@Urzigurumash
So you comment seems to be solely focused on PvP performance, and in that regard it make sense. What I'm saying is that Tankyness will have zero impact on the DPS and healer in PvE.
Let's look at DPS for example. Currently in live PvE:
1. all of your points go into your main damage resources already
2. Most will run sustain food, getting max resources and recovery
3. All possible DPS nodes will be slotted and priotized
4. Maybe one heal or shield will be slotted, while the rest of your bar will be dots.
So what resources can Dk still pull from it all of the above are turn and the class under performs in optimize group?

ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »

Urzigurumash wrote: »

You know, if we already saw that the universal meta for DDs in Cyrodiil was running 7x Divines, No Heavy, No Max Health food, etc., i.e., building for absolute maximum damage, there's no way that buffing the tank side of DK would let it be a better damage dealer.

But they're not, they're chugging tri-pots like tanks. Right?

If we're talking about how we get them to be rated top-tier DD for Trials, yeah I have no idea about that subject. I'm more or less using traditional PvE roles as the control for where a class should receive buffs if it's regarded as underperforming in general.

As it stands the only damage passives the DK recieve increases class dots by 33%, fire aoes by 6%, and the burning or poison status effect. Would broadening these, or adding a single universal passive be far more impact impactful.

Yeah, I don't know much about PvE. If we're talking about optimizing for Trials DD and Healer and getting as much possible efficiency out of the kit as possible, I know nothing at all. But, if we're not clear frontrunners for Trials Tank on account of our innate tankiness at least as much as our ability to convey group buffs, and there's allocation made towards survivability on almost every DK PvP spec - then it seems improvements to DKs tankiness should be the primary focus for buffs to the class.

Of course we want our class to perform well in every role - but if a class is falling behind in its core role, perhaps those areas should be addressed first. In PvP many of the other base-game classes are fulfilling their core role in a better way than DK.

On the damage side for PvP the idea I've liked the most is some sort of Super Poisoned or Super Burning status, where stacking DoTs or something provides a stronger bonus to Poisoned/Fire damage rather than just the 50% increase to damage on Poisoned and Burning ticks. For PvP, it's obvious the single best improvement we could have for damage is a large increase to the second hit of Inhale, probably with a removal of the targeting requirement. Players have been suggesting this for a long time I think. Of course I've always wanted Weapon Stat scaling on Inhale, always was the number one thing I wanted back in the day. Either of those would help DK as a PvE DD obviously, but I don't know much about it.

+1 to this, I can give you my feedback from PVP:
magDK is my ex-main, got a stamDK too, loved them but it's so weack...moved to necro a couple of months ago and this is night and day!!!

Now I put really less effort in every fight and got way more better result than with my DK. it's a shame because I don't like really the class but no choice

You know, I never really spent much time thinking about individual nerfs/buffs since I don't really do PvP at all and, while I've done PvE stuff, I'm not a full expert. I mostly just play one character as my main and don't much think about it.

But hearing about the incredible buffs some people could manage with the proc scaling, e.g. the ability to get 70k+ health with specific builds, really made me look at what I as a DK can do versus other classes.

Big one I saw was the wings:
DK Protective scale: Cost 3780 at rank IV, reduces projectile damage by 50%, has a morph that reflects projectiles back for 1799 damage.
Warden Crystallized Shield: Cost 3780 at rank IV, completely negates three projectiles and restores mag for each, has a morph that reflects projectiles back for 1799 damage.

...so, Warden has almost the same skill, but way better? I know I'm allergic to vCR because of her Nocturnal's Favor, and I hear Wardens can just no-sell that attack.

...I dunno, seems a bit unbalanced to me...

Sangwyne wrote: »

So as I understand it, if there are zero changes to DK this next PTS patch cycle, week 3, then there won't be any for the remainder of the PTS cycle, correct? ZOS couldn't possibly be so heartless or unaware of its current issues as to allow DK to exist in this miserable state for several more months.

...Right?

I'm pretty sure the fact that there were zero changes in 7.0.0 already means there won't be any changes in Blackwood. PTS patches usually only tweak changes that were already in the x.y.0 PTS release; they don't generally add new additional changes.

@Urzigurumash
As it stands the DK only has 3 passives dedicated to actual damage done, and only 2 if you consider stamdk, and one of those buffs is actually a buff to a status effect. Compare that to the remaining 2/3 of passive that are dedicated to tanking and survival.
There is an argument to be had that the tank passives can be updated for current meta. But until the DK get more damage passives, and said passives universally impact damage done. The class will never improve, in either PvP or PvE.

ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »

@Urzigurumash
As it stands the DK only has 3 passives dedicated to actual damage done, and only 2 if you consider stamdk, and one of those buffs is actually a buff to a status effect. Compare that to the remaining 2/3 of passive that are dedicated to tanking and survival.
There is an argument to be had that the tank passives can be updated for current meta. But until the DK get more damage passives, and said passives universally impact damage done. The class will never improve, in either PvP or PvE.

Right, for PvP StamDK, the Ardent Flames passives by far need the most help to be relevant, but they need more than just an increase on their numbers. Some of the Draconic Power and Earthen Heart passives could possibly become much more competitive just through an increase on their numbers.