Midyear Mayhem a "Holiday" Achievement?

Xexpo · May 2017

But why? Why is pvp such a hard 'no'?
It's baffling to me to say the least.
It's just a game. What's the difference between dying to mobs or players?
Like did something happen to you all in pvp that legit terrifies you to participate now?

Khenarthi · May 2017

Xexpo wrote: »

But why? Why is pvp such a hard 'no'?
It's baffling to me to say the least.
It's just a game. What's the difference between dying to mobs or players?
Like did something happen to you all in pvp that legit terrifies you to participate now?

Mobs don't teabag or send hate whispers. I play to relax after a day's work, and don't find pvp relaxing at all (it's harder, challenging content because you can't really predict how another human will behave).

That said, I will try to complete this achievement even if 99% of my game time is spent on PVE. I can't help but think that the PVP crowd is not going to be happy with the queues and extra lag caused by all the extra people, like me, invading their zone...

KingYogi415 · May 2017

How do you stam pve without vigor?

nimander99 · May 2017

Yeah, although I'm not as extremely against PVP as you I do agree with the sentiment... Imperial City and other pvp content is just one big blank slate on an otherwise completed Achievement Panel. I still cant complete even the fishing achievement in the zone because someone inevitable comes by and roflstomps me while I'm fishing... I mean, really? I'm fishing dangit! Leave me alone...

Feanor · May 2017

Being a completionist must be really challenging. Glad I'm just enjoying the game instead.

Rozenwyn · May 2017

The achievements from all of the past holiday events have been incredibly easy to get. I highly doubt the PvP ones will be any different.

Grab a group of friends you usually do dungeons or trials with and just go in for a night/day of not caring and have some fun.

Ridiculous to want this in a different tab purely for selfish people who don't believe PvPers should have holiday events or their achievement bar to not be filled. Goodness there are many worse things to be complaining about.

nikigwil · May 2017

Is there a date for this event yet?

Banana · May 2017

It is PVPers turn for something. I'll happily sit this one out.

MornaBaine · May 2017

I still hate that the best black dye in the game, Legate's Black, is forever beyond my reach as not only is it a PvP achievement but an insanely hard one to get. Dyes should never have been achievements.

biminirwb17_ESO · May 2017

Make all areas pvp. (runs for the asbestos armour cupboard)

TheRealPotoroo · May 2017

Rozenwyn wrote: »

The achievements from all of the past holiday events have been incredibly easy to get. I highly doubt the PvP ones will be any different.

Grab a group of friends you usually do dungeons or trials with and just go in for a night/day of not caring and have some fun.

Ridiculous to want this in a different tab purely for selfish people who don't believe PvPers should have holiday events or their achievement bar to not be filled. Goodness there are many worse things to be complaining about.

Nobody is saying that PVPers shouldn't have events, holiday or otherwise, so stop saying they are. They can have as many events as they like, so long as they are held over there in PvP-Land.

Sakiri · May 2017

I'd prefer total segregation personally.

Hate PvP with a searing passion. The players' attitudes reek.

Seri · May 2017

Rainwhisper wrote: »

mesmerizedish wrote: »

They haven't put them in a PvE category. They've put them in a general category that you would like to be PvE-only.

It doesn't seem unreasonable to expect the category to stay PvE, since there is already a category for Player vs Player achievements.

I feel the compromise here is that all the PvE ones should be hidden behind a single PvE bar too, yea? Why should there be 9 other bars for people that just want to PvP? :P

Rozenwyn wrote: »

The achievements from all of the past holiday events have been incredibly easy to get. I highly doubt the PvP ones will be any different. .

Capture a keep, capture an IC district. So pretty much participation awards again. Defeat 50 opponents is easy by joining a zerg. The only thing remotely difficult would be winning a BG match since you can't hide quite as easily, but depending on the game, it's quite possible someone else could carry in domination or relic matches.

mesmerizedish · May 2017

TheRealPotoroo wrote: »

Rozenwyn wrote: »

The achievements from all of the past holiday events have been incredibly easy to get. I highly doubt the PvP ones will be any different.

Grab a group of friends you usually do dungeons or trials with and just go in for a night/day of not caring and have some fun.

Ridiculous to want this in a different tab purely for selfish people who don't believe PvPers should have holiday events or their achievement bar to not be filled. Goodness there are many worse things to be complaining about.

Nobody is saying that PVPers shouldn't have events, holiday or otherwise, so stop saying they are. They can have as many events as they like, so long as they are held over there in PvP-Land.

The OP is in fact saying that holiday events should be PvE-only.

It's not a position I agree with, but it is one that can lead to productive discussion if folks can avoid insulting one another about it.

Knootewoot · May 2017

Rainwhisper wrote: »

mesmerizedish wrote: »

Because it's a holiday event. Why would you assume that means exclusively PvE?

Because, typically in MMO's, and to-date in ESO, PvP events and PvE events are separate things. It's a tacit recognition that those are generally separate player bases, and no amount of wishful thinking on the part of the dev's is going to change that.

Starwars galaxies had amazing events which combined PvP and PvE. At the new life you could choose to be a PvE peasant and gather cookies and so. Or you could go PvP and destroy enemy trees (or decorate them as rebel) and kill other players.

Best combination I ever seen. And as PvE no harm was done to you.

Would be cool that Zos could do this. Make people who are afraid of dying to others be able to flag themselves as peasants. Then the PvP event continues while the PvE-flagged people have to do chores at the resources like mining at the mine, working on the land at the farm en chopping wood at lumbermill.

Joffi · May 2017

Those confused by this thread or the position of the OP may wish to read Richard Bartle's 1996 paper on player types.

Tan9oSuccka · May 2017

CyrusArya wrote: »

Be a terrified carebear

Get your achievements

Pick one. You can't demand that things be run on your terms. The goal of such an event is to get people who have not tried PvP or are on the fence to dabble. PvP needs a healthy player base to be functional and that end goal is far more important than the entitled demands of some whining carebears.

PvP could...could be good in this game. They represent a small fraction of the overall community.

The part that ushers most casuals away, is the even smaller toxic PvP cheesers/exploiters/cheaters.

As far as titles, who cares? Is it really worth getting insta-killed by someone that doesn't even animate an attack? Or my personal favorite, the guys that freeze you in place (Cannot break free, cannot move) similar to getting shocked by the Wamasu on Vet Arx Corninium.

Magdalina · May 2017

I'm stoked there's a PvP event and I don't even PvP that much. Now I haven't tested on PTS so maybe it'll be a lot less fun than I imagine but surely it'll be more exciting than freeing the same pig every day.

You're obviously welcome to not partake in it(for example, I didn't do Jester festival on NA because it's just so boring and didn't have anything I wanted anyway), but for it to be put in another category because it triggers your PvE exclusive completionism? I'm sorry, I'm actually genuinely trying to not be rude or anything, but that's silly. Iirc one of previous holidays had an achievement related to catching all the holiday fish(I think), does it mean it should've gone under Fishing?

I actually didn't expect them to go through with a PvP holiday because of the amount of complaining it's gonna net, but I'm super excited they decided to go through with it after all. Cyrodiil needs new people and even if it may not work for you it will work for many others. Sure a lot will just leave and forget it like a scary dream, but even if just 1 out of 10 people stays it's already a success.

Edit: cell typing

Feanor · May 2017

Ah. The PvP community is "toxic". Reading the latest dungeon group finder tantrums instead. The contrast is rather entertaining.

rootimus · May 2017

Seri wrote: »

The only thing remotely difficult would be winning a BG match since you can't hide quite as easily, but depending on the game, it's quite possible someone else could carry in domination or relic matches.

Just get 11 guild mates, go three times and everyone gets the achievement.

drakhan2002_ESO · May 2017

Rainwhisper wrote: »

I realize that several members of the development team have described a vision for ESO where players move happily between PvE and PvP. I assume that making the "Midyear Mayhem" achievement a "Holiday Events" achievement instead of a "Player vs Player" achievement is likely another indicator of that goal.

I hope they will rethink that. Many of us PvE-only, carebear types enjoy collecting things like holiday achievements, and we tend to be completionists. If you're going to make a PvP achievement, please keep it under the PvP tree, instead of bleeding it into the PvE achievements.

Many of us play with a solid firewall between our gameplay and PvP. We know it exists, and some players really like it, but it never in any way intrudes on our Elder Scrolls experience. We like that firewall, and I sincerely hope that ZOS will maintain it.

(Inevitably these discussions include comments of, "Maybe ZOS wants you to try PvP so you'll see that you like it. Just give it a shot. Heal some people. Repair some keeps. It's not so bad." I appreciate the sentiment, but PvP is a completely different game from PvE, I don't like it, and yes, it is that bad.)

I totally agree with you, but I think we all know that ZOS doesn't care - they are going to blindly push forward with another completely un-thought-out implementation to the game. It's a shame that the developers don't listen to the community - they just throw crap up on the wall to see if it sticks.

I hate mixing PvP and PvE achievements - make it one or the other.

hmsdragonfly · May 2017

TheRealPotoroo wrote: »

Rozenwyn wrote: »

The achievements from all of the past holiday events have been incredibly easy to get. I highly doubt the PvP ones will be any different.

Grab a group of friends you usually do dungeons or trials with and just go in for a night/day of not caring and have some fun.

Ridiculous to want this in a different tab purely for selfish people who don't believe PvPers should have holiday events or their achievement bar to not be filled. Goodness there are many worse things to be complaining about.

Nobody is saying that PVPers shouldn't have events, holiday or otherwise, so stop saying they are. They can have as many events as they like, so long as they are held over there in PvP-Land.

And the event is going to be held in PvP-Land.

hmsdragonfly · May 2017

drakhan2002_ESO wrote: »

Rainwhisper wrote: »

I realize that several members of the development team have described a vision for ESO where players move happily between PvE and PvP. I assume that making the "Midyear Mayhem" achievement a "Holiday Events" achievement instead of a "Player vs Player" achievement is likely another indicator of that goal.

I hope they will rethink that. Many of us PvE-only, carebear types enjoy collecting things like holiday achievements, and we tend to be completionists. If you're going to make a PvP achievement, please keep it under the PvP tree, instead of bleeding it into the PvE achievements.

Many of us play with a solid firewall between our gameplay and PvP. We know it exists, and some players really like it, but it never in any way intrudes on our Elder Scrolls experience. We like that firewall, and I sincerely hope that ZOS will maintain it.

(Inevitably these discussions include comments of, "Maybe ZOS wants you to try PvP so you'll see that you like it. Just give it a shot. Heal some people. Repair some keeps. It's not so bad." I appreciate the sentiment, but PvP is a completely different game from PvE, I don't like it, and yes, it is that bad.)

I totally agree with you, but I think we all know that ZOS doesn't care - they are going to blindly push forward with another completely un-thought-out implementation to the game. It's a shame that the developers don't listen to the community - they just throw crap up on the wall to see if it sticks.

I hate mixing PvP and PvE achievements - make it one or the other.

The community has been asking for PvP events for a long time, you simply don't represent the community.

Mixing PvP and PvE achievements? These are 100% PvP achievments. If you don't enjoy PvP, don't take part in the event, no one forces you to do it.

DisgracefulMind · May 2017

So PvE is allowed to have multiple holiday events, but PvP is not? Come on, that's ridiculous. Every single argument that any of you come up with really hasn't justified you all wanting ZoS to exclude the PvP community from this sort of thing.

As someone who appreciates both aspects of the game to their entirety (I've done just about everything.), I can honestly come to the conclusion that any PvE player who takes issue with the PvP event being considered a holiday is extremely biased and unfair to the rest of the population. The last two holidays do you know what PvPers did? They happily jumped into PvE land and did the events almost entirely without complaint.

Do you not realize that PvPers have to PvE to great lengths to get gear and other things the need to PvP? Yet you rarely see such crying as is in this thread from that side. Sure, there are people who complain about it, but mostly it's in response to a PvE players complaining about having to do anything in PvP.

It's time everyone realizes that ZoS wants players to become mixed up in both areas of the game. If you don't want to be, then don't. You're just hurting yourself by not being able to get your achievements. You shouldn't demand ZoS ruin something for a large amount of players because it's going to "annoy you" being listed as a holiday in a tab.

Of all things to complain about, my god.

Aisle9 · May 2017

I play PvE

I play PvP

I'm an achievement hunter

I'm a completionist

I have a minor OCD

The Achievement should stay where it is

A survey I took in Cyrodiil support my claim, everyone agrees.

On a sidenote, I've been playing the game for a year now, I have never been teabagged once, not sure where this fear of teebaggers comes from...

narf911 · May 2017

Proof that people will complain about anything. Just make sure your desk is nice and tidy and everything is in its tape outlined place. FFS... I shall give you small points due to the 'unique' nature of your whine.

CTSCold · May 2017

Everyone needs things from both. Vigor, rapids, warhorn, caltrops from PVP and Nearly ALL gear from PVE. The Holiday tab is not a PVE tab. It's a general tab as can be seen by this set of achievements.

As for toxic environments both have idiots in them. Sure some PVPer may teabag you but at least you get to play. PVEer's require you to be running whatever they think is BIS and have the 2796 addons they think are required for gameplay or it's an instakick.

Also it's an achievement if you don't think there will be keep flipping happening for the 'capture a keep part' your crazy. And there will be many BG carry groups for it too I'm sure.

Seri · May 2017

rootimus wrote: »

Seri wrote: »

The only thing remotely difficult would be winning a BG match since you can't hide quite as easily, but depending on the game, it's quite possible someone else could carry in domination or relic matches.

Just get 11 guild mates, go three times and everyone gets the achievement.

Wouldn't that assume they happen to be queued against each-other though? Plausibly there could be other groups.

drakhan2002_ESO · May 2017

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

The community has been asking for PvP events for a long time, you simply don't represent the community.

Mixing PvP and PvE achievements? These are 100% PvP achievments. If you don't enjoy PvP, don't take part in the event, no one forces you to do it.

Exactly the same argument back at you; you don't represent the community. My opinion, just as you have yours.

Because I like you, let me offer some free advice - not everything is PvP - the forums are not, yet you feel the need to introduce PvP to them.

DisgracefulMind · May 2017

drakhan2002_ESO wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

The community has been asking for PvP events for a long time, you simply don't represent the community.

Mixing PvP and PvE achievements? These are 100% PvP achievments. If you don't enjoy PvP, don't take part in the event, no one forces you to do it.

Exactly the same argument back at you; you don't represent the community. My opinion, just as you have yours.

Neither select groups of PvE players or a select group of PvP players represent the whole community. However, we all collectively represent the community together. So everyone's opinion matters, but it just means one side or the other isn't going to get their way about it.