I were trying to pick off people as they rode by with my Nightblade, I think that speed would be nice to have with the inifinite horse sprint that has been active since the game started. I am not saying that it justifies having the Night Silence speed but, for all fairness if you going to remove speed exploits then it would also have to be fixed.

Ezareth

Mauz wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Nearly all of the broken/imbalanced NB skills/passives have already been fixed.

The only one that still is borked, and only under certain conditions, is the dark cloak morph. Otherwise, they all seem to work and function exactly as listed.

Ah no thats not true.

- Fear which does allow to continue to block
- Shadow Cloak. There's the problem with the latency. I cast it, turn invisible-> my opponent cast a spell -> I'm visible again. In addition to latency the flight time of a projectile isnt taken into account. It's just the time spell is castet. This isnt actually a bug, it's simply doesnt work the way ZoS made it. Its broken.
- Concealed Weapon morph, weapon switch, cast of shadow cloak->speed buff disappears, youve to leave stealth and restealth again.
- For me most annoying, I cast ambush, doesnt work, I start to spam button, finally it works but now I cant stop it, it casts over and over again until my magicka is depleted. But it only appears for Ambush, not for other skills so no idea whats going wrong here, maybe input lags of server
- Ambush+Funnel Health gave 600+ healing per tick BUTONLY IF Funnel Health killed the enemy. But sometimes it only heals 8 or 12 per tick, did not found a rule for that. But if its once like that youve to wait until the hot is over otherwise you just refresh the low tick. They did not really fix it, they just capped the max possible healing but they did not fix the low tick problem. Its just a workaround.
- Soul harvest needs 500 ultimate to get max dmg. And its not 300% dmg and I would expect max dmg at 150 ultimate not at 500 for such a weak ultimate.

I could continue that list. Everything I start to test to the ground doesnt really work as soon as more than one dimension is taken into account. Abilities, passives, armor traits and bonuses. Nothing works as intended. I mean for me its fine that I cant burst everybody but I expect spells to work which I could use to not be defeated 100% of all times in case of I cant burst down someone in 2 secs.

Btw sneak speed stacking was a problem of multiplying buffs. I did sneak 10 times faster than normal. This cant be explained by +60% sneak speed from set. Same is for the sharpening trait bug. Everything ZoS made seems to multiply or even expotenciate instead of taking the sum...whyever. Simply taking the sum and you could have all bonuses together without breaking the game.

Apart from that I cant believe that the only way PvP can be played in ESO is to stand there 360° blocking and stacking shields while enemies are killed exploiting the sharpening trait bug. Btw to escape I could block cause than dmg doesnt break invisibility. Oh yeah, or I could exploit mist form + harness magicka bug after shadow cloak. That works 100%. But that cant be true, right?

This whole system is in my opinion broken not the NB. If everything would work I would be fine with my NB.

Should I start the sorceror list of abilities that are broken?

Ball lightning. Supposed to absorb all spell projectiles cast at the target for 6.5 seconds. It catches maybe 60% of them and there is no way to tell if it is working other than holding block and waiting for the first projectile to hit. I had a guy spamming power overload on me earlier... I cast ball lightning 3 times and he continued hitting me through each one until I gave up and spammed shields instead. This is just as bad as your dark cloak morph not working and I die because of it all the time.

Bolt Escape breaks daily. You can be running from people and suddenly it just stops working. It takes your mana and casts the spell but you don't move. The only way to fix it is to relog or switch zones.

Mages fury explosion was somehow turned into a projectile when they fixed the magic return of the endless fury morph. This means reflective scales procs the explosion on you instead ...I execute myself daily and there are fewthing I can do to damage DKs other than spam curse and fury on them with light attack weaving.

Then there is the prison spell, half the time you cast it on a person it doesn't CC them even if they aren't blocking. Its buggy as hell which is why no one uses it.

Power Overload toggle is so jacked up now I have to wait 2 seconds after casting it to see if it goes through before I can do anything because if I hit the button twice it will toggle on and then back off and I have to wait for two seconds again.

Nightblades aren't the only class that have to suffer broken abilities. Every class in the game could out down a list like we have. Some of them are broken abilities and more often the issue is just the terrible latency issue that affects everyone in cyrodiil. Knocked down through block, delayed weapon swaps and abilities that fire off long after you've cast them.

Grim13 wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Every person I hear on these forums crying about class imbalance is a nightblade and most of us are sick of hearing about it

Listen, the reason you keep hearing about NBs being broken is because Zenimax haven't fixed them yet.


PS- I don't give a rats behind if a few NBs have found success after becoming pseudo-Sorcerers... I care about the fact that several of my class's abilities have been broken since BETA...

None of the guys I mentioned are caster build nightblades.

Ifthir_ESO

Thats great Ezareth but this is a thread about sneak speed stacking.

Your pal Blinxey used this like crazy on his sorc and he wasn't a NB.

Vamp speed + Set bonus. No NB needed.

Ifthir_ESO

"There isn't an ambush nightblade in the game who could kill me solo and that isn't because I'm some great player, it is because it is a garbage build that is good at killing unskilled players who know how to counter it."

-- So basically NB has no option to kill a shield stacker other than move to Bow and cheese people with lethal arrow. Which is a skill available to all players. So we are back to NB has *** all to use in combat.


"Ohh and finally...I can't kill a decent shield stacking player 1 v 1 either "

-- So yet another DPS class can't kill a shield stacker. Seems legit. Not.

Ifthir_ESO

Rylana wrote: »

This is pretty much what I have been saying for months in nightblade threads, and still people throw a fit calling me crap like elitist, a liar, etc.

It's easy to say something. Its a lot harder to prove it. You play a NB. Everyone is calling you a liar because no one in this entire game is afraid of your NB. No one.

Show us this build of you beating ass with your NB and people might listen.

But again, this thread was about sneak speed. That had nothing whatsoever to do with NB. Bunch of non-NB players came to this thread basically saying NB is OP which is ridiculously laughable.

You know what, I am done arguing. I've been doing it for 1.5 years and we are still here having the same argument. I've got better things to do than argue about a game whose PvP somehow manages to get worse with every patch.

Ifthir_ESO

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest here, you've never killed me solo, not even close.

Ifthir_ESO

removed

Ezareth

Ifthir_ESO wrote: »

"There isn't an ambush nightblade in the game who could kill me solo and that isn't because I'm some great player, it is because it is a garbage build that is good at killing unskilled players who know how to counter it."

-- So basically NB has no option to kill a shield stacker other than move to Bow and cheese people with lethal arrow. Which is a skill available to all players. So we are back to NB has *** all to use in combat.


"Ohh and finally...I can't kill a decent shield stacking player 1 v 1 either "

-- So yet another DPS class can't kill a shield stacker. Seems legit. Not.

The problem is Sorcs only have magic damage abilities and harness magicka when stacked returns almost the cost of the shields back. With magicka return in a 1 v 1 a player can't do enough magical damage to overcome the cost of the shields. Physical damage will tear through the shields much faster however and a physical damage dealer has an easier time of it. That said even pure physical damage dealers will not have an easy time against a determined shield stacker that is willing to keep burning pots.

The problem is you're trying to look at this game as a 1 v 1 and it isn't, its A v A. Nightblades have their place just as every other class does. As I already mentioned 80% of my non bugged deaths come at the hand of a well played nightblade.

The best weapon I find against shield stackers is a 2 hander and crit charge.

As far as what this thread became, you should read it front to back. I never dragged it off topic but some nightblades began spouting nonsense about sorcs and it derailed from there.

Ifthir_ESO

I hear you RE: NB's.

I dont know how this thread got derailed. My frustration is the nerf to the dark stalker passive + set bonus. As @Dleatherus‌ said, any of us who were using the fast sneak were already giving up a lot to get to it.

The end result for me was instant vamp cure and still stack NB concealed blade + set bonus. I still run pretty damned fast in stealth. Shield stackers however can still take 1500+ damage without blinking an eye and to me thats a much bigger issue. Hence why I made the post pointing out what I feel is poor prioritization from Development.

But hey, gotta get ready for that Console $, right ZoS?

ZOS_MichelleA

We have removed more than several posts from this thread, due to nonconstructive and baiting behavior. Please keep the Code of Conduct in mind when posting; personal jabs will continue to be removed, and if this thread does not return to a respectful conversation, we will be forced to close it.

Thank you for your understanding.

krim

All im going to say is there some good NB builds out there. Just have to be a bit more clever and not get caught up playing a certain way.

Ezareth

Ifthir_ESO wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest here, you've never killed me solo, not even close.

Funny your screenshot shows you did 2600 damage to me(non shields) and I died, yet I have 3700 hitpoints and if I had the opportunity to block you I guarantee I used a potion too. My shields are also far larger than the damage you did to them, especially the hardened ward.

I remember every single person who has killed me in a true 1 v 1 (since hitting V12 at least) and you're not in that list. I also know everyone who has ganked me (not while I was AFK or crashed) and you're not in that list.

Your build is the easiest NB build by far for me, and you've admitted yourself you can't defeat someone who stacks shields, so what are you trying to prove? Shields and block destroy your entire build. It's a weak build versus anyone who knows how to defeat it. If you want to be effective in 1 v 1s you'll need to change your build to something that is more effective or you'll need to pick targets with low hitpoints or already fighting other players.

I don't know what else to tell you on that front.

If Zenimax truly wants to fix Shield stacking then they only need ensure Harness Magicka is always hit first, or they'll need to change it so that the magicka return and magic damage reduction is only applied to the damage done to the SHIELD not the player while the shield is active.

Ifthir_ESO

Ezareth I don't know what to tell you. You act like NB is OP with sneak speed but you say youve never ever died to one solo? Your logic doesn't make sense.

Guess we just agree to disagree.

Ifthir_ESO

krim wrote: »

All im going to say is there some good NB builds out there. Just have to be a bit more clever and not get caught up playing a certain way.

Krim you are one of the few running a not "off the shelf" NB build. I always respected you for that. However, your build requires skilled guildmates to complement if I am not mistaken. My recollection of your build is that it's not going to beat anyone by itself.

Correct me if I am wrong, I haven't played in a while.

Ezareth

Ifthir_ESO wrote: »

Ezareth I don't know what to tell you. You act like NB is OP with sneak speed but you say youve never ever died to one solo? Your logic doesn't make sense.

Guess we just agree to disagree.

Where did I ever say NB is OP? Where did I say I've never died to a NB Solo? I said in my prior thread that Ak'nur has killed me in 1 v 1s before. I was talking about the Ambush build you were using the last time I've seen you. Since you're complaining often about night blade I only pointed out your build as being very ineffective for many obvious reasons yet you seem to be pointing the finger at ZoS and things like Night's silence being the cause of your failure.

I never supported the change to nights silence but I totally understand why they did it because people being able sneak in stealth faster than a horse can run is pretty absurd when you think about it.

Dleatherus

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Ifthir_ESO wrote: »

Ezareth I don't know what to tell you. You act like NB is OP with sneak speed but you say youve never ever died to one solo? Your logic doesn't make sense.

Guess we just agree to disagree.

Where did I ever say NB is OP? Where did I say I've never died to a NB Solo? I said in my prior thread that Ak'nur has killed me in 1 v 1s before. I was talking about the Ambush build you were using the last time I've seen you. Since you're complaining often about night blade I only pointed out your build as being very ineffective for many obvious reasons yet you seem to be pointing the finger at ZoS and things like Night's silence being the cause of your failure.

I never supported the change to nights silence but I totally understand why they did it because people being able sneak in stealth faster than a horse can run is pretty absurd when you think about it.

agreed - as absurd as 3 NB's in stealth all coordinating to hit a templar with focused aim/camo hunter and moving his health bar down by just 5% so he still had 95% full health

D.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Yet sorcerers can stack shields, BE 8+ times and instacast for 1k.

Except that isn't remotely true.

Fixes it so it's actually true now. Lol I understand you want to try to preserve the op nature of the sorc having lots of time invested in it but the simple fact of the matter is you can roll one and do 30x better as a noob sorc than you could as a very skilled nb. But sorcs day is coming so is dk when they actually get hit with a nerf bat instead of tickled with the small adjustment to damage feather.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Yet sorcerers can stack shields, BE 20+ times and instacast for 1k.

Except that isn't remotely true.

Stop man. You must not have played any other classes. Sorcerers magicka efficiency, damage mitigation and speed are out of control.

sorry for the derail OP.

You're right. I've never played another class. What I have done however is played a Sorc in PVP longer than all but a handful of players out there and I know it very well.

No Sorc can bolt escape 20 times or even remotely close to that. I can Bolt Escape for half of that and there isn't a non-emperor sorc in the game who can do it more than me. My crystal frags in full legendary gear hit for 749.

If you want to present an argument, use facts, not garbage.

Your crystal frags hit for 750 non crit maybe which would bring crits in around the 1k-1.5 mar I would imagine but you're right he is spouting garbage. Not to mention wearing light armor and having a sharpened trait give way over hard cap spell resistance worth of spell penetration no ability required.

Edit: he is not exaggerating you are trying to downplay what the sorc class is actually capable of...

Ezareth

Luvsfuzzybunnies wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Yet sorcerers can stack shields, BE 8+ times and instacast for 1k.

Except that isn't remotely true.

Fixes it so it's actually true now. Lol I understand you want to try to preserve the op nature of the sorc having lots of time invested in it but the simple fact of the matter is you can roll one and do 30x better as a noob sorc than you could as a very skilled nb. But sorcs day is coming so is dk when they actually get hit with a nerf bat instead of tickled with the small adjustment to damage feather.

It still isn't true as you're calling a proc an "instantcast" and then considering a *crit* as guaranteed somehow. Spend a day in a sorc's shoes and you'll learn that there is no such thing as a guaranteed crit. I see plenty of sorcs in PVP that die and die and die, I know because bad sorcs are probably 40% of my daily AP.

Sorcs already had their day. They are already the least desirable class in PVE and PVP groups once you have a sufficient amount of negates.

But hey, the grass is always greener and all that. I know a couple of nightblades who tried rerolling sorc and they couldn't stand dying so much so they went back to their nightblades.

Samadhi

Mauz wrote: »

...
- Ambush+Funnel Health gave 600+ healing per tick BUTONLY IF Funnel Health killed the enemy. But sometimes it only heals 8 or 12 per tick, did not found a rule for that. But if its once like that youve to wait until the hot is over otherwise you just refresh the low tick. They did not really fix it, they just capped the max possible healing but they did not fix the low tick problem. Its just a workaround.
...

There used to be an issue with Funnel Health taking the damage of the attack before it as the basis for the healing effect.
I would Ambush people then use Funnel Health and it would return 25% of the Ambush Sneak Attack damage as healing. I did not need to kill the enemy with it to receive this bonus.
I would also sometimes attack an enemy with a light attack and have my Disease damage enchantment proc; if I cast Funnel Health afterward, it would only return 25% of the enchantment's damage as healing for 10 seconds.

That glitch appears to have been fixed.
Now I am experiencing a new glitch where if I go Ambush-->Funnel Health I receive 0 healing from Funnel Health.
If I cast Funnel Health again, it heals me for the Funnel Health damage.

I have not seen any issues with the 8-12 healing ticks since the last update; however, I am frequently seeing 0 heal ticks.

Mauz wrote: »

...
Btw sneak speed stacking was a problem of multiplying buffs. I did sneak 10 times faster than normal. This cant be explained by +60% sneak speed from set. Same is for the sharpening trait bug. Everything ZoS made seems to multiply or even expotenciate instead of taking the sum...whyever. Simply taking the sum and you could have all bonuses together without breaking the game.
...

The Sneak speeds relative to Night's Silence were as follows:
Human Character Sneaking with no buffs: 60% of regular running speed.
Human Character Sneaking with Night's Silence: 96% of regular running speed (an increase of 60% of the 60% speed that they were traveling).

Vampire character Sneaking with only Dark Stalker passive: 100% of regular running speed.
Vampire character Sneaking with passive and Night's Silence: 160% of regular running speed (a 60% increase of the 100% speed they were traveling).

The Night's Silence bonus was calculating by providing 60% of whatever the character's default Sneak speed was. Since vampires have no Sneak speed penalty, they got a 60% increase to their basic running speed.

You're spot-on with your other points though.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

TheBull wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Yet sorcerers can stack shields, BE 20+ times and instacast for 1k.

Except that isn't remotely true.

Stop man. You must not have played any other classes. Sorcerers magicka efficiency, damage mitigation and speed are out of control.

sorry for the derail OP.

You're right. I've never played another class. What I have done however is played a Sorc in PVP longer than all but a handful of players out there and I know it very well.

No Sorc can bolt escape 20 times or even remotely close to that. I can Bolt Escape for half of that and there isn't a non-emperor sorc in the game who can do it more than me. My crystal frags in full legendary gear hit for 749.

If you want to present an argument, use facts, not garbage.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=ckzH5oMifVw
There was point here (1:17) were BE was cast 17 times, while casting other spells.



I rest my case.

He did use potions as well I will not ignore the facts but it is excessive and exchanging an unused stat for massive amounts of health and Magicka is kind of op..

Luvsfuzzybunnies

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Yeah with two potions, magicka return from harness magicka and over a minute of time with magicka return.

I could cast Bolt escape far more than 20 times if I were to wait 4 seconds between each cast. Any class could cast ANY spell every 4 seconds an infinite number of times. What's your point?

If I cast Bolt Escape as fast as I can press the key I get 9 of them, 10 if I'm lagging some and had an extra regen tick in.

I don't even know why I'm debating your absurd charges anyways.

I disagree show me a nb who can cast cloak every 4 second infinitely and we can talk.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

Paidkilla wrote: »

Been playing a NB since beta, I use to hate BE all i did was complain about it. Then i leveled up a Sorc. You dont get BE till 42 in SC and i can tell you sorcs are almost helpless without it. In Blackwater there is no survivability at all vs guys spamming invasions and nb's spamming ambush. You cant really take BE away while everyone else is spamming gap closers. So i changed my point on Be i really think the class would be unplayable without it. Sorcs can get predictable i always would invasion and hold in block for half a second the minute i connected with them cause i knew they would hit streak. they can be run down, but become fresh meat you take the skill away.

Theyea have all the gap closers everyone else does.. this is the only teleport ability that does not have to have a target to cast. Make bolt escape require a target and I will call it fixed. Even if it is something they can put on the ground I think that would be appropriate then you could kite but not immediately run out of gap closer range which would be exactly what it needs to be.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

Hlaren_shortsheath wrote: »

you continually try to justyfy and say that the nightblade speed made them somehow overpowered when infact there is NOTHING that the speed we had allowed us to be able to do anything in combat because ALL sneak speeds we had are GONE when we come out of stealth.
we cant run scrolls with it because we are obviously out of stealth with a scroll!
nothing about sneak speeds has any effect at all in pvp. or combat of anykind.

I dont understand why people claim this was a nb only thing. Any class could achieve such speeds. NB was at a sprint vs the other classes normal run all speed buffs considered. This was not a nb only thing. Yet other classes with clearly more powerful abilities retain such advantages. Go figure

Ifthir_ESO

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Since you're complaining often about night blade I only pointed out your build as being very ineffective for many obvious reasons yet you seem to be pointing the finger at ZoS and things like Night's silence being the cause of your failure.

1. My complaint in this thread had nothing to do with NB.
2. I have never used Night's Silence set. Ever.
3. Failure? I went 34-0 yesterday (I stacked shields, haters). Its not about failure. Its about choosing to nerf something that in no way was OP while you allow dozens of OP issues to run rampant. That's what this thread was about. I know, I created it.

Luvsfuzzybunnies

Rylana wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

What I was quoting for truth wasn't that your complaints on whatever you feel isn't working on nightblades. Every person I hear on these forums crying about class imbalance is a nightblade and most of us are sick of hearing about it because there are some damn good nightblades out there who don't have a problem finding a build they enjoy that is very effective in PvP.

This is pretty much what I have been saying for months in nightblade threads, and still people throw a fit calling me crap like elitist, a liar, etc.

Those that seem to throw the biggest fits are the ones that want a build that does exactly this in five easy steps.

1. Can never be seen or attacked before they are ready to do step 2, ever, and i mean not even once.
2. Can do enough damage that whenever the nightblade wants to, it can kill anything, with any spec, any time, any place.
3. Can then get away without being caught, not even once.
4. Can then brag to their friends/enemies about how hardcore of a ganker they are with their pro leet hax like other stealthers do in other games
5. Possibly make humiliation youtube videos of their victims.

The reality is, the nightblade class has had some really REALLY good builds associated with it since even back in beta, its just certain really loud individuals that have no creativity and want easy mode handed to them via alpha class level "balancing" never bothered to actually theorycraft past the single target maximum spike damage in 2 seconds build, and forgot that nightblades have some of the most annoying and deadly CC/stuns in the game. Not to mention they are arguably the most powerful HoT healer/survivalist that exists. Id even argue a nightblade can actually outheal a templar or a sorc if they spec all-in to it.

With the recent slew of fixes and buffs to the class, the number of truly viable builds has gotten to the point where the nightblade class is arguably the most diverse in terms of what you can actually accomplish with one, almost any spec works now if you apply it correctly.

There are good players out there, some nightblades that can do things I cant even do, and ive been playing this class for almost as long as youve been playing sorc (i just have alt-itis and dont have the alliance rank street cred)

So you hit the nail more or less right on the head. I am familiar with every single one of those nightblades you mentioned, and they are better than I am, thats for sure. I also know they are using builds that the "common joe looking for an i-win build on the forums" is never going to figure out.

Its not so much a learn to play issue anymore in ESO, its become more of a "learn what you can ACTUALLY do if you try something other than the same three skills you "heard" were the good ones.

So you're saying they wanna be Dks or sorcs?

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Luvsfuzzybunnies wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

Yet sorcerers can stack shields, BE 8+ times and instacast for 1k.

Except that isn't remotely true.

Fixes it so it's actually true now. Lol I understand you want to try to preserve the op nature of the sorc having lots of time invested in it but the simple fact of the matter is you can roll one and do 30x better as a noob sorc than you could as a very skilled nb. But sorcs day is coming so is dk when they actually get hit with a nerf bat instead of tickled with the small adjustment to damage feather.

It still isn't true as you're calling a proc an "instantcast" and then considering a *crit* as guaranteed somehow. Spend a day in a sorc's shoes and you'll learn that there is no such thing as a guaranteed crit. I see plenty of sorcs in PVP that die and die and die, I know because bad sorcs are probably 40% of my daily AP.

Sorcs already had their day. They are already the least desirable class in PVE and PVP groups once you have a sufficient amount of negates.

But hey, the grass is always greener and all that. I know a couple of nightblades who tried rerolling sorc and they couldn't stand dying so much so they went back to their nightblades.

I've spent many a day in a sorcs shoes and if I am starting to get focused all i need do is turn on turtle mode(sheild stacking) and call in my birdy (bolt escape) and I'm out of there in no time. I understand the class I haven't played it quite as much as you buy I have played enough to know I can without a doubt escape 90% of the bad situations I put myself into. On the other hand I have played my nb far more often and fine my escape to be less than 50% reliable at best. I have killed some good sorcs who's sheilds just expired wit a well time snipe. The instances of me actually having to fight them on their terms is much more often given the efficacy of Bolt escape however and the seemingly limitless spammable ty of it with pots which simply cannot be don't with cloak.