PTS Feedback Thread for Dragonknight Balance Improvements

Chadwikid · February 2017

@nml

No lol not at all although i see how it reads that way. I was speaking of Vycor. sorry for the misinterpretation

pieratsos · February 2017

MaxwellC wrote: »

@thankyourat
See I don't play heavy armor but I run 5 medium 2 heavy as a redguard I also run max health/stam regen food. I run out of resources sitting at just almost 1400 regen so I wish I could speak to some of the DKs you've faced who some how never run out of sustain. I'm consistently having sustain issues the only time I never had it PvP wise is when I used my old build which gave me just about 2000 stamina regen; With that amount of regen I wasn't having issues at all but I'd still run out of stamina if the fight progressed too long.

Maybe you're confusing the class with a stam sorc ? Dark deal a couple times and you're all set, not like they need to use max health/regen food anyway.

You are running around solo/small scale on medium with 1.4k regen and u wonder why u are running out of stamina? You are on medium. You need more regen. Heavy armor builds run with less than 1k regen cause they can rely on helping hands and heavy attacks to sustain. You are playing on medium armor. You dont have that luxury. Get more regen.

Drishtan · February 2017

They Should Change Elder Dragon to 5% for each Stat Regen.

Drishtan · February 2017

Combustion should be Changed to 166% instead of 66%.

Drishtan · February 2017

Searing Heart Should apply to Destro Ult!

Drishtan · February 2017

And plz Fix Chains! Use the same pathing you use for crit rush and ambush plz!!!! So *** tried of chains not working!!!!

MaxwellC · February 2017

@thankyourat
When you use medium you can dodge more break free more and have lower cost in stamina abilities/sneak more. I prefer medium due to those factors. I never understood the argument that a stam dk doesn't need more regen then a stamblade or stamplar that confuses me sure 5% of our max stam back for a nearly 4.6k mag skill is good but you literally get 2 maybe 3 uses before your pool is depleted. Battle Roar isn't up every 1 to 2 mins so that's pretty unreliable too.
I also feel the constitution passive is rather misrepresented here. The passive doesn't give you more resources than someone with a 1.3k stam recovery that isn't true. You may recover more magicka if you're a stamina variant and vice versa but that's about it.
Lastly 5000 stam does not equal 500 weapon damage, 1 weapon damage = 10.46 stamina so it would be 478 which is still strong but doesn't stop me from equaling that damage out or out sustaining HA builds. I've done like I stated before against a HA DK tremorscale meta player and after a few CCs it was pretty much over.

I've fought stam sorcs and ofc they can go offensive without the need of sustain but other stam DKs I'd fight would drop if they're wearing HA in open world PvP. Like I said before Open world PvP it'll take time but I'll steam roll any DK HA build whether it be mag or stam now another class like stam sorc or especially mag/stamplar that'll be a battle that'll take a long time.

MaxwellC · February 2017

@pieratsos
I run out of stamina quickly based on what scenario I end up with e.g. 1vX scenario, fleeing scenario, and the fight takes too long scenario (fight being long in itself isn't the issue but depending on how offensive the person is will depend on my resources). I Heavy attack a lot as I stated a few pages ago so my sustain is pretty fine depending on how short the battle is or what I'm doing.
Nevertheless anyone running HA I definitely out sustained so far aside from a stam sorc and sometimes a stamplar.

I wonder do you play Xbox NA because I'd love to duel you.

Stamden · February 2017

usmcjdking wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

PTS wrap up.

ZOS

The update to dragonblood was good, I'm very pleased with it. Even though our sustain issues didn't make it to this update we have made several steps forward. But unfortunately there is still one very large step backwards and that is the nerf to reflect. Revert that nerf and this update will be a success despite the things you couldn't get to this time. However if you leave the nerf in then this long anticipated update will be highly disputable as a success. The change to reflect crushes our viability against other magic classes in a way that dragonblood may not compensate for.

Make this update a win and revert the reflect nerf.

(I suggest everyone wrap up their feedback for what must happen before this goes live in a few days.)

Disagree.

A main spammable attack as weak as crushing shock should not be so easily negated.

You do realize that a bunch of other things go straight through wings too, right? Instead of "What skills can get through wings?" it has become the question of "What skills can't simply bypass my wings?"

It was bad before and rarely used in builds anymore. The last thing it needed was another nerf and this last change is the nail in the coffin for this skill. Either pulse needs to be reflectable again, or this skill needs a complete rework.

Obviously, there is no time for that with this update, so this skill is just going to have to remain useless for the entirety of Homestead. No big deal, as DK's we're very used to having useless skills.

thankyourat · February 2017

MaxwellC wrote: »

@thankyourat
When you use medium you can dodge more break free more and have lower cost in stamina abilities/sneak more. I prefer medium due to those factors. I never understood the argument that a stam dk doesn't need more regen then a stamblade or stamplar that confuses me sure 5% of our max stam back for a nearly 4.6k mag skill is good but you literally get 2 maybe 3 uses before your pool is depleted. Battle Roar isn't up every 1 to 2 mins so that's pretty unreliable too.
I also feel the constitution passive is rather misrepresented here. The passive doesn't give you more resources than someone with a 1.3k stam recovery that isn't true. You may recover more magicka if you're a stamina variant and vice versa but that's about it.
Lastly 5000 stam does not equal 500 weapon damage, 1 weapon damage = 10.46 stamina so it would be 478 which is still strong but doesn't stop me from equaling that damage out or out sustaining HA builds. I've done like I stated before against a HA DK tremorscale meta player and after a few CCs it was pretty much over.

I've fought stam sorcs and ofc they can go offensive without the need of sustain but other stam DKs I'd fight would drop if they're wearing HA in open world PvP. Like I said before Open world PvP it'll take time but I'll steam roll any DK HA build whether it be mag or stam now another class like stam sorc or especially mag/stamplar that'll be a battle that'll take a long time.

With heavy you don't need to dodge roll as much I think that's were the strength is. It's hard to put any real pressure on someone in heavy and if you can't pressure them you can't cause them to waste resources. It also allows you to use your magicka abilities more which helps you sustain your stamina. I think you have to look at the build strengths against other classes as well. Like for you a Templar is a tough fight, but for me I main a magblade so Templar is the easiest fight for me with dk being the most difficult class to fight. As for why a dk needs to run less regen than a stamblade or stamplar is because of helping hands and battle roar. Stamplars are screwd lol they don't a way at all to help resource management, and stamblades have siphoning attacks, but it's useless if you force them on the defensive stamblades have to stay offensive or they aren't going to be able to manage their resources. I think stam dk is probably the second best class right now, with the first being a class that's completely broken (stam sorc)

usmcjdking · February 2017

Neighbor wrote: »

usmcjdking wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

PTS wrap up.

ZOS

The update to dragonblood was good, I'm very pleased with it. Even though our sustain issues didn't make it to this update we have made several steps forward. But unfortunately there is still one very large step backwards and that is the nerf to reflect. Revert that nerf and this update will be a success despite the things you couldn't get to this time. However if you leave the nerf in then this long anticipated update will be highly disputable as a success. The change to reflect crushes our viability against other magic classes in a way that dragonblood may not compensate for.

Make this update a win and revert the reflect nerf.

(I suggest everyone wrap up their feedback for what must happen before this goes live in a few days.)

Disagree.

A main spammable attack as weak as crushing shock should not be so easily negated.

You do realize that a bunch of other things go straight through wings too, right? Instead of "What skills can get through wings?" it has become the question of "What skills can't simply bypass my wings?"

It was bad before and rarely used in builds anymore. The last thing it needed was another nerf and this last change is the nail in the coffin for this skill. Either pulse needs to be reflectable again, or this skill needs a complete rework.

Obviously, there is no time for that with this update, so this skill is just going to have to remain useless for the entirety of Homestead. No big deal, as DK's we're very used to having useless skills.

Wings still reflects:

-Poison Arrow
-Snipe
-Magnum Shot
-Rapid Fire
-Flying Blade
-Vampires Bane
-Dark Flare
-Javelin
-Crystal Frags
-Stone Fist
-Strife
-Cripple
-Grim Focus

And probably a lot more that I'm forgetting. All of these skills, all of them, are far more dangerous than Crushing Shock. If arguably the weakest skill in that bunch manages to outright break the viability of wings for you, then I suppose you are being far too dramatic.

Cronopoly · February 2017

Am I the only one thinking DK's abilities are being degraded to make way for Warden as savior in June...for the shortsighted. I'm calling it. Low magicka heal...smh

Sugaroverdose · February 2017

usmcjdking wrote: »

Neighbor wrote: »

usmcjdking wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

PTS wrap up.

ZOS

The update to dragonblood was good, I'm very pleased with it. Even though our sustain issues didn't make it to this update we have made several steps forward. But unfortunately there is still one very large step backwards and that is the nerf to reflect. Revert that nerf and this update will be a success despite the things you couldn't get to this time. However if you leave the nerf in then this long anticipated update will be highly disputable as a success. The change to reflect crushes our viability against other magic classes in a way that dragonblood may not compensate for.

Make this update a win and revert the reflect nerf.

(I suggest everyone wrap up their feedback for what must happen before this goes live in a few days.)

Disagree.

A main spammable attack as weak as crushing shock should not be so easily negated.

You do realize that a bunch of other things go straight through wings too, right? Instead of "What skills can get through wings?" it has become the question of "What skills can't simply bypass my wings?"

It was bad before and rarely used in builds anymore. The last thing it needed was another nerf and this last change is the nail in the coffin for this skill. Either pulse needs to be reflectable again, or this skill needs a complete rework.

Obviously, there is no time for that with this update, so this skill is just going to have to remain useless for the entirety of Homestead. No big deal, as DK's we're very used to having useless skills.

Wings still reflects:

-Poison Arrow
-Snipe
-Magnum Shot
-Rapid Fire
-Flying Blade
-Vampires Bane
-Dark Flare
-Javelin
-Crystal Frags
-Stone Fist
-Strife
-Cripple
-Grim Focus

And probably a lot more that I'm forgetting. All of these skills, all of them, are far more dangerous than Crushing Shock. If arguably the weakest skill in that bunch manages to outright break the viability of wings for you, then I suppose you are being far too dramatic.

Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

pieratsos · February 2017

MaxwellC wrote: »

@pieratsos
I run out of stamina quickly based on what scenario I end up with e.g. 1vX scenario, fleeing scenario, and the fight takes too long scenario (fight being long in itself isn't the issue but depending on how offensive the person is will depend on my resources). I Heavy attack a lot as I stated a few pages ago so my sustain is pretty fine depending on how short the battle is or what I'm doing.
Nevertheless anyone running HA I definitely out sustained so far aside from a stam sorc and sometimes a stamplar.

I wonder do you play Xbox NA because I'd love to duel you.

I dont play on xbox and what on earth do duels have to do with this. In duels even magicka DKs are good. You are not gonna proof anything to anyone in duels. Again you are in medium armor. If you have sustain issues it means you need more regen and obviously you do have sustain issues cause 1vX scenario and fleeing scenario is what you will usually encounter when u are playing solo. Medium armor builds need high regen to sustain. They do not rely on utility abilities to sustain their stamina. You cant take dmg like heavy armor builds, you need to dodge roll a lot and sprint. Heavy armor builds sustain in a completely different way. They want to get hit to get resources back and they can rely on heavy attacks to sustain cause they get more stamina back than you do and they can also rely on helping hands cause they have tons of magicka. For the last time. If you have sustain issues its because ur build could use some improvements not because ur class isnt good. You are playing a full dmg build with 2 dmg sets and u are complaining why u have sustain issues. Drop some wpn dmg glyphs , change ur mundus, change ur sets. You have plenty of options to get more regen. If you dont want to do that put on heavy armor.

ManDraKE · February 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

[Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

you can stil reflect the cristal frag, yu won't get killed by crushing shock spam by a magsorc.... Also fighthing a magsorc with a mDK is pretty simple, root him and move behind him.

Sugaroverdose · February 2017

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

[Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

you can stil reflect the cristal frag, yu won't get killed by crushing shock spam by a magsorc.... Also fighthing a magsorc with a mDK is pretty simple, root him and move behind him.

crushingshock 100%

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhjolI-6FGc

PandaIsAPotato · February 2017

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

[Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

you can still reflect the cristal frag, yu won't get killed by crushing shock spam by a magsorc.... Also fighthing a magsorc with a mDK is pretty simple, root him and move behind him.

Mines, and we can't do enough damage to shields reliably enough to kill one quickly, not to mention the second you root one they'll bolt escape 15m away. It's a losing battle, especially considering as a Sorcerer it's virtually impossible to run out of resources when played skillfully enough. Meanwhile we're over here injecting Tripots into our veins like addicts and spamming Ultimates just to entertain the thought of sustain.

pieratsos · February 2017

Xvorg wrote: »

Spell res passive is useful no matter how you look at it for both stamDK and mDK. Im not exactly sure if u know how that passive or resistances in general work. Major and minor resistance buffs have nothing to do with that passive. They stack. And it also doesnt matter if u are a mDK or stamDK. You need both physical and spell resistances. Physical resistance will mitigate the incoming dmg from stamina attacks and spell resistance will mitigate the incoming dmg from magicka attacks. You need both. That passive is extra mitigation for both stam DKs and mDK. Is it the best? Like i said no. But its certainly not useless. Its still 4-5% spell dmg mitigation or something close to that.

Tell, how can be useful an increase in spell resistance for an mDK that's 75% of the time using a shield to protect himself? Or a HA tank who can reach max spell res without that passive? Is it useful for a HA stam user? Maybe, but with sharpen being bis, that spell res increase increases penetration too.

The blocking passive helps u block more dmg. How is this not useful for DKs? Snb builds are the most common builds u see in cyro for both mDK and stamDK.

What if I don't want to play a S/B HA DK? See, that's what I mean wth "pigeonholed". It is not "popular" because it's trendy, it is the only way you have to play the game

Helping hands is a very good passive to sustain ur stamina for stamDK so yes im gonna say it again. Thats not my imagination. Thats a fact. Its happening in cyrodiil. Stam DKs are running around with 600-700 regen and sustain fine. They use igneous shield to get major mending and stamina back.

Tell me, how much do those abilities cost for a stam DK? They are EXPENSIVE because all of the cost MAGICKA and Stam DKs run with a very small MAGICKA POOL and the return of stam is 5% max stam. In a 40k stam build, the return is 2K stamina. So, If you use fossilize (the cheapest skill in the earthe heart line) you are trading 3.5K magicka for 2K stamina... and we are talking about stamDKs with magicka pools smaller than 12K. IN THEORY, what yo say is OK, but in the practice, the passive is, at its best, situational.

Mountains blessing gives ult and minor brutality. Minor brutality is 5% wpn dmg. How the hell isnt that a good passive for stam DK? Also the fact that u are comparing minor brutality with sorc dmg passive and that u are complaining why it doesnt help ur mDK shows that u dont play any other class other than DK therefore its difficult for you to understand class balance. There are 4 different minor buffs. Each class has one. DKs have minor brutality which is useless to mDK. Sorcs have minor prophecy which is useless to stam sorcs. Templars have minor sorcery which is useless to stamplars. Nightblades have minor savagery which is useless to magicka nightblades. Those buffs are applied also to ur group not just urself. Its a way to incentivize having all four classes in a group. Class balance.

For a stam DK is kind of useful, nevertheless that's not the point. As stated above, whats the incentive for stam DKs to slot earthen heart skills? They sound very good in THEORY but in the practice they are a waste of slots. Fossilize is your best shot.

Battle roar is good. I know that it was designed with dynamic ult regen in mind but its still a good passive. And i also said im not against buffing the DK ult regen. But u cant buff the crap out of ult regen just because that passive was designed around that. It has to be implemented smartly if its going to happen. StamDK are already good in PVP. Buffing ult regen for DK can have a huge impact on class balance. Seriously people are asking to buff helping hands, battle roar and ult regen. Like really? That just means infinite sustain which leads to huge dmg. DKs will be completely overpowered. Can we please think about the possible consequences before asking for buffs all over the place?

How much res do you get for using a cheap ulti like DBoS? It is not even meaningful. The more expensive the ulti, the bigger the restored pools. Again, It seems everything you say comes from theory and not practice.

No one is forcing you to use heavy armor. If you feel like ur pigeonhold into using heavy armor to utilize helping hands then u dont understand game mechanics and how light, medium and heavy armor works. Stam sorcs cant streak if they dont have magicka sustain. Stamblades cant cloak, fear etc if they dont have magicka sustain. Stamplars cant purge if they dont have magicka sustain. That doesnt mean they are all forced into heavy armor. Its how utility abilities works. You put on heavy armor, u have magicka sustain and u use ur utility abilities more frequently. If u are playing in medium armor you are not supposed to rely on utility abilities to sustain ur stamina. Thats why medium armor gives you cost reduction and regen. Does that mean medium armor is better than heavy? No. But thats an issue with the balance of light, medium and heavy armor. Not with the DK.

Sorry, but all that you said there is... how can I tell you? Wrong. As a sorc can't streak forever, a stamDK can't spam petrify forevere to get stam back. In fact a sorc has more than 3 chances to streak in a row. Besides that, NBs, Sorcs and Templars have skills that regenerate magicka in one way or another. DKs? Nah.

Is heavy armor useful for DKs? Yeah obviously. The class is designed to be more tanky. Its obvious from the passives and abilities. Block more dmg, more healing, more resistances, major mending, healing buffs. Dont wonder why ur passives do not give u the same dmg as the stam sorc or stamblade passives. Its two completely different classes. Thats like a stam sorc or stamblade complaining about not having major mending and defensive passives in general. Stop asking for a class overhaul just because you want more dmg. If you want more offensive passives and abilities u are playing the wrong class.

The class is also designed to use flame and poison dmg. HA doesn't help to fulfill that design. Nevertheless you are right at this point: " Its two completely different classes". So, if stamDK is a different class from stamblade, or stamsorc, why it does feel like a 2hander and not a stamDK. Because there's nothing the class give to the stam user, and under tha PoV, it is far from being unique.

You asked me in a different post if im playing a DK. Im playing all four classes and my main is a DK. I understand how each class is designed and their issues. The problem is that u dont play anything else other than a DK so its difficult for you to understand class balance. You seem to think that every class in the game has everything except the class you play. Your complaint about minor brutality being useless to ur mDK and the comparison u made with sorc dmg passives clearly shows that.

My apologies, but I don't believe you play a DK. Not even a NB. You don't even know the Executioner passive of NBs (otherwise you should know it is the way a NB keeps on cloaking after killing). You even consider helping hand is a good passive for stam return (lol) in a stamDK (without looking at the magicka polls stamDKs have). What I believe, based on what you write, is that you are a sorc and you are afraid of the changes to DK, but don't worry, they will have little to no impact when the patch comes. So you can spam your shield as always.
.
I play mostly DK, NB and now I'm starting Sorc. I've been playing the first 2 classes for almost 3 years. I'm one of the guys who is very pissed off for the nerfs done to mageblade and I've even suggested frost dmg in some skills. Also I was one of the guys who claimed against the change to velocious, but I grant you I know little to nothing about sorcs (except they're quite easy to play). So I believe I know better than you about the position where DKs are at this point...

Its a tanky class. It promotes you to have high resistances and block. You are asking for a class overhaul because u dont like that playstyle. You are asking for the game to be balanced around ur playstyle. If you dont like heavy armor and tanky classes just reroll a nightblade. If you dont want to block then dont block but stop asking for class overhaul. What if i want to tank and more block mitigation on nightblades? Does that mean i should start asking for block mitigation passives for nightblades? Seriously? Thats not how the class is designed.
The spell res is roughly 5% spell dmg mitigation. Its useful for everyone. Even if u use shields its still useful. You are not a magicka sorc. Your shields are gonna go down. And its also not useless just because u can reach the cap. Having that passive means its easier to reach the cap. Its not useless. Thats like saying every single resistance passive and ability is useless because u can reach the cap without them. And reaching the cap means u are in heavy. If you are in heavy u are not using shields to begin with with so how is it useless. Another proof that u have no idea about what u are talking about. Helping hands is a very good passive. Stam DKs that rely on it wear heavy armor so they have magicka sustain. If u are in medium armor u are not supposed to rely on that passive. You need high regen in medium armor. If you are in heavy however and u find that passive not good its because like i said you are bad DK. Good DK sustain fine. Im not the one saying this. Everyone says that. Open ur eyes next time u go in cyro. Btw do u even math? Streak is increasing in cost by 50% everytime u use it. 3 streaks in a row is more than 15k magicka. Thats literally all ur magicka pool if u are playing a stam sorc. Hell u probably dont even have that much magicka as a stamsorc. And NB are not relying on executioner to cloak. Lol. Half the time you wont even proc that passive and there are a lot of nightblades that are not even running with killers blade. Which means they proc that passive very rarely. And what if i want to cloak before killing someone. And on top of that, that passive gives u like 2k magicka over 6 seconds. Cloak costs 4k and lasts 3 seconds. So how on earth im i suppose to rely on a passive that i cant even proc reliably and when it wont even give me enough magicka to cloak even once. Battle roar isnt forcing u to use expensive ult genius. Thats why it scales of the ult u use. If you use an expensive ult is gonna give u more resources cause it takes more time to get it up. If you use dbos its not gonna give u much cause u will have it up faster. I said im not against increasing ult regen but you dont buff the classes just because it makes sense. If you buff ult regen, u are buffing sustain and dmg at the same time. And on top of that u are asking to buff sustain and dmg separately. Thats not class balance. Thats making DKs overpowered. Stam DK is a different class than stamblades and stamsorcs. They are designed in a different way. Stam DK is designed to be tanky, it has high healing, more dmg mitigation and blocking mitigation. Stamblades are bursty and their defences are to avoid dmg. They have no heals. Stam sorcs are mobile and they do high dmg. Like is this so hard to understand?

MaxwellC · February 2017

@pieratsos Stop being condescending seriously, like I said before those sustain issues are due to different scenarios if I get into a fight and get out that's a whole different thing. HA doesn't save you people need to stop thinking it does, sure you can take more damage but that doesn't mean you can out sustain someone who's built to do so. If I CC you and keep CCing you well guess what you're going to burn through stamina and yes people in HA due dodge roll please stop assuming that they do not. Open world Heavy armor doesn't work on a Stam DK since you're missing out on damage and your sustain is far worse in comparison to a medium armor stam dk or a sorc who can ignore it with dark deal.

I wanted to duel you because I wanted to see if I can gain a perspective since I'm trying to give some leeway but yet again you're attitude is what really needs to be checked. You act like you're some knowledgeable person on the DK class when reading through your posts with other players... well that says otherwise. I wouldn't duel you on my Mag DK in the first place if I was talking about my Stam DK so I'm not sure where you're getting that from.

A fleeing scenario doesn't always happen, I can 1vX pretty easily depending on who I'm facing. If I'm facing two incredibly offensive players then opening myself to use fossilize more often would aid me in that.

Heavy armor doesn't matter in PvP because most players can still do decent damage through it depending on their penetration, sure that means medium players will get hit harder but we can counter some of that by being more offensive as a push back and dodge/break free more often than a HA build can.

Heavy armor will not save you in PvP open world please stop assuming it does. I even presented a clip of me using medium armor and even after 5+ near maxed CP players gang up on me with radiant hitting me I was still able to get away. HA wise I wouldn't be able to keep running out dodge rolling which does save you in PvP. HA only works so well when you're in a duel or small scale PvP vs another small scaled PvP scenario. It doesn't work with you just riding around in cyrodiil by yourself, I play solo PvP all the time and have used heavy armor builds to troll people since I played a HA stam DK way way back then (Due to aesthetic reasons lol).

Last time. Regen isn't a issue on a medium armor based build and HA doesn't give you more resources than someone in medium armor. If you rock HA and kill off some of your offensive glyphs for stamina reduction I am more than certain that nearly equals what a person would wear in medium armor since it's around 15% reduction. Example: Rally is 3400 without any medium armor and 100 in warlord now subtract that by a maxed stam reduction glyph (203) = 3197. 5 Medium is 15% reduction in cost so you do 3400 * 15% which = 510 stamina reduced. HA wise if they're both using stam regen food instead of max stam then sure at 7 out of 7 HA pieces you would receive around 150 more stamina per second then someone not wearing 5 medium but the 5 medium reduction would out pace it by nearly 400 stamina a second.

Addition: in the post above you stated DKs are designed to be tanky because of more mitigation and high heals. Let's correct that! We have 5% mitigation on block, that doesn't equate to anything in PvP so please no. We're designed to 'Stand our ground' and have high heals; unfortunately the latter is dead and having high heals is ok but usually people have major defile ready to smack you back in place lol.

CyrusArya · February 2017

Its official. DKs have replaced Templars as the whiniest class with the neediest and most overdramatic player base.

ManDraKE · February 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

[Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

you can stil reflect the cristal frag, yu won't get killed by crushing shock spam by a magsorc.... Also fighthing a magsorc with a mDK is pretty simple, root him and move behind him.

crushingshock 100%
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhjolI-6FGc

1 year and a half old video of a dude taking down low-VR level guys from horses. I'm out of this

Sugaroverdose · February 2017

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

[Crushing Shock reflect was last thing which prevent magsorc to get easy kill while completely negating mele magdk

you can stil reflect the cristal frag, yu won't get killed by crushing shock spam by a magsorc.... Also fighthing a magsorc with a mDK is pretty simple, root him and move behind him.

crushingshock 100%
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhjolI-6FGc

1 year and a half old video of a dude taking down low-VR level guys from horses. I'm out of this

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

Armitas · February 2017

usmcjdking wrote: »

Wings still reflects:

-Poison Arrow
-Snipe
-Dark Flare
-Crystal Frags
-Stone Fist

And probably a lot more that I'm forgetting. All of these skills, all of them, are far more dangerous than Crushing Shock. If arguably the weakest skill in that bunch manages to outright break the viability of wings for you, then I suppose you are being far too dramatic.

I removed the minor ones and just keep the ones that make wings worth slotting and the ones I wanted to comment on. (I'm speaking of small engagements, not tanking a zerg)

Poison injection can be 100% animation cancelled and invisible to reactive wings. There is no reflecting it against an active opponent.
No one uses snipe in a 1v1 or in a rotation. It's used before a gank, and stealth shots do not reflect.
Dark Flare is worth slotting but it doesn't protect from the defile.
Crystal frags is worth slotting for but it's hit or miss on reflect. Most of the time it is cast point blank, or nested with CC.
Stone fist is too fast now for reactive wings, so is javelin. (the speed was increased by 20%)

You have specific instances where it's worth slotting, but specific instances are the sole privilege of Dueling, not open world. It is no longer worth the slot for open world (aside from the do nothing tank builds). Open world is where we have suffered over the past year.

ManDraKE · February 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

no is not lol

Armitas · February 2017

Cronopoly wrote: »

Am I the only one thinking DK's abilities are being degraded to make way for Warden as savior in June...for the shortsighted. I'm calling it. Low magicka heal...smh

It has crossed my mind as well. Especially when I consider our lack of a sustain update in this patch.

Sugaroverdose · February 2017

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

no is not lol

Deeply argumented point of view, thank you for participation.

ManDraKE · February 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

no is not lol

Deeply argumented point of view, thank you for participation.

what argument do you want? unless your are fighthing a underleveled-undergeared dude, you won't kill it with crushing shock. I can outheal crushing shock spam just with vigor ticks

Sugaroverdose · February 2017

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

no is not lol

Deeply argumented point of view, thank you for participation.

what argument do you want? unless your are fighthing a underleveled-undergeared dude, you won't kill it with crushing shock. I can outheal crushing shock spam just with vigor ticks

On magdk you have no vigor and zero sustain so you'll get out of magicka even with new cDB trying to get through mines and outheal crushing shock damage.

Vigor is overpowered at least by 2x anyway.

ManDraKE · February 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Did i said that this vid is about incredibly skilful 1vX in 1T? I believe that i didn't, fact is - crushing shock is powerfull enough to kill someone by it's own even without waving.

no is not lol

Deeply argumented point of view, thank you for participation.

what argument do you want? unless your are fighthing a underleveled-undergeared dude, you won't kill it with crushing shock. I can outheal crushing shock spam just with vigor ticks

On magdk you have no vigor and zero sustain so you'll get out of magicka even with new cDB trying to get through mines and outheal crushing shock damage.

Vigor is overpowered at least by 2x anyway.

you have a serious case of L2P if your problem is crushing shock and mines lol.
mDK bad sustain? i play a stamplar too, tell me about bad sustain LOL.

MaxwellC · February 2017

I think the problem with fighting a sorc isn't crushing shock but it's the shields. This upcoming patch Imma be a loser and rock shield breaker but for my mag dk it'll have to be something I have to try and overcome. Shields are very strong and in most cases too strong. I remember on my Stam DK literally having to use a stealth pot because the mag sorc would stack so far up that even after a CC I would need to break through 2 to 3 shields lol. My Mag DK simply can't fight that for sure especially if they have engine guardian as that's infinite sustain for the most part.

Addition: My stealth pot is my escape pot lol. I'll use it when timed correctly so travel abilities connect and no dot is placed on me.