Necromancer Criminal ACT illogical

CameraBeardThePirate · January 31

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

Aerin wrote: »

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I kinda like it. Just dont summon a skelly in town and you will be all right. Otherwise just pay up the few gold

You don't even know what you're saying. I'm in Ash Mountain, Stonefalls! This isn't a town; it's a mountain! Yet, NPCs ask for my help, and when I start to assist them, they attack me and put a bounty on me. I can't finish the quest, I can't pay the bounty because there are no guards here.
And, why should I pay for a bounty to help others when they ask me?
How can this make any sense?

edit:
And don't try to tell me to "avoid those skills" because that's even worse.
I can't use the skills to level them up and learn weaving while playing the game, because I will get a bounty. Come on... don't use that argument to "avoid skills" while playing one class of the game.

I think i'm very well placed to know what i'm saying.

Necromancy is illegal in most place in tamriel.
Practice it at your own risk

And yes i have 2 tamriel hero necromancer so i did get the experiance of questing with one.

We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

It isn't illegal though. Necromancy isn't officially banned until the 3rd era.

Aerin · January 31

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I think i'm very well placed to know what i'm saying.

Necromancy is illegal in most place in tamriel.
Practice it at your own risk

And yes i have 2 tamriel hero necromancer so i did get the experiance of questing with one.

We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

We have to agree on this one:

I can tolerate this "criminal act", and I really can understand why we're being attacked in the middle of town. If there's nothing else to be done and I begin raising skeletons, I really can see a reason for a bounty. The problem is not practicing necromancy at my own risk in the middle of town.

The nonsense here is when NPCs ask for your help, you assist them, and then they turn around and attack you because you cast spells to aid them. This makes absolutely no sense! It's entirely illogical. We shouldn't be penalized simply for helping someone who requested our assistance.

edit:
I am a necromancer. I cast spells to summon skeletons because it's my skill. If someone asks for my assistance, I will use my abilities to help them.
If I were to attack who asks for my help, there would be a reason for a bounty or to be attacked by guards. All ok! However, there is no reason at all to be attacked simply because I use my skills to assist them. And if I defend myself, the bounty grows bigger and bigger.

Dark_Lord_Kuro · January 31

Aerin wrote: »

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I think i'm very well placed to know what i'm saying.

Necromancy is illegal in most place in tamriel.
Practice it at your own risk

And yes i have 2 tamriel hero necromancer so i did get the experiance of questing with one.

We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

We have to agree on this one:

I can tolerate this "criminal act", and I really can understand why we're being attacked in the middle of town. If there's nothing else to be done and I begin raising skeletons, I really can see a reason for a bounty. The problem is not practicing necromancy at my own risk in the middle of town.

The nonsense here is when NPCs ask for your help, you assist them, and then they turn around and attack you because you cast spells to aid them. This makes absolutely no sense! It's entirely illogical. We shouldn't be penalized simply for helping someone who requested our assistance.

edit:
I am a necromancer. I cast spells to summon skeletons because it's my skill. If someone asks for my assistance, I will use my abilities to help them.
If I were to attack who asks for my help, there would be a reason for a bounty or to be attacked by guards. All ok! However, there is no reason at all to be attacked simply because I use my skills to assist them. And if I defend myself, the bounty grows bigger and bigger.

Sure quest giver shoulnt give bounty but everyone else in that village is a villager like in all town, they see a crime, they give bounty

Aerin · January 31

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

Sure quest giver shoulnt give bounty but everyone else in that village is a villager like in all town, they see a crime, they give bounty

Why don't they run away when they see a Necromancer?
Why NPC's seek help from Necromancer?
Why do they even speak with me if I'm a necromancer?

Why do they put a bounty on me when I summon a skeleton? Because they know I'm practicing necromancy, right? Then, why do they ask for my help if they know I'm a necromancer and will use my abilities to assist them. So, why do they ask for my help?
Does roleplay only work when it makes no sense?

Remathilis · January 31

All this and people demand sorcerer pets be the bounty as well

Aerin · January 31

I just found it. Turns out, this isn't a necromancer; it's Jesus Christ.

In Luke 6:29-30 (New International Version), Jesus says:
"If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them. Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back."

When NPCs seek our aid as Necromancers, we respond with a resounding 'Yes!' Yet, when faced with adversaries, we refrain from aggression, abstaining from casting any spells. Instead, we bravely confront our fate, meeting our end as heroes.

The roleplay experience in Elder Scrolls is expanding, we just need to dive deeper into it to fully grasp its magnitude!

CameraBeardThePirate · January 31

Remathilis wrote: »

All this and people demand sorcerer pets be the bounty as well

I mean I'm of the opposite opinion.

If undead pets are a bounty, in theory Daedric pets should be too (especially given the entire Fighter's Guild questline seems to paint any and all interactions with Daedra as evil).

In reality, neither should be a bounty for the same reason that this game doesn't have a starvation mechanic. Sure, it's iMMeRsIvE but it's also just annoying, needlessly prohibitive, and inconsistent.

StarOfElyon · January 31

Aerin wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

If we completely ignore the theme of the class, it seems unreal that a paid class punishes the player so much. This paid class currently lacks much of what even the free classes have, and you get actively penalized for using this paid class around NPCs. But, maybe the class experience isn't the main selling point for this class — maybe the theme of the class is the main selling point?

Absolutely, it's disappointing how the paid class pales in comparison to the free ones, especially considering the penalties. Perhaps they're relying more on the thematic appeal rather than the gameplay experience. Nevertheless, it's frustrating to receive penalties for playing with necromancer class.

I'm glad it's not pay to win.

Anyway, I think vampirism and necromancy should be criminal. I'm fine with it the way it is. I just do my writs in Coldharbour.

Tessitura · January 31

Aerin wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

it is very annoying
using vampire skills (except mesmerize) are also bounty

being a transformed WW is a bounty

half of necromancers skills are bounty

ive accidentally gotten a bounty before on my necromancer because i finished killing something and happened to run past one of those wandering merchants with my heal ghost still active and guess what? now i have a bounty

its also impossible to duel in a town as a necromancer, WW, or vampire since if you do you will 1) likely get a bounty and 2) also likely to be interrupted and killed by a guard (ive had this happen and seen it happen to other people occasionally too)

I fondly recall the times when we would craft our own background stories to enhance the immersion of our roleplaying experiences in the Elder Scrolls series. Now, we're unable to even play it. How disappointing.

What do you mean? If you choose to do something illegal in the setting, your background should fit that.Why do you get to just pretend to be the exception? Be a vampire or ww in public reap the rewards. Necromancy their might be a cause for since it isn't universally illegal in lore but in a lot of countries it is super illegal and the law should come for you there. But I would think as a rper you would appreciate the world viewing your character for what they are.

Aerin · January 31

Tessitura wrote: »

What do you mean? If you choose to do something illegal in the setting, your background should fit that.Why do you get to just pretend to be the exception? Be a vampire or ww in public reap the rewards. Necromancy their might be a cause for since it isn't universally illegal in lore but in a lot of countries it is super illegal and the law should come for you there. But I would think as a rper you would appreciate the world viewing your character for what they are.

If what I'm doing is illegal, why do NPCs still seek my help?

Tessitura · February 1

Aerin wrote: »

Tessitura wrote: »

What do you mean? If you choose to do something illegal in the setting, your background should fit that.Why do you get to just pretend to be the exception? Be a vampire or ww in public reap the rewards. Necromancy their might be a cause for since it isn't universally illegal in lore but in a lot of countries it is super illegal and the law should come for you there. But I would think as a rper you would appreciate the world viewing your character for what they are.

If what I'm doing is illegal, why do NPCs still seek my help?

Desperation, they don't know till you cast? Quest giver will never turn against you, the people around them might but not the guy asking for help.

Aerin · February 1

Tessitura wrote: »

Desperation, they don't know till you cast? Quest giver will never turn against you, the people around them might but not the guy asking for help.

Okay, am I only helping the NPC who asks for my assistance, or are we assisting all of them? If we're helping all of them, why do they attack us? Can I progress in the story and complete all quests without receiving bounties for using my class abilities? No. Then where's the sense in this, or where's my roleplay as a necromancer?

Once again, I find myself facing a dilemma. As a necromancer, I am unable to fully embrace my role in the game by utilizing my class abilities, lest I incur a bounty. Can you please explain to me in detail how I am supposed to level up my skills when I'm unable to use them? Where's the enjoyment in being a necromancer if I can't engage in necromantic abilities? I would greatly appreciate your insights on this matter.

Ferrym4n · February 2

The game morality does not go far enough.

Give us Vigilants of Stendarr. Make Templars holy, and lawful, buffing law or just agency.

Make Vampire Templars painful, creatures of darkness should not be using powers of holy light!

Why should Sorcs get away with running around civilians with Daedric pets in tow?

Civilians, and the laws of civilisation should matter.

And you make your choices, and live and die by them.

Rasande_Robin · February 2

I love this part of the necromancer, please don't change this like you are doing with our beloved stalking blast bone.

#leavestalkersalone

Iriidius · February 2

Make Cyrodiil guards of your own faction also attack players if they use illegal skills the same way as guards in towns including immortality and oneshotting the player after a while! XD

Iriidius · February 2

Ironically Necromancer, Werewolf and Vampire also tend to be the worst (sub-)classes in the game and not only the illegal ones. Maybe you get punished for playing inefficient. Counting vampire as bad despite most PvPers using stage 3 for undead, because stage 3 isn‘t illegal and vampire skills which are illegal are also rarely used.

Think it wasn‘t „players“ like majority of players, that wanted necromancer to be illegal but rather someone with a bad idea that was used by ZoS who didn‘t thought about consequences enaugh. Of course they also put this system on werewolf and vampire, thought it was with greymoor, so 1 year after necro released in elsweyr, despite having enaugh time to see how annoying it was.
Werewolf in Skyrim gave you only bounty when transforming of 1000 gold, same as murder, while transformed you wouldn‘t get bounty because guards didn‘t recognize you as the dragonborn. You could transform into werewolf, go in city and murder someone, then leave city and transform back and if nobody saw you transforming you avoided bounty for murder so it had advantages and disadvantages in bounty system, while in ESO it is just bad.

Tyrant_Tim · February 2

Fargrave and Coldharbour appear to be the most friendly towards Necromancy, so Daedric realms seem to be the way to go.

We just need more of them.

Aerin · February 2

Rasande_Robin wrote: »

I love this part of the necromancer, please don't change this like you are doing with our beloved stalking blast bone.

#leavestalkersalone

If by changing skill, they eliminate this nonsense "criminal act", it's a win.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 2

Tyrant_Tim wrote: »

Fargrave and Coldharbour appear to be the most friendly towards Necromancy, so Daedric realms seem to be the way to go.

We just need more of them.

Apocrypha isn't for some reason.

Tyrant_Tim · February 3

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Tyrant_Tim wrote: »

Fargrave and Coldharbour appear to be the most friendly towards Necromancy, so Daedric realms seem to be the way to go.

We just need more of them.

Apocrypha isn't for some reason.

Really? I would push for a change to that.

soulus42 · February 3

Aerin wrote: »

Tessitura wrote: »

Desperation, they don't know till you cast? Quest giver will never turn against you, the people around them might but not the guy asking for help.

Okay, am I only helping the NPC who asks for my assistance, or are we assisting all of them? If we're helping all of them, why do they attack us? Can I progress in the story and complete all quests without receiving bounties for using my class abilities? No. Then where's the sense in this, or where's my roleplay as a necromancer?

Once again, I find myself facing a dilemma. As a necromancer, I am unable to fully embrace my role in the game by utilizing my class abilities, lest I incur a bounty. Can you please explain to me in detail how I am supposed to level up my skills when I'm unable to use them? Where's the enjoyment in being a necromancer if I can't engage in necromantic abilities? I would greatly appreciate your insights on this matter.

As a fellow Necro going through the zones, I can safely say that the only issue citizens seem to have with Necromancy is when they see you raising undead or becoming undead yourself.

Ripping the essence from freshly dead enemies? Fine
Throwing flaming skulls? Wonderful
Desecrate the land whenever and wherever? Awesome
Call the dead to claw at their feet? They're still in the ground so it's a-okay!

So you can just keep them on hand so they level up and use them when there's no witnesses.

Aerin · February 4

soulus42 wrote: »

As a fellow Necro going through the zones, I can safely say that the only issue citizens seem to have with Necromancy is when they see you raising undead or becoming undead yourself.
Ripping the essence from freshly dead enemies? Fine
Throwing flaming skulls? Wonderful
Desecrate the land whenever and wherever? Awesome
Call the dead to claw at their feet? They're still in the ground so it's a-okay!
So you can just keep them on hand so they level up and use them when there's no witnesses.

Actually, these actions aren't classified as necromancy; they're pure magic! Any magic character can perform them, but only necromancy can raise skeletons. That's the rule in ZoS roleplay, at least.

This doesn't make any sense. So, is everything working as it should.

soulus42 · February 4

Aerin wrote: »

soulus42 wrote: »

So you can just keep them on hand so they level up and use them when there's no witnesses.

Actually, these actions aren't classified as necromancy; they're pure magic! Any magic character can perform them, but only necromancy can raise skeletons. That's the rule in ZoS roleplay, at least.

This doesn't make any sense. So, is everything working as it should.

Sure raising the dead is what you think of when it comes to necromancy, but it's not limited solely to that. Still, maybe one day our good deeds will be recognized and we'll no longer have to worry about our undead companions causing a fright, but until then it's best to keep them out of sight.