A reading problem.

MindOfTheSwarm · May 2021

I don’t know if it’s just me but it seems that after reading comments to both my own posts and others, people comment in a way which makes it obvious they haven’t read the post fully. This then leads to responses that distract from the main point of the post which in turn can lead to others commenting on the misleading comments and the whole point of the post is lost among the many misinformed responses. Is not common sense to fully read and understand a post before making a comment? Is not bad etiquette to comment if you’re too lazy to read through a post? I feel that many people make valid points for others to simply dismiss the point with a comment that is written to do exactly that ‘dismiss the post’ without addressing the point at hand or putting any thought into it. I know this on the surface seems like a complaint that is not important but then again remember that many of these people are the same ones that complain about things that aren’t even broken because they can’t be bothered to learn how to play and end up steering the game into something that veteran players know is not good.

orion_1981usub17_ESO · May 2021

Welcome to the internet? First time? The cake is a lie by the way.

bmnoble · May 2021

Depends if they decide to write a novel as their post or not, if they don't get to their point in a clear way I will respond to the thread title instead.

For reference I would say if the text in someones post is about 3 times as long as the one in this OP, I would be highly like to skim rather than read the whole thing, the only time that is fine is if they are providing evidence or a guide for something.

If its much longer than that and they are not getting to their point I will make my response based on the title of their thread, then move on.

DreamyLu · May 2021

What OP says is true. It's not only ESO forum. It's the same everywhere, no matter the forums, communication platforms, work tools (minutes of meeting, meeting agenda, to do list, power point presentations...) and so on...

It's one of the first rule in communication to keep things short and clear to avoid losing attention of readers/audience.

I believe that even more in a forum related to a game, when a post is long, most readers will just go through it "diagonally" and of course, miss some of the details. As well, if a thread is too long, with several pages, readers who will first read OP and every pages before current one are probably rare.

The solution is on author's side: keep things straight to the point.

colossalvoids · May 2021

Reason why you should be short if possible, most people seem to read just the beginning of the thread, some even just a title. Example any CP related threads, people could read any proposals but ultimately they have their own problems with it that they want to express and get noticed so it's inevitable, especially when the system having some obvious flaws not addressed and system not meeting devs goals even.

Michae · May 2021

If you have an issue that needs a longer post it's generally good thing to keep arguments in separate paragraphs. And mind, that they shouldn't be novel sized. Even better if you can make a list.

People don't usually come to the forums for some deep reading, just to skim around the posts in their break time. Remember that.

MindOfTheSwarm · May 2021

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Welcome to the internet? First time? The cake is a lie by the way.

Haha. This made me laugh. There is a reason I stay away from Twitter. Pure toxicity.

AnyOldIron · May 2021

Yes, I love waffles too!!!

MindOfTheSwarm · May 2021

AnyOldIron wrote: »

Yes, I love waffles too!!!

Hahaha. Brilliant

MorganaLaVey · May 2021

the main reason is ppl just want to push there own agenda or talk about whatever they have on their hearts. its not that they dont understand or did not read it all, they know they are offtopic they just dont care.

- you'r mad because you got kicked by "elitists" ? use the comment of someone who complains about roleplayers in vet dungeons to complain about elitisim.

-you'r mad because dd's where mad you did not heal them? use the comment of someone giving healer advise to complain about how everyone expects to much of healers and should look more on himself.

best exemple are the off-meta fans who highjack every thread with some build advise.

thats wy they are bad players in the first place: they rather complain then to look at what they can do better.
but its not only in this forum its everywhere, its just how ppl are these days.

geonsocal · May 2021

Lephrel · May 2021

A reading problem.

You're saying you have a reading problem? I am not sure how the forums can help you with this, so let's talk about an issue that I care about instead: I want more housing slots.

Varana · May 2021

MindOfTheSwarm wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Welcome to the internet? First time? The cake is a lie by the way.

Haha. This made me laugh. There is a reason I stay away from Twitter. Pure toxicity.

It's not a Twitter thing, or "ow, the younglings can't read any more!"
I've been using the internet for about 25 years now, and I'm pretty sure it started that way.
And before the internet, people didn't read typewritten letters. Or handwritten ones.
And I'm also pretty sure that emperor Augustus had a whole lot of memos prepared by underlings that he didn't really read, either.
And before that, king Enmerkar of Uruk certainly slept through a few of his officials' briefings.

(It might also be an idea to break up your post into several paragraphs, or at least have a few line-breks in between.)

DaiKahn · May 2021

MindOfTheSwarm wrote: »

I don’t know if it’s just me but it seems that after reading comments to both my own posts and others, people comment in a way which makes it obvious they haven’t read the post fully. This then leads to responses that distract from the main point of the post which in turn can lead to others commenting on the misleading comments and the whole point of the post is lost among the many misinformed responses. Is not common sense to fully read and understand a post before making a comment? Is not bad etiquette to comment if you’re too lazy to read through a post? I feel that many people make valid points for others to simply dismiss the point with a comment that is written to do exactly that ‘dismiss the post’ without addressing the point at hand or putting any thought into it. I know this on the surface seems like a complaint that is not important but then again remember that many of these people are the same ones that complain about things that aren’t even broken because they can’t be bothered to learn how to play and end up steering the game into something that veteran players know is not good.

Imagine how the Mods/Admins feel reading the forums

Lugaldu · May 2021

DaiKahn wrote: »

Imagine how the Mods/Admins feel reading the forums

They are likely to feel similar to teachers having to read their students' exams.

SilverBride · May 2021

If you want posters to read the entire OP, keep it short and to the point, and separate it into paragraphs.

RupzSkooma · May 2021

I don’t know what you said but I love you.

Kadraeus · May 2021

Yeah, people do this all the time, and I'll admit that sometimes I have to force myself to keep reading the rest of someone's comment (though there's a point when people say something so absurd that I just refuse to read any more). I will say, however, that veteran players also do this as much as everyone else. I've seen people disregard another person's valid complaint just because it comes from someone who isn't a veteran. Being a veteran player doesn't mean everything you say is correct. If anything, you can be biased against certain complaints just because you've gotten used to the issues other people are complaining about, and you, therefore, don't see them as issues. New perspectives are still worth a lot.

Dojohoda · May 2021

What I think this topic is about and my replies in parenthesis.

Those who make comments frequently do not comment on the topic of the post. (I have noticed that this happens often.)
Do they read the post? (I did, but it is a wall. Points evolve in the same one long paragraph.)
Furthermore, do they even bother to learn to play? (Personally, I make an effort as time permits.)
Does their uninformed comments skew the direction of this game? (I can't speak for decisions made by devs. I don't know, but we have to admit that sorcs were nerfed after the thousands millions of "nerf sorc" requests. <- that was an attempt at humor.)

WiseSky · May 2021

World with a Wealth of Information leaves a Poverty of Attention

rpa · May 2021

Be concise. It helps.

Nastassiya · May 2021

MindOfTheSwarm wrote: »

I don’t know if it’s just me but it seems that after reading comments to both my own posts and others, people comment in a way which makes it obvious they haven’t read the post fully. This then leads to responses that distract from the main point of the post which in turn can lead to others commenting on the misleading comments and the whole point of the post is lost among the many misinformed responses. Is not common sense to fully read and understand a post before making a comment? Is not bad etiquette to comment if you’re too lazy to read through a post? I feel that many people make valid points for others to simply dismiss the point with a comment that is written to do exactly that ‘dismiss the post’ without addressing the point at hand or putting any thought into it. I know this on the surface seems like a complaint that is not important but then again remember that many of these people are the same ones that complain about things that aren’t even broken because they can’t be bothered to learn how to play and end up steering the game into something that veteran players know is not good.

You should show us an example of a post that people react this way towards. Sometimes I won't fully read a post of the persons English is mediocre and hard to follow. I also quit caring what a person has to say if words like "Wat?" are in their messages.

kargen27 · May 2021

Was a study done. Average reader will stop somewhere in the 2nd paragraph of an article. A surprising number of people do not go past the headline and first two lines of the story. Some are headline only. That is why misleading headlines work so well. The writers if they do include anything that contradicts the headline usually bury it three or more paragraphs down.

Short and to the point usually works best for forums. Offering a preface or premise before getting to the details usually means we don't get to the details. I'm guilty of sometimes making posts longer than they need to be and I also am guilty of skimming instead of reading long posts.

SirAndy · May 2021

Maybe try using paragraphs in your next post?

SickleCider · May 2021

I just skipped around the OP and chose a few words and how dare you say I'm too lazy to learn how to play!

RedMuse · May 2021

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Welcome to the internet? First time? The cake is a lie by the way.

What do you mean, cake is eternal.

RedMuse · May 2021

Nastassiya wrote: »

MindOfTheSwarm wrote: »

I don’t know if it’s just me but it seems that after reading comments to both my own posts and others, people comment in a way which makes it obvious they haven’t read the post fully. This then leads to responses that distract from the main point of the post which in turn can lead to others commenting on the misleading comments and the whole point of the post is lost among the many misinformed responses. Is not common sense to fully read and understand a post before making a comment? Is not bad etiquette to comment if you’re too lazy to read through a post? I feel that many people make valid points for others to simply dismiss the point with a comment that is written to do exactly that ‘dismiss the post’ without addressing the point at hand or putting any thought into it. I know this on the surface seems like a complaint that is not important but then again remember that many of these people are the same ones that complain about things that aren’t even broken because they can’t be bothered to learn how to play and end up steering the game into something that veteran players know is not good.

You should show us an example of a post that people react this way towards. Sometimes I won't fully read a post of the persons English is mediocre and hard to follow. I also quit caring what a person has to say if words like "Wat?" are in their messages.

Personally I stop reading after a sentence or so if the person refuses to use paragraphs. Or worse, no paragraphs and no proper punctuation. This isn't twitter.

Like OP here. I frankly did stop reading after one sentence. For all I know it is just them, or maybe not. Maybe the point of this post was something else entirely. No idea, I refused to battle my way through that wall of unformatted text.

VaranisArano · May 2021

I tend to write walls 'o text on the forums. I'm wordy and like to explain myself in great detail, for good or ill.

Paragraph breaks are very helpful.

If I've been misunderstood, I tend to first assume that I wasn't as clear as I thought I was. Sometimes I'm able to clear up the confusion. Other times, we agree we understand each other...and we still disagree. That's fine too!

And after that...this is a forum. The original poster can't really control where the conversation goes. In fact, I find that the threads where the OP tries to demand that everyone stay narrowly on topic or, worse, posts a poll and then argues with everyone posting a dissenting opinion, are the threads that derail into snide comments and bickering faster than usual.

Mahabahabtha · May 2021

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Welcome to the internet? First time? The cake is a lie by the way.

Made my day...
Thx 😂

RedMuse · May 2021

VaranisArano wrote: »

I tend to write walls 'o text on the forums. I'm wordy and like to explain myself in great detail, for good or ill.

Paragraph breaks are very helpful.

If I've been misunderstood, I tend to first assume that I wasn't as clear as I thought I was. Sometimes I'm able to clear up the confusion. Other times, we agree we understand each other...and we still disagree. That's fine too!

And after that...this is a forum. The original poster can't really control where the conversation goes. In fact, I find that the threads where the OP tries to demand that everyone stay narrowly on topic or, worse, posts a poll and then argues with everyone posting a dissenting opinion, are the threads that derail into snide comments and bickering faster than usual.

(Emphasis mine)

And this Varanis is why I don't mind your walls of text. In general I do not mind long text posts as long as the writer have done some formatting of them.

Tandor · May 2021

I do sometimes see that players haven't read a post correctly when commenting on it, as the OP suggests, and that does make me wonder whether their interpretation of e.g. patch notes is similarly ill-informed. Then again, posters - especially when launching a topic - do sometimes have their own particular bias which they shouldn't criticise others for side-stepping.