Zenimax, balance and hotfix your game. (Batswarm OP video)

Esther

Yeah, Pryda is absolutely right. The Vampire Ulti is op and just annoying, combined with a tank is just ridiculous. Nearly every second guy in PvP is using it nowadays and jumping into a full group. Hopefully there'll come a fix soon.

joshisanonymous

Are you an Emperor in the video?

I ask, because I was under the impression that this was only possible for an Emperor. That seemed to be the whole crux of the issue. An argument can be made that it's okay if it requires being an Emperor because you're essentially an epic mob while you have that title. If it's possible just normally, then obviously it could use adjusting.

Pryda

Without the 5% emperor passive, you get 4 ultimate cost for batswarm - so you can do the exact same thing, using block to get 4 ultimate

Dudis

I maintain that while the ult itself is strong, i don't think it's really OP.

Stacking Ult Cost reduction is the problem.

rophez_ESO

If you've been affected by this cheese mode, then be sure to send /feedback and spread around videos of how people can take on entire zergs without losing health. I'd like a response that it is at least being looked into.

joshisanonymous

Pryda wrote: »

Without the 5% emperor passive, you get 4 ultimate cost for batswarm - so you can do the exact same thing, using block to get 4 ultimate

I would guess it's being adjusted then, and I'd kinda prefer that it's not a hotfix. Hotfixes shouldn't be done for game balancing. There are too many side effects any single change can have. i.e. They hotfix bat swarm but it causes some other combination of skills to be equally effective. Now they have to hotfix that combination real quick, potentially leading to another similar problem. Etc.

I do agree that it's over-the-top to have any single non-Emperor that can stand in the middle of 20 active players, even bad players, without any fear of dying. I actually don't care if one player can kill 20 bad players, but it should require a hell of a lot of strategy and quick thinking, not just the right combination of passives.

RaZaddha

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

So you harassed a group that doesn't know how to Magee light... ok

Magelight doesn't work against mist form.

ZOS, fix this damn Twilight Wonderland Online, it's not our job to theorycraft this, it's ZOS's job to fix those things before they get out of control.

YuccaPalm

For me the 60% cost reduction doesn't work for ulti + all the passives are bugged. In my case vamp isnt op xD

largusmeansb16_ESO

Working as intended?? LOL No player should ever be able to do this in PVP, EVER!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyZsIDSSGV4

Feloirusb14_ESO

While I agree no one should be able to solo an entire raid, straight up nerfing vampirism's ult is not going to solve anything. Most people that do that are DK vamps with a destro staff. Any one of these alone is not OP, it's just this combination. As i'm a vamp I will only comment on what I think should happen to them.

Stages are currently implemented in a non flexible way. A flat reduction on everything is not the way to go, instead each move should get individual buffs depending on stage. Example: Instead of mist form costing nearly nothing at stage four lets say the duration was increased. Or for drain essence, lets say at stage 2-3 it heals more and at stage 4 you dont have to channel it. Keep in mind these are simply examples of what they could do which each move. I haven't thought of the bonuses for each yet. This would make it easier to balance future vampire moves they intend to implement as well.

It irks me that people are bitching only about the vampire part of the problem and nothing else. Like ult reduction gear, sorc ult reduction passive, impulse spam while still being able to block, dk rooting you in the ult. What do you nerf? All of it? No, you have to rework your system or people who don't go for the OP combos will be hurt for no reason.

Catches_the_Sun

orlandosrtub17_ESO wrote: »

Soban wrote: »

orlandosrtub17_ESO wrote: »

I'm just tired of everyone crying for Nerfs.... People let start asking for buffs not nerfs!!!!

So instead of nerfing 100% uptime stacking bat swarm and sub 80 magicka cost 75% damage reduction and near untargetability you would buff what instead?

What has not been said is how this 100% uptime is acquired. It requires you to be a Sorc and have the 15% ultimate cost reduction passive, Vapirism Stage 4 (60% vampire abilities cost reduction), and PvP Gear that reduces Ultimate Cost reduction by 20% = 95% Ultimate cost reduction. Every other class can only stack 80% Ultimate cost reduction.

So all of this is in the game and you say all of this is not working as intended??? Are you going to nerf the Sorc Passive? Are you gonna Nerf the PvP Set? Are you gonna nerf the Vampirism?

What needs to be buffed is the Fighter's Guild abilities so the balance is made between Hunted and Hunters. The biggest problem is that Fighter's Guild Abilities do not stack up to the opposite World Lines.

The problem with this approach is that it makes Vampire & Vampire Hunter the only viable PvP options. Personally, it bothers me that a game that otherwise has so much build diversity is being reduced to these 2 options at PvP endgame. Vampirism & Werewolf are supposed to be high risk/high reward playstyles. Right now, Vampire is high reward w/little to no risk, while Werewolf is high risk w/minimal reward.

Also, just because you CAN stack passives for virtually no Ultimate cost in the game doesn't mean that it was intentionally developed & balanced for you to do so. Oversights such as this happen in every MMO, especially right at launch. Otherwise you would never see balancing patches. I can't tell you what will change but I'd bet my mother's egg tooth that they'll make at least one change to address the Twilight Online issue.

Xsorus

Actually, Just cap Cost Reduction for Ultimates at whatever Stage 4 Vampire is currently (60% i think)

The rest of the problem with Vampires being overpowered can actually be easily fixed by just improving the Fighters Guild abilities.

TedLevine

I just want to say, on our server we were having a hard time against this very issue. My guild and I were running into VR10 vamps slaughtering us on a regular basis. So we found a solution, it's in the game, and it totally negates all vampire abilities. Seriously people, try understanding the mechanics first before calling for a nerf.

Now that we understand how to beat them, well lets just say these same guys that were tearing us up, now they avoid us and prey on others who don't understand how to totally wreck their whole build with one skill. Actually if anything is OP its the skill that totally negates all vampire abilities, and makes a whole skill line totally useless, and leaves the said vampire dead to fire based attacks in 2 seconds flat.

Why am I not telling you what that skill is? Well if you don't want to take the time to learn the mechanics, then you deserve to get rolled by vampires.

Xsorus

Sorcs Negate Magic Ultimate or whatever its called absolutely destroys Vampires

Utherix

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Sorcs Negate Magic Ultimate or whatever its called absolutely destroys Vampires

Yeah, right until they move out of it.

Asava

^^ Exactly! Then they pop mist form then rinse and repeat talons, bash, bat *** over and over.

TedLevine

Utherix wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Sorcs Negate Magic Ultimate or whatever its called absolutely destroys Vampires

Yeah, right until they move out of it.

Then your doing it wrong yet again, and not learning how to play the game. The VR10 vamps that we run into don't make it out of the Null Field , ever. Vamps are not a problem, misinformed, lazy gamers that don't want to learn how to play the game with tactics, a group of friends, and some work are the problem. Quit crying for nerfs, when you don' t even understand the mechanics.

Pryda

TedLevine wrote: »

I just want to say, on our server we were having a hard time against this very issue. My guild and I were running into VR10 vamps slaughtering us on a regular basis. So we found a solution, it's in the game, and it totally negates all vampire abilities. Seriously people, try understanding the mechanics first before calling for a nerf.

Now that we understand how to beat them, well lets just say these same guys that were tearing us up, now they avoid us and prey on others who don't understand how to totally wreck their whole build with one skill. Actually if anything is OP its the skill that totally negates all vampire abilities, and makes a whole skill line totally useless, and leaves the said vampire dead to fire based attacks in 2 seconds flat.

Why am I not telling you what that skill is? Well if you don't want to take the time to learn the mechanics, then you deserve to get rolled by vampires.

If you're DC or AD, please, please come to Auriel's Bow if you're in EU with your guild so you can taste how balanced it is.

AshTal

I agree with the original Post Bug or not Bat swarm and Mist form is just insanely over powered. If it's working as designed the Dev#s really screwed up PvP.

If they don't nerf the *** out of bat swarm I hope the create a few campaigns which don't allow vampires and then I will go play on one of them.

pecheckler

Has zenimax even acknowledged the bat swarm ultimate cost abuse yet? Do they even participate in their own game's PvP??!

RaZaddha

pecheckler wrote: »

Has zenimax even acknowledged the bat swarm ultimate cost abuse yet? Do they even participate in their own game's PvP??!

They do play, they are the ones screeching like teenage girls every time a vampire uses bat swarm, they even have banners with real-life sized Edward and Isabella kissing on their offices.

Dagoratho

FIX your game alredy Zenimax, just look the video, thats a JOKE, what kind of serius game have that kind of mechanism, if you cant fix it / re-balance it / re-make , the ulti right away, *** disable it for a few days/weeks, its just a FUN-KILLER for a lot of people... and the 30 days are ending.... its just... you cant enojoy pvp with that kind of crap being abused.

Kypho

since they can spam it, and not just emperor spamming it, lets just cut its damage/healing to 3rd. not even a healer is able to heal up ppl against 1 lolvamp spamming batswarm.

Kypho

TedLevine wrote: »

I just want to say, on our server we were having a hard time against this very issue. My guild and I were running into VR10 vamps slaughtering us on a regular basis. So we found a solution, it's in the game, and it totally negates all vampire abilities. Seriously people, try understanding the mechanics first before calling for a nerf.

Now that we understand how to beat them, well lets just say these same guys that were tearing us up, now they avoid us and prey on others who don't understand how to totally wreck their whole build with one skill. Actually if anything is OP its the skill that totally negates all vampire abilities, and makes a whole skill line totally useless, and leaves the said vampire dead to fire based attacks in 2 seconds flat.

Why am I not telling you what that skill is? Well if you don't want to take the time to learn the mechanics, then you deserve to get rolled by vampires.

Lol. DEFEEEEEEND THE VAMPIRES!!!! even with talking bs.
If you mean Negate Magic, then you can shut up. I cant have that. And since i cant have that, i should team up against 1 vamp. and since i need to team up against one vamp, its not ballanced.

Tandara

What shall this video show exactly? A Bunch of guys who seems like not to know how to counter it. A single dk with invasaion and talons would killed the Vamp in like 5 seconds? And don't come with the retreating maneuver exploit it only works(sometimes) atm because of the bad ping.

sdande

Tandara wrote: »

What shall this video show exactly? A Bunch of guys who seems like not to know how to counter it. A single dk with invasaion and talons would killed the Vamp in like 5 seconds? And don't come with the retreating maneuver exploit it only works(sometimes) atm because of the bad ping.

he can simply block that. as you can see the dk gain life/stamina/magica each ulti activation.

Zenimax please at least comment on this. You did not say anything about this real big problem. You write 20 posts on Bots and what ever but not a single word yet on those broken mechanics...

Libertine

orlandosrtub17_ESO wrote: »

Last thing I will say is that nerfs will not fix this game. Once vampires are nerfed it will be something else, after that something else and so on. People will always find something to complain about.

At the end there will be no use for classes and everyone will be whacking each other with nerf swords, at that point, I guess we will look for another game to play and complain about.

we get it, youre a vampire and dont want to get nerfed into the ground, now bugger off

Nimrael

This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen in any MMO PvP.

Actually, in any PvP anywhere ever. And I'm like... Serious.

Amazing that it went through beta, even more amazing it's apparently not even being looked at.

I feel cheated. Dude has a god mode combo due to shoddy game design and/or bug, and just runs face first into 20-30 people and kills them by spamming 2 buttons, without taking damage.

Complete joke.

Tandara

You must always consider that he is a sorc AND emp even without emp and only considering the class skills he would pay 4 ulti per batswarm. No other class can do this as effective before reaching emp. ;> 34 is the cap for all others.

And it's always a bit cheap to posting nerf vids after reaching a certain goal while using that exact "feature" to actually get to this rank. ;>

sdande

there is no differrence to the ability to spam the ulti. It simply does not matter if it is 40 or 4 or even 0 ulti costs. The ulti regenerates it self if you like it that way. No way this is working as intended.