This is OUR game!

Guppet · July 2014

Anastasia wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Let me explain what is going to happen because of this:
Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."

Guild leaders leave. "I should tow the line for a bunch of bads without any rewarding gameplay incentives for even marginally skilled players beyond time-rush fap trials? Sorry, that gets old quick."

Skilled players leave. "If I wanted a lobotomy I would beat myself over the head with a bottle of Jack Daniels. Sorry, YOU entertain the bads."

Awesome post AlienD, but this:

>>>>[*] Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."<<<<< is so absolutely certain and there will be disappointment and ang-sty whines heard amongst those who absolutely love the mods that have been developed for this community...for many a day hence, very likely beginning fairly soon.

Erm the add ons are already disappearing. That has nothing to do with the difficulty nerf, so don't even try to link the two.

badmojo · July 2014

Blackwidow wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

But, making the game solo friendly, discourages grouping.

Completely untrue. The game does encourage grouping.

Bonuses to xp and loot does encourage group play.

Did I mention playing with friends is fun? Try it sometime.

I don't enjoy having people all around me in 1-50

Then MMOs are not for you, it seems.

because they just steal kills before I get a chance to hit them to get credit.

How can they steal kills if they were fighting the monster first?

They add chaos to the fights when I am more than capable of doing them myself.

Yeah, MMOs are not for you if other people in your game bother you.

All in all, grouping is not desirable in a game where you don't benefit from doing it.

There are bonuses for grouping. If you don't know that, what game have you been playing?

So, basically what we are left with is the only people who group, do so because they already have a connection to each other.

You must not be a social person in game.

I already group with some friends in the game. The majority of my game play is in groups. Just about the only thing I don't group up for lately is the VR content because I'm literally addicted to the increase difficulty of doing it solo.

When I said grouping wasn't encouraged, I meant 'on the fly' grouping isn't encouraged if they make it solo'able. You know, the times where you are doing a quest and someone else happens to be next to you. Currently in VR it can help out, it can make things go quicker and you enjoy the help. It's encouraged because people benefit from another player fighting next to them, despite not 'adding each other to group'.

I didn't enjoy having people around me in 1-50 because there was no benefit, and in fact there were many down sides to having players constantly helping you. I'm a bit of an explorer, I like to open every chest, look at every book, and generally just see everything I can see. This has caused me to miss a couple boss fights, I'll be working my way towards a quest objective only to have some random guy run in and go straight there and slay the boss before I can even react to it. You know, when you're down reading a book and some guy runs up stairs and kills the boss and then you get the credit message pop up.

There's also the times where you follow someone through a dungeon and all you find are dead bodies. Or when you are doing a dolmen and enjoying yourself and then the enemies start to drop before you get a chance to hit them, you look around and see some VR level players "helping" out.

It's not that I don't like people or grouping in video games. I love that ***. It's specifically the reason I'm here playing this MMO and not playing Skyrim. I want to want to group up. I want the game to encourage that grouping, not just in a few VR areas, in the whole game. It's the reason I posted this thread about making 1-50 more like VR content.

Anyway, you'll notice I'm not insulting you in my posts, so please show the smallest bit of respect and don't litter your posts with insults towards me. Sure, they weren't blatant personal attacks, but when you start making assumptions about people, that gets insulting.

badmojo · July 2014

Blackwidow wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

You might feel better in the morning, once the shock wears off.

It's been two nights since the announcement. I can't speak for the OP, but I can say it's still just as disappointing after a good nights rest.

To be fair, everything seems to upset you.

Except the inventory system!!!

Swordguy · July 2014

Tabbycat wrote: »

Anastasia wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Let me explain what is going to happen because of this:
Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."

Guild leaders leave. "I should tow the line for a bunch of bads without any rewarding gameplay incentives for even marginally skilled players beyond time-rush fap trials? Sorry, that gets old quick."

Skilled players leave. "If I wanted a lobotomy I would beat myself over the head with a bottle of Jack Daniels. Sorry, YOU entertain the bads."

Awesome post AlienD, but this:

>>>>[*] Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."<<<<< is so absolutely certain and there will be disappointment and ang-sty whines heard amongst those who absolutely love the mods that have been developed for this community...for many a day hence, very likely beginning fairly soon.

From what I understand, most of the modding community was upset over changes with the API, not difficulty in the game or how many fire standers there are.

plus, modders are not a finite community that roams from mmo to mmo, setting up tent and working away until the ground becomes barren.

cracker81 · July 2014

Kulthax wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

WHY CAN'T ZOS JUST LET YOU FLAG YOURSELF FOR SOLO?

This would be a quick and easy way using CURRENT MEGASERVER TECHNOLOGY to give BOTH parties what they want!

You are definitely trolling now. Programming is not easy and capslocking and bold typing your statement does not make it any more valid.

YOU DID NOT KNOW Caps help making pionts? SURE PROGRAMING is easy I dream of it and it happens. Lol

Phinix1 · July 2014

They already have the phasing system built into the megaserver core.

Give me 50 MINUTES with the code and I will add the table column for you.

It is a simple change that gives everyone what they want.

Metacon · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Can't there be ONE game that has the courage to cater to intelligent people?

No as long as the game has the "massive multiplayer" in its name. it is bound to be targeted to a *massive* population to support it..

If you would only appeal the "intelligent" players (lets say IQ 130+) or something about that... there would be too few people in the game to allow it being called "massive".. and - whats even more important - those selected few bright brains would have to face an absurd monstly subscription fee. because development and maintenance cost (and shareholder earnings) have to come from fewer pockets

If you want the money, you want the masses - and if you want the masses, you have to cater to the masses.

Blackwidow · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

WHY CAN'T ZOS JUST LET YOU FLAG YOURSELF FOR SOLO?

This would be a quick and easy way using CURRENT MEGASERVER TECHNOLOGY to give BOTH parties what they want!

Did you just answer your own quote?

Nice move.

MeowGinger · July 2014

How many threads are you going to make about this? This is at least your third or fourth, including the one that got deleted last night.

Edit: It's "our" game too

Phantax · July 2014

I think if you read the TOS you'll see this is not 'our' game. We pretty much have no control, say or ownership over any part of it. Not that I'm saying that is fair, but every time we click "I agree" we pretty much allow ZOS to do the hell what they want with our money.
"Our Game'? never was... never will be !

Anastasia · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

This is OUR game!

Exactly!

And since "our" includes people like me who enjoy the solo part of the game, i for one am glad that ZOS has created a game that lets me play my way.
;-)

People keep chiming in here with this but you completely miss the point.

Veteran content is EASY to solo already. The problem is when you take the "play how you want" to the EXTREME and assume you should be able to stand in fire and use the same 5 abilities and single RP play style for EVERYTHING, completely flying in the face of a game that was designed to encourage you to ADAPT.

ZOS created a beautiful balance of content that can be easily solo'd if you adapt, but is still fun and rewarding to group for, and people want to throw that out the window and create just another WoW clone because they feel entitled to play bad if they want.

AlienD -- I so appreciate your taking the time over the last couple of days to share information and experience, and to explain your position, most of which many here concur with.

***Just so you know though, this part: "if you adapt.." IS THE PART THEY DON'T WANT TO DO ;o/.***

Phinix1 · July 2014

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

But can we please talk about he suggestion?

Why can't they add a column to the table in the existing phasing system and let people flag themselves solo if they want to play the nerfed content and leave it the same for the rest of us?

I would actually not be surprised if that is what they ended up doing.

Zabalah · July 2014

Fleymark wrote: »

Somehow we've gone from games being impossible to solo in, to soloing being an option, to soloing being the only real option on a practical level. And it's just destroying the genre. It's nice to be able to solo, but that shouldn't be the thrust of EVERY MMO. It's entirely possible to have options but still keep things balanced from a risk/effort vs reward standpoint.

I agree.

There is nothing quite so satisfying as playing in a group and conquering a challenge!

Jade_Knightblazerb14_ESO · July 2014

Anastasia wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Let me explain what is going to happen because of this:
Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."

Guild leaders leave. "I should tow the line for a bunch of bads without any rewarding gameplay incentives for even marginally skilled players beyond time-rush fap trials? Sorry, that gets old quick."

Skilled players leave. "If I wanted a lobotomy I would beat myself over the head with a bottle of Jack Daniels. Sorry, YOU entertain the bads."

Awesome post AlienD, but this:

>>>>[*] Addon authors leave. "Catering to fire standers and destroying the unique challenge and meaningful and rewarding group content? Sorry, support your own game."<<<<< is so absolutely certain and there will be disappointment and ang-sty whines heard amongst those who absolutely love the mods that have been developed for this community...for many a day hence, very likely beginning fairly soon.

Many Addon authors have already left T_T

Malpherian · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

People who want to come home from work and sleep through an online game like it is supposed to be their digital sedative HAVE their games! Rift, WoW, FFXIV, etc., etc., etc...

WHY CAN'T ZOS JUST LET YOU FLAG YOURSELF FOR SOLO?

That way you can play in a phase where everything is faceroll easy. You can have your digital sedative, and ZOS doesn't have to ruin the fun for everyone else!

Why does EVERY MMO have to cater to people that want to solo everything and never have to think about strategy or game mechanics, playing "how they want" to unwind from their "hard day at work" as if we all didn't have to do it, even if that is basically having an IV drip of instant gratification attached to their refusal to engage or adapt to anything?

Why can't there actually be an MMO designed for GROUP PLAY? Or at least that challenges those MINIMALLY (veteran content is EASY if you play the game as designed) who wish to solo everything?

Make it doable, but don't make it pointless!

No risk, no reward!

Veteran content in this game was the PERFECT mix. You could EASILY solo EVERYTHING outside of instanced and public dungeons and some world bosses if you actually showed the willingness to adapt your spec to do it. There were plenty of skill points by veteran levels to have all the backup abilities you would need to keep your current play style AND have several backups to fall back on.

Plus it provided at least > 5sec combat if you DID decide to play in a group. It gave you a sense of there being a REASON to play in a group. Like it mattered if you were there to help heal or tank for someone. Sure they could do it by themselves, but they could do it much easier and much faster with less risk and potentially more fun (synergy, spell effects) because YOU were there.

Now what will we have? A bunch of every-man-for-himself faceroll soloists and meaningless characters that aren't needed for 90% of the game.

What were you THINKING ZOS?

Nerf SOLO INSTANCED QUESTS if you must, but don't destroy the perfect balance you created because paid disinformation agents from other games come onto your forums and extend the Facebook experiment on contagious negativity!

Erect the spin of growing a spine!

You must not have played any other TES game. TES Franchise is for "Casuals", the every day person, and people who enjoy:

* RP
* Character Development
* Engrossing Story-lines
* Immersion
* Creativity
* A real gaming experience set in a real world where your choices matter.

Strangely... That list does NOT include:

* Hell Mode difficulty
* Forced Grouping
* Elitest Mobs (Not to be confused with Bosses)
* Must play 18 hours a day to do the content
* Rush to max level (TES games have never been about leveling)

So maybe you, my friend, are playing the wrong game. You should try Darksouls, or Diablo 3, I believe those would be more up your alley.

TESO is a game for those who want to enjoy the experience, not rush headlong into the biggest best content (Like wow). TESO is a different MMO from all other MMO's. It may simply not be Your type of game however.

Your attitude towards what type of game TESO should be is a very tiny % of gamer's. If ZOS capitulated to your desires, the game would be dead within a week.

It is the exact opposite of what the TES franchise represents, and lets be real here, the TES fans are what is currently keeping the game alive, and ZOS already lost 2+ million subs simply because they put classes in the game, despite Beta testers stating it was a Horrible idea en-mass.

If they followed your advice they can kiss the other 350k remaining fans goodbye, and since that's about 85% of their subs, You would effectively kill the game.

Phantax · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

Why don't you wait till Monday before you start moaning about whether this was a bad idea. We don't even know what ZOS are going to do yet !

MeowGinger · July 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

But can we please talk about he suggestion?

Why can't they add a column to the table in the existing phasing system and let people flag themselves solo if they want to play the nerfed content and leave it the same for the rest of us?

I would actually not be surprised if that is what they ended up doing.

How would that be different from a difficulty slider with two settings?

Blackwidow · July 2014

@‌Malpherian

/awesome.

RazielSR · July 2014

theyancey wrote: »

OP, I disagree with you 100%. There are many of us who are here ONLY for solo content. There are many PvE players only. Many are here because they hate formal groups and raids. TESO provides some action to most everyone. To run off a large segment of the paying customer base to service your ideological purity would be to abandon their fiduciary responsibility to their stake holders. Speaking of which, this is most certainly NOT our game. It belongs to ZOS. We are simply customers. I am very slightly invested in it in that I own a bit of Providence Equity Partners in one of my institutional accounts. PEP owns 25% of Zenimax. Still, I am just another sub paying customer like everyone else.

Of course.A LOT of people wants solo playng. Cmon,even the devs said the game was not all about groups. TES fans are the ones who should be considered in this game more than the others. The rest of gamers will just rush the game and they will jump to.another random mmorpg. ZOS knows what they are doing. They have the metadata and knows who are the ones that will cme back and will continue here.

Blackwidow · July 2014

Phantax wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

Why don't you wait till Monday before you start moaning about whether this was a bad idea. We don't even know what ZOS are going to do yet !

Come one, Man! It's not time to react. It's time to overreact!

Dayel · July 2014

Let's stop beating this extremely dead horse. A lot us love the game but do not wish to spend time messing about with groups which are often composed of elitest jerks. And I can assure you that rants like the posting that started this topic do nothing to change that opinion. Wishing to play solo does not indicate a desire to have everything made easy for us, but rather a desire to enjoy a game without the stress unfortunately attendant on grouping.

Tabbycat · July 2014

Blackwidow wrote: »

Phantax wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

Why don't you wait till Monday before you start moaning about whether this was a bad idea. We don't even know what ZOS are going to do yet !

Come one, Man! It's not time to react. It's time to overreact!

After all the ranting people will have been doing over the three day weekend, they will be too exhausted to over-react when the patch finally hits on Monday.

Lodestar · July 2014

Phantax wrote: »

I think if you read the TOS you'll see this is not 'our' game. We pretty much have no control, say or ownership over any part of it. Not that I'm saying that is fair, but every time we click "I agree" we pretty much allow ZOS to do the hell what they want with our money.
"Our Game'? never was... never will be !

oooh Phantax how cynical.... not entirely without merit mind, still we do have to see the bright side, and the fair side while we at it.

badmojo · July 2014

Tabbycat wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

Phantax wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

Why don't you wait till Monday before you start moaning about whether this was a bad idea. We don't even know what ZOS are going to do yet !

Come one, Man! It's not time to react. It's time to overreact!

After all the ranting people will have been doing over the three day weekend, they will be too exhausted to over-react when the patch finally hits on Monday.

Sort of like how if you guys post enough garbage and jokes in these threads, it makes discussion of the topic dwindle.

Lodestar · July 2014

badmojo wrote: »

Tabbycat wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

Phantax wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

OK, sorry if I have offended anyone posting my opinion that this nerf is a bad idea.

Why don't you wait till Monday before you start moaning about whether this was a bad idea. We don't even know what ZOS are going to do yet !

Come one, Man! It's not time to react. It's time to overreact!

After all the ranting people will have been doing over the three day weekend, they will be too exhausted to over-react when the patch finally hits on Monday.

Sort of like how if you guys post enough garbage and jokes in these threads, it makes discussion of the topic dwindle.

Life and soul of the party aren't you?

RazielSR · July 2014

Dayel wrote: »

Let's stop beating this extremely dead horse. A lot us love the game but do not wish to spend time messing about with groups which are often composed of elitest jerks. And I can assure you that rants like the posting that started this topic do nothing to change that opinion. Wishing to play solo does not indicate a desire to have everything made easy for us, but rather a desire to enjoy a game without the stress unfortunately attendant on grouping.

COMPLETELY AGREE. Let the TES fans decide about this game. Zos now knows who are the real supporters of this game. The elitists and so called hardcore fans can return to their random mmorpg and rush the content. ESO IS ABOUT TES UNIVERSE. not about elitists.

Grim13 · July 2014

RazielSR wrote: »

Dayel wrote: »

Let's stop beating this extremely dead horse. A lot us love the game but do not wish to spend time messing about with groups which are often composed of elitest jerks. And I can assure you that rants like the posting that started this topic do nothing to change that opinion. Wishing to play solo does not indicate a desire to have everything made easy for us, but rather a desire to enjoy a game without the stress unfortunately attendant on grouping.

COMPLETELY AGREE. Let the TES fans decide about this game. Zos now knows who are the real supporters of this game. The elitists and so called hardcore fans can return to their random mmorpg and rush the content. ESO IS ABOUT TES UNIVERSE. not about elitists.

A Dragon Break says what?

Blackwidow · July 2014

badmojo wrote: »

Sort of like how if you guys post enough garbage and jokes in these threads, it makes discussion of the topic dwindle.

Hello, Pot.

Why, hello there Kettle.

Pot, you seem to be a little black today.

Kettle, to be fair, you are an D-bag.

Kiwi · July 2014

you know what would be a less drastic fix for the current situation..

introduce mercenaries for hire

have them wander the roads, like merchants do
not many, just a few per zone so if infact you are alone for miles and you are having trouble you can hire one to help you out

if theres a lot of people in the zone all the mercs may have been hired but there will be others around to thin out the hostile intent

if you prefer the difficulty then you can carry on as usual

Metacon · July 2014

Malpherian wrote: »

ZOS already lost 2+ million subs simply

On a sidenote: Is there any source to support these numbers?

I really doubt they managed to sell 2m box copies of the game. I rather assume they had 2m players during closed beta (where everyone and his dog was given a key)

I would rather believe they sold somewhere between 300k and 500k copies (http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=elder+scrolls+online)

But I agree to the statement that they already lost a big deal of those players to the zillion of bugs and design problems they had within the last 13 weeks post release. (Bugs are only fun if you dont have to pay subscription fee for them)