Why not balance fatecarver like jabs?

Midohka · September 7

Hi there

I used to wonder what you'd think about this ^

Actually the fate-carver even slightly nerfed just over-performs on every situation for not asking much setup, which made me think to how the jabs used to have similar position back then. Why not apply the same conditions of damage to both spells ? So beam is still a very good mono spell and becomes a very good main target + ok other targets spell.
Idk if you got the idea

notyuu · September 7

So basically give the beam a cleave damage reduction, yeah can see that working, but what I wanna know is why don't they just give jabs full cleave damage?

The_Isatope8 · September 8

Full cleave on Fatecarver is fine, other classes also don't have access to great cleave like arcanist so it's fine. The only change to jabs I would like to see (other than the animation) is a conversion to single-target damage with splash damage, similar to werewolf heavy attacks. I think that such a change would be especially great for PvP.

Joy_Division · September 8

Because most Templars highly dislike what ZOS has done with Jabs.

Wuuffyy · September 9

notyuu wrote: »

So basically give the beam a cleave damage reduction, yeah can see that working, but what I wanna know is why don't they just give jabs full cleave damage?

This. If fatecarver works, why not re-remove the condition from jabs? We know it's functional, great, but not necessarily OP per-say; why not restore jabs -a suffering class-identity spammable- to its former glory?

peacenote · September 9

Joy_Division wrote: »

Because most Templars highly dislike what ZOS has done with Jabs.

This. I would hate to see my Arc get the same treatment as my Templar, which was my main and sits on the sidelines now.

Midohka · September 9

Wuuffyy wrote: »

notyuu wrote: »

So basically give the beam a cleave damage reduction, yeah can see that working, but what I wanna know is why don't they just give jabs full cleave damage?

This. If fatecarver works, why not re-remove the condition from jabs? We know it's functional, great, but not necessarily OP per-say; why not restore jabs -a suffering class-identity spammable- to its former glory?

Bc the problem with jabs (and Im not saying its perfect at all) was that it was overperforming just as the beam. A spell shouldnt be as efficient mono as it is in zone - the amount of damages the beam produces skips all alternatives of gameplay and just kills competition like no other class can do actually. In my view, it is completely logical that a class that have significant monotarget damage spells should be dealing more monotarget dps than a class that can cleave on all its spells for not that much of a drawback whatsoever.

Its litteraly the problem the jab had before and if we can do this for the jabs, I dont get why the beam couldnt be balanced in its damage output. An other class that cleaves a lot is necro (I main it) but necro requires a full two spellbar rotation and 30s of reunited condition to hit properly and achieve max dps, which on bosses for ex is quite rare, while arcanist asks 8 sec maximum to reach max dps in any situation.

I dont find this to be a sane gamedesign in matter of learning/exigence/reward and we can actually see the repercussions on group compositions, its not like I'm inventing it

/

Aurielle · September 9

Alternatively, why not buff jabs like Fatecarver? I’m tired of my main class feeling like it’s tickling players and mobs with a yellow pool noodle.

notyuu · September 9

Aurielle wrote: »

Alternatively, why not buff jabs like Fatecarver? I’m tired of my main class feeling like it’s tickling players and mobs with a yellow pool noodle.

Well in pve it's "alrightish"...mostly due to piling on a 27% pve exclusive damage boost (ansull + slayer buff + ur amulet) but in PvP it's kek tier bad.....zos just needs to buff it's base damage by roughly 20% and it'll be golden once again

Stafford197 · September 9

Imo the best solution is something like the following:
• Puncturing Strikes and its morphs change Cost Type based on higher Maximum Resource, deal the same (higher tooltip) damage to all enemies in the AoE, and grant Major Brutality/Sorcery for 20 seconds
• Biting Jabs converts into a Physical Damage ability, and increases damage done to the closest enemy by 33%
• Puncturing Sweeps heals for 40% of damage done against the closest enemy, and 10% against all other enemies

The percentages can change a bit, but the idea is to take the damage that Puncturing Strikes currently does to its closest target, and instead make it deal that same damage to all targets.

One morph effect is now a full on buff to your damage done against one target. The other morph is still meant to heal you, while now giving most of its benefit from attacking one target.

El_Borracho · September 9

Umm, no. Fatecarver is all the Arcanist has. The cleave is intentional, as they had the option to make it a single-target but chose not to. To flip it around and put it in Templar terms, how about we remove the execute damage from Jesus Beam because Arcanist doesn't have an execute that can compare?

Make Fatecarver into nerfed jabs, the nerf that anyone who mained a Templar hates to this day.

I'm with the others, buff jabs. I don't need another class getting nerfed.

Midohka · September 9

You guys amaze me by how intentionaly you miss the point, sad bc the ask was genuine

Wuuffyy · September 9

Midohka wrote: »

Wuuffyy wrote: »

notyuu wrote: »

So basically give the beam a cleave damage reduction, yeah can see that working, but what I wanna know is why don't they just give jabs full cleave damage?

This. If fatecarver works, why not re-remove the condition from jabs? We know it's functional, great, but not necessarily OP per-say; why not restore jabs -a suffering class-identity spammable- to its former glory?

Bc the problem with jabs (and Im not saying its perfect at all) was that it was overperforming just as the beam. A spell shouldnt be as efficient mono as it is in zone - the amount of damages the beam produces skips all alternatives of gameplay and just kills competition like no other class can do actually. In my view, it is completely logical that a class that have significant monotarget damage spells should be dealing more monotarget dps than a class that can cleave on all its spells for not that much of a drawback whatsoever.

Its litteraly the problem the jab had before and if we can do this for the jabs, I dont get why the beam couldnt be balanced in its damage output. An other class that cleaves a lot is necro (I main it) but necro requires a full two spellbar rotation and 30s of reunited condition to hit properly and achieve max dps, which on bosses for ex is quite rare, while arcanist asks 8 sec maximum to reach max dps in any situation.

I dont find this to be a sane gamedesign in matter of learning/exigence/reward and we can actually see the repercussions on group compositions, its not like I'm inventing it /

It was overperforming in the same context that CP was 'OP' and causing too much powercreep (and yet people complain of the same issue now in both the ideal that the system is OP itself still OR that NOW everything ELSE is causing power creep).

It's essentially mass hysteria (for the people calling nerfs) and you add to that that burning light (which was fully tethered to jabs) is now universal as well and you have the grounds to 're-buff' the skill in our aforementioned capacity.

ZOS_Icy · September 10

Greetings,

We are going to go ahead and close this thread as per the request of the OP.

Thank you for your understanding!