Crispen_Longbow wrote: »

Marcus684 wrote: »

I think I understand now. Those of you that like to faction hop are often in the upper tiers of pvpers. You were good enough, ground out the right gear, practiced your combos, and figured out how to win enough to be noticed by the better players in the other factions, "gf you should roll an AD (or DC or EP) so we can farm zerglings anyone together lmao".

I would say most of the Faction hoppers would agree with this. Made one correction that was showing a bit of your bias coming out.

Marcus684 wrote: »

So you did, and had lots of fun with your new cross-faction friends winning 2vX, 3vX, WhatevervX fights against unwashed the masses of terribad players anyone of all factions, racking up huge piles of EoC rewards and AP.

Fixed that for you, bias coming out again.

The old 80/20 rule. 80% of Players fall into this category (unwashed masses of terribad players) When the 20% of "Good" players refuse to fight that leaves the pugs to be slaughtered. We see it all the time when we face Guilds. Guilds follow the 80/20% rule as well. Most of them are terrible.

Marcus684 wrote: »

Who cares who's emp , or who has scrolls?

Do you think the 2 to 3 man cross-faction group is going to dethrone an emp? That is the job of large guilds. Cyrodill is a large sandbox where all playstyles are welcome. They only playstyles that we should have issues with are the ones that bring the servers to its knees, which is too many people in one location.

For years we have been asking for changes to dethrone mechanic. Funneling everyone into one keep for a dethrone results in super lag for all. Now you are saying you want those small man Cross-factions to join in the lag mess instead of spreading out like they are doing.

All of this applies the same for scrolls, do you think the 2 to 3 man cross-faction group is going to take a scroll during primetime?

Marcus684 wrote: »

or who's leading the campaign

Campaign wins are won by the 16 hours of population imbalances when the campaign's primetime is over. This has been this way for years and years and years. How do you not know this? There is zero reason for anyone that plays in primetime to care about "Campaign" wins as they have virtually no impact on the campaign. This is the majority of when players play, so the majority of players have no impact on the campaign.

Any "primetime" player that cares about campaign wins boils down to a few things...

1. They don't realize that what they are doing has virtual no impact on the campaign. "Ignorance"
2. They are a solo player that isn't very good at pvp. They can’t kill anyone unless they follow along a group of players and then they now massively outnumber their opponents. This is a hollow victory for them. So, a campaign win is the way for them to feel good about what others do. A common saying for them is, "Well we got our asses handed to us in that fight but that's OK, look at the campaign score"!
3. They are a group / Guild player that isn't very good. Same logic as the solo player that is terrible, now apply that as a guild. There are many terrible guilds that get slaughtered when they face another guild. Pvdooring Kingscrest, Rayles, Blackboot, Bloodmayne for a morale boost has been a running joke for years. These are your "Faction-Loyalists" guilds they are terrible at PVP. A campaign win is the only way they feel better about what they do as a guild. Constantly being slaughtered isn't enjoyable to them. They don't want/know how to improve so they are off to Pvdoor another keep. It would be one thing if they went off to pvdoor a keep so they could create their own fights and spread out fights but sadly there are only a handful of groups that can do this.

Marcus684 wrote: »

You don't need the buffs as you kite around a resource tower killing zergling after zergling until your fingers cramped, laughing in voice chat having a blast, or running the walls of Glade wiping the same terrible guilds & groups that refuse to get better at PVP and then leave the other 30 pugs to get slaughtered over and over again.

Good times...

Fixed that for you, green is what is added for clarification.

See Reason #3 as to why any group can do this. If the guilds and groups would be better at fighting this wouldn't happen.

Zone Call out examples...

Guild Zone call out.
Zone chat call out, "Drac or Omni is killing everything at Glademist, we need help!!!". DC Guilds, "We already died to them twice and now are on camp timers, we need our morale boost, on to Kingscrest".

Small man Cross-Faction call out.
Zone Chat call out, "5 or 6 EP farming at Faregyl Mine, need help!!!" AD small man group responds, they die once and never go back. Instead of going back to improve they leave the solos to get slaughter and they are off to Alessia Bridge.

If you want to blame someone for getting farmed look in the mirror. Tell your DC Guilds to improve and tell your DC small mans to help. O wait, those are the cross-faction groups trying to help out that have now been locked out from helping.

Marcus684 wrote: »

Along comes ZOS and says, " Nope, those days are over. " " We have a rule change, that will hurt population imbalances even more". Now most of your friends are either stuck behind a faction lock wall, or decided this was the last straw and quit the game. Now all you have left is to scrape together the few of your friends left and hop onto the unlocked campaign, which is currently a ghost town most of the time, or solo on the locked campaign, which is also poorly populated most of the time.

ZOS created a few sandboxes for all the kids to play in, however all the kids only use 1 sandbox (30 Day CP Campaign). As that is all of the PVP population that is left. It has dwindled to what we have now because ZOS has neglected server performance for years, that is why we have empty sandboxes.

ZOS decides to come up with a new rule.

This rule will force 1 of the 2 kids that care about this rule to an empty sandbox. Neither kid wants to play in the empty sandbox. Regardless if ZOS makes the new sandbox a “Faction lock only” or a “Faction Open” sandbox, it will be dead and empty. Neither kid wants to play in an empty sandbox.

Marcus684 wrote: »

I get it. it sucks when something you loved is taken from you. Now you have 2 3 choices, adapt or quit or provide examples to ZOS to help them reverse their decision. Given enough evidence or backlash ZOS may reverse faction locks, but given their track record this won't happen soon, if ever.

Fixed that for you again.

Cross-Faction players are choosing #3 as their option. They continue to provide reasons why ZOS should reverse this. In the mean time they are choosing #1 like all good players do, they are adapting.

They have adapted by choosing their main characters factions. The consequences of this is that we are seeing a greater population imbalance in non primetime hours.

Just like they said would happen from experiencing this in the past.

This.

@Crispen_Longbow How are you gonna talk about how bad the "playstyle that brings the server to it's knees" when you've been playing that way since the start of the game, kinda ironic you talking about it huh. Funny all the guilds you list that you've been in are literally the most well known zerg guilds that do exactly what you say everyone should have issues with

@Crispen_Longbow

Nice read. (Un)fortunately you live in a perfect world.

There is also a very dark side to it. It is not about campaign or emp or the imbalance between bottom and top. The worst are psychological and verbal abuse of players. Brain ganking if you like. Unfortunately Cyrodiil is the only place i cant ignore chat. This "spitting" on people stopped since the lock is back. For me the lock is the better solution.

If the lock should be up for the campaign or for 6 hours is a different animal for me.

Since faction lock the play is much better and will continue to improve. The bottom line here is if you don't like to fight for one faction against two others in cyro for the win, you have a choice where you can go and still play with CP points. The fact that the 7 day camp isn't populated now doesn't speak well to the argument its the 'majority' of players who did this regularly.....and saying they would prefer a "no cp option" also smacks of pre battleground creation crying. It isn't true and is another convenient excuse along with all the others that in order to have fun in the game a segment of the population REQUIRES the rest of the game to allow them 'conditions' to play. Main one being they dont fight for win, but imaginary 'wins' that are not tracked and recorded like scores and points. How convenient that is, to have no one but you and your group decide what winning looks like. Yet, many faction swappers claim they dont care....I submit they do, in fact more than others but do not want to have a standard to measure the win with. That would ruin the whole game for them, a standard measure.

Not only that, but the anecdotal evidence presented is patently false.....a dead camp is NOT a sign the swappers didn't really care and stayed on the main 30 day camp, its more likely they are truly the minority and yet I see players claiming consistently otherwise. If they were looking for good fights, they would find them with other groups who don't push map and also are looking for good fights. If they were really more knowledgeable about the game and better then they should be looking for others who are doing the same thing- both of those could be found on the 7 day non locked camp- yet again we have the excuses that are all too convenient, yeah.....just don't care so we stayed, would prefer a 30 day no cp option. But instead of playing the game where they have the option, they would rather spend the time they are not in the game here in forums talking about how unfair everything is in game for them, given that they are super good and the best most knowledgeable groups out there----but, they just need a few of the rules of the game adjusted to accommodate them and they definitely dont want to be isolated on a server where everyone is doing what they are doing- I assure you if accommodated as they were in Tam 1, they will only move the goalpost as they did with battlegrounds creation.

idk wrote: »

I cannot figure out the purpose of this thread. It just seems OP is just trying to troll those who are not in favor of faction locks with some crazy mixed up theories. I guess some are just out for attention.

caeliusstarbreaker wrote: »

I just find it comical how the same people who complain about “adapt” as a response to things, so easily use “adapt” as a response to things.

Irony is usually used for vindictive humor; you are supposed to find it comical.

Morgul667 wrote: »

Just let us play with faction lock already

Most people are happy with it

Where do these assertions that “most” or the “vast majority” of players are happy with it? Stop saying this unless you can provide numbers.

Players spent money, time, and energy in leveling characters and now they are told they can’t play those characters.

Put the faction lock on the 7 day campaign. Give the vocal MINORITY who actually asked for the locks a place to play they want. Let everyone else play the characters they bought and leveled.

Well I have 14 AD faction toons.

I made a Necro as my 15 toon, kinda messed up and forgot about which faction I wanted and didn't notice until like lvl 10 when I went in to PVP to get the quick shards/exp etc from the first few quests. Only after locking in as home campaign.

So now I have to wait 20 days to play the other 14 toons on the 30 day normal.

Here I thought faction lock wont not affect me since I was all AD anyways.... but ... oh well , not a real big deal i guess, just a bit annoyed atm, but I will get over it.

My fault for not selecting AD when I made the toon.

bulbousb16_ESO wrote: »

Reevster wrote: »

So now I have to wait 20 days to play the other 14 toons on the 30 day normal.

That sucks for sure, but why not just rock the 30-day No CP for three weeks?

Ya probably will, but I like my CPs.

Soul_Demon wrote: »

Dutchessx wrote: »

Soul_Demon wrote: »

Since faction lock the play is much better and will continue to improve. The bottom line here is if you don't like to fight for one faction against two others in cyro for the win, you have a choice where you can go and still play with CP points. The fact that the 7 day camp isn't populated now doesn't speak well to the argument its the 'majority' of players who did this regularly.....and saying they would prefer a "no cp option" also smacks of pre battleground creation crying. It isn't true and is another convenient excuse along with all the others that in order to have fun in the game a segment of the population REQUIRES the rest of the game to allow them 'conditions' to play. Main one being they dont fight for win, but imaginary 'wins' that are not tracked and recorded like scores and points. How convenient that is, to have no one but you and your group decide what winning looks like. Yet, many faction swappers claim they dont care....I submit they do, in fact more than others but do not want to have a standard to measure the win with. That would ruin the whole game for them, a standard measure.

Not only that, but the anecdotal evidence presented is patently false.....a dead camp is NOT a sign the swappers didn't really care and stayed on the main 30 day camp, its more likely they are truly the minority and yet I see players claiming consistently otherwise. If they were looking for good fights, they would find them with other groups who don't push map and also are looking for good fights. If they were really more knowledgeable about the game and better then they should be looking for others who are doing the same thing- both of those could be found on the 7 day non locked camp- yet again we have the excuses that are all too convenient, yeah.....just don't care so we stayed, would prefer a 30 day no cp option. But instead of playing the game where they have the option, they would rather spend the time they are not in the game here in forums talking about how unfair everything is in game for them, given that they are super good and the best most knowledgeable groups out there----but, they just need a few of the rules of the game adjusted to accommodate them and they definitely dont want to be isolated on a server where everyone is doing what they are doing- I assure you if accommodated as they were in Tam 1, they will only move the goalpost as they did with battlegrounds creation.

Wow! Assumes A LOT

I would like to add that imho - the CP 7 day server has always been less populated. I think it is still important to note that most people are still probably playing the new content. I also believe the current state of Cyrodiil performance is discouraging people to pvp at the moment. As well as the new necro ulti hitting for an ungodly amount, it is the epitome of an I win button.

Also, remember ZoS did have CP Battlegrounds but it was a tank fest and it was reverted BACK to No CP.

Edit to refine comments.

#FreeNoCP

I appreciate the comment, but do not share your views on the issue.....if anything the idea the players I speak of should JUMP at the chance to go somewhere that was left explicitly for them alone to play. They did not, that speaks volumes to the motivations and truths of why they play the way they play.

And the battlegrounds was predicted to be a failure before it was done, but the 'small man, we are the best players in game at everything' groups in forums pushed the issues and ZOS gave them battlegrounds....that promptly failed miserably. Those same players are still in cyro complaining and crying in forums about how mistreated they are along with how good they really are and they just need a few more changes to show everyone that.....just a few more changes. Like swapping for no cost and having other players forced to do the same thing bunched up with them on one server so they can 'show' everyone.

It always centers around players who don't endorse that play style being given no other options but to be with those who do like Tam 1. It isn't changing, and likely never will...its what these people do. Anything done to allow them the choice they will scream 'Its unfair and only for the bads" with goalposts being moved yet again, for you see.....they are not what they present themselves to be in the forums. Not by a long shot. Notice the toxic zone trolls curbed along with the exploiting groups? Coincidence? Nope.

Salty? I jest of course! Maybe.

#FreeNoCP

Dutchessx wrote: »

Soul_Demon wrote: »

Dutchessx wrote: »

Soul_Demon wrote: »

Since faction lock the play is much better and will continue to improve. The bottom line here is if you don't like to fight for one faction against two others in cyro for the win, you have a choice where you can go and still play with CP points. The fact that the 7 day camp isn't populated now doesn't speak well to the argument its the 'majority' of players who did this regularly.....and saying they would prefer a "no cp option" also smacks of pre battleground creation crying. It isn't true and is another convenient excuse along with all the others that in order to have fun in the game a segment of the population REQUIRES the rest of the game to allow them 'conditions' to play. Main one being they dont fight for win, but imaginary 'wins' that are not tracked and recorded like scores and points. How convenient that is, to have no one but you and your group decide what winning looks like. Yet, many faction swappers claim they dont care....I submit they do, in fact more than others but do not want to have a standard to measure the win with. That would ruin the whole game for them, a standard measure.

Not only that, but the anecdotal evidence presented is patently false.....a dead camp is NOT a sign the swappers didn't really care and stayed on the main 30 day camp, its more likely they are truly the minority and yet I see players claiming consistently otherwise. If they were looking for good fights, they would find them with other groups who don't push map and also are looking for good fights. If they were really more knowledgeable about the game and better then they should be looking for others who are doing the same thing- both of those could be found on the 7 day non locked camp- yet again we have the excuses that are all too convenient, yeah.....just don't care so we stayed, would prefer a 30 day no cp option. But instead of playing the game where they have the option, they would rather spend the time they are not in the game here in forums talking about how unfair everything is in game for them, given that they are super good and the best most knowledgeable groups out there----but, they just need a few of the rules of the game adjusted to accommodate them and they definitely dont want to be isolated on a server where everyone is doing what they are doing- I assure you if accommodated as they were in Tam 1, they will only move the goalpost as they did with battlegrounds creation.

Wow! Assumes A LOT

I would like to add that imho - the CP 7 day server has always been less populated. I think it is still important to note that most people are still probably playing the new content. I also believe the current state of Cyrodiil performance is discouraging people to pvp at the moment. As well as the new necro ulti hitting for an ungodly amount, it is the epitome of an I win button.

Also, remember ZoS did have CP Battlegrounds but it was a tank fest and it was reverted BACK to No CP.

Edit to refine comments.

#FreeNoCP

I appreciate the comment, but do not share your views on the issue.....if anything the idea the players I speak of should JUMP at the chance to go somewhere that was left explicitly for them alone to play. They did not, that speaks volumes to the motivations and truths of why they play the way they play.

And the battlegrounds was predicted to be a failure before it was done, but the 'small man, we are the best players in game at everything' groups in forums pushed the issues and ZOS gave them battlegrounds....that promptly failed miserably. Those same players are still in cyro complaining and crying in forums about how mistreated they are along with how good they really are and they just need a few more changes to show everyone that.....just a few more changes. Like swapping for no cost and having other players forced to do the same thing bunched up with them on one server so they can 'show' everyone.

It always centers around players who don't endorse that play style being given no other options but to be with those who do like Tam 1. It isn't changing, and likely never will...its what these people do. Anything done to allow them the choice they will scream 'Its unfair and only for the bads" with goalposts being moved yet again, for you see.....they are not what they present themselves to be in the forums. Not by a long shot. Notice the toxic zone trolls curbed along with the exploiting groups? Coincidence? Nope.

Salty? I jest of course! Maybe.

#FreeNoCP

With such a well thought out and logic driven comment- exactly what does one say other than "I told you so" and thanks for helping illustrate the point more eloquently than I ever could.

Yeah but it's a video game that has an alliance war....

We've got them here too, friends, voice comms, etc., but they are fewer now.