New to Templar, have i set sail for fail?

falcuk · August 2014

Hi guys,

New to TESO, although been playing MMO's since EQ1 on release day, i picked up TESO pre-order and never got round to playing it.

So a week or so ago i picked it up, initially i rolled up an NB, got to 37, full medium, Bow primary, Dual Wield seconday and then realised i was not enjoying it as much as i thought i should be, so i decided a few days ago to try something different.

Once the patch landed i decided it was time to start something new, so i rolled an Imperial Templar, so far im 17 and i have chosen to go full heavy armour, Sword and Shield primary and 2H as my backup, i figure this should keep me going til 50 then i will need to re-assess my build if i want to do the VR content, dungeons etc and ultimately PVP.

Am i right in thinking that really there is no specific skills i will need for levelling? so far i took the Aedric Spear skill that hits the mobs and heals me, i cant remember its name, i also took the instant heal, and for my Ultimate i have the Dawns Wrath one that reduces damage and does damage to the mobs.

I have taken Puncture from the Sword and Shield, and also Shield Charge, i mainly use Shield Charge to get in close then use the Aedric Spear spell that damages mobs and heals me. This seems to work well, i have been putting points into my Racial and Heavy skills too.

For character points i have been putting them into Magicka but have also now started adding some to Stamina.

What i want to know is, are there any Templar Skills that are really a must have while levelling? Is there any Sword and Shield Skills that i should definitely take? What should i avoid?

I based my build on a kinda Paladin build with decent self sufficience, so far i have been impressed in my ability to kill stuff while remaining fairly safe.

End game i want to know what i should be looking at as my main role? im told DPS is not good for a templar, which is fine if i can find a niche as a tank or perhaps a healer? although i would prefer Tank if possible as it suits my playstyle more.

djyrb · August 2014

Here's an example of a tanking build for a Templar - I try to focus on one bar for tanking and another to use some of the great group utilities that the Templar offers.

Link

Bar 1:
Puncturing Sweep - AOE damage, light CC, light self heal
Ransack - taunt and extra armor
Invasion - gap closer and stun
Breath of Life - mostly for a burst heal for yourself, but can be used as an off heal to assist the main healer
Blazing Shield - now buffed as of update 3, great defense and damage to help keep aggro
Ultimate: Empowering Sweep - AOE attack that reduces enemy damage, also fairly cheap to use

Bar 2:
Restoring Focus - powerful spell resist and armor AOE, will aid your healer to keep your health up
Purifying Ritual - very large AOE for a heal over time, and removes debuffs from you and allies
Power of the Light - magnifies group DPS
Blazing Spear - stuns one enemy and does damage over time to all in its radius
Blinding Flashes - makes enemies miss
Ultimate: Solar Disturbance - locks down enemies and damage over time

There are other options that you can mix and match based on situations (more healing, more defense, etc). If you are enjoying playing a Templar now, I would recommend sticking it out to endgame; by then you should be very familiar with your abilities and make a great tank. Just be mindful of your magicka bar, as they are at a disadvantage when it comes to that area compared to other classes (aka dont spam the class abilities too much).

Gillysan · August 2014

Take a look at the skills for the armors and note that to use them all you only need 5 pieces of that armor. It's not a bad idea to go 5H and 2M or 2L pieces. Medium for some stamina and light for magicka. Eventually you have plenty of skill points to get a little experimental without resorting to a respec, even tossing in some Fighters Guild skills to make Coldharbour easier. As long as you don't go crazy crafting of course.

Fighters Guild passives I get all those. Active skills I like Expert Hunter and usually on a character only get this one, resisting getting any of the others but TBH you probably will have enough skill points to try a couple of others of this skill line.

The Undaunted, I'm not sure which one I like. No passives to worry about here.

Mages Guild, for a warrior type character, Entropy >> Degeneration maybe on the second bar as an alternative or additional self heal. I think on the Templar this doesn't matter that much. Haven't decided yet, might just do it for varieties sake for a little while.

--- Had to come back and say the way I play my Templar is not in line with the way everyone says to play them. I refuse to go stick&skirt, I don't care if I'm gimping myself at this time. I'm pure Sword & Shield including the offhand. My main is a DK 2h+2h, 5H+2M armor. Carries a staff but only when I run into a group dungeon where no one is a healer. I call that role ghetto healing.

I believe eventually the devs will get the balance better and this won't be considered a mages game as some have called it.

timidobserver · August 2014

In my experience most groups prefer DK tanks because that pull is extremely useful on certain pulls, but they'll take a Templar that knows what they are doing.

Dudis · August 2014

Templar is a lot of fun, at least in PvP.
Too bad everyone is just abusing blazing shield though...

Troponin · August 2014

I have been tanking on my Templar more and more after getting the skills I finally wanted to be able to do it. I am still playing around with skills, however, the play is similar.

I was very pleasantly surprised at my survivability and tanking capabilities. The ONLY reason why most people say DK is better tank is because of talons. HOwever, I would just like to point out, that it's not JUST the tank's job to CC. For trash, it's all about AoE and some CC, which most classes have.

Templars have very good spell resist with the right set up too, and that's a lot of the issue with most of the tanking in the end game. I am currently level 47, but by level 42 I was overcharged on spell resist and I am currently overcharged by 300. That's without adding active skills too, which can get you an additional 1,000 or more spell resist and armor before DR. If you know a boss will do lots of spell damage, you can also use reflective light on them to get an additional few hundred spell resist, again, before DR.

Anyway, i am having fun with it. I can add a ton of additional healing to the group as well. I like using Extended Ritual in place of health recovery and you get a lot of healing through that, and only have to cast it every 22 seconds for little magicka.

BTW, just to make sure. Rituals stack, right? SO if I have a templar healer, his will stack with mine?

NerfEverything · August 2014

Templars don't really get to do PvE endgame. It has been a major issue since craglorn was realased. Most trial groups will not accept Templars because they cannot DPS. And you don't even need a templar for healing since sorcs and NBs can heal just as well, if not better than templars, while also DPSing.

So if you are looking to do endgame PvE, you will have an impossible time as a Templar. Every other class is fine though. And PvP is another story, Templars are fun PvP. Not quite easymode like DKs, but still very fun.

As for leveling, 1-50 are so easy you don't need to use any specific skills. Vet 1-12 are also now very easy, you can do them with just about any build.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO · August 2014

Templars don't really get to do PvE endgame. It has been a major issue since craglorn was realased. Most trial groups will not accept Templars because they cannot DPS. And you don't even need a templar for healing since sorcs and NBs can heal just as well, if not better than templars, while also DPSing.

i dont agree. templars healers are for sure are sought after for endgame pve. unfortunately not as dps. have seen templar tanks do just fine too. I heal 300k+ just on magefight on AA and id like to see the setup of non templar pulling that.
they are also good for pvp in spite of lowest dps.

Gillysan · August 2014

CC? My first, and sort of main, is DK and I do have maxed out Talons. OK, here is how you CC with a Templar: Invasion, knock down, Pierce Armor...Invasion, knock down, Pierce Armor...Invasion, knock down, Pierce Armor...all the mobs are down and aggroed on you. You also can toss out a heal, Cleansing, whatever strategy you prefer.

Regarding DPS for trials I can't comment very much as I have never done them. I'm mostly interested in crafting and only get the levels up so I can use all the craft stations. This Templar is the last one to level up in this matter then I'll take a closer look at pvp and what else they have for VR. I really detest the VR questing they have now and think it's an awful way to throw supposed content at us. However, I digress...but I do wring the most fun I can out of my subscription.

Perhaps it's true that the trials are too centered on DPS at this time. Future trials there is a good chance they won't do things the same or they will give all classes the ability to put out about the same DPS. Also, it's like kill ratios in those FPS games. That stat simply doesn't tell the full story of a players contribution to a team. Eventually the community figures that out or I'll find people who see things my way. Either way, by the time I get to trials I'm sure the game will have changed. I'm not sweating it and will let others play test the game.

falcuk · August 2014

I'm 49 now and so far have been using invasion followed by ransack and then puncturing strikes, stuff dies and I move onto the next etc

I have 50 in Aedric spear now and also in Restoring light, however I have not bothered with the other line.

For weapons I have 50 in sword and board and I have started raising resto staff, I have the first two skills unlocked is there a must have resto staff skill to get?

I am full heavy armour at 50 too, I am not going to wear anything other than heavy as it doesn't feel right, feels bad enough using a staff tbh

I have 10 health 10 stam rest in magicka, should I just put it all in magicka?

I plan on mainly pve but will also dabble in pvp

AlexDougherty · August 2014

I play Dragonknight, Sorceror, and Templar, all of these classes are viable, and very easy to learn.

I personally have problems with my Nightblade, but others swear by them, so they are probably viable too.

There are very few ways to build an unviable character, provided you avoid putting everything/nearly-everything in stamina.

Guppet · August 2014

falcuk wrote: »

I'm 49 now and so far have been using invasion followed by ransack and then puncturing strikes, stuff dies and I move onto the next etc

I have 50 in Aedric spear now and also in Restoring light, however I have not bothered with the other line.

For weapons I have 50 in sword and board and I have started raising resto staff, I have the first two skills unlocked is there a must have resto staff skill to get?

I am full heavy armour at 50 too, I am not going to wear anything other than heavy as it doesn't feel right, feels bad enough using a staff tbh

I have 10 health 10 stam rest in magicka, should I just put it all in magicka?

I plan on mainly pve but will also dabble in pvp

You may want to try using light head and belt. You can't see them and it does help for magica. Also it suggest 5 seducers and 4 magus, if your using a shield. Add to that magica regen jewellery and you will be fine with 5 pieces heavy and a sword and shield.

You can look like a classic knight and gave decent magica regen.

Drjones501 · August 2014

Right now I am running 2 heavy 5 light and an armor glyph on 1 piece of jewelry. Both defense resists are soft cap, magicka regen is soft capped, and I have not come close to dying in pve vet content. My gear is 5 seducer, 3 or 4 magus, and 3 pieces of jewelry are all warlock. Run s&b / resto. In groups both pve and pvp I resto main. Traits are 5 impen. And 2 divines.

eliisra · August 2014

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO wrote: »

Templars don't really get to do PvE endgame. It has been a major issue since craglorn was realased. Most trial groups will not accept Templars because they cannot DPS. And you don't even need a templar for healing since sorcs and NBs can heal just as well, if not better than templars, while also DPSing.

i dont agree. templars healers are for sure are sought after for endgame pve. unfortunately not as dps. have seen templar tanks do just fine too. I heal 300k+ just on magefight on AA and id like to see the setup of non templar pulling that.
they are also good for pvp in spite of lowest dps.

Not sure I agree about NB/Sorc being better healers. NB can fluff heal passively while dps'ng. Sorcerer is the best Restoration Staff spammer with the highest auto attacks. But neither of these 2 classes can compare with a Templar when it comes to raw healing. They cant feed the tank stamina for blocking either. Making them pretty mediocre (compare to Templar) in a heal intensive fight with loads of spike dmg.

Issue with trials is the fact that you dont need that much healing or healers to begin with. Casual and shaky groups usually need 2 Templars for healing. Accomplished groups only use one single Templar.

Dragon Knights are the preferred tank. We cant join as dps. That leaves me with 1-2 trial spots I can "apply" for as a Templar and only if I heal.

NB use to be in a sad state back when Craglorn was new. Groups only used one NB in trials, for one synergy. The rage back than from the NB community, screams all the way from Rivenspire to Coldharbour...But ZOS quickly stepped in and gave NB the best caster dps in the game. Yet they choose to neglect us Templars, even though we where in the exact same situation. It's a shame really.

Khivas_Carrick · August 2014

I will never know why so many game companies hate with all their might possible on the "Holy" classes. Blizzard continuously *** on Paladins for years, literal years until Wrath, and then broke them back into the ground in Cata.

This game hates Templars, and for no discernible reason no less. What the hell guys, what did we ever do to you?

AlexDougherty · August 2014

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

This game hates Templars, and for no discernible reason no less. What the hell guys, what did we ever do to you?

Templars were the default choice for bots at launch, I don't think the devs have ever forgiven this.

Xexpo · August 2014

NerfEverything wrote: »

Templars don't really get to do PvE endgame. It has been a major issue since craglorn was realased. Most trial groups will not accept Templars because they cannot DPS. And you don't even need a templar for healing since sorcs and NBs can heal just as well, if not better than templars, while also DPSing.

So if you are looking to do endgame PvE, you will have an impossible time as a Templar. Every other class is fine though. And PvP is another story, Templars are fun PvP. Not quite easymode like DKs, but still very fun.

As for leveling, 1-50 are so easy you don't need to use any specific skills. Vet 1-12 are also now very easy, you can do them with just about any build.

NB heal better than Templars ?! haha
I would normally say you must run with terribad templars but , I know that's probably not true. So can you explain that statement a bit more if you get a chance?
Also, templars can dps enough for these Trials, it may not be up to elitist snob standards but it's enough.
I agree with everything else you said.

@OP Templars can be really fun if you spend the time to learn your skills and their utility, and find a place for them in your play style.

Khivas_Carrick · August 2014

Night Blades get better magicka returns when using resto staff and Sorcs have pretty much the same deal. A temp with a resto staff doesn't compare because NBs and Sorcs have better class passives than we do by a large margin. Plus Resto heals are actually really freaking good and can go a long way to doing stuff.

A main issue I will point out though, or at least an opinion on what I perceive is an issue, is that most bosses and raids are stupid short and meant to be hardcore DPS races, to which only the best elitist specs can win at. This is bad because this game has more than just one or two types of players in it (basically it isn't a mage only game yet it's being treated like one), and Templar's make excellent support DPS, the only problem is Healers using Resto Staffs heal and DPS at the same time, doing just as much damage as other weapon skills. That's terrible and should not be a thing, and is what's killing this game.

If you roll a Templar, don't feel bad if you seem to be underperforming, because ten to one you're playing amazingly well, it's the game that's putting you down.

Zsymon · August 2014

How does NB have the best caster dps? I'm not saying it doesn't, just asking how.

Thejollygreenone · August 2014

Zsymon wrote: »

How does NB have the best caster dps? I'm not saying it doesn't, just asking how.

Funnel Health+Crippling Grasp is respectable damage alone in a robe and stick build, but the kicker is the insane ult generation this build gets, as every damage tick of a siphoning ability ( the two I listed ) gives like 2 extra ultimate, as well as heals critting from funnel healths passive heal will also generate ultimate additional to this.

The reason the ultimate generation is so important because of the uptime on Veil of Blades one can achieve with it, as far as I knew caster nightblades can achieve 100% uptime frequently. Veil of blades in itself is a massive dps boost with its high damaging twice a second DoT.

That would be how, although how much truth there is to that claim, I wouldn't know. I picked the path of stamina long ago and gave up on trials not long after. ( Although if someone were to show me a bow or 2h pure stamina build that did 1k dps, I'd love to hear about it

)

EDIT: I'm sorry, only realizing now how offtopic this post is, I suppose I should add some templar insight. If you're looking to dps in trials as a templar, good luck. You picked the short stick on that one.

However if you're a pvp fan and dont care much about trials, you're in luck! Templars do great in pvp in a few different builds. There's my two cents, its not all crap for templars, imo.

(But of course I'm of the opinion that templars dps in trials could use help, it's unfair how far behind they are, but ideally it would be in a way that leaves their state in pvp little-disturbed.)

Nestor · August 2014

falcuk wrote: »

So a week or so ago i picked it up, initially i rolled up an NB, got to 37, full medium, Bow primary, Dual Wield seconday and then realised i was not enjoying it as much as i thought i should be, so i decided a few days ago to try something different.

Once the patch landed i decided it was time to start something new, so i rolled an Imperial Templar, so far im 17 and i have chosen to go full heavy armour, Sword and Shield primary and 2H as my backup,

Hope you kept your NB, they are actually fun to play since the last patch/update. If nothing else, turn them into a Crafter.

Anyway to answer your question about the Templar. I don't think you should have two similar attacks skills as Primary and Secondary, in this case up close Melee. Drop the 2H and use instead a Staff or a Bow so you have some way to attack from a distance. A Bow can do 600 to 800 damage on a first shot (Sneak Crit with Snipe) and can also stun enemies with a Heavy Attack from sneak. You can use this before you close in close and switch the to 1H/S. In fact, a stun shot with a bow, coupled with Shield Charge or Invasion as a second attack would be quite devastating, and a good way to shut down a Healer. At that point, you just have one or two mop up hits and then you can go after the main NPC.

The reason I suggest keeping the 1H/S is you can apply a glyph to a shield and get a nice boost in Health or Mana or Stamina from it. Plus 2H attacks are just to slow to maintain the DPS needed. Shield Bash is also quite devastating, either from Stamina or the skill Deadly Bash. It's almost like being Dual Wield.

Tamanous · August 2014

Nestor wrote: »

falcuk wrote: »

Plus 2H attacks are just to slow to maintain the DPS needed. Shield Bash is also quite devastating, either from Stamina or the skill Deadly Bash. It's almost like being Dual Wield.

Another poster has showed 2h doing decent dps. Most players simply do not do animation cancelling well enough and can often take twice as long to get off attacks. I constantly see players doing the full windup and swing through when using heavy attack. You only need to watch your back swing reach it's final point then immediately use a skill. The full heavy attack damage still goes off in far less time.

I see massive disinformation on these forums. One such example is the often touted "spamming puncturing strikes (and morphs)" is the highest dps a Templar can do. I have tested this many times and can easily obtain a higher sustained dps rotating through several skills with both bow and dual wield that is far more resource efficient.

Khivas_Carrick · August 2014

Shouldn't have to animation cancel to make use of a weapon, or have to be restricted to a single weapon or set of skills to function, in this case a Resto Staff, Bow, or Puncturing Sweeps.

*** needs to change and it needs to change today god damn it.