Bash 3 Second Cooldown on PTS

Cydone

jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »

TESO Elite PvP podcast with Dev Brian Wheeler Brian Wheeler mentions it in the podcast, I don't remember when and I really don't want to have to sit through the hour long video to try and find it, sorry.

Daily quests are terrible content design, they quickly become a chore, you have to do them or you miss out.

Agreed. Much preferred a repeatable that I could pick up at any time and just travel right back to the fight.

Or even better, no quest, and just giving the proper rewards for kills instead of the back-and-forth that the 20 kill quest had us doing. That quest completely ruined the moment of PvP, because if you didn't hand it in right away you were wasting kills. All of the alliance/experience points should be rewarded to the player while they're out in the field. The loot bags are also a let down, I've never gotten anything other than green, meanwhile pve can get up to purple as drops.

They could just fix it to where you can get the quest from any quarter master at any allied keep. Or do that with this adjustment:

The current kill 20 quest, for me at VR4, gives 4.3k xp, 1000 AP and like 302 gold, change it to a quest that continues up to 100 kills, but is repeatable.

Kill 20 Players: 4.3k Xp, 1000 AP, 302 gold
Kill 40 Players: 6.3k XP, 1500 AP, 402 gold
Kill 60 Players: 8.3k XP, 2000 AP, 502 gold
Kill 80 Players: 10.3k XP, 2500 AP, 602 gold
Kill 100 Players: 12.3k XP, 3000 AP, 702 gold

XP would be scaled to your level, of course.

Niffo

Cydone wrote: »

They could just fix it to where you can get the quest from any quarter master at any allied keep. Or do that with this adjustment:

The current kill 20 quest, for me at VR4, gives 4.3k xp, 1000 AP and like 302 gold, change it to a quest that continues up to 100 kills, but is repeatable.

Kill 20 Players: 4.3k Xp, 1000 AP, 302 gold
Kill 40 Players: 6.3k XP, 1500 AP, 402 gold
Kill 60 Players: 8.3k XP, 2000 AP, 502 gold
Kill 80 Players: 10.3k XP, 2500 AP, 602 gold
Kill 100 Players: 12.3k XP, 3000 AP, 702 gold

XP would be scaled to your level, of course.

Might even be better to have it scale the reward without capping it, each kill is worth a certain amount of xp/ap/gold, and you can hand it in whenever.

ElSlayer

KoooZ wrote: »

jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »

Giving an interrupt ability a cast time defeats the purpose of an interrupt ability.

It would be possible to interrupt an interrupt.

Cydone

jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

They could just fix it to where you can get the quest from any quarter master at any allied keep. Or do that with this adjustment:

The current kill 20 quest, for me at VR4, gives 4.3k xp, 1000 AP and like 302 gold, change it to a quest that continues up to 100 kills, but is repeatable.

Kill 20 Players: 4.3k Xp, 1000 AP, 302 gold
Kill 40 Players: 6.3k XP, 1500 AP, 402 gold
Kill 60 Players: 8.3k XP, 2000 AP, 502 gold
Kill 80 Players: 10.3k XP, 2500 AP, 602 gold
Kill 100 Players: 12.3k XP, 3000 AP, 702 gold

XP would be scaled to your level, of course.

Might even be better to have it scale the reward without capping it, each kill is worth a certain amount of xp/ap/gold, and you can hand it in whenever.

I like that.

e.gamemarkb14_ESO

well no idea where the poster got his info, but it was already confirmed on PTS that there is NO cooldown for our regular bash ability. Everyone has it, no CD on it at all.

There is also no CD on the 5th skill, the actual bash skill you can get. The regular shield bash skill is also an interrupt, you would then have to set every weapon type the same as you could swap weapons to "bash" or interrupt.

Nothing more to be concerned with here, already tested on PTS and all is good.

Zargorius

This is from PTS 1.1.1 patch notes:

Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Something has been changed apparently.

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

Will you leave the game because now it require more skill and less spam? Nice, bye guys.

For me is a good solutions, bash/interrupt is a "skill" that should be used at the right time, not a spam lamer skill.

And don't forget there are another "skills" in the game with cool downs right now, for example all synergies.

Jade_Knightblazerb14_ESO wrote: »

Yes give Bash a Cast time, not a Global Cooldown. Besides Cast timed spells/abilities feel more real in the game then the Instant pewpew ones.

WTF? Interrupter skill with cast time? Are you serious?

Dominulf

Good news. An interrupt should not be so devastating. It's a terrible crutch and obviously over the top in terms of damage and speed that can be used WHILE holding block. It should be taken down a few pegs. It's the best stam dump by far.

Sebyos

There is a real problem with Bash right now and most people I know that use it at least have the decency to recognize that it's broken. It used to be higher dps while having much higher survival now it may not be high dps, but it's still much much higher survival than your opponent.

Now, survival alone is great, blocking should help defense a lot, but the idea that you can spend an entire duel blocking 70-80% damage while attacking is just wrong. It creates a huge difference between the damage output of both duelers and a cooldown on it is the right way to go. Now people are gonna have to learn how to PvP instead of taping their right mouse button while spamming their left one.

Hessen

The fix is to stop you not having to wait the animation time to bash again. Now you can still spam it, but you need to wait for the full animation each time.

Kililin

Sebyos wrote: »

There is a real problem with Bash right now and most people I know that use it at least have the decency to recognize that it's broken. It used to be higher dps while having much higher survival now it may not be high dps, but it's still much much higher survival than your opponent.

Now, survival alone is great, blocking should help defense a lot, but the idea that you can spend an entire duel blocking 70-80% damage while attacking is just wrong. It creates a huge difference between the damage output of both duelers and a cooldown on it is the right way to go. Now people are gonna have to learn how to PvP instead of taping their right mouse button while spamming their left one.

Just a FYI, because i am unsure if you are aware, you can use every instant spell/ability while blocking. So bash needs to be balanced with those instant abilities.

The balance to blocking per se is slower movement.

driosketch

Zargorius wrote: »

This is from PTS 1.1.1 patch notes:

Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Something has been changed apparently.

@Zargorius‌ I stood there and bashed an enemy as fast as I could click my mouse until stamina was depleted. I'm a PTS tester. You tell me what actually changed and I'll take a look.

Zargorius

driosketch wrote: »

Zargorius wrote: »

This is from PTS 1.1.1 patch notes:

Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Something has been changed apparently.

@Zargorius‌ I stood there and bashed an enemy as fast as I could click my mouse until stamina was depleted. I'm a PTS tester. You tell me what actually changed and I'll take a look.

Well at this point only Zenimax knows.

driosketch

Hessen wrote: »

The fix is to stop you not having to wait the animation time to bash again. Now you can still spam it, but you need to wait for the full animation each time.

I wouldn't be surprised if this was actually the case. I can confirm every animation was dealing damage. This is a far cry from a 3 second cool down, and actually a pretty good fix. It slows nothing down when repeatedly interrupting one or multiple enemies, while preventing someone from turbo clicking a foe to death.

e.gamemarkb14_ESO

Zargorius wrote: »

This is from PTS 1.1.1 patch notes:

Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Something has been changed apparently.

Ok, here is the skinny of it, and I think ZOS should spend a little more time being specific on what exactly things mean instead of leaving it to the imagination of it's player base. They have a long ways to go in "communicating" effectively.

Bash / Interrupt encompasses ALL weapon types, such as:

All weapon types you have the ability to interrupt someone else by Right Click + Left Click, or you rebind the interrupt to another key (which many do so it's a single key stroke).

So if you think about this logically, the "interrupt" portion has been fixed. This will not stop anyone from spamming the bash / interrupt which you can do with every weapon, but it limits how often you can actually "interrupt" the other player's abilities / casts.

Example, With a staff, any 2H weapon, or bow, if you hold down your RMB, your character "blocks", and if you then LMB, it bashes / interrupts your opponent. Go ahead, log into the game and try it out. It is the simple basic ability everyone can use.

The same thing applies with 1H weapon + shield. This does not mean the fix is singling out "shields", they are simply encompassing all "bash / interrupts" so that you can't perma-interrupt another player, that's all!

Hope this brings a little light to the situation

arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO

driosketch wrote: »

Zargorius wrote: »

This is from PTS 1.1.1 patch notes:

Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Something has been changed apparently.

@Zargorius‌ I stood there and bashed an enemy as fast as I could click my mouse until stamina was depleted. I'm a PTS tester. You tell me what actually changed and I'll take a look.

OMG.... I was happy thinking that bash spammers will be banished.....

Maybe Zenimax want all players use 1h+shield or staff.

popatiberiuoneb18_ESO

Oblongship wrote: »

I understand nerfing it...make it cost more or reduce the damage....but a 3 second cooldown?

This goes against everything ZOS said while in dev that this is not supposed to be a time based cool down system.

If it goes through with a time based CD I am gone...I wouldn't care if they nerfed the damage to do 5 damage per bash...going back on your fundamentals and your word as a dev is enough for me to want to leave.

Lol, say no to cooldowns ..not on pts so cant say if this is true or not. Even if it was this wouldnt change the fact that PTS is a test server, they are suposed to put changes in there and get feedback from players. If this would make it to live then i'd be worried since this only sets a precedent for adding cds on many more abilities (or stamina perks, since some smartbottom might bring the argument that bash is not a skill)

Edit: I personaly preffer the CD system as long as it lets you use a higher arsenal of skills and ESO (5+1)x2 skill limitation seem more like a bad joke. If they ever add cds in this game to all/limited amount of skills, with the curent limitation to number of skills usable this is a sure one way trip to fail.

Xnemesis

Cant confirm that this is a timer but this is all the PTS patch notes mention about bash
Combat & Gameplay
General
Fixed an issue where bash/interrupt could be used more frequently than intended when it was repeatedly engaged.


Read more on TESO Elite: http://www.tesoelite.com/2014/05/pts-patch-notes-1-1-1/#ixzz318bRoI9s

Hessen

Hessen wrote: »

The fix is to stop you not having to wait the animation time to bash again. Now you can still spam it, but you need to wait for the full animation each time.

Seriously. Everyone. This is what they've fixed.

At the moment on live you can bash/interrupt again before the full animation has played. It's been fixed so it's similar to light attacks now.

driosketch

@Xnemesis‌ Well I am on the PTS, and once again I can confirm there is no 3 second cool down. Near as I can tell, the only thing this change could mean is they synced the damage done to the timing of the animation. So no turbo spamming bash damage.

Xnemesis

driosketch wrote: »

@Xnemesis‌ Well I am on the PTS, and once again I can confirm there is no 3 second cool down. Near as I can tell, the only thing this change could mean is they synced the damage done to the timing of the animation. So no turbo spamming bash damage.

That would make sense. Just eliminate the clipping first and slowly adjust the damage and cost until it feels balanced. A CD would kind of be ridiculous and I am glad we could but this panic of a nerf to bed.

MorHawk

This thread is hilarious. @driosketch, you're a bit of a hero. Just painful that after you replying to something like half a dozen people, there are still people commenting on the OP as though it were gospel. It should be illegal to not read properly before commenting.

driosketch

MorHawk wrote: »

This thread is hilarious. @driosketch, you're a bit of a hero. Just painful that after you replying to something like half a dozen people, there are still people commenting on the OP as though it were gospel. It should be illegal to not read properly before commenting.

Don't I know it.

Vartra

@driosketch

Thanks for the clarification and the tag, I probably would've missed it otherwise. Good to hear that once again people are talking out of their backsides to mislead others on the actual PTS changes. Well not good to hear, but good to know it's not the idiotic claims made by such people.

Kewljag_66_ESO

driosketch wrote: »

@Cydone OP is wrong. There is no such cooldown on PTS.

SirPuppingtonVonHat wrote: »

To help hammer the point home:

THERE IS NO COOLDOWN ON BASH

I just got off the the test server, and I could bash all I wanted. Anyone who says that there is a CD on bash is either misinformed at best or malicious at worst.

Everyone and myself thought the Op was talking about the Shield Bash from the 1hand / shield skill line but that's not the case. They are talking about the Rights + Left clik Interupting bash ability

Honfold

Can the mods shut this down already I mean the title alone on the forum front page is clear enough.

grabbintrionb14_ESO

Jade_Knightblazerb14_ESO wrote: »

Yes give Bash a Cast time, not a Global Cooldown. Besides Cast timed spells/abilities feel more real in the game then the Instant pewpew ones.

It's supposed to be able to interrupt casts. How can it perform this function if it has a cast time?

Oblongship

Honfold wrote: »

Can the mods shut this down already I mean the title alone on the forum front page is clear enough.

No they can't...it is a valid discussion. Feel free to participate or not...it is your choice please don't come make useless comments.

Cydone

popatiberiuoneb18_ESO wrote: »

Oblongship wrote: »

I understand nerfing it...make it cost more or reduce the damage....but a 3 second cooldown?

This goes against everything ZOS said while in dev that this is not supposed to be a time based cool down system.

If it goes through with a time based CD I am gone...I wouldn't care if they nerfed the damage to do 5 damage per bash...going back on your fundamentals and your word as a dev is enough for me to want to leave.

Lol, say no to cooldowns ..not on pts so cant say if this is true or not. Even if it was this wouldnt change the fact that PTS is a test server, they are suposed to put changes in there and get feedback from players. If this would make it to live then i'd be worried since this only sets a precedent for adding cds on many more abilities (or stamina perks, since some smartbottom might bring the argument that bash is not a skill)

Edit: I personaly preffer the CD system as long as it lets you use a higher arsenal of skills and ESO (5+1)x2 skill limitation seem more like a bad joke. If they ever add cds in this game to all/limited amount of skills, with the curent limitation to number of skills usable this is a sure one way trip to fail.

Cooldowns are probably the easiest way to balance out combat in this game. Each ability, depending on its power, would be instant cast but have a cooldown associated with it. Like Snipe for Bow.....right now has a 3 second cast time....which is an ETERNITY in PvP when ppl are almost always moving in and out of cover. It deals a damn good amount of damage though. Having it instant cast, just by itself, would be OP. BUT, you add in a cooldown of like 5-8 secs and it's completely balanced.

Niffo

Cydone wrote: »

Cooldowns are probably the easiest way to balance out combat in this game. Each ability, depending on its power, would be instant cast but have a cooldown associated with it. Like Snipe for Bow.....right now has a 3 second cast time....which is an ETERNITY in PvP when ppl are almost always moving in and out of cover. It deals a damn good amount of damage though. Having it instant cast, just by itself, would be OP. BUT, you add in a cooldown of like 5-8 secs and it's completely balanced.

Cooldowns go in the completely opposite direction of the games design, resource management is the cooldowns for this game. The bash problem is solved by reducing the base damage by 1/2 to 3/4.