Combat Updates – Update 51 PTS

Arunei · 3:32PM

MSattrtand wrote: »

Wuuffyy wrote: »

They didn’t seem to consider this or care when destroying werewolf sustain which ergo directly affects ‘werewolf bash weaving’ as well.

I loved the skill expression despite it being 1-bar.

For the love of Eights, can you stop writing about Werewolf sustain in PvE? I'm tired of parsing.

I'm double-bash-weaving for the whole fight. My sustain is perfectly fine with green food and tri-stat potions.

If you want to double-bash-weave with green food and armour potions, well, you can, but that's not a good idea. But it's technically possible.

Double-bash-weaving on 6-mil dummy, so only my own sustain. Green food, tri-stat potions. Sustain is bad. Do not double-bash-weave in groups that can't even provide the Orb.

And no, you can't sustain double-bash-weaving on Mag Werewolf, like any other Mag spec. And yes, once again I'm talking only about PvE.

Your Stam parses mean nothing when one of the big reasons the Stam cost increase is a problem is BECAUSE Mag builds' sustain will be ass. A Trial Dummy providing you every relevant buff also doesn't apply to solo content when the only buffs you're getting are from your own Skills and Gear.

tomofhyrule · 3:49PM

Arunei wrote: »

Trial Dummy providing you every relevant buff also doesn't apply to solo content when the only buffs you're getting are from your own Skills and Gear.

And here is the crux of most balancing issues.

If you balance against every person being solo, then groups are OP. If you balance against groups, then soloists are left in the dust.

Which is the right answer?

GeneralGrundmann · 3:57PM

Don't know if this is "the" right answer.

It depends what you would like to compare.

Comparing trial builds for dps = 21m dummy

Comparing solo builds for dps = 6m dummy

Any other comparisons are more difficult if not impossible. Healing for example.

A trial build dps might slot zero self heals because he gets all the healing it needs from the group.

A solo build needs healing skills or relies only on pale order.

Balancing a game like this is for all situations is impossible, especially cross-comparisons.

LadyGP · 4:24PM

Whats happening right now with OSR is insane..

This little cllip right here, how decisions are made, is something ZoS should take directly to the heart, inject in their veins, whatever it needs. The way decisions are being made right now are.... all over the place.

https://youtu.be/SVgcOWPU6k0?si=1aKFvmoUcpkxj3YE&t=788

Because they won't click the link I'm sure I'll type it all out.

Context: Leading from the heart.

"It doesn't feel safe. It feels safe to have numbers making decisions for you. I think as soon as you get lost in that you're not really making decisions anyway.. you're just letting consequences roll out of data points.. which is unfortunate."

"I think for us leading with heart is the only thing we can do really well."

Look at what the very first thing he did when he became CEO.... I'll wait.

- xcatguy

Wuuffyy · 4:36PM

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

Trial Dummy providing you every relevant buff also doesn't apply to solo content when the only buffs you're getting are from your own Skills and Gear.

And here is the crux of most balancing issues.

If you balance against every person being solo, then groups are OP. If you balance against groups, then soloists are left in the dust.

Which is the right answer?

Fully optimized groups are pulling 230-250k (I've seen those group CMXs in actual content with my own eyes). Worry about the little guy (solo/small scale) and make sure less of it affects the big guy (big groups/large scale) when possible... but definitely focus on the little guy first.

Werewolf sustain nerfs? They smash the competition and leave sorc as the only viable option to maintain werewolf sustain and it 'feel good'. Little Jimmy turning into a NB werewolf or turning into a werewolf from a magden is destroyed yet 'The Wolfinator' is over here chugging along still on sorc next patch based on my own PTS insight.

Anyone with a unique IA sustain wolf build- hurt deeply.

Anyone with a 4-man PvE tank built for self-sustain- hurt deeply.

Anyone on a mag build outside of parsing on 'da 21m dummy and/or a fully optimized group- hurt deeply.

Sustain nerfs were for PvP, geared towards 'overbearing werewolf issues' yet leaves Conservation of Energy unchecked and trickles down to each facet of PvE and off-meta PvP uniquely.

Arunei · 5:09PM

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

Trial Dummy providing you every relevant buff also doesn't apply to solo content when the only buffs you're getting are from your own Skills and Gear.

And here is the crux of most balancing issues.

If you balance against every person being solo, then groups are OP. If you balance against groups, then soloists are left in the dust.

Which is the right answer?

The right answer in this case would be trying several things they seem unwilling to do:

1) Adjust CoE because it's overtuned regardless but is especially busted on WW. Increasing the Stam cost is just going to drive everyone to playing Sorcs for it. And mind you I don't PvP much at all and one of the characters I play is a Sorc, so I'm not saying to lower CoE because I want to see Sorc nerfed. I want to see other things NOT get nerfed because it's too strong.

2) Make WW Skills cost whatever your highest resource is. That way at least Mag WWs would still be able to sustain because the Skills would cost Mag (though the heal should swap to a Stam Skill in this case if they could do that).

3) Make CoE require a Sorc Skill be used to activate.

4) Disable CoE when a player is transformed while in Cyro/IC/BGs.

5) Make the increase smaller, say the Stam Skills cost 1.5k Stam instead, rather than going up as high as.they have.

6) Make use of Battle Spirit more and add the Stam Skill cost increases there instead of to WW overall where it will also affect PvE, which they've said they're happy in the past with where PvE WW was so why do something that nerfs it?