The absolute irony in this post.

Really would like to see the healing on conservation reigned in a bit, it's a bit too much that it is outhealing everything on CMX every fight.

React wrote: »

Really would like to see the healing on conservation reigned in a bit, it's a bit too much that it is outhealing everything on CMX every fight.

You're gonna have to fight the entire Sorc community as well lmao. Good luck with that

Are cooking? I think we might be cooking Sorcs.

*chuckles nervously pacing back and forth*

React wrote: »

Really would like to see the healing on conservation reigned in a bit, it's a bit too much that it is outhealing everything on CMX every fight.

It needs to scale with max mag/stam only, not HP, and generally be a slightly harsher scaling value.

Apart from this, ZoS did right. Static Reverb nerfed and Conservation left as is. Though Blood Magic could be looked at as described.

xylena wrote: »

Do we still need to nerf DK?

I never thought we did, but just to buff every other class up to current DK with each refresh. If the answer to this during the warden refresh in 5 months is that warden is underperforming compared to DK, then I think the answer will probably change to yes.

Wuuffyy wrote: »

hoangdz wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

The absolute irony in this post.

In any case you'll still be able to use Sorc for your WW, so that's not too bad after all

What if I wanted to use literally anything else… I said ‘just shut that particular class mastery passive off for werewolf’ if it’s so problematic. Or I guess just give werewolf its own ‘class mastery’ if it’s receiving nerfs in part/ because of them? (I bet next week we lose that too, and they revert nothing meaningful)

So happy you managed to keep this. Meanwhile my werewolf bleed on berserker does less damage per second than on live and was reduced from 4 seconds to… checks notes… 1 second with a 1 second delay.

I mean are we serious? Can we not just convert power at this point from that into something else for PvP?Are we all in here and believe that wasn’t just a little heavy handed??

///

Yes I get to talk about werewolf in the jammm sorc mastery thread if it’s catching nerfs for it.

And btw, i’m not 100% happy about this lol. In 1 month Cyrodiil will have sorcs running around with 40k+ HP that are extremely tough to kill. Not a good PvP environment at all. Conservation needed some adjustments to its healing and buffs to its resource return. Ideally I’d want the old 1k mag/stam value and blood magic proccing off sorc abilities only, not all.

hoangdz wrote: »

Wuuffyy wrote: »

hoangdz wrote: »

Panderbander wrote: »

The absolute irony in this post.

In any case you'll still be able to use Sorc for your WW, so that's not too bad after all

What if I wanted to use literally anything else… I said ‘just shut that particular class mastery passive off for werewolf’ if it’s so problematic. Or I guess just give werewolf its own ‘class mastery’ if it’s receiving nerfs in part/ because of them? (I bet next week we lose that too, and they revert nothing meaningful)

So happy you managed to keep this. Meanwhile my werewolf bleed on berserker does less damage per second than on live and was reduced from 4 seconds to… checks notes… 1 second with a 1 second delay.

I mean are we serious? Can we not just convert power at this point from that into something else for PvP?Are we all in here and believe that wasn’t just a little heavy handed??

///

Yes I get to talk about werewolf in the jammm sorc mastery thread if it’s catching nerfs for it.

And btw, i’m not 100% happy about this lol. In 1 month Cyrodiil will have sorcs running around with 40k+ HP that are extremely tough to kill. Not a good PvP environment at all. Conservation needed some adjustments to its healing and buffs to its resource return. Ideally I’d want the old 1k mag/stam value and blood magic proccing off sorc abilities only, not all.

Yeah honestly.. As a Stam Sorc, we were done dirty for years, but we we're under dogs, it felt unique to have next to no identity, but still able to compete with speed and good sustain combined with great set abuse. I never jumped ship and despite feeling "weaker" I always managed to get by and compete. I'm talking before hybridization, Crystal Weapon, and Bound Armaments. All we had was weapon abilities, Hurricane, Streak, Surge, Dark Deal, Implosion, and Overload 3rd bar.

The patches where Stam Sorc became meta due to abusing ridiculous set combinations always led to us being nerfed in the class kit some how. Hrothgar's Chill, Oakensoul, Savage Werewolf, Master DW, list goes on and on.

Then came subclassing, and suddenly everyone is picking up the only good skill line we have via Storm Calling to abuse Streak and Hurricane, literally 2/3 of the main reasons I started maining Sorc in 2015. I pray they don't gut them and Critical Surge like a pig for slaughter. Maybe some tweaks, even quality of life changes like Surge getting some scaling introduced or BOL getting Major Expedition instead of projectile absorption, but I'm super curious how they'll go about it.

DK was an easy class to start with because they were already the best pre refresh class design that best highlighted the direction they wanted to go with a very clear fantasy across the class and majority of abilities already dealing flame damage. Warden is a complete mess, Sorc has some very strong skills, but about 80% that do nothing. Necro is a clunky mess that needs a rework from top to bottom. Templar needs a passive buff, some new damage skills, and some skill swaps, but they're not far from being great.

I'm sure DK mains feel the same way now with all the meta chasing bandwagoners jumping to their class, it's just how the cookie crumbles, but I prefer to be slightly under power and under estimated rather than feeling like I'm cheating or meta chasing.

I guess the lesson is I can never be happy lol.

At least now I don't really think it's a big deal since Sorc is going to be refreshed in 6 months anyway, anything powerful via Masteries this patch will be retuned soon when a lot of the power is added back to abilities and passives where they belong.

...actually less than 6 months, PTS for U52 should be Sept 13th so 4.5 months, Warden and U51 should be July 6 so only 2.5 months. They'll also probably release preview articles earlier.

We have entered a weird timeline were the Sorc rework might end up being a net nerf for pure Sorc PvP after setting the bar so high in U50.

MashmalloMan wrote: »

Vaqual wrote: »

We have entered a weird timeline were the Sorc rework might end up being a net nerf for pure Sorc PvP after setting the bar so high in U50.

Nothing can be worse than 80% of the kit being useless. We're regulated to a handful of skills of which you can get half of through subclassing. I'll take upcoming nerfs with open arms to have a better designed class from top to bottom.

This here exactly (which was also one of the main factors behind my original thread back in U36 that proposed a full rework to sorcs entire kit).

I'd love to have DKs current dilemma of wanting to slot (or at the bare minimum tinker around with) every single skill/morph of the class kit rather than just having 1 ability always used, a couple of others that are fill in's for when the build isn't getting a better option from elsewhere and the rest being completely unusable.

I chose Sorcerer originally because it was the lightning class, but right now I have streak and that's really all I have left in sorcs kit that still feels somewhat like that original design/feeling.

There's a lot of abilities with shock damage tacked on, but none of them have that same feeling to them (most just feel like recolored/retextured fireballs, looks at overload, shocking soul, shock clench, etc.).

My biggest hope for the class refresh is if ZOS can somehow include that chain lightning ability from infinite archive into sorcs kit, that is one of the most satisfying and coolest lightning effects I have seen in this game in a very, very long time (it's also very muted visually as well so it's not mega flashy like things like overloads heavy attacks, etc. while still retaining that feeling of lightning jumping across the battlefield).

Dracane wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

MashmalloMan wrote: »

Vaqual wrote: »

We have entered a weird timeline were the Sorc rework might end up being a net nerf for pure Sorc PvP after setting the bar so high in U50.

Nothing can be worse than 80% of the kit being useless. We're regulated to a handful of skills of which you can get half of through subclassing. I'll take upcoming nerfs with open arms to have a better designed class from top to bottom.

This here exactly (which was also one of the main factors behind my original thread back in U36 that proposed a full rework to sorcs entire kit).

I'd love to have DKs current dilemma of wanting to slot (or at the bare minimum tinker around with) every single skill/morph of the class kit rather than just having 1 ability always used, a couple of others that are fill in's for when the build isn't getting a better option from elsewhere and the rest being completely unusable.

I chose Sorcerer originally because it was the lightning class, but right now I have streak and that's really all I have left in sorcs kit that still feels somewhat like that original design/feeling.

There's a lot of abilities with shock damage tacked on, but none of them have that same feeling to them (most just feel like recolored/retextured fireballs, looks at overload, shocking soul, shock clench, etc.).

My biggest hope for the class refresh is if ZOS can somehow include that chain lightning ability from infinite archive into sorcs kit, that is one of the most satisfying and coolest lightning effects I have seen in this game in a very, very long time (it's also very muted visually as well so it's not mega flashy like things like overloads heavy attacks, etc. while still retaining that feeling of lightning jumping across the battlefield).

The chain lightning from the Infinite Archive is indeed a very satisfying effect. I love whenever it goes off. Though ironically it's also a useless thing like most Sorc shock skills. It deals very low damage and becomes redundant after a few rounds. But that is beside the point. We need these visuals.

I am 100% referring to the visuals of that effect (I also just always take it on my IA runs, just cause I love it that much, even though it does fall off very quickly, it just looks so cool).

I really hope ZOS can lean into the visual design of that effect for the Sorcerer rework. It's flashy and feels like lightning without being over the top or feeling like a different element that's been reskinned like overload, wield soul, clench etc. all do.

That effect is something I was actually hoping would be what the static class mastery passive and the scribing class script would look like for their visuals, where it would chain a small lightning proc to nearby enemies for bonus cleave instead of just a boring reskinned circle to show it as an AoE.