Heavy armor completly useless in PvP.

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

Hi, I have been playing since the release with light armor because I knew its impossible to be the main healer without light armor.

A week ago I thought to change to heavy armor because I was bored about wear a skirt. After play one week wearing heavy armor I only can say it's completly useless in PvP, light armor is FAR better in all aspects.

Isn't a secret that spell damage is the best source damage at this moment and heavy armor doesn't give us nothing good.

- Offensive Rol: Light armor is far better, you have magick penetration, critical chance and better resources. - 21% spell cost is simply too good.

- Defensive Rol: Light armor gives the double bonus of spell resist if you make a comparison with heavy armor (spells are the best source of damage at this moment), plus you can use defensive spells and healings in more effective way than any other armor type.

The only good passive skill in heavy armor tree is reduce 20% block cost. The others passives are useless or simply worse than light armor passive skills.

PLEASE buff heavy armor!!!! We want be able to use it in PvP whitout think we are useless!!!

Lupinemw

heavy works fine for my DPS guy.

You take the armour suited to the stat you need upping. Traditionally in a lot of games Casters have been denied access to Hvy Armour. I guess its all the arm waving stuff they do.

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

Lupinemw wrote: »

heavy works fine for my DPS guy.

You take the armour suited to the stat you need upping. Traditionally in a lot of games Casters have been denied access to Hvy Armour. I guess its all the arm waving stuff they do.

Which stats????

- Armor? ok, heavy armor gives more armor (but most of dmg right now is originated by spells).
- Spell Resist? light armor is much better.
- Heal recovery? xDDDD REALLY? is the easier recovery stat to reach the CAP. This passive is totaly USELESS.
- +7% melee attack power? Poor bonus and totaly useless if you make a comparison with "Concentration" skill 42% spell penatration.
- -10% cost blocking? Is the only good heavy armor passive skill.
- +7% healing received? not really good. Poor bonus.

Excuse me but if you think heavy armor is ok you should play more PvP.

Baphomet

Does heavy armor need a buff, absolutely.

It's good for dipping into, but going 5+ pieces of heavy is pretty crappy at the moment. I would like to point out though that one cannot compare 7% melee damage with 42% spell penetration as those percentages are based on complete different numbers and mechanics.

TheGrandAlliance

Use reflect ablities vs mage users. WOrks wonders.

Lupinemw

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

Use reflect ablities vs mage users. WOrks wonders.

Oh yes

Rylana

Medium armor is best armor

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

Baphomet wrote: »

Does heavy armor need a buff, absolutely.
I would like to point out though that one cannot compare 7% melee damage with 42% spell penetration as those percentages are based on complete different numbers and mechanics.

I know, +7% depend about how much attack power you have, and concentration depends about how much spell resist the enemy have. Right now considering the base stats that players have, concrentration is much better as offensive skill. It only was an example but I can make a comparison between light and heavy skills one by one.

7 pieces light armor vs 7 pieces heavy armor:


1-

* Light - Evocation: -21% spell cost (Excelent passive, one of the best in the game right now)
* Heavy - Resolve: +28% armor (REALLY??? More armor?? I can reach the armor cap even with medium armor) and +28% spell resist (it's OK but light armor gives 42%)

2-

* Light - Recovery: +28% Magicka Recovery (the most important stat right now in the game and is hard to reach the CAP)
* Heavy - Constitution: +28% Health recovery (Is really easy reach the health recovery CAP, useless skill).

3-

* Light - Spell Warding: +42% spell resist (Nice bonus considering spells are the best source of damage right now).
* Heavy - Juggernaut: +7% power attack (just noticeable difference, is near to useless)

4-

* Light - Prodigy: 10% critical change (Nice skill, nothing more to say)
* Heavy: Bracing: -20% cost blocking (Ok this skill is awsome and the only good heavy passive).

5-

*Light - Concentration: +42% spell penetration (Excelent offensive skill, it's even better than active skills that reduces spell resist)
* Heavy - Rapid Mending: +7% healing received (Only good if the fight lasts long. It's a PvE skill, in PvP barely notice the difference. Useless skill).

CapuchinSeven

No you can reach the SOFT cap, there is nothing wrong with putting more into a stat already at softcap (even more so if it's free), you're just not getting the same gains anymore.

If you're hitting the HARD cap, then you have a problem. While you wouldn't want to keep spending lots of points in something at softcap, there is nothing wrong with going well into the softcap when you're getting that for free. It does make a difference, and armour is one place you can see that difference.

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

CapuchinSeven wrote: »

No you can reach the SOFT cap, there is nothing wrong with putting more into a stat already at softcap (even more so if it's free), you're just not getting the same gains anymore.

If you're hitting the HARD cap, then you have a problem. While you wouldn't want to keep spending lots of points in something at softcap, there is nothing wrong with going well into the softcap when you're getting that for free. It does make a difference, and armour is one place you can see that difference.

OMG..... I Know it, but when you reach the soft CAP you received the half bonus.

What do you prefer, a skill that gives 42% spell resist or a skill that gives only 28% spell resist and 14% armor?. Before answer, you have to think that 70% or more damage you receive in PvP is Spell Damage.

I would like that people who defend "Heavy armor is OK" could give me an example where Heavy armor does better than light armor in PvP.

Armitas

Light armor all the way. If I need physical mitigation I can pop an armor buff skill. Who needs heavy armor when you can wear heavy armor over top of your light armor with a skill? In fact my p/m MIT's are higher this way than in a heavy set.

Cheatingdeath23

I am stubbornly wearing 7/7 heavy armor because I like the look of it and think that is how my character WOULD wear armor as a tank.

That said, everything I have read/seen/discussed is that light armor is the best and I just need two rings to get armor protection.


It is frustrating, I think they need to come up with some way to make heavy armor better. I've fully specced out into heavy armor and it feels like a waste-- even adding a "chainmail heavy" would help, which would have less armor than current heavy (more than medium) but provide stamina regen in addition to the health regen of current heavy.

Agrippa_Invisus

Heavy Armor could really use some tweaking upwards.

I'd love to see it add some more Stamina regeneration and/or Health regen to make it worth it, perhaps increase the Juggernaut damage bonus in some manner (turn it into Armor Pen or just increase the raw percentage). As it is, the only reasons to even have it are raw armor and the 20% block cost reduction at 5 pieces. There is no reason to have a full set (like there is with Light).

deathcoyrwb17_ESO

Cheatingdeath23 wrote: »

I am stubbornly wearing 7/7 heavy armor because I like the look of it and think that is how my character WOULD wear armor as a tank.

That said, everything I have read/seen/discussed is that light armor is the best and I just need two rings to get armor protection.


It is frustrating, I think they need to come up with some way to make heavy armor better. I've fully specced out into heavy armor and it feels like a waste-- even adding a "chainmail heavy" would help, which would have less armor than current heavy (more than medium) but provide stamina regen in addition to the health regen of current heavy.

Besides using armor enchants in rings, you can also go for set bonus in armor or use the many armor buffs especially if you're a DK or Sorc. Its just ridiculous that Light Armor has the best synergy with all builds, im using Light Armor to tank every content even trials, PvP and it is superior.

Like OP mentioned the only thing going for Heavy Armor is the 20% cost reduction to block which is not a lot because all classes have skills/spells that help them recover stamina. They need to buff this passive to have higher cost reduction for block and introduce more Tank specific passives like more block mitigation, increase passives dodge, cost reduction to all stamina & magicka skills/spells(maybe make it a lower value around 10% cost reduction since it affects both stamina and magicka) and especially cost reduction to CC break & dodge. We really need such Tank oriented passives...

Tintinabula

I wore 5 light and two heavy and recently switched to 5 heavy and two light and my survivability shot through the roof.

teladoy

OK you want to be a better healer, with magicka regen, pool and etc with heavy armor than with light.

This is like say why I can't eat better my pasta with a spoon that with a fork!! whyy!!! cry cry etc

You can eat your pasta with a spoon, but don't expect that it has to be the same that with a fork!

Heavy armor is for tank, pasives are different from light armor, and of course you can enchant your armor with magicka and magicka regen. You will heal and you will be more tanky.

But somebody with light armor, will heal more, will have more magicka, but will not be so tanky.

Is all about what you want, but you can't have all the good things, every decision will have pros and cons.

ESO gives you the option to build what you want, you have no restrictions, but the choises you make will have positive and negative results.

Maulkin

Mountain_Dewed

Rylana wrote: »

Medium armor is best armor

Mine is broke. I feel neked

Jitterbug

go nekkid!

Draxys

and months later, heavy armor is still not very viable in PvP

Orchish

Yep, i don't mind this thread coming back from the dead. Still waiting for some changes.

tplink3r1

teladoy wrote: »

OK you want to be a better healer, with magicka regen, pool and etc with heavy armor than with light.

This is like say why I can't eat better my pasta with a spoon that with a fork!! whyy!!! cry cry etc

You can eat your pasta with a spoon, but don't expect that it has to be the same that with a fork!

Heavy armor is for tank, pasives are different from light armor, and of course you can enchant your armor with magicka and magicka regen. You will heal and you will be more tanky.

But somebody with light armor, will heal more, will have more magicka, but will not be so tanky.

Is all about what you want, but you can't have all the good things, every decision will have pros and cons.

ESO gives you the option to build what you want, you have no restrictions, but the choises you make will have positive and negative results.

Funny, i just switched to light armor from heavy and im dying a lot less in PvP now.
heavy armor is fail, no resource management and no resistance bonus, it should have AT LEAST 20% damage mitigation for all damage.

suycyco

The 1% absorb (in stamina/magicka) while blocking was put in game finally or not? If yes maybe they should maybe try 2% or even better let it like that but drain 1% if blocking while wearing light or medium armor.
Maybe this should solve the problem of perma blocking light armor caster wich are a pain in Cyro for me.

SRIBES

Heavy armor really does need some love I think heavy armor should be built more for people who want to use magika and stamina but also sustain in health. To call it useless is not true though. Some of my DK buddies can block forever with potion cooldowns, 7/7heavy armor, sword and shield, juggernaut+warlock set. It's not that viable to 1vX or do group play but not useless just needs love.

Sharee

suycyco wrote: »

The 1% absorb (in stamina/magicka) while blocking was put in game finally or not? If yes maybe they should maybe try 2% or even better let it like that but drain 1% if blocking while wearing light or medium armor.
Maybe this should solve the problem of perma blocking light armor caster wich are a pain in Cyro for me.

Its not while blocking, just simply being hit. If you are hit, you gain 0.15% of your max HP as stamina and magicka per piece of heavy armor worn(comes out as 1.05% in full heavy), with a 2 second internal cooldown.

suycyco

Sharee wrote: »

suycyco wrote: »

The 1% absorb (in stamina/magicka) while blocking was put in game finally or not? If yes maybe they should maybe try 2% or even better let it like that but drain 1% if blocking while wearing light or medium armor.
Maybe this should solve the problem of perma blocking light armor caster wich are a pain in Cyro for me.

Its not while blocking, just simply being hit. If you are hit, you gain 0.15% of your max HP as stamina and magicka per piece of heavy armor worn(comes out as 1.05% in full heavy), with a 2 second internal cooldown.

Ok thanks for the enlightment, then maybe shorten the internal cooldown should be an idea because 15 hp per second and something like 10 magicka an stamina isn't really a change that could fill the gap between heavy and light armor.

Orchish

I heard that for 1.6 they are reviewing skills and classes? I seriously hope that heavy armour will finally be getting some love. 7 months i have been playing and waiting for it to be improved.

My DK tank should not be better off in light than heavy, not for tanking.

Jaerlach

AsweetRoll wrote: »

Heavy armor really does need some love I think heavy armor should be built more for people who want to use magika and stamina but also sustain in health. To call it useless is not true though. Some of my DK buddies can block forever with potion cooldowns, 7/7heavy armor, sword and shield, juggernaut+warlock set. It's not that viable to 1vX or do group play but not useless just needs love.

I am PVPing in Heavy because it is my leveling/pve equipment, and one thing I notice is that combining heavy with Hist Bark is pretty tremendous - the dodge while blocking really helps control stamina (as it makes those blocks use 0 stamina) and I think I am a lot more survivable than people expect me to be, especially as I am only V11.

I fought a 1v4 today after being sniped off a horse, and managed to kill one of them before dying just by dropping my standard and using talons - they stayed in the standard expecting to kill me before they died, but I didn't die until the standard wore and managed one kill and nearly 2 for my trouble. My opponents were all V12-14, though not high PVP ranked.

Heavy is definitely not well positioned, but it can have some strengths - as a pure health build in heavy, snipers are really not an issue - I have been sniped off my horse, survived the 2 second CC, popped my wings and then proceded to kill the archer, as their burst only accounted for about 2/3 of my health in the 2s window - the reflect damage + invasion/talons/whip was enough to finish them rapidly when they started their rotation a 2nd time.

I find myself wanting to run Elude to spike my dodge rating and help control my stamina usage, but I agree that heavy really needs some additional help with resource management.

Agrippa_Invisus

One other combination that works well with Heavy Armor is the Arena set.

With 5 pieces of heavy you are looking at 60% off CC breaks, which makes the phenomenally cheap. Add in the fact that a HA wearer is likely to have a very high stamina pool and your CC breaks are going to consume less than 200 stamina per break.

Draxys

Jaerlach wrote: »

AsweetRoll wrote: »

Heavy armor really does need some love I think heavy armor should be built more for people who want to use magika and stamina but also sustain in health. To call it useless is not true though. Some of my DK buddies can block forever with potion cooldowns, 7/7heavy armor, sword and shield, juggernaut+warlock set. It's not that viable to 1vX or do group play but not useless just needs love.

I am PVPing in Heavy because it is my leveling/pve equipment, and one thing I notice is that combining heavy with Hist Bark is pretty tremendous - the dodge while blocking really helps control stamina (as it makes those blocks use 0 stamina) and I think I am a lot more survivable than people expect me to be, especially as I am only V11.

I fought a 1v4 today after being sniped off a horse, and managed to kill one of them before dying just by dropping my standard and using talons - they stayed in the standard expecting to kill me before they died, but I didn't die until the standard wore and managed one kill and nearly 2 for my trouble. My opponents were all V12-14, though not high PVP ranked.

Heavy is definitely not well positioned, but it can have some strengths - as a pure health build in heavy, snipers are really not an issue - I have been sniped off my horse, survived the 2 second CC, popped my wings and then proceded to kill the archer, as their burst only accounted for about 2/3 of my health in the 2s window - the reflect damage + invasion/talons/whip was enough to finish them rapidly when they started their rotation a 2nd time.

I find myself wanting to run Elude to spike my dodge rating and help control my stamina usage, but I agree that heavy really needs some additional help with resource management.

Don't get your hopes up for Hist Bark + Elude, I tried that for DsA and they don't appear to stack. I could be wrong, but I was dodging way less than I should have been.

Thechemicals

Lets see.... its gives:

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

One other combination that works well with Heavy Armor is the Arena set.

With 5 pieces of heavy you are looking at 60% off CC breaks, which makes the phenomenally cheap. Add in the fact that a HA wearer is likely to have a very high stamina pool and your CC breaks are going to consume less than 200 stamina per break.

Someone already made a competent thread about medium armor being superior to heavy arena set armor through breakouts and sustainability. Heavy armor lacks what would make it op....stamina. 1% stamina recovery every 3-5 seconds isnt going to do sht.