Overland Content Feedback Thread

SilverBride · September 11

If all that players want is increased story boss difficulty that could easily be done by making all story bosses instanced (most already are) and offering different difficulty options such as Easy, Normal, Veteran and Veteran Hard Mode. In that case Overland wouldn't need to be touched at all. But this discussion hasn't just been about story bosses.

Some players want all Overland in general to be more difficult, so that also needs to be addressed.

twisttop138 · September 11

SilverBride wrote: »

The point being given for the past 4 years was immersion and that there should be danger from overland mobs. If players are switching back to normal difficulty that is defeating the whole purpose. And if they are switching back and forth unrestricted for better rewards or for easy farming, that is manipulating the system.

Others may not agree, but this is how I see it, and I hope they are taking things like this into consideration.

No dear, that was not the point given. There were many and varied points given. Multitudes of people want different things for different reasons. Who are you to say what people want it for or dictate? It's frankly none of your business if I want to have harder quest boss and 5 seconds later go do an easy survey and then immediately after that do a hard quest. All through this thread you speak as if you're in some kind of control. Please stop pretending like you have the sum of all answers and know the reason people want things. You don't.

BagOfBadgers · September 11

All I want is harder overland content, when I'm capable. I don't care about the rewards just more interesting fights, as flail beam and the mob is dead in not fun, trust me!

I'll repeat something I have said before. I'm disabled and as far as ESO goes, some days I can HM trials and others all I can do is HA. So not being able to swap difficulty's as I NEED, is punitive and feels spiteful. I hope people can understand the unintended consequences of their suggestions beyond their own Horizons?

I want everyone to have fun, AT ALL LEVELS OF SKILL. I and others don't need to punished because of our higher skill level, do we? I don't complain (much) that there are things I can't get, eg some Tri's and Titles, do I suggest that as I can't get them it's unfair, nope! I don't really PvP much, do housing, trading but if ZoS messed that up I would support others getting it fixed.

I'm not “that” Elite/high CP player being described by many and it would seem the majority of players aren't either, in that we know what it's like, as we all started the same, eg, no gear and little skill. So please stop with the straw-man arguments, that the one player who did not respect you, is everyone else.

disky · September 11

SilverBride wrote: »

disky wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

This is interesting.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682963/overland-challenger-an-addon-that-challenges-you#latest

Again, what this does is hobble the player and restricts buildcraft, which shouldn't be necessary and isn't fun for a lot of people. It's not what we're looking for, or we wouldn't be here discussing this. We'd be doing that ourselves or using the mod you just posted.

I never said I thought it was a good idea. I just found it interesting.

But it does make me wonder if something similar to this is what is being planned. Especially since the players aren't going to be separated. If we are all in the same world then I suspect that it's the player that will be changed.

Yeah, and it doesn't take something like this to do that. You know this, we've been going back and forth over this literally for years now. Why are you acting as if you've forgotten it all? At the very least, you, I and sparta all understand the basics of the discussion and the broader solutions that have been presented. If anything, what I expect they will do is either implement a debuff system or some other kind of change that I'm not privy to which doesn't limit the player in terms of buildcraft, because as we've been saying, that isn't fun and it shouldn't be necessary.

SilverBride · September 11

I never said they would do what that addon does, but it did make me wonder. But even if it is just a debuff system, there have been posters against that, too. There is no general consensus on what is wanted or how it should be implemented.

shadoza · September 11

Tariq9898 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Difficulty choices aren't just for Vets. I am a Vet player and I prefer an easy laid back questing experience, as do some other Vets, so I will not be increasing my difficulty. While others players may prefer difficulty from the start, and may choose more difficulty even for their new characters. It's a personal preference.

Exactly, and THIS is why it’s more inclusive. I paid for the game you too! I want to enjoy solo stories and be immersed by them and feel the stakes and the challenge! I want more challenge. I hate grouping up. Having that option gives me access to that without taking anything away from you.

How does this include 'me?'

twisttop138 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The point being given for the past 4 years was immersion and that there should be danger from overland mobs. If players are switching back to normal difficulty that is defeating the whole purpose. And if they are switching back and forth unrestricted for better rewards or for easy farming, that is manipulating the system.

Others may not agree, but this is how I see it, and I hope they are taking things like this into consideration.

No dear, that was not the point given. There were many and varied points given. Multitudes of people want different things for different reasons. Who are you to say what people want it for or dictate? It's frankly none of your business if I want to have harder quest boss and 5 seconds later go do an easy survey and then immediately after that do a hard quest. All through this thread you speak as if you're in some kind of control. Please stop pretending like you have the sum of all answers and know the reason people want things. You don't.

One player can only say what they want. BUT, your not like what they say does not make them wrong and it does not mean they they speak for anyone other than their selves. Why are you so angry over one comment?

spartaxoxo · September 11

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This change is including people who were previously excluded. It's like you already have a story shaped cookie and now they're giving a cookie to everyone else. Everyone now has 1 cookie.

shadoza · September 11

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This is including people who were previously excluded.

Wait a moment, please, you are telling me what I enjoy now?
By "people who were previously excluded" are you meaning people like myself that are excluded from Group activities because we don't group?

spartaxoxo · September 11

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This is including people who were previously excluded.

Wait a moment, please, you are telling me what I enjoy now?
By "people who were previously excluded" are you meaning people like myself that are excluded from Group activities because we don't group?

No. I just figured you liked solo stuff since you said you played it and didn't like group content. If you don't like questing either, my apologies. Maybe a post explaining why you don't like the current difficulty level would help you get what you want. Whatever they implement will have multiple difficulty levels, after all.

Story mode for dungeons is an upcoming feature, as I already stated, so no.

This is about offering more quest difficulty levels. They are already balanced for solo casual play.

shadoza · September 11

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This is including people who were previously excluded.

Wait a moment, please, you are telling me what I enjoy now?
By "people who were previously excluded" are you meaning people like myself that are excluded from Group activities because we don't group?

No. I just figured you liked solo stuff since you said you played it and didn't like group content. If you don't like questing either, my apologies. Maybe a post explaining why you don't like the current difficulty level would help you get what you want. Whatever they implement will have multiple difficulty levels, after all.

Story mode for dungeons is an upcoming feature, as I already stated, so no.

This is about offering more quest difficulty levels. They are already balanced for solo casual play.

I do nearly all of overland content. This includes WBs and Dark Anchors. There are some incursions I do not do because they take too long to complete.

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities. (Many here say it doesn't happen, but it does, and it is a problem that needs addressing.) I do not complete group dungeons because the mechanics make it impossible to do without a tank or a partner. I love PvP but avoid it because I think the balance is broken and those that frequent the PvP games are not pleasant to play with or against. So . . . my contest is not about me preferring solo content.

I have a friend who played group overland with me sometimes. He is playing another game right now. He said there was no point in going into dungeons or tying to do anchor when there was such a crowd that the mobs and bosses disappear before one gets to fight. (He was trying to complete Alik'r map.) It is a problem and it will not be resolve if those wanting a challenging overland can occupy both spaces with dual difficulties. I could likely get my friend to join me if I ask politely, but he is not likely to continue to pay for the sub to do that, so we will be confined to the base areas.

I just wanted to enjoy the game without having the boss kills, resources, quest mobs swept away from me, which leaves me waiting more than playing. Posters seem to believe that my wanting that takes away from them. They can have everything in overland at one level, why do they need everything at two levels? If they want questing and resources to be easy but bosses to be challenging, then it sounds very much like they do not want a more challenging overland at all.

spartaxoxo · September 11

shadoza wrote: »

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities.

It does though, at least for some people. You're arguing against something that helps resolve your issue.

I like to quest and want to be able to enjoy the quests in this game. When I quest, I have no meaningful choice but to quickly kill everything around me. I don't want to kill mobs that quickly. And you have communicated that you don't want me to kill mobs that quickly. Allowing me to take more damage from mobs and deal less damage to mobs will stop me from killing mobs so quickly. I want a system that lets me go from a high powered player to a player that is being challenged. That way I can enjoy the same exact experience as the lower power player.

Not wanting to encourage vet players to use such a system is arguing against allowing vet players to lower their power level.

Tariq9898 · September 11

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This is including people who were previously excluded.

Wait a moment, please, you are telling me what I enjoy now?
By "people who were previously excluded" are you meaning people like myself that are excluded from Group activities because we don't group?

No. I just figured you liked solo stuff since you said you played it and didn't like group content. If you don't like questing either, my apologies. Maybe a post explaining why you don't like the current difficulty level would help you get what you want. Whatever they implement will have multiple difficulty levels, after all.

Story mode for dungeons is an upcoming feature, as I already stated, so no.

This is about offering more quest difficulty levels. They are already balanced for solo casual play.

I do nearly all of overland content. This includes WBs and Dark Anchors. There are some incursions I do not do because they take too long to complete.

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities. (Many here say it doesn't happen, but it does, and it is a problem that needs addressing.) I do not complete group dungeons because the mechanics make it impossible to do without a tank or a partner. I love PvP but avoid it because I think the balance is broken and those that frequent the PvP games are not pleasant to play with or against. So . . . my contest is not about me preferring solo content.

I have a friend who played group overland with me sometimes. He is playing another game right now. He said there was no point in going into dungeons or tying to do anchor when there was such a crowd that the mobs and bosses disappear before one gets to fight. (He was trying to complete Alik'r map.) It is a problem and it will not be resolve if those wanting a challenging overland can occupy both spaces with dual difficulties. I could likely get my friend to join me if I ask politely, but he is not likely to continue to pay for the sub to do that, so we will be confined to the base areas.

I just wanted to enjoy the game without having the boss kills, resources, quest mobs swept away from me, which leaves me waiting more than playing. Posters seem to believe that my wanting that takes away from them. They can have everything in overland at one level, why do they need everything at two levels? If they want questing and resources to be easy but bosses to be challenging, then it sounds very much like they do not want a more challenging overland at all.

And I want to enjoy the game by feeling challenged when soloing and exploring quests. As I’ve said previously, I want to feel the stakes, fail and die, and fail again until I win!

I’m a relatively high leveled player of 1900 CP who sometimes farm in low level areas. Now, am I doing it on purpose to get someone to quit??? No. It’s not personal and I don’t even know you. Don’t blame me that ZOS puts Mythic leads in certain beginner zones!

This goes both ways. Just like your friend, there have been many people who quit due to Overland being too easy and ultimately unfulfilling. I personally know a few friends who tried ESO but quit because everything just feels flat.

This option won’t please everyone 100% because at the end of the day, it’s an MMO and it’s physically impossible to make everyone happy. There’s always gonna be give and takes, compromises. Having an optional Overland difficulty scaling adds more than takes away.

shadoza · September 11

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities.

It does though, at least for some people. You're arguing against something that helps resolve your issue.

I like to quest and want to be able to enjoy the quests in this game. When I quest, I have no meaningful choice but to quickly kill everything around me. I don't want to kill mobs that quickly. And you have communicated that you don't want me to kill mobs that quickly. Allowing me to take more damage from mobs and deal less damage to mobs will stop me from killing mobs so quickly. I want a system that lets me go from a high powered player to a player that is being challenged. That way I can enjoy the same exact experience as the lower power player.

Not wanting to encourage vet players to use such a system is arguing against allowing vet players to lower their power level.

I am not arguing that part of the layer. What I don't want is for that layer to be on a toggle where those that do kill everything because the can will return to the base level to do just that in order to get resources whether is is a simple rune or leads. I think if a player chooses more challenging overland, they should stay there for a period rather than shift back and forth in second or even minutes. I have trouble understanding why they would want more challenging overland and want to return to base for easy farming too.

Put it on a cool down. Make it account wide and have options like the delete options. Require tokens which can be earned or purchased for gold or crown.

shadoza · September 11

Tariq9898 wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This is including people who were previously excluded.

Wait a moment, please, you are telling me what I enjoy now?
By "people who were previously excluded" are you meaning people like myself that are excluded from Group activities because we don't group?

No. I just figured you liked solo stuff since you said you played it and didn't like group content. If you don't like questing either, my apologies. Maybe a post explaining why you don't like the current difficulty level would help you get what you want. Whatever they implement will have multiple difficulty levels, after all.

Story mode for dungeons is an upcoming feature, as I already stated, so no.

This is about offering more quest difficulty levels. They are already balanced for solo casual play.

I do nearly all of overland content. This includes WBs and Dark Anchors. There are some incursions I do not do because they take too long to complete.

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities. (Many here say it doesn't happen, but it does, and it is a problem that needs addressing.) I do not complete group dungeons because the mechanics make it impossible to do without a tank or a partner. I love PvP but avoid it because I think the balance is broken and those that frequent the PvP games are not pleasant to play with or against. So . . . my contest is not about me preferring solo content.

I have a friend who played group overland with me sometimes. He is playing another game right now. He said there was no point in going into dungeons or tying to do anchor when there was such a crowd that the mobs and bosses disappear before one gets to fight. (He was trying to complete Alik'r map.) It is a problem and it will not be resolve if those wanting a challenging overland can occupy both spaces with dual difficulties. I could likely get my friend to join me if I ask politely, but he is not likely to continue to pay for the sub to do that, so we will be confined to the base areas.

I just wanted to enjoy the game without having the boss kills, resources, quest mobs swept away from me, which leaves me waiting more than playing. Posters seem to believe that my wanting that takes away from them. They can have everything in overland at one level, why do they need everything at two levels? If they want questing and resources to be easy but bosses to be challenging, then it sounds very much like they do not want a more challenging overland at all.

And I want to enjoy the game by feeling challenged when soloing and exploring quests. As I’ve said previously, I want to feel the stakes, fail and die, and fail again until I win!

I’m a relatively high leveled player of 1900 CP who sometimes farm in low level areas. Now, am I doing it on purpose to get someone to quit??? No. It’s not personal and I don’t even know you. Don’t blame me that ZOS puts Mythic leads in certain beginner zones!

This goes both ways. Just like your friend, there have been many people who quit due to Overland being too easy and ultimately unfulfilling. I personally know a few friends who tried ESO but quit because everything just feels flat.

This option won’t please everyone 100% because at the end of the day, it’s an MMO and it’s physically impossible to make everyone happy. There’s always gonna be give and takes, compromises. Having an optional Overland difficulty scaling adds more than takes away.

Yes, there will always be gives and takes, unfortunately, this game is giving way to much to the grouping side which does take away content creation opportunity for the solo runners or casual players. I asked what does the lower side of the scale get from this change? Nothing. They get more and more content that cannot be done alone or with one friend.

My friend did not quit playing because the game was too easy or too hard. (He is easy-going; a direct opposite of myself.
He was happy with the die-trying concept and he also was good with just following through a quest and killing stuff on the way.) He lost interest because it was getting too frustrating having other players sweep the prize away because they could one-hit and it felt like we were standing around waiting for respawns more often then fighting because of it.

spartaxoxo · September 11

The purpose of the difficulty toggle is to make questing more immersive to many players. They shouldn't be punished while doing unrelated activities. Rada al-Saran does 20% more damage and also slows down your crafting surveys does not make sense.

Player A getting a node first because they got there before Player B is fair, regardless if Player A is a stronger player.

All such a punishment would do is discourage people from ruining their game by turning it on and give an unfair advantage to player b against those who use it anyway.

ETA 2

Also, as someone who is not disabled but is not picture perfect health, I have good and bad days. Some days I am up to the challenge and some days I'm not. Not only would not being able to turn it off be unfair to vet players. It would also be extremely unfair to players with chronic illnesses or disabilities.

SilverBride · 12:02AM

I understood that a difficulty option would make a more difficult overland experience overall because they announced it as "an increase to general overland difficulty". To me that includes everything we do in overland, such as questing, world bosses, zone events, completing some endeavors and even gathering surveys because of the mobs we will encounter along the way.

shadoza · 12:11AM

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The purpose of the difficulty toggle is to make questing more immersive to many players. They shouldn't be punished while doing unrelated activities. Rada al-Saran does 20% more damage and also slows down your crafting surveys does not make sense.

Player A getting a node first because they got there before Player B is fair, regardless if Player A is a stronger player.

All such a punishment would do is discourage people from ruining their game by turning it on and give an unfair advantage to player b against those who use it anyway.

ETA 2

Also, as someone who is not disabled but is not picture perfect health, I have good and bad days. Some days I am up to the challenge and some days I'm not. Not only would not being able to turn it off be unfair to vet players. It would also be extremely unfair to players with chronic illnesses or disabilities.

We are back to why do we need a more difficult overland if those players only want bosses to be challenging?

spartaxoxo · 1:49AM

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The purpose of the difficulty toggle is to make questing more immersive to many players. They shouldn't be punished while doing unrelated activities. Rada al-Saran does 20% more damage and also slows down your crafting surveys does not make sense.

Player A getting a node first because they got there before Player B is fair, regardless if Player A is a stronger player.

All such a punishment would do is discourage people from ruining their game by turning it on and give an unfair advantage to player b against those who use it anyway.

ETA 2

Also, as someone who is not disabled but is not picture perfect health, I have good and bad days. Some days I am up to the challenge and some days I'm not. Not only would not being able to turn it off be unfair to vet players. It would also be extremely unfair to players with chronic illnesses or disabilities.

We are back to why do we need a more difficult overland if those players only want bosses to be challenging?

Quests aren't solely in instances. The big ones are but there's plenty of side quests in overland and the only way to get a satisfying story from those is through overland difficulty options.

If you know some other way to offer optional quest difficulty, I'm all ears.

BagOfBadgers · 2:01AM

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities.

It does though, at least for some people. You're arguing against something that helps resolve your issue.

I like to quest and want to be able to enjoy the quests in this game. When I quest, I have no meaningful choice but to quickly kill everything around me. I don't want to kill mobs that quickly. And you have communicated that you don't want me to kill mobs that quickly. Allowing me to take more damage from mobs and deal less damage to mobs will stop me from killing mobs so quickly. I want a system that lets me go from a high powered player to a player that is being challenged. That way I can enjoy the same exact experience as the lower power player.

Not wanting to encourage vet players to use such a system is arguing against allowing vet players to lower their power level.

I am not arguing that part of the layer. What I don't want is for that layer to be on a toggle where those that do kill everything because the can will return to the base level to do just that in order to get resources whether is is a simple rune or leads. I think if a player chooses more challenging overland, they should stay there for a period rather than shift back and forth in second or even minutes. I have trouble understanding why they would want more challenging overland and want to return to base for easy farming too.

Put it on a cool down. Make it account wide and have options like the delete options. Require tokens which can be earned or purchased for gold or crown.

So, as someone who can enjoy vet at times but other time not, you are suggesting I should be made to pay because of my disabilities, yes? Do you see how that could be seen as discriminating? It's OK, I'm used to it RL unfortunately

.

I'm not saying that you are purposely making your opinion to do that but it would be unfair.

As much as you are suggesting that skilled/high CP/Vet players behave like Seagulls, you know, make lots of noise, nick all the shines (kills/resources/fun), poop on you then naff off, it's only a small minority that do. Low levels often get a few strikes on a DL World Boss/Dragon/Harowstorm I'm soloing and do I get miffed that they got an easy tag and kill, um, NO. Have they spoiled my fun no, have they earned the kill no, do I care that they got a reward for something they put little to no effort into, NO! I and others jump in and help zone request, YES because it's an MMO and players help players.

I hope this all makes sense. I just want everyone to FUN!

shadoza · 3:28AM

BagOfBadgers wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities.

It does though, at least for some people. You're arguing against something that helps resolve your issue.

I like to quest and want to be able to enjoy the quests in this game. When I quest, I have no meaningful choice but to quickly kill everything around me. I don't want to kill mobs that quickly. And you have communicated that you don't want me to kill mobs that quickly. Allowing me to take more damage from mobs and deal less damage to mobs will stop me from killing mobs so quickly. I want a system that lets me go from a high powered player to a player that is being challenged. That way I can enjoy the same exact experience as the lower power player.

Not wanting to encourage vet players to use such a system is arguing against allowing vet players to lower their power level.

I am not arguing that part of the layer. What I don't want is for that layer to be on a toggle where those that do kill everything because the can will return to the base level to do just that in order to get resources whether is is a simple rune or leads. I think if a player chooses more challenging overland, they should stay there for a period rather than shift back and forth in second or even minutes. I have trouble understanding why they would want more challenging overland and want to return to base for easy farming too.

Put it on a cool down. Make it account wide and have options like the delete options. Require tokens which can be earned or purchased for gold or crown.

So, as someone who can enjoy vet at times but other time not, you are suggesting I should be made to pay because of my disabilities, yes? Do you see how that could be seen as discriminating? It's OK, I'm used to it RL unfortunately .

I'm not saying that you are purposely making your opinion to do that but it would be unfair.

As much as you are suggesting that skilled/high CP/Vet players behave like Seagulls, you know, make lots of noise, nick all the shines (kills/resources/fun), poop on you then naff off, it's only a small minority that do. Low levels often get a few strikes on a DL World Boss/Dragon/Harowstorm I'm soloing and do I get miffed that they got an easy tag and kill, um, NO. Have they spoiled my fun no, have they earned the kill no, do I care that they got a reward for something they put little to no effort into, NO! I and others jump in and help zone request, YES because it's an MMO and players help players.

I hope this all makes sense. I just want everyone to FUN!

I don't know you; I am not a partner in your personal attributes.
You are projecting a bit here. I did not say or even suggest that all players behave badly. Of course the players who get the best bang for their fighting buck are not going to feel the burn, the problem is the low end players that have to wait for the boss, mob, or resource to respawn before they can move on with their game play.

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The purpose of the difficulty toggle is to make questing more immersive to many players. They shouldn't be punished while doing unrelated activities. Rada al-Saran does 20% more damage and also slows down your crafting surveys does not make sense.

Player A getting a node first because they got there before Player B is fair, regardless if Player A is a stronger player.

All such a punishment would do is discourage people from ruining their game by turning it on and give an unfair advantage to player b against those who use it anyway.

ETA 2

Also, as someone who is not disabled but is not picture perfect health, I have good and bad days. Some days I am up to the challenge and some days I'm not. Not only would not being able to turn it off be unfair to vet players. It would also be extremely unfair to players with chronic illnesses or disabilities.

We are back to why do we need a more difficult overland if those players only want bosses to be challenging?

Quests aren't solely in instances. The big ones are but there's plenty of side quests in overland and the only way to get a satisfying story from those is through overland difficulty options.

If you know some other way to offer optional quest difficulty, I'm all ears.

I suggested that quests areas that require mob interaction, delves, and public dungeons be made instances. This way there are fewer people colliding in these areas.

BagOfBadgers · 5:07AM

@shadoza Please don't shirk from what you wrote. Did you not type "Put it on a cool down. Make it account wide and have options like the delete options. Require tokens which can be earned or purchased for gold or crown." That cost, that you suggested would cost me for being me, eg disabled. Nothing more, nothing less, is that fair?

You also said "My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities. (Many here say it doesn't happen, but it does, and it is a problem that needs addressing.) I do not complete group dungeons because the mechanics make it impossible to do without a tank or a partner. I love PvP but avoid it because I think the balance is broken and those that frequent the PvP games are not pleasant to play with or against. So . . . my contest is not about me preferring solo content." So saying again that "highly-powered players interfering"

Do you not think that this goes both ways. I get affected the same by pugs of ALL LEVELS. I have to wait on boss, mob, or resource to respawn, the same as you and others before I can move on with my game play too. Just because I can kill quickly or solo stuff, doesn't reduce the spawn times, I still have to wait for a respawn if it's been killed by a low level/newbe!

I'm not projecting, I'm trying to giving you an others an understanding that a players skill and ability can change at any time, through no fault of their making. I can't change you thought patterns, only you can.

Yes there are players that don't see others, much like real life, yes. How many? I don't know, I would not like to estimate a %. ESO is an MMO, so you are going to get all types of players, skill and ability crossing your path, for good and bad.

I never thought I would see reverse gatekeeping, yet here we are........

shadoza · 6:05AM

BagOfBadgers wrote: »

@shadoza Please don't shirk from what you wrote. Did you not type "Put it on a cool down. Make it account wide and have options like the delete options. Require tokens which can be earned or purchased for gold or crown." That cost, that you suggested would cost me for being me, eg disabled. Nothing more, nothing less, is that fair?

You also said "My concerns regarding the layering of overland is that it will not resolve the issues with highly-powered players interfering with new and low-powered player activities. (Many here say it doesn't happen, but it does, and it is a problem that needs addressing.) I do not complete group dungeons because the mechanics make it impossible to do without a tank or a partner. I love PvP but avoid it because I think the balance is broken and those that frequent the PvP games are not pleasant to play with or against. So . . . my contest is not about me preferring solo content." So saying again that "highly-powered players interfering"

Do you not think that this goes both ways. I get affected the same by pugs of ALL LEVELS. I have to wait on boss, mob, or resource to respawn, the same as you and others before I can move on with my game play too. Just because I can kill quickly or solo stuff, doesn't reduce the spawn times, I still have to wait for a respawn if it's been killed by a low level/newbe!

I'm not projecting, I'm trying to giving you an others an understanding that a players skill and ability can change at any time, through no fault of their making. I can't change you thought patterns, only you can.

Yes there are players that don't see others, much like real life, yes. How many? I don't know, I would not like to estimate a %. ESO is an MMO, so you are going to get all types of players, skill and ability crossing your path, for good and bad.

I never thought I would see reverse gatekeeping, yet here we are........

Nothing wrong with my thought pattern.

As I stated, I am not a partner in your or anyone else's skills or abilities. I am speaking only for myself. You don't have to like my suggestions or statements.

I am not referring to Pick up Groups (PUGs.) In the scenario I set, the players that are getting frustrated are the ones doing quests and map completion for the first time. The players that are being disruptive are those who are farming daily, running by and one-hitting bosses, spawn-camping delve bosses while AFK allowing their companion to fight and auto loot to pick up the goods, players that run around quest areas or public dungeons herding all the mobs while spamming magic and not once stopping their path to actually fight . . . I did specify in/over several posts what I was trying to work around. I do not understand what your argument is based on.

I am not avoiding what I said. Someone said to me "If you know some other way to offer optional quest difficulty, I'm all ears." I gave them that response.

Muizer · 9:23AM

SilverBride wrote: »

I understood that a difficulty option would make a more difficult overland experience overall because they announced it as "an increase to general overland difficulty". To me that includes everything we do in overland, such as questing, world bosses, zone events, completing some endeavors and even gathering surveys because of the mobs we will encounter along the way.

If it were so that you'd get enhanced rewards for everything you do in overland just because you have set combat difficulty to a higher level, that would indeed be wide open to all sorts of exploitation. I'm sure if that is obvious to us, it will be obvious to the Devs and they won't implement it like that. As I said, increased combat difficulty should translate only to increased combat rewards, and that based upon actually experienced combat (damage done) not just the nominal participation in a fight while being at a particular difficulty setting.

SilverBride · 4:59PM

twisttop138 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The point being given for the past 4 years was immersion and that there should be danger from overland mobs. If players are switching back to normal difficulty that is defeating the whole purpose. And if they are switching back and forth unrestricted for better rewards or for easy farming, that is manipulating the system.

Others may not agree, but this is how I see it, and I hope they are taking things like this into consideration.

No dear, that was not the point given. There were many and varied points given. Multitudes of people want different things for different reasons. Who are you to say what people want it for or dictate? It's frankly none of your business if I want to have harder quest boss and 5 seconds later go do an easy survey and then immediately after that do a hard quest. All through this thread you speak as if you're in some kind of control. Please stop pretending like you have the sum of all answers and know the reason people want things. You don't.

We all have the right to present our feedback as we see it.

twisttop138 · 6:25PM

Muizer wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I understood that a difficulty option would make a more difficult overland experience overall because they announced it as "an increase to general overland difficulty". To me that includes everything we do in overland, such as questing, world bosses, zone events, completing some endeavors and even gathering surveys because of the mobs we will encounter along the way.

If it were so that you'd get enhanced rewards for everything you do in overland just because you have set combat difficulty to a higher level, that would indeed be wide open to all sorts of exploitation. I'm sure if that is obvious to us, it will be obvious to the Devs and they won't implement it like that. As I said, increased combat difficulty should translate only to increased combat rewards, and that based upon actually experienced combat (damage done) not just the nominal participation in a fight while being at a particular difficulty setting.

See this is reasonable. It's not "Aha! I've caught you out in a lie as 'you' stated all along it was about immersion so you should just be stuck in vet overland or have to pay up to turn it off."

SilverBride wrote: »

twisttop138 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The point being given for the past 4 years was immersion and that there should be danger from overland mobs. If players are switching back to normal difficulty that is defeating the whole purpose. And if they are switching back and forth unrestricted for better rewards or for easy farming, that is manipulating the system.

Others may not agree, but this is how I see it, and I hope they are taking things like this into consideration.

No dear, that was not the point given. There were many and varied points given. Multitudes of people want different things for different reasons. Who are you to say what people want it for or dictate? It's frankly none of your business if I want to have harder quest boss and 5 seconds later go do an easy survey and then immediately after that do a hard quest. All through this thread you speak as if you're in some kind of control. Please stop pretending like you have the sum of all answers and know the reason people want things. You don't.

We all have the right to present our feedback as we see it.

While we're in disagreement about this topic, you are 100% correct. I wouldn't want it any different. To be clear though, it wasn't your feedback that I took issue with, but rather the snide way you gave it in the comment and in many others in this thread. I do understand that you are tired of this topic, Ive seen you post that repeatedly. I hope, but am not confident, that ZOS will release more details soon that everyone is happy with and this thread can die in peace with other banger threads like "nerf this" and the ever popular "the server are down, compensation when?" We can pour out a little beer and get back to playing.

SilverBride · 6:34PM

I stand by my view, which is how I feel about the topic.

Kallykat · 8:04PM

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This change is including people who were previously excluded. It's like you already have a story shaped cookie and now they're giving a cookie to everyone else. Everyone now has 1 cookie.

This is not an accurate analogy. It ignores the game in its entirety. A more accurate analogy would actually be something like this:

Some players have one sugar cookie they can enjoy and a whole plate of various cookies they are allergic to and cannot enjoy. Other players have access to that whole plate of cookies, but they don't really like the taste of the one sugar cookie the first players can eat. They are going to be given a sugar cookie using a new recipe so they can enjoy all the cookies if they so choose. Meanwhile, the first players are still stuck with one sugar cookie and a plate of various cookies they can't eat. Oh, and to top it off, the plate of cookies is covered in fancy sprinkles, and the new sugar cookie recipe will also probably have fancy sprinkles.

Hopefully that makes it a little clearer why some people are upset by this and don't see it as a "fair" solution at all. You are of course free to disagree, but at least try to have an accurate understanding of the other side's point of view.

Tariq9898 · 8:24PM

Kallykat wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

shadoza wrote: »

How does this include 'me?'

Overland is already at a level of difficulty that you enjoy. This change is including people who were previously excluded. It's like you already have a story shaped cookie and now they're giving a cookie to everyone else. Everyone now has 1 cookie.

This is not an accurate analogy. It ignores the game in its entirety. A more accurate analogy would actually be something like this:

Some players have one sugar cookie they can enjoy and a whole plate of various cookies they are allergic to and cannot enjoy. Other players have access to that whole plate of cookies, but they don't really like the taste of the one sugar cookie the first players can eat. They are going to be given a sugar cookie using a new recipe so they can enjoy all the cookies if they so choose. Meanwhile, the first players are still stuck with one sugar cookie and a plate of various cookies they can't eat. Oh, and to top it off, the plate of cookies is covered in fancy sprinkles, and the new sugar cookie recipe will also probably have fancy sprinkles.

Hopefully that makes it a little clearer why some people are upset by this and don't see it as a "fair" solution at all. You are of course free to disagree, but at least try to have an accurate understanding of the other side's point of view.

So what about me?? What about the thousands of players who complain and quit due to the game being too easy? Who also paid money for this game. They deserve cookies too in the case of harder Overland difficulties. As I've said, this goes both ways.

I'd rather have more cookies for both parties. I don't care if people see it as "unfair” because it’s optional!

spartaxoxo · 8:26PM

Kallykat wrote: »

Some players have one sugar cookie they can enjoy and a whole plate of various cookies they are allergic to and cannot enjoy.

Yeah, no. Vets being unable to play it because it's not designed to include them is very different from someone who doesn't enjoy group play. Normal trials and dungeons are already in the game. And many casual users play and enjoy them. They aren't allergic. It's existence does not cause them harm. Some of them don't feel like eating the sugar cookie with blue frosting because they don't like blue. But it's still a cookie baked to the taste of sugar cookie enjoyers.

It's more like I hate peanut butter so I should be the only with a sugar cookie, if we're going to treat the other content as cookies on this plate.

Tariq9898 · 8:45PM

Dungeons and trials should NOT be the only places to encounter hard difficulties. Challenging content that is optional need to also exist when soloing and questing as well! We only have two hard solo content in the form of Maelstrom and Vateshran arenas against the flood of challenging group content. This is counting the entirety of the game in the span of 11 years. Add to that, majority of ESO players prefer to play alone and treat it as another singleplayer title.

Yeah... we need more flexibility of enjoyment for solo playing by adding an optional difficulty slider.