We have been asking for....

sans-culottes

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

AlwaysDancing wrote: »

Furniture deconstruction would be a nice QoL upgrade, but should never be considered a feature.


And AI art is absolutely not inspiring. Art created by an actual human being is inspirational.

MoonPile wrote: »

I agree with the premise of decon, and agree, @AlwaysDancing - the inclusion of "AI" imagery is unfortunate. Many of us in housing are in the arts outside of this game: I would rather not to see the thing that was developed on my peers' stolen work, actively making our careers worse in every way, is incredibly environmentally damaging, and is engendered primarily by companies/billionaires whose primary goal is not to help regular people, but to profit even more.

You are both reading more meaning into this than is necessary.

By "inspiration" I mean to inspire debate in this thread, not as inspiration for the actual furnishing table. Think of it as "advertising". Pictures sell, marketing 101.

Inspire debate about the horribleness of AI replacing art and not your actual topic?

A discussion about your topic would be much better without a pointless image. An imagine that wasted water and power to be made.

No artists were harmed by @Pixiepumpkin using a simple GenAI mockup.

NotaDaedraWorshipper

sans-culottes wrote: »

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

AlwaysDancing wrote: »

Furniture deconstruction would be a nice QoL upgrade, but should never be considered a feature.


And AI art is absolutely not inspiring. Art created by an actual human being is inspirational.

MoonPile wrote: »

I agree with the premise of decon, and agree, @AlwaysDancing - the inclusion of "AI" imagery is unfortunate. Many of us in housing are in the arts outside of this game: I would rather not to see the thing that was developed on my peers' stolen work, actively making our careers worse in every way, is incredibly environmentally damaging, and is engendered primarily by companies/billionaires whose primary goal is not to help regular people, but to profit even more.

You are both reading more meaning into this than is necessary.

By "inspiration" I mean to inspire debate in this thread, not as inspiration for the actual furnishing table. Think of it as "advertising". Pictures sell, marketing 101.

Inspire debate about the horribleness of AI replacing art and not your actual topic?

A discussion about your topic would be much better without a pointless image. An imagine that wasted water and power to be made.

No artists were harmed by @Pixiepumpkin using a simple GenAI mockup.

Artists are harmed every day by AI.

spartaxoxo

MreeBiPolar wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

• Bound/antiquity furnishings should also be allowed to be deconstructed. There is no difference between deconstrucing a farmed furniture item and getting back resources as there is in farming a piece of gear and getting back resources.

The problem with this part is, lots of furniture is non-craftable (actually, SIGNIFICANTLY more than 3068 craftable at the moment), so they'd need to put a crafting cost on everything. Including onto stuff that was never meant to have it like store exclusives, antiquities, etc.

Until we had the sticker book, you could decon gear that you'd be unable to craft again later but still at least get mats. They can just give a random supply of mats for that stuff. We don't have a recipe for those items so it does not need set mats.

thejadefalcon

sans-culottes wrote: »

No artists were harmed by @Pixiepumpkin using a simple GenAI mockup.

Even if that was the case, the environment was, and for what? It added nothing to the discussion. It inspired nothing. The only people talking about it at all are the people saying how pointless it is. No-one thought "I didn't understand until you posted a picture and only then did I remember what a crafting table was!" This is why people laugh at AI, because it's so utterly pointless.

Arunei

DenverRalphy wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

<snip>
• Bound/antiquity furnishings should also be allowed to be deconstructed. There is no difference between deconstrucing a farmed furniture item and getting back resources as there is in farming a piece of gear and getting back resources.
<snip>

I was in agreement with you up to this point.

Bound/Antiquities shouldn't allow for deconstruction because the purpose of deconstruction is to recoup a portion of your materials investment. In the case of antiquities, those have an infinite supply and as a result could be used to farm mats (ie.. heartwood from the aylied tree in West Weald).

Which is no different than farming a piece of gear in a dungeon or trial.

Except that with antiquities you have to at least farm the lead first, some are easier than others.

Its a total non issue.

The gear you farm from dungeons/trials don't drop precious mats like heartwood/mundane runes/etc..

I get it. Deconstructing furniture would be great! But let's not get greedy if what we ask for is ever to see the light of day.

Deconstructing crafted furnishings is fair, because the player has mats and style materials invested into them. Bound/Antiquity items are bound for a reason, to prevent or mitigate exploitation/gold selling/real world money exchanges/etc.. You may not like it, but if you want furnishing deconstruction to ever come to pass, you've gotta manage your expectations.

There is a 40% chance of getting heartwood or mundane rune from their respective nodes in the wild. They are not exactly a rare resource.

Note that I did not say rare. I said precious. Sure the furnishiing mats are relatively common drops. But the amount they drop compared to how much is required to craft furnishings makes them noticeably valuable. Thus precious.

That's just because there's no furnishing passives. The amount required to make gear is a lot too. You can also deconstruct gold gear and get gold mats, which are rarer.

There's no reason to treat deconstructing furniture any different to deconstructing gear, IMO

I never said I was against deconstructing furnishings. I only said that if it ever comes to pass, that it'd likely only be for crafted gear and not bound/antiquities/crown-purchased furnishings. And I was emphasizing why crafted gear should be deconstructed to get a return on the mats.

...which would be treating deconstructing furniture different to different deconstructing gear.

You can farm and deconstruct gear. I don't agree you should be unable to deconstruct farmed furniture.

Sure you can farm and deconstruct gear. But when was the last time you saw gear dropping that yields mats anywhere near as valuable as furnishing mats? Yeah sure, you can get a gold mat from deconstructing gold gear. But I don't see gold gear dropping anywhere that you can farm it.

There's simply no way ZOS will ever allow a mechanic that can be exploited for real world currency.

A lot of Style mats that can be obtained from deconning Gear are more expensive/valuable than Housing mats these days. And even out of Housing mats, only a handful were ever expensive: Heartwood, Mundane Runes, and Decorative Wax. And even for those, they only made it to around 1k average per on PC/NA. Numerous Style mats have been and ARE way more than that because of how hard it is to get them...because they can only really be obtained by breaking down Gear of that Style.

Gear can be farmed endlessly. Antiquities can only be farmed as long as you have the Lead, and even the ones that drop often like the one crystals from harvesting Alchemy mats in Coldharbour don't drop *that* often to make 'farming' those Leads more productive than just farming the nodes themselves.

And that's the main thing. Who's going to waste time trying to get Leads to farm for Antiquities when it would be much faster, easier, AND more productive to just farm the mats themselves? Especially since ZOS increased the drop rates of these things not too long ago, so now it's actually more viable to farm them. So much in fact that the prices have come down a decent chunk, Heartwood averages somewhere around 600-some per now instead of closer to 1k.

The only reason I could see them not including non-craftable Furniture to be deconned (if we EVER get this feature, which would be REALLY nice) is because they'd have to assign all those items some kind of mat to drop. Would crystal-based Furnishings drop mats for Enchanting, Jewelry, or Blacksmithing? Would a Bed drop Clothing or Woodworking (there are Beds in both categories)? Would a lamp drop Enchanting or Blacksmithing (plenty of Lights are in both categories too)? And so on and so forth.

But there's nothing "valuable" about Housing mats that can't be applied to mats you might get from deconning Gear. And to touch on the other part of your post, er...gold sellers have existed in this game since the day it launched. They're the reason we have a cooldown on how many characters we can delete at once. And no gold seller is going to waste time trying to farm Antiquities to break down to Housing mats to sell for the gold when they can just set their bots to endlessly farm raw mats to sell instead. I don't see how there's any logical way to exploit deconning Antiquities for their mats when there are far easier things to exploit that the gold sellers already do.

scrappy1342

Arunei wrote: »

Gear can be farmed endlessly. Antiquities can only be farmed as long as you have the Lead, and even the ones that drop often like the one crystals from harvesting Alchemy mats in Coldharbour don't drop *that* often to make 'farming' those Leads more productive than just farming the nodes themselves.

And that's the main thing. Who's going to waste time trying to get Leads to farm for Antiquities when it would be much faster, easier, AND more productive to just farm the mats themselves? Especially since ZOS increased the drop rates of these things not too long ago, so now it's actually more viable to farm them. So much in fact that the prices have come down a decent chunk, Heartwood averages somewhere around 600-some per now instead of closer to 1k.

the main difference i see is that someone could theoretically buy cheapo vendor white furniture and make heartwood/mundane runes/decorative wax by deconning. you don't get those expensive style mats from deconning any gear that you can buy from a vendor. there's a difference between farming endlessly for something (spending hours) and just clicking at a vendor to obtain a pile of something.

Wuduwasa13

Grand master crafter furnishing station: combine all furnishing production into one central station and avoid the unnecessary running between & googling which type of plan it is. Also, deconstructing comes with it.

Sorted.

edward_frigidhands

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

....the ability to deconstruct furniture.

If ZOS servers can not handle the additional data required for a furnishing bag (which is why I assume we are getting the vault), why not instead just allow for us to deconstruct furniture?

• This has been a requested feature since housing released as evidence of a forum search for "deconstruct furniture".
• This would reduce data load on servers.
• The deconstructed materials would go into the craft bag.
• Bound/antiquity furnishings should also be allowed to be deconstructed. There is no difference between deconstrucing a farmed furniture item and getting back resources as there is in farming a piece of gear and getting back resources.

Part of what we pay for as customers is continued development. People have been asking for the abilty to deconstruct furniture since housing was implemented. Those folks had forsight to realize the issues we would eventually be facing with furniture. This should have been nipped in the bud way back in the day and not allowed it to metastasize into the issue that has plagued the housing community (arguably some of the biggest spenders in game) that it has become.


EDIT:
AI Art for visual inspiration/eye candy to inspire debate in the thread. This image is not meant to inpsire the look of an actual "Furniture Deconstruction Table".


[edited for baiting]

I love 💕 this idea.

LootAllTheStuff

scrappy1342 wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

Gear can be farmed endlessly. Antiquities can only be farmed as long as you have the Lead, and even the ones that drop often like the one crystals from harvesting Alchemy mats in Coldharbour don't drop *that* often to make 'farming' those Leads more productive than just farming the nodes themselves.

And that's the main thing. Who's going to waste time trying to get Leads to farm for Antiquities when it would be much faster, easier, AND more productive to just farm the mats themselves? Especially since ZOS increased the drop rates of these things not too long ago, so now it's actually more viable to farm them. So much in fact that the prices have come down a decent chunk, Heartwood averages somewhere around 600-some per now instead of closer to 1k.

the main difference i see is that someone could theoretically buy cheapo vendor white furniture and make heartwood/mundane runes/decorative wax by deconning. you don't get those expensive style mats from deconning any gear that you can buy from a vendor. there's a difference between farming endlessly for something (spending hours) and just clicking at a vendor to obtain a pile of something.

That is solvable by adjusting either the %chance or the number of "rolls" for a drop based on item rarity. Common white furniture shouldn't have that much of a chance to drop rare mats, and shouldn't drop more than 1 or 2 mats of any kind. Maybe an isomorphic assembly diagram and a couple of stray hex head screws, though!

Pixiepumpkin

edward_frigidhands wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

....the ability to deconstruct furniture.

If ZOS servers can not handle the additional data required for a furnishing bag (which is why I assume we are getting the vault), why not instead just allow for us to deconstruct furniture?

• This has been a requested feature since housing released as evidence of a forum search for "deconstruct furniture".
• This would reduce data load on servers.
• The deconstructed materials would go into the craft bag.
• Bound/antiquity furnishings should also be allowed to be deconstructed. There is no difference between deconstrucing a farmed furniture item and getting back resources as there is in farming a piece of gear and getting back resources.

Part of what we pay for as customers is continued development. People have been asking for the abilty to deconstruct furniture since housing was implemented. Those folks had forsight to realize the issues we would eventually be facing with furniture. This should have been nipped in the bud way back in the day and not allowed it to metastasize into the issue that has plagued the housing community (arguably some of the biggest spenders in game) that it has become.


EDIT:
AI Art for visual inspiration/eye candy to inspire debate in the thread. This image is not meant to inpsire the look of an actual "Furniture Deconstruction Table".


[edited for baiting]

I love 💕 this idea.

Thank you. I can't take credit for it as it has been suggested by countless others over the years and its one of those things that "just makes sense", but thank you nonetheless.