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Discussion: Heavy Armor

Khivas_Carrick
Khivas_Carrick
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Much like another wondrous player did for Two Handed Skills in the Weapons Forum, I'm going to toss some ideas to make Heavy Armor much more viable for both Tanking and Melee DPS, and even to help support the original Battlemage Archetype that seems to have died off/altered beyond recognition in ESO.

This is mainly for discussion and flaming will get nobody anywhere, so I ask that you please refrain from being blatant *** and hyperbole in everything and simply offer legitimate suggestions and ideas and critiques, so that our lovely Devs-Iin-Charge can read and take the hint.

Resolve:
Minor increase to the amount of Armor and Spell Resistance gained. Right now it's 3% per piece. I'd much rather see it be 5%.

Constitution:
This is a tricky one, and frankly they're going in the right direction, similar for the above Resolve Passive, but it needs a bigger oomph to make it's bang really worth it's buck. The first half of Constitution, the Health Regen can stay as is but would be better optimized if it increase all forms of regeneration, including Magicka and Stamina.

The second half however is a bit of a joke/tease if all it restores in .15% per piece of heavy armor. Note that is -point- One-Five, Fifteen, not a full 15%. To that end, I would be much agreed to see that this skill does a full 1% Per Piece of Armor instead. I believe that would go quite a long way in helping to maintain resources while tanking or DPSing.

Juggernaut:
This is where the DPS part kicks in for this armor type. The main issue here is that Medium and Light offer things to make Casters, Healers, and Physical DPS viable in one way or another, and while there are other underlying issues that affect that status, right now Medium and Light offer trade offs that make them more DPS friendly than Heavy. However, I still agree that a man in Heavy Armor should be able to DPS, what I do not agree with is that it should be DPS with just anything lying around. To that end, I suggest the following changes to Juggernaut.

1) As of now it adds a 1% increase per piece of armor to melee attacks. I believe this should be as is, but instead of damage with melee attacks, change it to Raw Weapon Damage for Melee Weapons and Staffs. This affects multiple things and will go nicely with many changes that have been proposed elsewhere on these forums as linked above, and would help support the Battlemage Archetype (Heavy armor, Destro Skills/Staff).

2) Break Free part of Juggernaut should remain entirely as is, it works fine that way.

Bracing:
Rename this to Sundering and keep the Blocking bonus, but also include a cost reduction for Melee Attacks. Or something like that. Note: I say sundering because you are both sundering your enemies now and Sundering their attacks across your blocking ability.

Rapid Mending:
Seeing as this is mostly for Tanking and PvP, I'd say double this to get the most bang for your skill point buck. Maybe add in that whenever you critical strike an enemy with any skill, you get a small portion of that damage back as HP.
Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO


    Juggernaut:
    This is where the DPS part kicks in for this armor type. The main issue here is that Medium and Light offer things to make Casters, Healers, and Physical DPS viable in one way or another, and while there are other underlying issues that affect that status, right now Medium and Light offer trade offs that make them more DPS friendly than Heavy. However, I still agree that a man in Heavy Armor should be able to DPS, what I do not agree with is that it should be DPS with just anything lying around. To that end, I suggest the following changes to Juggernaut.

    1) As of now it adds a 1% increase per piece of armor to melee attacks. I believe this should be as is, but instead of damage with melee attacks, change it to Raw Weapon Damage for Melee Weapons and Staffs. This affects multiple things and will go nicely with many changes that have been proposed elsewhere on these forums as linked above, and would help support the Battlemage Archetype (Heavy armor, Destro Skills/Staff).

    Oh and additionally, I particularly love this. I reckon the amount would need some tweaking to bring it at least somewhat in line with medium and light but I think this is the right direction for the tree.

    All armor types should allow for dps one way or another. No reason why they can't just be a different way for each to do so!

    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    If you're serious that actually makes me rather happy as I wasn't sure if I would be flamed or not, but thank you.

    Also thank you to the guy on the horse. Whoever he is, let him he looks most badass.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    If you're serious that actually makes me rather happy as I wasn't sure if I would be flamed or not, but thank you.

    Also thank you to the guy on the horse. Whoever he is, let him he looks most badass.

    Completely serious, your suggestions are not over the top but still address the shortcomings of the set. People seem to be in a hurry to match armor to a specific role, as though they have a set idea of what each is supposed to look like.

    I was under the impression that the skill system in this game was trying to break down that wall.

    Please keep making open minded suggestions like these, I don't feel like it is too late for balanced variety yet :)
    Edited by jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO on September 4, 2014 4:46AM
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    If you're serious that actually makes me rather happy as I wasn't sure if I would be flamed or not, but thank you.

    Also thank you to the guy on the horse. Whoever he is, let him he looks most badass.

    Completely serious, your suggestions are not over the top but still address the shortcomings of the set. People seem to be in a hurry to match armor to a specific role, as though they have a set idea of what each is supposed to look like.

    I was under the impression that the skill system in this game was trying to break down the wall so to speak.

    Please keep these open minded suggestions going, I don't feel like it is too late yet :)
    There are manly tears rolling down my face, for you honor me and my ancestors!

    Also you're absolutely positively *** RIGHT about how this game was originally meant to be played. I do not, DO NOT AT ALL mind if a guy in Light or Medium Armor tanks something, or heals, or if a guy in Heavy armor Heals or casts fireballs all day.

    It's Elder Scrolls.

    That's how it's supposed to roll.

    It's just the Devs don't quite get the big picture there yet, they think it's all Rainbow Shitting Unicorn Dance Parties down here. Ima do Medium Armor in another thread when I get my bearings back together later too, so keep an eye out.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • Marthenil
    Marthenil
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    @Khivas_Carrick‌ No the issue is that, from the direction they are taking so far at least, the devs seem to have decided that each armor type should be restricted to a role.

    I will be completely honest here and say that if that turns out to be true and continues down this path, a lot of my interest in the game will dwindle.
    Edited by Marthenil on September 10, 2014 11:31PM
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    If that's the case then why the hell am I able to tank in full light armor nearly if not just as well as a guy in heavy.

    And tbh I'm with you on the dwindling interest part.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • Imp666
    Imp666
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    If that's the case then why the hell am I able to tank in full light armor nearly if not just as well as a guy in heavy.

    And tbh I'm with you on the dwindling interest part.

    You are probably able to tank better than the guy in heavy:P

    But that is mainly due to the low armour caps (plus the insane magic res light armour gives) and the bulk of block upgrades coming from the 1h+s skill line.

    I m already past the dwindling part and counting the days till the sub runs out.

  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    And that saddens me, so, so much, like you don't even know.

    I was thinking though on something, and you know how you get a bonus for wearing 5 Pieces of an armor type? What if those Skills gave them per piece instead of having a requirement of 5pc?
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    Psst....@ZOS......Any word on making Heavy armor more personally viable for DPS Specs?
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • Najarati
    Najarati
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    Constitution:
    This is a tricky one, and frankly they're going in the right direction, similar for the above Resolve Passive, but it needs a bigger oomph to make it's bang really worth it's buck. The first half of Constitution, the Health Regen can stay as is but would be better optimized if it increase all forms of regeneration, including Magicka and Stamina.

    The second half however is a bit of a joke/tease if all it restores in .15% per piece of heavy armor. Note that is -point- One-Five, Fifteen, not a full 15%. To that end, I would be much agreed to see that this skill does a full 1% Per Piece of Armor instead. I believe that would go quite a long way in helping to maintain resources while tanking or DPSing.

    The improvement to the second half may be a bit much. Let's assume the average tank has 3500 health and wearing the minimum amount of heavy armor required to use all its passives--five pieces. With your changes, this means said tank would receive 175 stamina and magicka every two seconds (3500 * 0.05) while taking some form of damage. This is on top of the tank's existing stamina and magicka recovery, which let's say is in the neighborhood of 85 stamina and 60 magicka returned every two seconds. Just those two aspects together is pretty massive.

    (As far as I know, the Constitution benefit from heavy armor does not count towards the recovery cap. Can anyone else confirm?)

    Let’s take this a step further. Let’s say this tank is a Nightblade with Siphoning Attacks (like mine) and using Sap Essence to trigger the stamina/magicka restore effect. Now, this tank is receiving 175 stamina and magicka every two seconds (in combat) plus his combat recovery in addition to 3% max stamina and magicka returned on strike plus a 10% chance for any attack to return 15% magicka and stamina. That is some serious resource regeneration.

    Place that tank in the middle of four or more enemies and he/she would be hard-pressed to exhaust stamina and magicka. Don’t get me wrong; it’d be amazing, but perhaps too amazing. For the sake of balance, I think Constitution’s bonus shouldn't go over 0.5% per piece of heavy. Thoughts?

    EDIT: Clarity
    Edited by Najarati on September 16, 2014 6:59PM
  • Imp666
    Imp666
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    I think it is quite easier to empty your bars as a tank in heavy armour. No reduction in skill cost, combined with no mass taunt, means you would now have enough resources to try and grab every loose mob.
    It would also mean that taunting+blocking+dodging would not deplete your resources too fast, enabling you to tank more efficiently. I do not see anything game breaking in that (from a pve point of view).
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    I didn't know NB's had regen like that, that's actually rather upsetting to know because as a Templar I get zero regen, and I was under the impression other classes also had little to no regen ability and this was tailored specifically for tanks and juggernauts in both PvE and PvP.

    That knowledge can seriously throw a wrench in the plans there. Perhaps......

    Yes, I could see .5 instead of .15 being better overall, but taunts and threat mechanics as well as class skills involving regen would need a few tweaks first.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • Najarati
    Najarati
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    I didn't know NB's had regen like that, that's actually rather upsetting to know because as a Templar I get zero regen, and I was under the impression other classes also had little to no regen ability and this was tailored specifically for tanks and juggernauts in both PvE and PvP.

    We do, but Siphoning Strikes and its morphs come at the cost of damage potential, and since many Nightblade builds center around burst damage (at least in PvP) you don't see it as often as you might think. However, for the much less common Nightblade tank it's a good ability. Regardless, you're more likely to see it than, say, Blur or any of its morphs!
    Edited by Najarati on September 17, 2014 5:26PM
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    Hmmm.....I see.

    Noted, although I think these changes would still be the right direction, numbers obviously tweaked.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • WrathOfRegicide
    WrathOfRegicide
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    Much like another wondrous player did for Two Handed Skills in the Weapons Forum, I'm going to toss some ideas to make Heavy Armor much more viable for both Tanking and Melee DPS, and even to help support the original Battlemage Archetype that seems to have died off/altered beyond recognition in ESO.

    This is mainly for discussion and flaming will get nobody anywhere, so I ask that you please refrain from being blatant *** and hyperbole in everything and simply offer legitimate suggestions and ideas and critiques, so that our lovely Devs-Iin-Charge can read and take the hint.

    Resolve:
    Minor increase to the amount of Armor and Spell Resistance gained. Right now it's 3% per piece. I'd much rather see it be 5%.

    Constitution:
    This is a tricky one, and frankly they're going in the right direction, similar for the above Resolve Passive, but it needs a bigger oomph to make it's bang really worth it's buck. The first half of Constitution, the Health Regen can stay as is but would be better optimized if it increase all forms of regeneration, including Magicka and Stamina.

    The second half however is a bit of a joke/tease if all it restores in .15% per piece of heavy armor. Note that is -point- One-Five, Fifteen, not a full 15%. To that end, I would be much agreed to see that this skill does a full 1% Per Piece of Armor instead. I believe that would go quite a long way in helping to maintain resources while tanking or DPSing.

    Juggernaut:
    This is where the DPS part kicks in for this armor type. The main issue here is that Medium and Light offer things to make Casters, Healers, and Physical DPS viable in one way or another, and while there are other underlying issues that affect that status, right now Medium and Light offer trade offs that make them more DPS friendly than Heavy. However, I still agree that a man in Heavy Armor should be able to DPS, what I do not agree with is that it should be DPS with just anything lying around. To that end, I suggest the following changes to Juggernaut.

    1) As of now it adds a 1% increase per piece of armor to melee attacks. I believe this should be as is, but instead of damage with melee attacks, change it to Raw Weapon Damage for Melee Weapons and Staffs. This affects multiple things and will go nicely with many changes that have been proposed elsewhere on these forums as linked above, and would help support the Battlemage Archetype (Heavy armor, Destro Skills/Staff).

    2) Break Free part of Juggernaut should remain entirely as is, it works fine that way.

    Bracing:
    Rename this to Sundering and keep the Blocking bonus, but also include a cost reduction for Melee Attacks. Or something like that. Note: I say sundering because you are both sundering your enemies now and Sundering their attacks across your blocking ability.

    Rapid Mending:
    Seeing as this is mostly for Tanking and PvP, I'd say double this to get the most bang for your skill point buck. Maybe add in that whenever you critical strike an enemy with any skill, you get a small portion of that damage back as HP.

    For resolve i think it should have some type of "retaliation" perk to it, like..."every 2-5 hits on you should reflect some of the damage back to the enemy.
    I think you're on the right track for the constitution, but one thing that bothers me is you have to get hit before you get to benefit from that perk, which seems kind of lame.
    As for juggernaut I think Zeni needs to add spell damage and melee weapon damage to make heavy armor more attractive.
    Bracing i think it should be like "block melee attacks and regen some stamina or health 10% of the damage done to you"
    I don't know if my idea's would make heavy armor over-powered or not just spit balling some idea's out there.

  • tplink3r1
    tplink3r1
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    i dont really care for a damage boost in heavy armor, more survivability is what i want.
    VR16 Templar
    VR3 Sorcerer
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    tplink3r1 wrote: »
    i dont really care for a damage boost in heavy armor, more survivability is what i want.

    With the sheer number of skills and morphs available there is no reason why both can't be an option.
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    To be honest, there are actually only two things that really hold back heavy armor:

    1) Armor and Spell Pen Caps

    and

    2) Lack of any sort of regeneration from it's passives.

    Not saying it doesn't have any, but it's so little that it's a drop in a parched bucket, and when you're tanking you really need those precious resources to damage an enemy enough to make sure they stay on you (due to the sad and sorry nature of "threat" in this game), and in PvP.....Well, without anything coming back to you or at least something to really make you worth being used to hit stuff, there's little incentive to rock heavy armor other than it looks cool, because Light and Medium can get the same effect of surviving as heavy can, only better in Light's case.


    However, since Medium armor now works to add raw weapon damage and in a rather large way, I think Juggernaut may need a different way to increase it's damage in this hypothetical rework, and frankly the first thing that came to mind was:

    Juggernaut -
    1) Increases Armor Penetration by 1/2% Per Piece of Heavy Armor and returns .25/.5% Base Stamina And Magicka for Each Successful Heavy Attack Per Piece of Heavy Armor.

    2) Same as before.

    Note I say Base, as is whatever you have without enchants, attribute points, and food buffs.

    Thoughts?
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    To be honest, there are actually only two things that really hold back heavy armor:

    1) Armor and Spell Pen Caps

    and

    2) Lack of any sort of regeneration from it's passives.

    Not saying it doesn't have any, but it's so little that it's a drop in a parched bucket, and when you're tanking you really need those precious resources to damage an enemy enough to make sure they stay on you (due to the sad and sorry nature of "threat" in this game), and in PvP.....Well, without anything coming back to you or at least something to really make you worth being used to hit stuff, there's little incentive to rock heavy armor other than it looks cool, because Light and Medium can get the same effect of surviving as heavy can, only better in Light's case.


    However, since Medium armor now works to add raw weapon damage and in a rather large way, I think Juggernaut may need a different way to increase it's damage in this hypothetical rework, and frankly the first thing that came to mind was:

    Juggernaut -
    1) Increases Armor Penetration by 1/2% Per Piece of Heavy Armor and returns .25/.5% Base Stamina And Magicka for Each Successful Heavy Attack Per Piece of Heavy Armor.

    2) Same as before.

    Note I say Base, as is whatever you have without enchants, attribute points, and food buffs.

    Thoughts?

    That's a cool idea but it still needs either a raw damage boost or a crit boost for PvE. For PvP it would be extremely useful since it would deal extra damage that wouldn't be affected by people stacking impenatrable.

    I love what they did for medium armor because currently I'm using it but down the line I'd rather medium improved speed and heavy improved raw damage. Otherwise we are back at square 1, heavy is far inferior to medium for any sort of damage dealing.
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    Than haste/attack speed will need a serious rework, and animation canceling would have to be abolished for any buffs to speed to work
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    Completely agree. I just can't think of another way it could be done since medium now has all of the dps options attached to it.
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    Well I wouldn't say all. Armor Pen would still help a good bit in PvE as enemies do wear armor and all that, and a flat increase just seems tacky if another armor set does the same.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    I guess it depends how much extra damage armor pen would afford a heavy armor wearer. I haven't really seen boss stats, could be that it makes a large difference. I would like to think so, haven't given up on heavy melee dps yet...but I will admit that my optimism is starting to wane pretty badly.
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    Oh I gave up on melee DPS I just haven't switched because I like melee too much, but then again I've always been a Hybrid player, this is why I had such high hopes for this game but they went by the wayside.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO
    That is a shame. I understand though. Touting a game as "play how you want" and then releasing something so disjointed and unbalanced really hurt my faith in the game and my enjoyment of it.
    I can has typing!
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    UPDATE!

    Holy fracking shiaaat, I didn't know/wasn't aware of the massive buff to stamina weapons and the like, and uhhhh, I'm rocking 4 Heavy, 2 Medium, 1 Light, and pulled over 800 DPS just shitting around in a Vet Dungeon thanks to it.

    That said, you can wear heavy armor and if you manage your resources you'll be fine, but it still needs a serious boon to DPS purposes. Well maybe not serious, but something.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • ph1026
    ph1026
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    My 2 cents...
    Resolve:
    change resolve to 3/6/9 % physical damage reduction per piece of heavy. Take spell mitigation off of it and replace it with 2/5/10 % chance to reflect a single target spell back at the caster. I believe that spells should be the bane of heavy armor example-being cooked alive in your heavy plate. However if you shine that sumbish up proper like you have a chance to send it back downrange. I realize that with other reflect set bonus's some dragon knights may turn into disco balls on the battlefield, but I don't think it will be out of hand.
    Constitution:
    Increase health/magicka/stamina regen by 2/4 %(or some non o.p. number) per piece of heavy worn.Also reduces the cost of bash by 2/4% per piece of heavy armor worn. get your recovery from this talent, and if spells will be the heavy armors bane then reducing the cost of bashing them in their cake hole makes sense
    Juggernaut:
    Increases Heavy attack damage by 3/5 %(or some non o.p. number)per piece of heavy armor. This will make it more appealing to the battle mage people instead of melee only. So in heavy armor while your regenerating your magicka/stamina with heavy attacks your doing more damage.Keep the break free cost right where its at I feel its perfect.
    Bracing:
    Keep the block cost where it is, and add a talent to take less spell damage while blocking, maybe 2/4 %(or some non o.p. number)this will allow tanks to have some way of mitigating incoming spell damage.
    just my two cents, I would also like to see immovable require 5 pcs of heavy armor. it just makes sense to me.
    Edited by ph1026 on October 10, 2014 9:42PM
  • Khivas_Carrick
    Khivas_Carrick
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    ph1026 wrote: »
    My 2 cents...
    Resolve:
    change resolve to 3/6/9 % physical damage reduction per piece of heavy. Take spell mitigation off of it and replace it with 2/5/10 % chance to reflect a single target spell back at the caster. I believe that spells should be the bane of heavy armor example-being cooked alive in your heavy plate. However if you shine that sumbish up proper like you have a chance to send it back downrange. I realize that with other reflect set bonus's some dragon knights may turn into disco balls on the battlefield, but I don't think it will be out of hand.

    Constitution:
    Increase health/magicka/stamina regen by 2/4 %(or some non o.p. number) per piece of heavy worn.Also reduces the cost of bash by 2/4% per piece of heavy armor worn. get your recovery from this talent, and if spells will be the heavy armors bane then reducing the cost of bashing them in their cake hole makes sense

    Juggernaut:
    Increases Heavy attack damage by 3/5 %(or some non o.p. number)per piece of heavy armor. This will make it more appealing to the battle mage people instead of melee only. So in heavy armor while your regenerating your magicka/stamina with heavy attacks your doing more damage.Keep the break free cost right where its at I feel its perfect.

    Bracing:
    Keep the block cost where it is, and add a talent to take less spell damage while blocking, maybe 2/4 %(or some non o.p. number)this will allow tanks to have some way of mitigating incoming spell damage.
    just my two cents, I would also like to see immovable require 5 pcs of heavy armor. it just makes sense to me.
    Spacing is your friend.

    Now then,

    1)Resolve - This is a great idea for the damage reduction, absolutely terrible for the spell reflection. Second it needs to be a per piece thing. 10% reduction in damage is actually very potent as is, let alone you getting it simply by wearing a single piece of plate. Wear full 7 pieces of plate then get 70% damage reduction? Oh no, ohhhh no. And then spell reflection, even if it's by chance, is also bad. It needs to be either a one shot via a skill or not at all, hence why it's actually best to leave Resolve as it is now just with increased numbers. That or Damage Reduction only but with 1/2/3% per piece of heavy.

    Come to think of it I actually really like the idea of raw damage reduction.

    2) Very tentative on this one. I want to say sure, go ahead, I mean Light and Medium armor already restore Stamina and Magicka, so why not let Heavy do it too but with Health as well because it's all about surviving! Only that it isn't. Not by a long shot in fact, the goal of this was to rework heavy armor so that it's viable for both DPS and for Tanking. That said, I am not keen on letting Heavy add regen to all 3 stats at once, in fact I'm downright against it, but I could be persuaded to say otherwise. Also the Bashing is done via Sword and Board and only Sword and Board for a reason, as bashing is a tank's thing. I'd much rather see Constitution as is but with bigger numbers.

    3) Your suggestion isn't exactly far off from mine, especially with the new change coming to Two-handers. In fact, I rather like it and think that both could be done, looking something like this:

    Juggernaut - Increases Weapon Damage by 1/2% Per Piece of Heavy Armor and Increases the Damage of Light and Heavy Attacks by 2/4% Per Piece of Heavy Armor.

    Break Free cost would remain exactly as is as that's currently brilliant. I do worry though that this could step on the toes of Medium Armor as it currently stands, but I feel as if I shouldn't worry so much since Medium Armor also offers a massive amount of Crit Chance, something Heavy does not do and Light Armor only does a set amount for after wearing a full set. Note by the way I have it in my mind that wearing full heavy armor would more than likely leave you using either a destro staff or two-hander of some sort, and in builds using all heavy or mostly heavy like this the sudden boost from having 28% additional damage from a heavy attack in full plate would mean your DPS would come from pretty much your weapon in a sustained but powerful manner, leaving your magicka skills for utility mostly, thus Support DPS suddenly having a purpose.

    Example: There's a mage in full light nuking EVERYTHING with magic and doing well on the boss for single target, but offers no group utility. Then there's a warrior in full plate with a giant sword that has say....healing spells and auras of some kind, like two of his skills are these and the other two are his weapon skills, one of which is a charge. The charge is useless now but that last attack skill just became his bread and butter, especially when mixed with his heavy and light attacks. And the warrior can just as easily be a Battle Mage because staffs = weapons = Heavy and Light Attacks as well. This is also balanced out in PvP simply by stating that these are Staffs and Melee Weapons only and blocking is a definite thing that screws over heavy attacks.

    4) Does blocking not already reduce spell damage by a large amount? If anything I'd say bake in a talent that gives you a damage shield equal to half the damage of the spell you just blocked that has a cooldown of like once per minute or something. Or just rebuild it entirely as I had suggested because it's kinda.....Meh.
    Bobbity Boop, this game might become poop, but I'll still play because I'm just a pile of goop!
  • ph1026
    ph1026
    ✭✭
    Sorry about the spacing, I am old and a relative forums newbie, ill try harder.

    I should have pointed out that the numbers aren't fixed, more of a placeholder for some non over powered number. What I was trying to do was give each armor its own niche if you will. light armor for spell power/crit/penetration,and spell resist. medium armor for physical crit/power, and sneaking/dodging. With heavy armor as physical mitigation with good regeneration with helpful skills for tanks and utility players

    resolve

    having physical damage reduction over armor makes medium armor making the armor soft cap a moot point, as heavy will always be better against physical attacks . I feel that light armor already has spell mitigation no need for it in heavy as well. This will also set up the "armor niche" I was talking about. You may be right about the spell reflect, I was trying to add something fun to draw people to a boring armor choice.

    Constitution

    It is this ones opinion that the biggest problem with heavy armor is no regen, not worth a damn anyways. You run out of stamina and magicka very quickly with no way to get it back. If your dps'ing it will drop off, tanks get plowed without stamina to block and magicka users left twiddling their thumbs.
    adding all three allows for better dps/tanking/healing (you have resources to use skills)
    As it is now you get next to nothing back for getting your face ripped off. I would even take raising the health health ,magicka, and stamina pool by a % per piece of heavy over the worthless talent that's there now. The deal with the bash costing less here is to not just appeal to tanks, but stamina users as well. I know plenty that wont waste the stamina on bash if it means they cant use a dps move after it.

    Juggernaut

    I agree with you on this one, x/x % weapon damage and heavy attack damage with the better regen(or larger pool) from constitution will make dps,and tanking better. With break free as we all seem to agree remaining as is.

    Bracing

    As before keep the block reduction in 5 pcs, maybe add a talent that in 5 pcs of heavy armor successful blocks decrease the cost of your next spell or ability by 10% or something to that effect.
    I am not to keen on adding another damage shield to the game as there are plenty as is(unless your a NB).This is something that will help every character regardless of role.

    In the end I just feel that all armor types should have a weakness of some sort. In this design light armor would be weak to physical attacks, heavy armor weak to spell attacks and medium armor would be weak to both but do good damage and have better stealth and acrobatics to offset the lack of resistance.
    Light armor would be the choice of the magicka dps'er trying to max out spell dps.medium would be the choice for for maxing out physical damage.heavy armor would allow better regen at the cost of not maximizing dps. there has to be a trade off I think.


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