Why aren’t Golden Pursuits tasks related to scribing retroactive?

AlnilamE · July 13

Honestly, having done one of them yesterday, I now see this as a rope thrown at the people who are just starting scribing because they will not be able to finish the Pursuits without going through that quest chain.

The people who already had scribing unlocked are the ones better off.

Heren · July 13

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Certainly more challenging than simply logging in clicking a claim button. It's inherently obvious that they meant challenge in the sense that you have to do something, and not just get rewarded for doing nothing.

Technicaly correct, true, but you're splitting hairs a bit here.

AlnilamE wrote: »

Honestly, having done one of them yesterday, I now see this as a rope thrown at the people who are just starting scribing because they will not be able to finish the Pursuits without going through that quest chain.

That's one way too see this, but you could also consider that the GP add some value for players unlocking scribing. Mix of both most likely.

Ingenon · July 13

I hope that ZOS continues to give us more options to complete a Golden Pursuit than the number we need to unlock the final reward. I never want them to give retroactive credit, so that a player can login and claim all the Golden Pursuit rewards immediately. The Golden Pursuit for scribing seems OK to me. I unlocked scribing when Gold Road released, so I cannot get credit for all the options, but there are enough other options that I can still earn the final reward. Works for me.

Koshka · July 13

It's not a big problem in my opinion, there's enough simple tasks to get the rewards. Like, yeah, "defeat 300 enemies" might seem like a lot, but we have a month to do that. I've already completed 10-12 tasks without even trying.

Sailor_Palutena · July 13

darkriketz wrote: »

NeuroticPixels wrote: »

aleksandr_ESO wrote: »

If the tasks are retroactive, they will be completed immediately by most players.

What’s wrong with that?

It's supposed to be a challenge. A challenge must be challenging.
If you complete the Golden Pursuit right after they begin ingame because you already did the Scribing questline with your whatever-number-of-toons, then what's the point in creating a challenge in the first place ? ZoS would save some time by just granting rewards to anyone has completed the Scribing questline (spoiler alert : this questline already grants its own rewards) and promise it to players who still need/want to do it at their pace.

Let's stop creating challenging and engaging events, after all everything we need is ZoS filling a checklist of ingame accomplishments and randomly rewarding players for no reason >_>

Maybe pick another set of activities instead of one most people most likely already done? And if they DONE it, the challenge was done. Plus the quests were major booooooring, I can't fathom the idea of repeating them.

Katahdin · July 13

IMO this feels like this is an attempt to encourage more people do scribing.
I am seeing lots of people running the quests so the strategy worked I guess, however I acknowledge they could be people doing it on alts

darkriketz · July 13

Sailor_Palutena wrote: »

darkriketz wrote: »

NeuroticPixels wrote: »

aleksandr_ESO wrote: »

If the tasks are retroactive, they will be completed immediately by most players.

What’s wrong with that?

It's supposed to be a challenge. A challenge must be challenging.
If you complete the Golden Pursuit right after they begin ingame because you already did the Scribing questline with your whatever-number-of-toons, then what's the point in creating a challenge in the first place ? ZoS would save some time by just granting rewards to anyone has completed the Scribing questline (spoiler alert : this questline already grants its own rewards) and promise it to players who still need/want to do it at their pace.

Let's stop creating challenging and engaging events, after all everything we need is ZoS filling a checklist of ingame accomplishments and randomly rewarding players for no reason >_>

Maybe pick another set of activities instead of one most people most likely already done? And if they DONE it, the challenge was done. Plus the quests were major booooooring, I can't fathom the idea of repeating them.

"Most people most likely already done."
That's two uncertainties in one sentence, and since Scribing was behind a paywall, I'm really not sure it was that common before the Golden Pursuits. And since the event is called "Scribing for all", of course it's scribing-based. If you want rewards related to what you've already done in the game, press J and go to the fourth tablet on your screen.

I agree on the fact that the quests are long, and some game mechanics are repetitive (location > wards > keys > tasks > lair > master task > repeat 4 times), but they're not boring. There is good lore and interesting characters. I love the relationship between the fox and the gryphon.

SilverBride · July 13

Katahdin wrote: »

IMO this feels like this is an attempt to encourage more people do scribing.

I don't believe it's a coincidence that this Golden Pursuit started the same day that Scribing became part of the base game. This gives an added incentive for those that never had access before to give it a try now.

kargen27 · July 13

lostineternity wrote: »

darkriketz wrote: »

NeuroticPixels wrote: »

aleksandr_ESO wrote: »

If the tasks are retroactive, they will be completed immediately by most players.

What’s wrong with that?

It's supposed to be a challenge. A challenge must be challenging.

Do we play the same game? Challenge in golden pursuit/endeavors? Boring chore - yes, challenge - no

Challenges come at all levels of difficulty. Almost like a dare. I dare you to taste this hotdog or challenge you to taste this hotdog is the same thing. Easy challenge. A more difficult challenge would be eat five hotdogs. More challenging still eat more hotdogs than I do.
A challenging puzzle would be considered a difficult puzzle. Someone challenging you to do a puzzle really doesn't say anything about the difficulty, only that they want you to do it.

SeaGtGruff · July 13

Personally, I don't think activities should ever "backfill" if they're listed as one of the endeavors or pursuits. "Cut 8 logs of wood." Wait, I did that last week, why didn't it backfill for today's endeavor? "Scribe 1 new skill." Wait, I did that last year, why didn't it backfill for this month's pursuit? Sorry, but no. Just... no. No, no, no.

One-time (non-repeatable) activities like "Claim the Scribing feature" may seem like another matter, but I still don't think they should ever backfill as long as there are plenty of other repeatable activities such that everyone can still easily earn the apex reward even if they're unable to complete the one-time activities.

In my opinion, the only time something should ever backfill for something is when there's a community event where the whole community is supposed to work together to achieve some goals. And only non-repeatable activities such as earning a given zone's pathfinder achievement should ever be backfilled; repeatable activities such as killing dragons, sealing volcanic vents, or shutting down dark anchors should never backfill.

Imperial_Archmage · July 14

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

Did you not read even the title? I specifically said the tasks directly connected to Scribing which CANNOT be completed at all by players who had already done them before the system went free. There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

mdjessup4906 · July 14

Its 5 tasks. You can still complete the pursuit without using any new characters or learning any new scribing things. Theres enough stuff here for everyone which is how it should be.

Imperial_Archmage · July 14

Koshka wrote: »

It's not a big problem in my opinion, there's enough simple tasks to get the rewards. Like, yeah, "defeat 300 enemies" might seem like a lot, but we have a month to do that. I've already completed 10-12 tasks without even trying.

It may not be a big deal to you but that doesn’t change the fact that this is quite literally a punishment for players who paid to unlock Scribing. They have to go through the slog of killing 300 enemies while the players who are getting the system for free now can get credit for a task literally just be clicking a button. Like I said, it’s a slap in the face of paying customers. That kind of callous disregard towards paying players just encourages them to cancel their subscriptions and wait for content to become free. Hell, the devs are even going to reward you for being a freeloader with even more freebies like these tasks. What kind of a way to run a business is this!?

DenverRalphy · July 14

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

Sure there is. They're there for players new to scribing to complete. It gives new players the ability to participate right out of the gate.

SeaGtGruff · July 14

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

Did you not read even the title? I specifically said the tasks directly connected to Scribing which CANNOT be completed at all by players who had already done them before the system went free. There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

Players who had already completed the Scribing quests could begin working on the Golden Pursuits such as "Kill X enemies using scribed skills" the moment that the campaign went live. Not only that, but they can earn the capstone reward and all of the special rewards (meaning the ones you get by completing specific pursuits, such as getting 50k gold for scribing 1 skill) without needing to do any of the pursuits which are clearly aimed at players who are just getting into Scribing. I've already completed 17 pursuits and earned the capstone reward and all special rewards, and an 18th pursuit will essentially complete itself as I log in each day and claim my free login rewards-- and I have not done the "Claim Scribing from the Crown Store" pursuit (because I'm unable to) or any of the "Complete such-and-such Scribing quest" pursuits (because I'm not interested in doing them again on an alt). In contrast, the players who are brand new to Scribing can't even scribe 1 skill, let alone kill any enemies using scribed skills, until they've acquired the Scribing feature and completed all of the Scribing quests.

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

Sure there is. They're there for players new to scribing to complete. It gives new players the ability to participate right out of the gate.

Exactly.

Desiato · July 14

IMO, the Golden Pursuit was intentionally designed so the Altar would be easily available to those new to Scribing as added motivation to complete the quest.

I think they don't want everyone to get it because a reward like that it has downstream effects for players who sell them -- Crafting enthusiasts. Or at least people who grind writs and sell items purchased with writ vouchers.

Vonnegut2506 · July 14

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

Koshka wrote: »

It's not a big problem in my opinion, there's enough simple tasks to get the rewards. Like, yeah, "defeat 300 enemies" might seem like a lot, but we have a month to do that. I've already completed 10-12 tasks without even trying.

It may not be a big deal to you but that doesn’t change the fact that this is quite literally a punishment for players who paid to unlock Scribing. They have to go through the slog of killing 300 enemies while the players who are getting the system for free now can get credit for a task literally just be clicking a button. Like I said, it’s a slap in the face of paying customers. That kind of callous disregard towards paying players just encourages them to cancel their subscriptions and wait for content to become free. Hell, the devs are even going to reward you for being a freeloader with even more freebies like these tasks. What kind of a way to run a business is this!?

*slap in the face -- The sheer angst over a Golden Pursuit is hilarious, and I already had scribing and all of the quests done but oddly enough, didn't end up with a bruised face and got the pursuit done in 5 days.

Imperial_Archmage · July 14

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

Did you not read even the title? I specifically said the tasks directly connected to Scribing which CANNOT be completed at all by players who had already done them before the system went free. There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

Players who had already completed the Scribing quests could begin working on the Golden Pursuits such as "Kill X enemies using scribed skills" the moment that the campaign went live. Not only that, but they can earn the capstone reward and all of the special rewards (meaning the ones you get by completing specific pursuits, such as getting 50k gold for scribing 1 skill) without needing to do any of the pursuits which are clearly aimed at players who are just getting into Scribing. I've already completed 17 pursuits and earned the capstone reward and all special rewards, and an 18th pursuit will essentially complete itself as I log in each day and claim my free login rewards-- and I have not done the "Claim Scribing from the Crown Store" pursuit (because I'm unable to) or any of the "Complete such-and-such Scribing quest" pursuits (because I'm not interested in doing them again on an alt). In contrast, the players who are brand new to Scribing can't even scribe 1 skill, let alone kill any enemies using scribed skills, until they've acquired the Scribing feature and completed all of the Scribing quests.

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Why would Golden Pursuits be retroactive? If every objective was automatically completed because the player did the activity sometime in the past 11 years, then every Golden Pursuit would be finished the second it started.

The Golden Pursuits are to complete these objectives now to earn a new set of rewards for doing them now.

There is absolutely no excuse for a task that literally cannot be completed to exist, period. This isn’t open to interpretation or subjective in any way. It’s objectively a terrible decision.

Sure there is. They're there for players new to scribing to complete. It gives new players the ability to participate right out of the gate.

Exactly.

All you need to do to unlock Scribing is complete the initial quest which takes all of 5 minutes. Players who had already unlocked it have no advantage whatsoever. You’re bending over backwards trying to defend a decision that was at best ill considered by the devs. [snip]

[edited for baiting]

SilverBride · July 14

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

All you need to do to unlock Scribing is complete the initial quest which takes all of 5 minutes.

Did they change this? Because it used to be that one character had to complete the full quest chain first. Then after that alts could choose to just do the initial quest if they didn't want to do the whole thing again.

Desiato · July 14

No one is bending over backwards. It's called putting it into perspective. It's not a big deal. If the OP thinks this is being treated terribly, they must live a blessed life.

Honestly, I'm not trying to be insulting at all, but I encourage you to flat out skip some events and golden pursuits and I bet you'll find you don't care at all. I save my event/gp energy for the ones that happen to have rewards I *really* want which is rare.

This game is so overwhelmingly rewarding it burns me out and skipping events helps me to see clearly they're not really important.

SilverBride wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

All you need to do to unlock Scribing is complete the initial quest which takes all of 5 minutes.

Did they change this? Because it used to be that one character had to complete the full quest chain first. Then after that alts could choose to just do the initial quest if they didn't want to do the whole thing again.

On accounts new to scribing, characters gain access to scribing after completing the first quest but obviously can't do very much with it.

The golden pursuit was obviously designed to add more motivation for players new to scribing to complete the quest and I think that's fine.

Ingenon · July 14

SilverBride wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

All you need to do to unlock Scribing is complete the initial quest which takes all of 5 minutes.

Did they change this? Because it used to be that one character had to complete the full quest chain first. Then after that alts could choose to just do the initial quest if they didn't want to do the whole thing again.

It is still like what you described. I unlocked scribing when it was first released with Gold Road and did the full quest chain on my main, but I still had one alt that had not done any scribing, and I did the initial quest and got credit towards the Golden Pursuit.

scrappy1342 · July 15

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Personally, I don't think activities should ever "backfill" if they're listed as one of the endeavors or pursuits. "Cut 8 logs of wood." Wait, I did that last week, why didn't it backfill for today's endeavor? "Scribe 1 new skill." Wait, I did that last year, why didn't it backfill for this month's pursuit? Sorry, but no. Just... no. No, no, no.

One-time (non-repeatable) activities like "Claim the Scribing feature" may seem like another matter, but I still don't think they should ever backfill as long as there are plenty of other repeatable activities such that everyone can still easily earn the apex reward even if they're unable to complete the one-time activities.

In my opinion, the only time something should ever backfill for something is when there's a community event where the whole community is supposed to work together to achieve some goals. And only non-repeatable activities such as earning a given zone's pathfinder achievement should ever be backfilled; repeatable activities such as killing dragons, sealing volcanic vents, or shutting down dark anchors should never backfill.

totally agree. the problem is that they included things that can't be done over again. they probably should have just left all of that out of it and made up the other 5 or 6 with an extra rank of the other ones.

it's not that it's difficult or takes too much time (because from what i'm seeing it takes ppl who have already done it a LOT less time than those of us having to go through the questline, which is pretty neat, but also tedious XD)... it's the fact that they can't be done. it's not an option. zos could have saved a whole lot of drama by not doing it that way. if they wanted to reward something specific for doing the quests... i dunno, maybe they could have added a pet or a costume for getting the achievements for doing them. because that -should- be retroactive and also complete for the ppl who did it over a year ago.

Grizzbeorn · July 15

SilverBride wrote: »

Imperial_Archmage wrote: »

All you need to do to unlock Scribing is complete the initial quest which takes all of 5 minutes.

Did they change this? Because it used to be that one character had to complete the full quest chain first. Then after that alts could choose to just do the initial quest if they didn't want to do the whole thing again.

I can't remember what it was like when Scribing was first launched, but I had only done the initial quest then two of the five wings (indrik and Netch) with my main at the time these GPs went active last week, and all my chosen alt had to do was the initial quest in order to start scribing their own skills.

Hapexamendios · July 15

If you can't complete enough of this easy list of tasks without have some retroactively done, I don't know what to tell you.

DenverRalphy · July 15

The issue is that a lot of players are somehow under the impression that they earned progress through the GP because they completed those quests in the past. They simply don't realize that the rewards are not earned for doing the actual quests themselves. But instead they are earned for actually participating in the GP. Retroactive completion of tasks is not participating.

Elvenheart · July 15

I have previously completed the entire scribing quest chain on two chars (one in the beginning, and one recently) and unlocked scribing with the initial quest on all of my other characters. All my characters have learned all of the scripts, and all the grimoires.

I view GP activities as things that must be completed within the bounds of the start date and the end date of the GP, not something we should get credit for if we have done it prior to the start of the GP. And if we can’t do those things inside the bounds of the GP because we have already done them, at least they have put enough activities in the GP that we don’t have to do them to get the capstone reward.

I’m happy for the people just starting out in scribing that can get something special for doing those activities we have already done, but that they HAVE to complete to be able to progress in the GP at all. If they don’t do the initial quest, they cannot scribe a skill. If they don’t do the other quests at least once, they cannot find Luminous Ink. I could do all of that and more on the very first day of the GP, so I’m happy. And I would not have wanted all of those quests to suddenly be backfilled for me and the GP already half done without me doing anything that first day.

frogthroat · July 15

I have two accounts. The alt account is the one we got free from Epic. No ESO+, no DLCs other than what you get for free.

I finally got around to level up my toon to level 50 so I can start scribing quests. Didn't remember how long these scribing quests are.

Previously I had completed the Golden Pursuits on my main account where I have 20/20 toons, all with scribing done until Indrik.

After having done this pursuit on two accounts, one with scribing already done and another with no scribing previously, I have to say I prefer this pursuit without the scribing quests. My main account was much faster to do than the one where I started to do scribing.

So if you already have done scribing, good. The other pursuits are quicker.

Here's what I noticed:

These come without even trying

Claim 5 Rewards from the Daily Login Calendar
Claim 10 Rewards from the Daily Login Calendar

Just log in 10 times and you get 2 pursuits done.

Daily crafting & Guild dailies

Complete 5 Quests
Complete 15 Quests
Complete 20 Quests
Complete 3 Guild Daily Quests
Complete 10 Guild Daily Quests

Do Guild dailies with 4 characters, that's 12 quests. While you're at it, daily crafting with 2 characters, that's 14 quests more. So, 4 characters needed for one day completion or 2 characters in 2 days and 5 pursuits done.

Easy harvesting tasks

Harvest 25 Resources from the World
Harvest 50 Resources from the World
Acquire 10 Luminous Ink

Luminous ink drops everywhere. If you go to your favourite harvesting area you get 50 done in no time and most likely 10 inks as well. I didn't even notice when I got the 10 inks.

Blue beam ftw

Cast 10 Skills with active Skill Styles
Cast 50 Skills with active Skill Styles
Kill 100 Foes with Class Skills

I just set styles to everything I happened to have. All these were almost full after doing harvesting and guild quests. If you're still missing some, go to any place with plenty of enemies. I had blue beam so these came quickly.

Preparation for the last ones

Scribe 1 Skill
Acquire 3 Grimoires

On one toon I hadn't done other scribing than the quests until Indrik, I bought Banner Bearer, Soul Burst and a third skill (doesn't matter which). I scribed Soul Burst with damage and DOT, and a Healing Banner. Could have done this on any toon but I didn't want to mess any existing scribed skills.

Greenshade pest control

Defeat 100 Enemies with Scribed Skills
Defeat 300 Enemies with Scribed Skills
Heal 250,000 Amount with Scribed Skills
Heal 400,000 Amount with Scribed Skills

I went to Greenshade, south of Marbruk (actually, just ported in front of my house outside of Marbruk), activated my banner and went hunting for wasps. There are many, many nests. Just go and collect the wasps and spam Soul Burst. 300 enemies come very quickly because wasps are plentiful. Soul Burst is not a strong damage skill, but it's quick, AOE and wasps are weak. And your banner will heal you. After I had killed 300 wasps I was still missing some healing.

So I found a couple of thunderbugs. I left my character standing in front of them while I went to make some sandwiches. The healing was done while I was afk.

Way faster than on my alt account where I did scribing quests.

mdjessup4906 · July 16

Heal banner is smart. My normal damage one doesn't seem to count towards them, maybe because no killing blow?
I made healing contingency and a scribing knife with crux gen. Ran a trial and a few world bosses yesterday with that on trash and im over halfway there now.

mdjessup4906 · July 18

I am now the proud new owner of my own scribing station:D with zero new chars needing to be made.

PSA Undaunted dungeon pledges Do Not count for the guild quest thing. Only the Undaunted delve one and the mages, fighters guild dailies do.