I do not. I like the new system. Always stuff happening. Everything's free here on out...not much for me to complain about. The base game needs an overhaul just like they are doing and that's not possible for them to do with the old model.

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

@Mathius_Mordred
The funny thing was that High Isle was, aside from the Trial, considered a major disappointment for most of the players. The Trailer led players to believe there would be naval combat but instead we got a very mediocre storyline that told us that war was bad.
And then as a major feature they gave us that card game that no one plays.

Not to mention it was, and still is, buggier than a roach motel and a perfect example of why staged bosses are unpopular.

Everything is a massive reaction or none at all for this games creative team (or rather, the shareholders.) "We, the players don't like this" tends to result in, "ZOMG - DUMP IT, DUMP IT ALL, REDO IT ALL," or, "Well, we've taken time to thoughtfully consider this and feel the current course...(read: we ain't changin' it, chumps.") It's all at the whims of where the market lies rather than in terms of long-term health of the property. It's an unsustainable financial model, and we're experiencing the death throes.

So, some of you are saying chapters, with all of the different content they had were formulaic, but a chore list of doing the same thing multiple times is not?

That’s irony at its finest. I guess you like busy work.

What it really boils down to, I guess, is that some people are just playing for the social aspect.

I completely understand what OP means. But now, after several reveal streams and a better idea of ​​what to expect this year, I'm almost glad there's a new concept.
As others have already said, the chapters became more formulaic and predictable year after year; there was no longer any real excitement or curiosity about what was coming. Now, lots of different content has been announced, and I'm excited to see what it will be like and what will come in all future seasons. The concept of "no two seasons will ever be the same" is truly a breath of fresh air.

I'm really trying to stay optimistic. I do think some of the new features they are introducing are interesting, and I'm waiting to see how Winterhold will pan out. However, I also can't help but miss the large chapter releases. I know a lot of people complained about them being formulaic, but I like knowing what to expect with regards to the kind of content I'm getting. I liked pieces together clues about the new zone and looking forward to the big summer release.

I'm not a fan of the timed events/zones. I like to take my time and sometimes don't get to new content for years because I'm busy doing other things in the game. I don't want to feel pressured to constantly leave my current stories to check out the new content before it disappears.

I'm glad a lot of people who were unhappy with chapters seem to be excited about the changes, and morale seems a little better overall. I still have some reservations, personally.

I'd miss them if they were good quality but they haven't been outside of Wrothgar honestly. I guess Morrowind and Necrom at least came with a class though.

Syldras wrote: »

allochthons wrote: »

I'm on UESP and can't find the info. Can you give a hint as to where this info is? Discussion pages? On the specific quest page? Character page?

There is an UESP category page:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Category:General-Designers_&_Writers
It's 73 entries, though. It would be easier to be able to just link the specific page, but unfortunately I'm not sure if naming a specific person is allowed.

Wasn't this person one of the writers let go in that big axe-swinging?

Kallykat wrote: »

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

@Mathius_Mordred
The funny thing was that High Isle was, aside from the Trial, considered a major disappointment for most of the players. The Trailer led players to believe there would be naval combat but instead we got a very mediocre storyline that told us that war was bad.
And then as a major feature they gave us that card game that no one plays.

While the main quests in High Isle were not my favorite, I did actually enjoy many of the side quests as well as the Firesong DLC. Plus, the zone itself was gorgeous.

I also enjoyed a lot of the side stuff. And I would have enjoyed the main story quite a bit more if it hadn't been so painfully obvious from the get-go who the two big baddies were.

Kallykat wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

I'd personally be fine if they managed to return to the story design and depth, and writing quality, they had in ESO's earlier years, in particular what we saw in base game, Wrothgar, and the Morrowind - CWC - Summerset story arc. After that, the decline began, though Elsweyr was still good for me, and I also liked Greymoor for the overall atmosphere and some of the characters introduced. But after that? Well...

There were just a few stories that felt particularly well-written and had that typical TES feel for me within the past few years: the Tel Dreloth quest in Telvanni Peninsula, Corelanya Manor in West Solstice, and Zerith-var's storyline. They had some truly tragic aspect without immediately destroying the atmosphere with some stupid quips or juvenile jokes. They had morally ambiguous situations and characters, without immediately lecturing the player like a child about how bad these deeds and people were. They felt more mature than most ESO stories nowadays, and also a bit more complex in theme. This is exactly what I'd like to see here!

And just last week I found out that these three quests/questlines were all written by the same writer (it's stated like that on UESP). If they're wise, they should involve this writer more, especially also into bigger storylines. Then I see a chance that ESO could, over time, get back on the level the writing had back at Summerset times. But if that will happen or if we'll get more shallow, quippy, "funny" meme stuff...?

I'm not against a bit of humour, by the way. ESO always had some funnier moments, also in base game. But it was on a different level than what we saw in the last few years, and the writing also had many serious stories as a contrast.

I just replayed Zerith-var's intro quest on a different character a few days ago. I haven't played his whole storyline yet, but so far, I really enjoy that character/story. I think he's probably the best companion they've introduced, at least storywise.

It is well worth taking the time to listen to the full dialogue. I really enjoyed this the most of anything in ESO.

I didn't mind the Chapter system but I was rather bored with it. It was ok but I'm looking forward to these changes just to see what things will be like.

If we are lamenting what we miss about the 'old' ESO, here's a few I miss that go back to the very early days...

I miss the game starting everyone with the Molag Bal opening quest.

I miss the base zones being level based so you did them in order as you levelled up. You could go to any of them but you might find the mobs are 10 levels higher than you.

I miss the raw matts in the base zones being associated with the levels that questing gave you in those zones. I could have one crafter, completely levelled up but I knew if I needed iron I could take her to Glenumbra and farm iron and maple there. Then I could take her to a higher zone for a different level mat. I really, really miss that. Especially for farming different waters.

I REALLY miss Craglorn not even being accessible to you unless you were Veteran 1 level, and even at that I had to sneak around and avoid the wasps I was never happy to see level 7's farming nirn after what we all did to get there, and I thought it just made Craglorn special in a good way.

I kind of felt the game caved to the "quick and easy" and I get it for attracting those players but I still miss it.

I miss the chapters, too. I'm currently trying to give the new system a chance and find my way around it, and it's not that everything is bad, but I really liked the old system and wish we could just return to it, or at least something similar.
I liked the predictability of knowing what we'll get and getting the big new zone to explore, with its own stories and activities.

The writing in newer chapters did indeed get weaker, with the notable exceptions that were excellent as always. I personally found it going back on the upswing in Solstice. I liked the main quest better again, with more interactivity and choice and feeling somewhat more serious again too, and there were the excellent side quests (I think many of us here have the same favourites, Corelanya, Zerith and so on ). Some parts landed...less well, granted.
But the biggest appeals of the Elder Scrolls universe to me have always been the world and the stories, with its particular storywriting style, as was already said above. The judgment-free mix of very alien cultures and the memorable characters that come from these cultures and interact with the world in their own ways, and it can lead to serious philosophical stories or those with an absurd humour.

In my eyes what we needed was simply a re-focus on the core writing style of the franchise and maybe a return to stricter editorial standards. You don't have to overturn the whole system for that. There was still good writing in the game, that's the thing, it's not broken, it just needs to be given the focus it deserves.

Alastrine wrote: »

I miss the raw matts in the base zones being associated with the levels that questing gave you in those zones. I could have one crafter, completely levelled up but I knew if I needed iron I could take her to Glenumbra and farm iron and maple there. Then I could take her to a higher zone for a different level mat. I really, really miss that. Especially for farming different waters.

Now that respeccing skills is free and fairly fast, it's easy enough to bump your crafter down to the level you need for, say, Ironwood, and do your surveys, in order to stock up.

Before the respec was added, I had an armory build on my crafter that was at craft level 1, so I could bump it up to whatever level I wanted, do my surveys, and then reset.

I wasn't playing when mats were linked to zones. I didn't even know it used to be that way. Interesting.

The current priorities seem right to me.

dinokstrunz wrote: »

Chapters lost their appeal very fast.

Not for me. Farming for cosmetics is what I find boring.

Jammy420 wrote: »

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

@Mathius_Mordred
The funny thing was that High Isle was, aside from the Trial, considered a major disappointment for most of the players. The Trailer led players to believe there would be naval combat but instead we got a very mediocre storyline that told us that war was bad.
And then as a major feature they gave us that card game that no one plays.

I dunno, I get pops for the card game all the time, and for me, it was a breath of fresh air. It is something I can do aside from stabby stab roll roll ad nauseum. Antiquities were also nice, as it added another element to the game that wasnt simply constant combat. People seem to forget this is an mmoRPG, not just an action game. The more RPG aspects added to the game, the more attractive it is to a lot of different players, including myself.

As for the chapters, the problem was, a lot of the time, we got hints of what was coming, and then a big let down. Greymoor is a great example. The vampire rework was supposed to be this great nod toward vamp players. But we got a playstyle that was completely counterproductive to group content, and by the time it released, it was too late and they didnt want to spend more time on it. So honestly, I like the new flexible system.

There is actually a very good reason why we have not gotten cinematics over the last 2 years, and that is simply because they shifted a ton of their resources towards their now shut down new MMO project. Now all their resources are being redirected back to this game, so I am confident we will see more cinematics again, I just hope they at least KIND of relate to the content.

I agree with your first paragraph. There's more to a game like ESO than combat. What I enjoy in the game has little to do with combat. Combat is something I have to get through sometimes in order to get to what I actually want to do.

It sounds like you're suggesting that false marketing was part of the problem? Player expectations weren't managed properly?

I do hope we'll get more cinematics at some point.

I agree that chapters got to be formulaic and weren't always the best quality, but dropping them in favour of a chore list and a temporary "event zone" with a vague promise that some time later we might occasionally get a quest line doesn't feel like an improvement.

In fact it reminds me of the time a few friends and I tried suggesting to the guy who always organised our meet-ups that maybe we could eat somewhere other than a steakhouse, so he refused to go anywhere and insisted on ordering from the chicken shop round the corner instead. Pretty much the same price for much worse food, but any suggestion to change that was met with "you all said you were sick of resturants!" but I kept hoping maybe one day the opportunity would come up to order from the Indian resturant I'd wanted to go to.

And yes the solution there is to go to the resturants I like on my own and just meet with those friends socially, maybe eat beforehand. ESO has similar solutions: play other games for the story, lore and exploration and just log into ESO for the social aspects, but that's not really what I wanted and certainly not what ZOS want since it involves me spending nothing on their game.

I'd be very happy to be proven wrong, but at the moment I'm not convinced they even believe this is giving us what they thought we wanted. The whole thing looks like a cost cutting measure - stripping back to just producing a handful of rewards (mostly skins that would be 1 motif for a chaper) each "season" and occasionally throwing in one part of what we used to get, whilst charging the same price each year. Factor in the state Microsoft has got themselves into recently and it's not surprising, but doesn't give me much hope things are going to improve.

Kallykat wrote: »

Jammy420 wrote: »

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

@Mathius_Mordred
The funny thing was that High Isle was, aside from the Trial, considered a major disappointment for most of the players. The Trailer led players to believe there would be naval combat but instead we got a very mediocre storyline that told us that war was bad.
And then as a major feature they gave us that card game that no one plays.

I dunno, I get pops for the card game all the time, and for me, it was a breath of fresh air. It is something I can do aside from stabby stab roll roll ad nauseum. Antiquities were also nice, as it added another element to the game that wasnt simply constant combat. People seem to forget this is an mmoRPG, not just an action game. The more RPG aspects added to the game, the more attractive it is to a lot of different players, including myself.

As for the chapters, the problem was, a lot of the time, we got hints of what was coming, and then a big let down. Greymoor is a great example. The vampire rework was supposed to be this great nod toward vamp players. But we got a playstyle that was completely counterproductive to group content, and by the time it released, it was too late and they didnt want to spend more time on it. So honestly, I like the new flexible system.

There is actually a very good reason why we have not gotten cinematics over the last 2 years, and that is simply because they shifted a ton of their resources towards their now shut down new MMO project. Now all their resources are being redirected back to this game, so I am confident we will see more cinematics again, I just hope they at least KIND of relate to the content.

I agree with your first paragraph. There's more to a game like ESO than combat. What I enjoy in the game has little to do with combat. Combat is something I have to get through sometimes in order to get to what I actually want to do.

It sounds like you're suggesting that false marketing was part of the problem? Player expectations weren't managed properly?

I do hope we'll get more cinematics at some point.

Yeah, I was never a fan of cinematics that had 0 to do with what we are getting. I love HOW they were done, but they were wildly misleading.

I mean, I enjoy the combat, but I want to be able to do something else as well. I have 3 characters I use, one for each alliance. Each character does different things. One is focused mainly on combat, one is a thief / assassin, the third is focused on academic things. And the card game, that just fits into all of them.