Please skip Warden and Sorc refreshes and rework Nightblade!

Pinktraining · May 6

nightbringer1993 wrote: »

I can still destroy people with a nightblade but necromancers can’t.

Read the PTS, people are extremely disappointed from the Necro masteries. Melavolent does not even target players, merciless resolve does crazy amounts of damage and nightblade have more buff than Necro.

Go play Necro and check! I am a want to remain Necro main who is about to leave the game because of all of the nerfs. And I can tell you that nightblade is doing far better than Necro.

Necro has no proper execution skill, NB does.

Necro has no proper stun skills, NB does.

Necro has no proper burst damage as blastbone got nerfed. NB can mix cloak, ulti and merciless resolve to destroy people.

Necro’s heal give us debuff like minor defile where nb can heal much more. And our ghost got nerfed five years ago.

Those class masteries are bad as hell, and people complained and then the devs told us that the refresh was needed to have those masteries optimized, which means that the class will remain unplayable up until winter 2027. And once again this is a PAID class!

Every class have burst damage, like BFB, skulls etc.But NB's Merciless isn't delayed so it's worst "burst' skill among all classes. Incap is the only actually good skill NB has but it's good because of 20% damage increase, while everyone on it's own doesn't have any skills to buff with this 20%... Never in your entire life NB will not have a free slot for killer's blade because lack of free slots has been NB's problem for a long time and still is. Stop trying to mislead ZOS and make NB dead because you don't like the class.Everyone will just press block and outheal merciless' damage with 1 burst heal or even just hots, and you can't ever reliably hit it after your incap.
And Gravelord was the best damage skill line, better than animal.In small encounters or duels , Gravelord was obviously better because BB is OP.Not to mention DK's and Necro's spammable are better than NB.

nightbringer1993 · May 6

Pinktraining wrote: »

nightbringer1993 wrote: »

I can still destroy people with a nightblade but necromancers can’t.

Read the PTS, people are extremely disappointed from the Necro masteries. Melavolent does not even target players, merciless resolve does crazy amounts of damage and nightblade have more buff than Necro.

Go play Necro and check! I am a want to remain Necro main who is about to leave the game because of all of the nerfs. And I can tell you that nightblade is doing far better than Necro.

Necro has no proper execution skill, NB does.

Necro has no proper stun skills, NB does.

Necro has no proper burst damage as blastbone got nerfed. NB can mix cloak, ulti and merciless resolve to destroy people.

Necro’s heal give us debuff like minor defile where nb can heal much more. And our ghost got nerfed five years ago.

Those class masteries are bad as hell, and people complained and then the devs told us that the refresh was needed to have those masteries optimized, which means that the class will remain unplayable up until winter 2027. And once again this is a PAID class!

Every class have burst damage, like BFB, skulls etc.But NB's Merciless isn't delayed so it's worst "burst' skill among all classes. Incap is the only actually good skill NB has but it's good because of 20% damage increase, while everyone on it's own doesn't have any skills to buff with this 20%... Never in your entire life NB will not have a free slot for killer's blade because lack of free slots has been NB's problem for a long time and still is. Stop trying to mislead ZOS and make NB dead because you don't like the class.Everyone will just press block and outheal merciless' damage with 1 burst heal or even just hots, and you can't ever reliably hit it after your incap.
And Gravelord was the best damage skill line, better than animal.In small encounters or duels , Gravelord was obviously better because BB is OP.Not to mention DK's and Necro's spammable are better than NB.

Then play necro and look how destroyed the class, and once again you are completely wrong, necro is the worst class in the game there are crazy amounts of threads about it

And animal companion does more damage than grave lord. Deep fissure does more damage than blastbone and the line has access to more buff than necro. Go to cyro and see, that toxic, assassination/animal companion/storm calling(sometime replaced by aedric spear) has been a plague in cyro.

And even PVE wise the necro got nerfed and discriminated, so much that necro DDs are being kicked out trial groups. I switched to nightbalde two years ago when blastbone got nerfed so I know what I am talking about.

So before telling that the class is doing better, then try it for a week and see. Try stunning poeple with the totem, try to kill people with the blastbone. THE CLASS IS DESTROYED.

And the skull is so slow that people can dodge it, the nightblade spamable does far more damage, than the skull, and look at merciless resolve. Nightblade got buffed when they added 10 charges of it allowing multiple resolve to be shot in a small amount of time.

And the incapacitating strike is still OP, and you are telling me that necro is doing better than NB!

I played nightblade for two years now, and I can tell you that NB is in a better state than necro. So now read the threads that are made about necro. Because there are way more than NB threads.

And ZOS game maj vul to other classes, five years ago with the archdruid and turning tide sets. So seriously before telling than other class are better, try them for a week. Because that is what I did, and I went sick when I saw that they were far stronger than necro. I tried the new DK, and when I saw how OP it was, I immediately reduced my ESO playtime because of how depressive it was.

Pure NB can still kill people in pvp, where necro cannot since the blastbone nerf! And when you say blastbone is OP, recheck the merciless resolve, and check at deep fissure, and that whip from DK. And even sorc crystal and bound armament and curse can do better than blastbone.

ZOS destroyed the necromancer class, and should have been refreshed this year because of it, and because it is a PAID class, and that people should be able to enjoy the product they PAID for! where right now this class is a complete pay to lose.

How many other necro threads do I have to share?

Pinktraining · May 6

nightbringer1993 wrote: »

Pinktraining wrote: »

nightbringer1993 wrote: »

I can still destroy people with a nightblade but necromancers can’t.

Read the PTS, people are extremely disappointed from the Necro masteries. Melavolent does not even target players, merciless resolve does crazy amounts of damage and nightblade have more buff than Necro.

Go play Necro and check! I am a want to remain Necro main who is about to leave the game because of all of the nerfs. And I can tell you that nightblade is doing far better than Necro.

Necro has no proper execution skill, NB does.

Necro has no proper stun skills, NB does.

Necro has no proper burst damage as blastbone got nerfed. NB can mix cloak, ulti and merciless resolve to destroy people.

Necro’s heal give us debuff like minor defile where nb can heal much more. And our ghost got nerfed five years ago.

Those class masteries are bad as hell, and people complained and then the devs told us that the refresh was needed to have those masteries optimized, which means that the class will remain unplayable up until winter 2027. And once again this is a PAID class!

Every class have burst damage, like BFB, skulls etc.But NB's Merciless isn't delayed so it's worst "burst' skill among all classes. Incap is the only actually good skill NB has but it's good because of 20% damage increase, while everyone on it's own doesn't have any skills to buff with this 20%... Never in your entire life NB will not have a free slot for killer's blade because lack of free slots has been NB's problem for a long time and still is. Stop trying to mislead ZOS and make NB dead because you don't like the class.Everyone will just press block and outheal merciless' damage with 1 burst heal or even just hots, and you can't ever reliably hit it after your incap.
And Gravelord was the best damage skill line, better than animal.In small encounters or duels , Gravelord was obviously better because BB is OP.Not to mention DK's and Necro's spammable are better than NB.

Then play necro and look how destroyed the class, and once again you are completely wrong, necro is the worst class in the game there are crazy amounts of threads about it

And animal companion does more damage than grave lord. Deep fissure does more damage than blastbone and the line has access to more buff than necro. Go to cyro and see, that toxic, assassination/animal companion/storm calling(sometime replaced by aedric spear) has been a plague in cyro.

And even PVE wise the necro got nerfed and discriminated, so much that necro DDs are being kicked out trial groups. I switched to nightbalde two years ago when blastbone got nerfed so I know what I am talking about.

So before telling that the class is doing better, then try it for a week and see. Try stunning poeple with the totem, try to kill people with the blastbone. THE CLASS IS DESTROYED.

And the skull is so slow that people can dodge it, the nightblade spamable does far more damage, than the skull, and look at merciless resolve. Nightblade got buffed when they added 10 charges of it allowing multiple resolve to be shot in a small amount of time.

And the incapacitating strike is still OP, and you are telling me that necro is doing better than NB!

I played nightblade for two years now, and I can tell you that NB is in a better state than necro. So now read the threads that are made about necro. Because there are way more than NB threads.

And ZOS game maj vul to other classes, five years ago with the archdruid and turning tide sets. So seriously before telling than other class are better, try them for a week. Because that is what I did, and I went sick when I saw that they were far stronger than necro. I tried the new DK, and when I saw how OP it was, I immediately reduced my ESO playtime because of how depressive it was.

Pure NB can still kill people in pvp, where necro cannot since the blastbone nerf! And when you say blastbone is OP, recheck the merciless resolve, and check at deep fissure, and that whip from DK. And even sorc crystal and bound armament and curse can do better than blastbone.

ZOS destroyed the necromancer class, and should have been refreshed this year because of it, and because it is a PAID class, and that people should be able to enjoy the product they PAID for! where right now this class is a complete pay to lose.

How many other necro threads do I have to share?

What are you talking about? Everyone's using Restoration and Storm in combination with Grave Lord or Animal Companion; that's the mainstream build.

Grave Lord is strong because it counters Restoration builds to some extent and provides stronger overall pressure and slightly higher burst damage. Furthermore, Grave Lord is easier to time than Grim Focus because it attacks every 3 seconds with a delay, allowing it to arrive alongside other damage. With good timing, Bone Burst and Abyssal Rift combined with Dawnbreaker can basically one-shot everything.

That's enough. Your questions have already been answered one by one in that link. There's absolutely no need to reply further.

nightbringer1993 · May 6

look at this:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691398/what-class-is-the-most-in-need-of-attention-bug-fixes-and-buffs-right-now/p1
60% for necro
7% for NB
Are you going against what players thinks?

look at the amount of threads concerning necro/
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691821/necro-class-mastery-passives-are-disappointing#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691794/necromancer#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691329/malevolent-promise-necromancer#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/678437/surprise-surprise-blastbones-and-animate-blastbones-ulti-are-unusable-in-pvp-now#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/678437/surprise-surprise-blastbones-and-animate-blastbones-ulti-are-unusable-in-pvp-now#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8439940#Comment_8439940

So now play the class and see! because players are defending a 2026 necro refresh more than the NB refresh. Try the destroyed corpse gameplay, and see how frustrating it is.
Read those threads.
And check at that video by avid necro

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BAgo_L_x1Q

L_Nici · May 6

Pinktraining wrote: »

Demanding that Nightblade be refreshed first is perfectly reasonable, as Nightblade is the weakest class, with all three lines being poor and offering fewer bonuses compared to other similar abilities. For example, Magicka Flood only provides 6% resources, while Sorc gains 108 Weapon Damage through Expert Mage, and Warden gains 5% Critical Damage per skill through Advanced Species.

Not to mention in random groups, you'll see a lot of players using pets(Bear and Bird) and HA, but you'll never see anyone using Nightblade to gain a damage buff through stealth. Even the Necromancer is used more often than Nightblade; Colo and Resurrection are everywhere.

Yeah, ALL 3 lines of NB are so bad, that it is meta to run Assassination on everything.

Also in PvP, NB is one of the classes I never even considered subclassing on. It did best as pure class until the DK was reworked.

katanagirl1 · May 7

I don’t think you can say one class is better unless you have played that class. You also can’t make calls based on streak or any other class skill now because of subclassing either.

I’d love to see NB get worked because it has been bad in PvE since probably before hybridization. I’ll wait and hope they give it something to improve the class.

Four_Fingers · May 7

All I know is my NBs do just fine in PvP and general PvE, trials I don't do on a stealth character.

Pinktraining · May 7

nightbringer1993 wrote: »

look at this:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691398/what-class-is-the-most-in-need-of-attention-bug-fixes-and-buffs-right-now/p1
60% for necro
7% for NB
Are you going against what players thinks?

look at the amount of threads concerning necro/
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691821/necro-class-mastery-passives-are-disappointing#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691794/necromancer#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691329/malevolent-promise-necromancer#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/678437/surprise-surprise-blastbones-and-animate-blastbones-ulti-are-unusable-in-pvp-now#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/678437/surprise-surprise-blastbones-and-animate-blastbones-ulti-are-unusable-in-pvp-now#latest
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8439940#Comment_8439940

So now play the class and see! because players are defending a 2026 necro refresh more than the NB refresh. Try the destroyed corpse gameplay, and see how frustrating it is.
Read those threads.
And check at that video by avid necro
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BAgo_L_x1Q

These prove nothing; they only prove that Necromancer players are unwilling to face reality.

I could also provide many links from Nightblade players requesting a buff for Nightblade, such as:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/692573/revert-nb-nerf-and-remove-battle-spirit-penalty#latest

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/692234/the-current-state-of-ranged-magblade#latest

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/692571/push-nb-rework-ahead-of-warden#latest

You just want your class to get favored; it's not about fair play.

Pinktraining · May 7

Four_Fingers wrote: »

All I know is my NBs do just fine in PvP and general PvE, trials I don't do on a stealth character.

Stealth is undoubtedly a PvE ability ,too . Did you know that Stealth can avoid damage from some boss mechanics? Not to mention, Stealth also has a damage buff specifically for "monsters".

annathepiper · May 7

I'm a data point of one, but I'm still a data point against the idea that nobody is playing Nightblades at all. I am. While I am not a Nightblade main, I DO have a Nightblade alt. She was in fact my very first DPS character.

As of the current patch, I'm still doing decent enough damage with my NB when I run her in dungeons and trials. She's not doing spectacular damage, certainly not in comparison with my Arc and my DK, both of whom can currently do about 10K more DPS than she does when I'm parsing. But she's still perfectly functional.

Am I anxious to see the Nightblades refreshed? Absolutely. I'm still very partial to this character even though she's not necessarily my first choice for DPS anymore, if my guild is doing vet content. And I'd like to see her catch up with my characters that pack the bigger punches. But I don't feel like she's really suffering that much by comparison. She's still absolutely fine for running any normal tier content, and even some of the easier vet trials such as Hel Ra.

Pinktraining · May 7

annathepiper wrote: »

I'm a data point of one, but I'm still a data point against the idea that nobody is playing Nightblades at all. I am. While I am not a Nightblade main, I DO have a Nightblade alt. She was in fact my very first DPS character.

As of the current patch, I'm still doing decent enough damage with my NB when I run her in dungeons and trials. She's not doing spectacular damage, certainly not in comparison with my Arc and my DK, both of whom can currently do about 10K more DPS than she does when I'm parsing. But she's still perfectly functional.

Am I anxious to see the Nightblades refreshed? Absolutely. I'm still very partial to this character even though she's not necessarily my first choice for DPS anymore, if my guild is doing vet content. And I'd like to see her catch up with my characters that pack the bigger punches. But I don't feel like she's really suffering that much by comparison. She's still absolutely fine for running any normal tier content, and even some of the easier vet trials such as Hel Ra.

Don't you realize that your example perfectly illustrates why Nightblade is in such a bad situation?

Any experienced player can clearly tell you: Normal difficulty = no difficulty.

Truly challenging game content (in PvE) is at least the Veteran's Trial DLC, or even HM.

nightbringer1993 · May 7

Once again Necro is in more need of refresh than NB.

Try and use the class! The class is destroyed!

You say blastbone is OP! The skill is nerfed like hell and can be unreliable! Deep fissure does more damage!

I switched to NB two years ago because of it and I have significantly increased my damage! And the class is more reliable!

Go to cyro and compare kill 20 NB and kill 20 necro, and you will see the actual necro pop. I always tried to avoid the necro quest because of it.

We paid for a product that we can’t use!

old_mufasa · May 7

Pinktraining wrote: »

You just want your class to get favored; it's not about fair play.

Oh the irony....

Moredhel83 · May 7

As long as they turn the Sorc flappies into succubi, I'm happy. Oh, and split the hairless monkey and dinosaur into two separate skills so we can have both running around, kthnxbai. But mostly the flappies.

Arunei · May 7

There's no way they're going to rearrange the order of the reworks. As someone else said they've probably already got Warden on the road to being done and have groundwork laid for Sorc at the very least. Hell, for all we know they might have stuff done for all the reworks to a certain degree and switching the around and trying to shift priorities might screw things up.

Others have asked if you've played the Classes you're claiming are fine or even OP, and I don't think you've actually answered yes or no. And when people plead the fifth, as it were (the right not to speak/answer questions for those not familiar with what that means lol), then others will ALWAYS assume the negative thing is the answer. In this case, they're going to assume you haven't played the Classes to actually know how well they do or don't play.

But there's also just bias regardless and everyone has different opinions of what is or isn't 'the worst'. And that's why ultimately ZOS is very unlikely to listen to people saying "buff X first it's worse than Y!" because most people who main anything other than X will disagree and think THEIR X is what needs more attention.

I'd assume ZOS has a reason for the order of the list, likely internal numbers and such that none of us have access to. Aka actual data and not just opinions and biases.

Urzigurumash · May 7

The other thing is Warden is the other DK, it is a thematic counterpart and a mechanical replication. Ice and Biological vs Fire and Geological. Many of the skills can be matched up quite well, for instance Shalks is a ranged Breath with their AoE Breach, Flies is a ranged claw, Shards is Talons, Sleet Storm is Magma Armor, and so on.

So I think that's probably why it's next. They should be balanced together, and actually in many patches if you look back they often travelled the same direction through Tiers in PVP, up or down from patch to patch, probably because they were the High HP and Heavy Armor classes much moreso than the others, back in the days before Hybridization and revised Armor Passives and such.

Urzigurumash · May 7

Pinktraining wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

Pinktraining wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Pinktraining wrote: »

Nightblade is at the bottom in both PvE and PvP, the weakest class and in dire need of a rework more than any other! ZOS, please don't waste resources on classes that are already strong; you need to help the weakest class like Nightblade!

Necros

The Necromancer was always in better shape than Nightblade, especially after obtaining Masteries in U50, which gave it almost unlimited stamina, completely overwhelming Nightblade.

bruh no, necros have been dogwater since like 2021. If anyone deserves a skip to the front its them.

I am not at all biased, ignore the necromancer i leveled fully just before they nerfed it and has been a crafter ever since lol.

No ! Necro have always been one of the best classes in both PvP and PvE.But NB is always the bad in PVP/PVE.
NB needs huge buffs. Easily all its tooltips could be tripled and it would be still be lightyears behind the PVP God Classes like Necro and Arcanist

hey at least quote me would ya @Pinktraining 😉

Urzigurumash · May 7

For some constructive ideas here I'd say Major Breach on Contingency. Helps everyone else more than DK and Warden. Might be a bit busted in theory but it's Melee and we may have an Ele Sus meta on our hands.

ESO_Nightingale · May 7

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

This.

Oblivion_Protocol · May 7

This is the greatest troll thread ever, I’ve got to say. Just A+ material. Trying to convince people that the class widely considered to be the devs’ favorite (for good reason) is actually the worst class in the game is just hilarious.

There are no Nightblades in Ba Sing Se.

ZhuJiuyin · May 7

Oblivion_Protocol wrote: »

This is the greatest troll thread ever, I’ve got to say. Just A+ material. Trying to convince people that the class widely considered to be the devs’ favorite (for good reason) is actually the worst class in the game is just hilarious.

There are no Nightblades in Ba Sing Se.

It's impossible to confirm if this is a troll thread, as there are similar posts from different people on PTS.

Oblivion_Protocol · May 7

ZhuJiuyin wrote: »

It's impossible to confirm if this is a troll thread, as there are similar posts from different people on PTS.

Even if it’s not, which I doubt, it and other threads like it are pointless. ZOS already laid out the roadmap for the year and has their plan in place. A multimillion dollar company isn’t going to just put its plans on hold and change them around because a handful of people said they should.

Besides, when has PTS feedback ever been worth more than a fart in the wind?

ZhuJiuyin · May 7

Oblivion_Protocol wrote: »

ZhuJiuyin wrote: »

It's impossible to confirm if this is a troll thread, as there are similar posts from different people on PTS.

Even if it’s not, which I doubt, it and other threads like it are pointless. ZOS already laid out the roadmap for the year and has their plan in place. A multimillion dollar company isn’t going to just put its plans on hold and change them around because a handful of people said they should.

Besides, when has PTS feedback ever been worth more than a fart in the wind?

Honestly, I genuinely believe that most of these posts demanding a change in the refresh order are actually from other vendors trying to disrupt ZOS. Look at the feedback on PTS right now; there are five or six posts from just one person about buffing Nightblade, and they're attacking ZOS and everyone who raises different opinions.

Psyphiman · May 7

I’ve played thousands of hours on a Redguard Nightblade. I thought I was just a bad player. I’m so relieved that I have been using the worst race and class.

The_LondonTeletubby · May 7

The issue isn't the order of classes it's the fact that only 1 class is being addressed at a time.

The DK rework is undeniable proof that multiple classes need to be released at the same time to prevent one class dominating over the rest.

I saw someone from twitch hit 100,000 Tick of damage on a DK bomber whilst crying that cross healing is too strong and needs nerfing.

After this Warden & Werewolf release they need to hold back the next round of class reworks and do multiple together.