Players are leaving ESO - here's why

IncultaWolf

I'm in several large eso discords with hundreds of members, and most of them don't even log in to play the game anymore. Most are very disappointed with the upcoming pvp feature and how they handled it. A large complaint was the lack of rewards or proper leaderboard/ranking to these new battlegrounds.

Elsonso

Katheriah wrote: »

For me it doesn't feel like we're having a grand 10y celebration. I feel like everything in the game is just neglected. I used to be fan of the idea to temporarely trade 1 story DLC for fixes, but only if those fixes were also about the same effort. I feel like ZOS has put a skeleton crew in place that's trying to juggle between performance, new content and engaging in the community, but fails at all those points. The new housing feature and the BG update almost feel like insults to me. I was there during the good days when you actually had to put some thoughts in which of the shiny new features of a chapter you will try first.

Well, since it feels like ZOS took the year off, I don’t feel it is unwarranted for the players to take some time off, too!

dk_dunkirk wrote: »

I've been around since 2019. I've never had a problem with Steam or the launcher. If you want to pretend there's a statistically-significant problem with the launcher since before the influx during COVID, I guess that's your prerogative.

It s an extra something that goes wrong. I stopped using the Steam launcher entirely and have a desktop icon to the ESO executable. Steam is totally unaware that I even play the game when I play my Steam account.

MISTFORMBZZZ

SilverBride wrote: »

Aggrovious wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

ESO isn't a perfect utopia where every player gets exactly what they want. No game is. But it has a lot of options for many play styles, and many of us still enjoy this game very much.

I don't understand why some unhappy players feel the need to prove to everyone else that they should be unhappy, too.

So you are a happy player. What makes you feel happy about the game when you play?

What makes me happy isn't the topic of this thread. The important thing is that many players are happy and are still playing, and this game is not dying.

It is aboslutely dying, you should rather see it that way, just because some (few) people are still playing and happy, doesnt mean the game is NOT dying.


EDIT

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/666306/population-shrinking-please-do-something/p16

17 Pages full of valid points.

But im glad there is still people who are happy, nobody wants to take this from you or change it.
We are all interested in Zos to get theit hips up and do something so the game stays alive for another 10 years.

But at the moment it doesnt look like it.

People are leaving the game in masses, the average player doesnt come here to announce that, they just move on.

Since Zos obviously doesnt give out numbers we can only tell by indicators but its clear in wich direction we are going right now and its a downfall.

Agree or not agree.
In the end i can only tell you zos wont keep the games servers costs up for solo players.
It should be in everyones interest, to have the population healthy.

Elsonso

.

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

It is aboslutely dying, you should rather see it that way, just because some (few) people are still playing and happy, doesnt mean the game is NOT dying.

It just feels a little early to be measuring for the coffin...

Franchise408

vsrs_au wrote: »

Speaking of echo chambers... there are several long-term forum members who will never admit the game is in trouble, no matter what evidence you show them to show otherwise. I've spent almost all this year playing various offline games, and I have a long list of games to play. The only reason I still post here is idle curiosity about whether ZOS will actually turn the game around or not.

And why does anyone need to admit to anything? What does that accomplish?

I can't even be accused of being a ZOS / ESO fanboy. I haven't played the game regularly in years. I log on maybe once a month at best to join my guild for a trial or something. I'll probably never be a regular ESO player ever again. I'm pulling back on subs and chapter buys. While I like ESO, and enjoy it, if it weren't for my guild, I probably would have been gone gone a long time ago, and I probably have just as many complaints about the game as I do things I like. I don't believe in ZOS' vision of the game and there's really not much of anything that can excite me to come back for any extended period of time.

That being said, I don't know what I'd actually have to admit to. I certainly don't think the game is dying. Some people might leave. It's a 10 year old game. We are also at a point right now where a lot of new stuff is dropping. Shattered Space just dropped for Starfield. A new DLC and season dropped for Diablo 4. Dragon Age is coming out later this month. Populations will come and go. Steam #'s are at a certain level? Steam isn't the whole picture for ESO, which has a majority of their players that don't play through Steam.

ESO isn't dead. It isn't dying. It might not be at the same level it was at its peak, but games don't always stay at the same level. There are a whole bunch of other options besides just "peak" and "dead"

OtarTheMad

So much doom and gloom, the game seems fine. Every time I log in, which is rare but also weird times, I always run into a good amount of players. On some consoles it very well could be drowning but not all.

Also, players can absolutely love the game but still not play all the time due to a variety of issues. For me, I love the game, I get to do a variety of things that cover different play styles. Do I want to do a builder type thing, well then I can do housing, how about PvP… okay I got Cyrodiil and BGs, etc etc. So many things can push you away from the game temporarily like life, other games, doing other things with free time… I am not playing as much right now because I am enjoying LOTR: RtM and Enshrouded.

While some issues are big and deserve more attention and things frustrate me at the end of the day it’s still a game to me. I think some people lost sight of that, take it too seriously. I am a Magcro PvPer… my class is literally poo but I still enjoy the game and logging in.

dk_dunkirk

Elsonso wrote: »

dk_dunkirk wrote: »

I've been around since 2019. I've never had a problem with Steam or the launcher. If you want to pretend there's a statistically-significant problem with the launcher since before the influx during COVID, I guess that's your prerogative.

It s an extra something that goes wrong. I stopped using the Steam launcher entirely and have a desktop icon to the ESO executable. Steam is totally unaware that I even play the game when I play my Steam account.

So because of problems with the launcher years ago, you're still running the executable directly, skipping the automatic update check, and manually logging into the game every time you play? And you want me to believe that enough Steam-account players are going through this extra hassle as to have a statistically-significant impact the numbers on the Steam charts?

SilverBride

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

It is aboslutely dying, you should rather see it that way, just because some (few) people are still playing and happy, doesnt mean the game is NOT dying.

No, it absolutely is not dying. My opinion based on the MANY players I see everywhere I go every time I play. PCNA is alive and well and if the other servers aren't then I really have no answer to that. But no one can say that their unhappiness is everyone's unhappiness and is causing the game to fail.

As someone mentioned earlier, these doomsday threads have been around since the game launched, but 10 years later here we still are.

notyuu

I can tell you why I'm certinally having trouble playing the game, it's a lack of things to do.

Before my yearly cycle used to be like so

• Q1 dungeons come out
• Beat them
• study them
• pratice
• hard mode
• speed run
• no death
• trifecta
• Farm gear to add to sticker book.
• Got 2-3 weeks before Q2 chapter drops,
• kill this time by doing side stuff, misc achivements for the dungon, collecting motifs, Dalies, doing housing, pvp, ect.
• Q2 drops, story stuff
• trial
• rinse and repeat the cycle with the dungons, but a bit slower due to it being a trial.
• Got a week before Q3
• Q3 drops, same story as Q1
• Q4 drops, like Q2 just with a longer downtime.

So across the entire year I'd have 6-8 weeks of just plippin about doing side stuff, an easily sustainable rate

And then U35 hit, suddenly, My stamplar can't get the higher end trial stuff done and PvP becomes a miserble sisyphean task, which cuts down both the runtime of Q2 and what I can do in the gaps, then zos cuts the amount of yearly content in half and due to stadia the "dead time" between the end of the PTS and the release of the chapter, so my yearly cycle now looks like this.

• Q1 dungeons come out
• Beat them, study them, pratice, hard mode, speed run, vet, no death, trifecta
• Farm gear to add to sticker book
• got ~1 month before chapter drops, kill this time by doing side stuff, misc achivements, colleting motifs, dalies, housing.
• Q2 drops, story stuff and not much else.
• got 3 months before Q3 drops, kill this time by doing side stuff.
• Q3 drops, where's the content?
• got 4 months before Q4 drops, kill this time by doing side stuff.
• Q4 drops, ohh new shiny IA
• Blitz IA and get all the achivements and gear in 30 days
• got 3 months to kill before Q1, kill this time by doing side stuff.

Repeat the above again for this year, except Q3 IA refresh lasted even less time, and the upcomming Q4 is something I can't get into, except at this point I've run out of "side stuff" I can do

• Gotten and furnshed all the houses.
• Unlocked all the plans
• have all the motifs
• unlocked all the styles
• gotten all the gear
• mastered all the dungeons
• learned all the recpies
• gotten all the fishing stuff
• done all the dalies everywhere
• gotten all the books
• dug up all the antiquties
• gotten all the skyshards
• unlocked all the dyes (except pvp ones, thanks u35)
• caught all the fish
• all the basegame

And while I have gone above and beyond to do as much of every type of content as possible this is a situation that a considerble number of players are facing, a sheer lack of things to do in game leads players getting bored and just leaving, heck, the only reason I hang around anymore is to RP with my friends, and even they are getting tired of the lack of content in the game.

So Please ZoS, can we go back to getting 4 content updates a year instead of just Two?

Aliniel

I see arguments about how people see other people everywhere they go. Yes, you do. Because ZOS implemented the instance system. There are many world instances running in parallel. They won't put you into an empty one. You will put you into a full one. This way you always have a feeling like you're not alone.

MISTFORMBZZZ

Aliniel wrote: »

I see arguments about how people see other people everywhere they go. Yes, you do. Because ZOS implemented the instance system. There are many world instances running in parallel. They won't put you into an empty one. You will put you into a full one. This way you always have a feeling like you're not alone.

This tbh ^We dont even know how many instances there are at the same time now at this point.

Maybe there is just one at this point to make it look less empty.

Same as the Cyrodiil population cap has been reduced over the years to fake make it look as if its not empty.

In the begin it was 600v600v600 now we tested after a maintenance and were like 120-150 max = bars and pop lock.

So the argument "its not dead i seen someone!!!" is invalid for me anyway.

tohopka_eso

The amount of games I've played through the years that were dieing and yet still exist. I'm one of those like SilverBride. I still log in and play. I don't use Steam, I use the actual launcher. I see people out in Tamriel all the time also.
I might not do group content so I can not give feedback. I don't PvP cause I hate it.
But, what I can say with feedback this is not the first gloom and doom thread I have seen not only here but as I've said other games I've played. The game might not be fine for the forum warriors, but might be fine for those that don't here. I only respond to threads when I feel like it but I've been here since Beta.

Coo_PnT

tohopka_eso wrote: »

The amount of games I've played through the years that were dieing and yet still exist. I'm one of those like SilverBride. I still log in and play. I don't use Steam, I use the actual launcher. I see people out in Tamriel all the time also.
I might not do group content so I can not give feedback. I don't PvP cause I hate it.
But, what I can say with feedback this is not the first gloom and doom thread I have seen not only here but as I've said other games I've played. The game might not be fine for the forum warriors, but might be fine for those that don't here. I only respond to threads when I feel like it but I've been here since Beta.

I don't know what is in your mind. I think this Forum is the place where I can honestly say what I think and what you think. There will be agreement, and there will be criticism. I think that's fine and I really appreciate you taking the time to post your opinions.

Rkindaleft

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSOER1kAeSc

I posted this in the performance thread but this was taken from a group I've been helping out in Rockgrove last night. These 2 clips were taken from the exact same pull of the boss. Most of the group was experiencing rubberbanding over several seconds and we had like 7-8 DCs in the 2 hour raid slot - and this isn't a one off thing, in the past few months pretty much everyone in the group has experienced these with frequency.

In the second part of the clip the lag is so bad you can literally see the curses freezing in place, the ghosts glitching back to their old positions and the behemoth randomly skipping in and out of existence while my character can't cast any skills. Through no fault of our own the game is pretty much just working against the player.

Then people wonder why trials or PvP players complain that there are so few players left to fight or run content with (and PvP players have had to deal with it longer than we have! I'm kind of shocked there's any of them left tbh.)

Elsonso

dk_dunkirk wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

dk_dunkirk wrote: »

I've been around since 2019. I've never had a problem with Steam or the launcher. If you want to pretend there's a statistically-significant problem with the launcher since before the influx during COVID, I guess that's your prerogative.

It s an extra something that goes wrong. I stopped using the Steam launcher entirely and have a desktop icon to the ESO executable. Steam is totally unaware that I even play the game when I play my Steam account.

So because of problems with the launcher years ago, you're still running the executable directly, skipping the automatic update check, and manually logging into the game every time you play? And you want me to believe that enough Steam-account players are going through this extra hassle as to have a statistically-significant impact the numbers on the Steam charts?

Steam Charts provides a number, and that is what people are looking for. Few, if any, really understand the number or what it means, but it is a number and people run with that.

I am sure that there is a correlation between opening the launcher from Steam and playing the game. Is it the exact same correlation that existed back in 2016? Does the difference, if any, matter? No one knows the answer to that. The assumption is that it does not matter because to say it does is to admit that the numbers might not be accurate for comparison.

This is why Steam Charts for ESO are only useful for general trends. Anyone who is doing math between Steam Chart numbers to get differences or percentages and applying them to the entire game is wasting their time. These sorts of calculations are useful only for questions specific to only people who play ESO on Steam. For everything else, is A greater than or less than B, and is that something that is new or something that has been happening for a while?

In the case of ESO, we are seeing a downward trend in the Steam Charts numbers, excluding the pandemic years. We can hypothesize that this means that fewer players are playing ESO when we extrapolate this to say that the trend is probably the same across the entire game. The extrapolation adds a degree of error. We cannot determine precise magnitude in any of this because we don't know how those numbers match up with the rest of the PC players, XBox, and Playstation. Maybe XBox numbers are going up while Steam numbers are going down? Maybe PC numbers are up because new players aren't using Steam. We can't tell.

Steam Charts is interesting, but the numbers are primarily related to Steam players. It is interesting that fewer players are playing on Steam, and while I am happy to entertain the thought that fewer players are playing ESO overall, we can't prove that from the Steam Charts numbers.

The preponderance of anecdotal evidence suggests that the Steam Charts numbers are reflecting an overall trend away from playing ESO. As of today, there is nothing in any of this that makes it a dire emergency. I don't see ZOS treating it like one, either. How ZOS responds is much more relevant than all of the anecdotal stories in here and Steam Charts.

M0ntie

tincanman wrote: »

Performance seems more reasonable.

And a failure in effective communication.

Are you kidding about performance?

We can't run a trial without people disconnecting EVERY SINGLE TRIAL. The DC's have been very bad for a few weeks now. Completely unacceptable in a game this old.
The bad performance of the game is a significant reason why people are leaving Fighting with game stability and bugs drives people away.

MissE

While I don't disagree with every point that is being made here, I see a lot of people who are saying things about "content nobody asked for."

I think it's important to remember that you aren't the only one playing this game and that it's not junk content just because you're not interested in it. Plenty of people like the new updates. For example, housing tours. There are a lot of houses listed for home tours and a lot of the houses are really cool. Some people in the game are really passionate about housing and decorating and have some REALLY creative ideas. Just because it's not your thing doesn't mean that it's no good.

Nothing that ZOS does will ever please everybody. If you're really bothered by the direction the game is going, stop complaining about what you think is no good about it and go play something else.

ADarklore

Amottica wrote: »

tincanman wrote: »

Performance seems more reasonable.

And a failure in effective communication.

Performance, yes, and the reduction of meaningful content since that is a major driver in keeping players' interest. Most of that list is not a notable driver, and some are the same in almost every MMORPG.

Perhaps one should look at SWTOR as an example of what happens to an aging MMO. Communications drops, devs leave, content drops, players start leaving, more stuff added to the online store to keep the game afloat. Having jumped from ESO over to SWTOR, I'm seeing all of that, then coming back and reading ESO forums and seeing the exact same thing starting to occur here.

dinokstrunz

ESO is a very tired game and this year has really exposed how poor ZoS have been at responding to criticism of their updates & balancing. Now the toll is being paid in sizeable chunk of the community (from PvE & PvP) walking away temporarily or permanently. People are just fed up with Zenimax at this point.

Aggrovious

MissE wrote: »

Nothing that ZOS does will ever please everybody. If you're really bothered by the direction the game is going, stop complaining about what you think is no good about it and go play something else.

Its thinking like this that makes me wonder why you are here? I am sorry, but little to no forums exist as an echo chamber for everything happy and cool. This is a live service game and many are not happy with recent changes. So they should be able to voice them and the Devs should reconsider some ill informed decision makings. Housing Tour is cool, but what about the confusing tool tip? Hybridization completion?

On top of that, combat nerfs are dictated by PVP threads here. So..

Tyrion87

SilverBride wrote: »

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

It is aboslutely dying, you should rather see it that way, just because some (few) people are still playing and happy, doesnt mean the game is NOT dying.

No, it absolutely is not dying. My opinion based on the MANY players I see everywhere I go every time I play. PCNA is alive and well and if the other servers aren't then I really have no answer to that. But no one can say that their unhappiness is everyone's unhappiness and is causing the game to fail.

As someone mentioned earlier, these doomsday threads have been around since the game launched, but 10 years later here we still are.

Haha after reading your posts it is clear that you are really deceiving yourself. You just can't accept the hard truth and don't want to acknowledge that the game you love is not in a good shape at the moment population wise. I'm far from saying it is dying but it has really huge problems with players retention and it is losing a lot of people playing endgame and/or harder content (PvP, vet dungeons/trials etc.) which you clearly and obviously don't engage with.

wazzz56

Empty guilds and discords are way more indicative of the population health than relying on how full an instanced location is IMHO....100 players over 10 instances a town seems empty, 100 players over 2 instances and the town seems full (they are completely arbitrary numbers btw).Guilds that used to have 100's of people on at a time having just a few dozen on tells a truer story to me. I have been playing on PS NA since just about launch, spent probably waaay too much time on pvp land and fishing, GM'd a decent pvp guild for years and now ESO is a ghost town for me. Various reasons have contributed to this over the years but this is as bad as any "dead time" I have experienced in the game. I am fairly certain my ESO time has run it's course. I haven't played other than to log in for rewards in months and I have stopped even doing that. Been fun though......

moderatelyfatman

ADarklore wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

tincanman wrote: »

Performance seems more reasonable.

And a failure in effective communication.

Performance, yes, and the reduction of meaningful content since that is a major driver in keeping players' interest. Most of that list is not a notable driver, and some are the same in almost every MMORPG.

Perhaps one should look at SWTOR as an example of what happens to an aging MMO. Communications drops, devs leave, content drops, players start leaving, more stuff added to the online store to keep the game afloat. Having jumped from ESO over to SWTOR, I'm seeing all of that, then coming back and reading ESO forums and seeing the exact same thing starting to occur here.

You make a good point with SWTOR, however, we should also consider some MMOs that are a similar age or even older than ESO: Guild Wars 2, Final Fantasy 14 and, of course, World of Warcraft. These three games look aged from a graphical perspective but the community is still vibrant and generally positive.

It also helps enormously that these games work properly and that the devs have listened (after a long period of ignoring in the case of WOW) to their players. Old does not necessarily mean buggy or tired or mediocre.

MISTFORMBZZZ

wazzz56 wrote: »

Empty guilds and discords are way more indicative of the population health than relying on how full an instanced location is IMHO....100 players over 10 instances a town seems empty, 100 players over 2 instances and the town seems full (they are completely arbitrary numbers btw).Guilds that used to have 100's of people on at a time having just a few dozen on tells a truer story to me. I have been playing on PS NA since just about launch, spent probably waaay too much time on pvp land and fishing, GM'd a decent pvp guild for years and now ESO is a ghost town for me. Various reasons have contributed to this over the years but this is as bad as any "dead time" I have experienced in the game. I am fairly certain my ESO time has run it's course. I haven't played other than to log in for rewards in months and I have stopped even doing that. Been fun though......

Crossplay would help.
PS EU would like to play with you, NA but we are not allowed too

wazzz56

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

Empty guilds and discords are way more indicative of the population health than relying on how full an instanced location is IMHO....100 players over 10 instances a town seems empty, 100 players over 2 instances and the town seems full (they are completely arbitrary numbers btw).Guilds that used to have 100's of people on at a time having just a few dozen on tells a truer story to me. I have been playing on PS NA since just about launch, spent probably waaay too much time on pvp land and fishing, GM'd a decent pvp guild for years and now ESO is a ghost town for me. Various reasons have contributed to this over the years but this is as bad as any "dead time" I have experienced in the game. I am fairly certain my ESO time has run it's course. I haven't played other than to log in for rewards in months and I have stopped even doing that. Been fun though......

Crossplay would help.
PS EU would like to play with you, NA but we are not allowed too

@MISTFORMBZZZ if I could do it without having to start over I would

TheMajority

TheMajority wrote: »

if people are leaving then why is it i can be out in the sticks thinkin I'm alone then like 30 elves on sparkle mounts run me over while im fishing

seems like the game is healthy to me

30 elves with sparkle mounts on the keep wall

30 elves with sparkle mounts

Take one down, they're still all around

45,000 elves with sparkle mounts on the keep wall

they just keep multiplying guys still not seeing the game dying

Ilumia

It seems that some people really can't see a decline, whether it's out of loyalty or wishful thinking I don't know. The thing is that the criticism is usually coming from people who actually cares about eso in some way. It's certainly a game they want to play in some form or other, and they are voicing what that form is (performance and decent regular content) - and that the game is moving away from it and not towards it anymore. I don't know why so many refuse to acknowledge a decline in player numbers and engagement. I'm on PC EU, and see it very clearly too, whether it is in towns, roaming the world, group content, pvp, guilds or discord, there's fewer in all of those places, and a larger number of the remaining that just log in sometimes and do very little.
I think the vast majority of devs care too, I just think funds are being moved to a new project. I won't follow if it's another mmo, I'm only here because I love elder scrolls, but I won't spend so much money and time if eso ends up getter abandoned, nor when this is the treatment we get for the money we pay, I miss pve without lag (among many things).

LPapirius

Elsonso wrote: »

.

MISTFORMBZZZ wrote: »

It is aboslutely dying, you should rather see it that way, just because some (few) people are still playing and happy, doesnt mean the game is NOT dying.

It just feels a little early to be measuring for the coffin...

Only to the PvE only community. You'll get a very different report from the PvP community who haven't seen any updates to Cyrodiil since 2018 and we aren't even allowed to bring up the topics of PvP or Cyodiil during live streams without being silenced for going on years now.

SilverBride

A natural decline in a 10 year old game does not indicate that the game is failing.

I don't understand why some are so insistent that this game is dying and so set on making sure that we all agree with them. When I feel a game is no longer for me I move on completely. Whether others feel the same or not doesn't affect my decision.

LPapirius

Ilumia wrote: »

It seems that some people really can't see a decline, whether it's out of loyalty or wishful thinking I don't know. The thing is that the criticism is usually coming from people who actually cares about eso in some way. It's certainly a game they want to play in some form or other, and they are voicing what that form is (performance and decent regular content) - and that the game is moving away from it and not towards it anymore. I don't know why so many refuse to acknowledge a decline in player numbers and engagement. I'm on PC EU, and see it very clearly too, whether it is in towns, roaming the world, group content, pvp, guilds or discord, there's fewer in all of those places, and a larger number of the remaining that just log in sometimes and do very little.
I think the vast majority of devs care too, I just think funds are being moved to a new project. I won't follow if it's another mmo, I'm only here because I love elder scrolls, but I won't spend so much money and time if eso ends up getter abandoned, nor when this is the treatment we get for the money we pay, I miss pve without lag (among many things).

I don't think ZOS is realizing how many ESO fans will never touch another ZOS product again if ESO isn't fixed in terms of performance.