Night Capping is Making PvP Pointless - Please do Something ZOS

Blackrim

Good Morning,

I want to address an issue that seems to be affecting the ESO community: night capping in Cyrodiil.

First and foremost, I want to clarify that this forum is not intended to target or disrespect anyone. Its purpose is to discuss and find solutions to the problem of night capping.

It is understandable that when players are offline, an enemy faction might take control of the map. From a strategic standpoint, this makes sense. However, it's important to consider the long-term effects this has on the game. Many players enjoy participating in Cyrodiil and competing against each other, particularly in group-versus-group content.

For those who may not engage in PvP frequently, many players appreciate the challenge of new sets and skills to optimize their gear and strategies. Furthermore, few players love to design group compositions of gear sets to be effective in Cyrodiil. This competitive environment is one of the most engaging aspects of the game.

Currently, the scoring system in Cyrodiil seems to be problematic. As it stands, factions like the Daggerfall Covenant and Aldmeri Dominion are not active during the early hours in Grey Host, allowing one faction to dominate the map and capture all the scrolls. To address this, the scoring system needs adjustment.

One possible solution is to modify the scoring based on population. For instance, if a faction has significantly more players online compared to others, their score growth should be adjusted to align with the other factions. Alternatively, we could implement lower population score bonuses for factions with fewer players online at a given time. I know this existed beforehand, and it most certainly worked well. Many players, such as those in the Aldmeri Dominion faction, have family and work commitments, which means they can't always be online.

To illustrate the issue, here is an example of scores from the Grey Host campaign:

On 08/10/2024:

DC: 28,000
AD: 27,400
EP: 31,000

On the morning of 08/11/2024:

DC: 31,000
AD: 30,800
EP: 35,000

The score discrepancies due to player activity suggest a fundamental problem with the current scoring system. The faction with the most activity during off-peak hours has consistently won the last 10-13 campaigns in Grey Host. This pattern indicates a statistical anomaly that points to a scoring issue.

I urge you to consider these ideas and propose solutions to address this problem. Implementing lower population score bonuses and adjusting score multipliers based on faction activity ratios could be effective. Another option is to change campaign rewards in a way that does not encourage faction hopping. If you have any questions about these suggestions or additional ideas, please feel free to contribute to this discussion.

darvaria

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

And BTW, a mostly one color map is NOT fun. I log off when I see it happening. I don't engage in night capping but I remember times when all factions scored the night cap. ATM, it's EP doing it.

Idinuse

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

It may be "prime time for some countries", but what I can not fathom is what fun they see in PvDooring an entire server their whole "prime time". Are they not in it for some real PvP? Where's the fun? You know an entire continent does not compulsively have to be on one and the same faction every time all the time. IF they were really PvP players of rank, they would divide themselves over all three factions and actually play against each other. As it is now it's just sad and pathetic with no honor or skill involved what so ever other than in their own minds.

Major_Mangle

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

There is no such thing as "personal primetime" I´m sorry to burst that bubble. Primetime is when the campaign/server reaches it´s peak in terms of population. Those hours obviously doesn´t align with the entire world due to timezones but there is usually only 1 primetime when all factions are pop-locked or when populations are at it´s highest.

I personally don´t care about the outcome of campaigns or the score since the rewards are whatever, but for those who does care I understand their frustration. Since it´s a lot more difficult to take objectives and do things that give score for your alliance during primetime compared to during off hours (when majority of campaigns are decided due to night-capping) the effort of those who play during primetime is extremely devalued. A better solution would be to add a dynamic point system that is based on population and obviously other factors. PvP campaigns should not be won when the least amount of PvP is happening, simple as that.

Tommy_The_Gun

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries.

Why then people from same time zone always "main" one faction then and they pop-stack ? It does not make sense. If indeed it was like you say, that different time zones also do play this game, then population would be more or less equal 24/7...

It is an old argument that is always use to defend PvDoor. I have said multiple times that there is way to have a cake & eat a cake here. Just make potenial points to scale with population. So if you capture enemy objecive when they have way less players than you, it would give less poteanial points. PvDoor would still affect scores, but in a minimal way and it would be actual PvP (playing vs actual defenders) that would decide who wins PvP campign. It always felt off to me that game rewards same potenial point regardles of the difficulty (PvDoor vs PvP to capture objective). It is an anomaly here as the game pretty much alwasy gives you better reward if content was harder (more AP for capturing / defending objecive, or even Perfected weapon for doing hard diculty Arena etc).

Blackrim

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

And BTW, a mostly one color map is NOT fun. I log off when I see it happening. I don't engage in night capping but I remember times when all factions scored the night cap. ATM, it's EP doing it.

In Cyrodiil, it is quite common for factions to form temporary alliances, as seen with the Aldmeri Dominion and Daggerfall Covenant teaming up against the Ebonheart Pact. This phenomenon is a strategic response to situations where certain factions hold the map during times of low population. It is done so via pattern recognition from people who have played the game repeatedly and not through direct communication. The frequent victories of one faction in the Greyhost campaign over the past two years highlight the need for a review and possible adjustment of the scoring system. This forum post aims to address and discuss this necessary change.

darvaria

I agree with @Blackrim and OP's post was very respectful and true. I just don't see a solution. It's been brought up many times during my 10 years of going to Cyro.

I've been on the DC side where the night cappers crowned one player Emp every single night for 2 years. About 2 or 3 years ago, AD had that power group that basically made it unplayable for anyone else. Currently, it is EP, the faction I have played for about 5 years now, that is doing the night capping. I agree the PV Dooring is not fun and I log off when it starts. I may grab our scrolls but after that, it's pointless PV Dooring.

Sort of fun defending all 6 scrolls, when the map has shifted.

I just don't see a solution unless ZOS offers transparency and matching size teams.

darvaria

UNLESS you closed the main Cyro and sent players to a smaller, type map with 2 teams during the off hours. I would say "off hours" are around 2 EST - 7 EST? Now that would be fun 25 v 25. NOT 1/3/1 which sometimes I think the 1's have less than 10 and the 3 has 100. I do remember when AD were the night cappers counting the EP online and we had 8. Most of us never left base and were watching Netflix.

The smaller map could offer 2 hour games with EQUAL size team, like BG's from any faction. I think you could get 50-60 players at all times. 1-2 hour games.

Aurielle

Idinuse wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

It may be "prime time for some countries", but what I can not fathom is what fun they see in PvDooring an entire server their whole "prime time". Are they not in it for some real PvP? Where's the fun? You know an entire continent does not compulsively have to be on one and the same faction every time all the time. IF they were really PvP players of rank, they would divide themselves over all three factions and actually play against each other. As it is now it's just sad and pathetic with no honor or skill involved what so ever other than in their own minds.

Maybe you should encourage the AD "nightcappers" on Blackreach to switch to Gray Host?

Current state of Blackreach on PCNA:

Urzigurumash

Why do you suppose a fantasy war in a fantasy world should be constrained by the movements of our own Earth and Sun - and not of Nirn and its Sun?

Urzigurumash

To put it another way, those who aren't night capping aren't playing the game in the most effective way, if your own Earthly needs are what prevents this then you are not maximally competitive, you're putting your personal needs above the Queen's - you haven't immersed yourself in Nirn sufficiently for Her needs.

Have you played Full Loot OW games? For some there's Offline Raid Protection - a less competitive form of the genre.

Yet despite all that I agree entirely with your basic premise - the lower population factions should score proportionally more per tick than they currently do.

Why not?

My debate is just the day / night thing is fundamentally irrelevant in Nirn - at ALL and ANY time this bonus should apply. Just a matter of theoretical framing really.

Urzigurumash

Let me express it more clearly. Forget day and night exist, let's pretend we live in Evergloam or Oblivion.

Does the suggestion of OP make GH more or less competitive?

Idinuse

Aurielle wrote: »

Idinuse wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

It may be "prime time for some countries", but what I can not fathom is what fun they see in PvDooring an entire server their whole "prime time". Are they not in it for some real PvP? Where's the fun? You know an entire continent does not compulsively have to be on one and the same faction every time all the time. IF they were really PvP players of rank, they would divide themselves over all three factions and actually play against each other. As it is now it's just sad and pathetic with no honor or skill involved what so ever other than in their own minds.

Maybe you should encourage the AD "nightcappers" on Blackreach to switch to Gray Host?

Current state of Blackreach on PCNA:

On the contrary. There is the incentive for EP to go Blackreach instead of GH, but I guess fighting real players isn't in EP's Night Cap Crew's genes.

Just log on to NA GH right now as of this post (August 13, 9AM) and it looks exactly the same as it did this time of day the last XXX days. EP gating both DC and AD. *SLOWCLAP*.

Dracosin369

People just quit playing the game or going into Cyrodil at all, because of this.

opethmaniac

I propose a system that introduces a divisor for the two most populated factions:
Example:
* DC Online: 10 players
* EP Online: 20 players
* AD Online 50 players

If DC captures a resource, they get the usual 1500 AP.
If EP captures a resource, they get 750 AP because they currently have twice as many players as DC.
If AD captures a resource, they only get 300 AP because they currently have 5* as many players as DC.

This divisor could be determined dynamically based on the current population and could be applied to any PVE-related action.

Other bonuses like LowPop could be applied on top, in my example for DC.

This would make nightcapping much less attractive for the strongest faction and could create more balance.

Blackrim

opethmaniac wrote: »

I propose a system that introduces a divisor for the two most populated factions:
Example:
* DC Online: 10 players
* EP Online: 20 players
* AD Online 50 players

If DC captures a resource, they get the usual 1500 AP.
If EP captures a resource, they get 750 AP because they currently have twice as many players as DC.
If AD captures a resource, they only get 300 AP because they currently have 5* as many players as DC.

This divisor could be determined dynamically based on the current population and could be applied to any PVE-related action.

Other bonuses like LowPop could be applied on top, in my example for DC.

This would make nightcapping much less attractive for the strongest faction and could create more balance.

I believe this is a solid idea. Achieving a balanced ratio of AP gains across different factions would create a fairer environment, enhancing incentives and ensuring equitable participation.

darvaria

@Idinuse Yes I see this every night. About 2 hours earlier, EP was gated and I logged out. I log out when my faction is gated and I log out when EP gets the first enemy scroll.

So YES, these maps ruin it for all factions. Except for the PV Door players. I posted multiple map screenies during MYM that showed solid color maps for ALL 3 factions.

I'm not sure what the middle ground is now?

PVDoor isn't really for AP. So this might not change anything. They are doing it for some form of revenge or something.

There needs to be QUES. 2/2/2. 1/1/1. None of this 1/3/1 or 1/1/Pop lock. TRANSPARENCY. Show us the numbers, not this nebulous bars.

darvaria

NUMBERS are shown everywhere else in the game: BG's, Dungeons, Trials.

Give us numbers so the problem can be really examined. AND Que by numbers. This might push some players into other campaigns.

Necrotech_Master

they have both low pop and low score bonuses

how they trigger is not really ideal though

low pop triggers based on what occurred in the previous X amount of hours, i dont know if this specified anywhere but its is definitely not "real time" or on short enough time scales to really matter, it also seems to be problematic because ive seen a faction get low pop when they have 2 bar population (and the other factions also had 2 or 3 bar pops)

low score bonus i think only triggers when the other factions are trailing in points by more than 50% less of the leading faction

AP gain and "campaign scores" dont really correlate

a faction could pvdoor the whole map, which is good for AP, but its also good for campaign score because the enemy factions wont have any keeps or scrolls (as you need those to provide points), reducing AP gains will just annoy people but it wont stop "tryhards" who actually care about campaign score, the best way to get score still would be to gate both enemy factions to stop them from earning points at the evals

i would also agree that if i go into a campaign and i see my faction gated, unless there is concerted effort of our faction trying to take trikeeps back, i dont even bother because i know im gonna get zerged down for even taking resources at our own factions trikeeps

FlopsyPrince

The second "all red" map is far more common when I try to go into Cyrodiil, especially to run the daily town quests.

I have enough issues with PvP (as many know) but this is not a serious issue in my view. I just go to a different campaign or do something else in the game. I am not the prime PvP target of course, but I don't think that many "PvP people" exist if the pop caps are so low for both CP campaigns.

Aurielle

Idinuse wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

Idinuse wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

There are low pop bonuses.

But what you are calling night capping is prime time for some countries. So unless you can make campaigns limited to specific time zones, I can't see a way to change this. I've often suggested transparency and matching ques. And making campaigns just 7 days. In a 7 day campaign, night capping might not change the end results as often. What about the double teaming? Yesterday ADC ran the whole map. But within hours EP had all their scrolls back. A few hours later, they had all 6 scrolls. I just checked and EP has all 6 scrolls now.

I would just like something that is 2v2. Not faction based. And lasts 2 hours. 50v50. I think the server could handle that number.

It may be "prime time for some countries", but what I can not fathom is what fun they see in PvDooring an entire server their whole "prime time". Are they not in it for some real PvP? Where's the fun? You know an entire continent does not compulsively have to be on one and the same faction every time all the time. IF they were really PvP players of rank, they would divide themselves over all three factions and actually play against each other. As it is now it's just sad and pathetic with no honor or skill involved what so ever other than in their own minds.

Maybe you should encourage the AD "nightcappers" on Blackreach to switch to Gray Host?

Current state of Blackreach on PCNA:

On the contrary. There is the incentive for EP to go Blackreach instead of GH, but I guess fighting real players isn't in EP's Night Cap Crew's genes.

Just log on to NA GH right now as of this post (August 13, 9AM) and it looks exactly the same as it did this time of day the last XXX days. EP gating both DC and AD. *SLOWCLAP*.

Edit: Never mind, not taking the bait. All I will say is that EP is obviously not the only faction guilty of taking the entire map unopposed during off-peak hours.

rprice1819_ESO

There's already a low pop bonus that can let a faction win by not logging on, why punish folk that actually play the game more than that. There is nothing stopping people from all over the world from logging on any time they want. Except for the low pop bonus things are as fair as can be the way they are.

Adamus

Why are 'night cappers' an issue only when EP is winning the campaign? The players during that time zone switch campaigns and factions all the time, often being the deciding factor if a faction wins or not. Whataboutism the day cappers who are playing when I'm at work? Because when EP isn't winning, all I hear is "who still cares about the score".

The score is useful and fun to play, it helps guide me who to attack and tactics to use. But if EP loses the camp, we lose, end of story, onto the next campaign. There are mechanics in the game for Low Pop and even some for low score, I remember a camp where a faction won by their low pop bonus. To be frank, I think they should get rid of the low pop bonus altogether (except for the bonus AP from the bonus, like that part).

Camps are won and lost, groups hope factions and ballgroups peak only to burn out. This isn't the first time this has happened either, those who think double teaming EP during primetime is going to change anything... it's not. Almost no one that plays during primetime is part of the NA night time crews... b/c those players are on the other side of the world, playing during their primetime hours. All the EP that play during primetime have to work in the morning and most of us are past the 'all nighter' stages of our lives.

As for lessons being taught, there are only two EP is really learning, it takes 2 factions united to beat us, and the level of poor sportsmanship there is in gaming.

Sorry your side is losing, camp's not over yet. A 5-10k lead is easily lost, especially with over half a month to go. The pendulum will swing back eventually. When it does, will you be back on the forums complaining about winning a campaign because there are people on the other side the world, who like the same game you do, and are playing it when you can't?

Note that my forum level is a golf score.

Aurielle

Adamus wrote: »

Why are 'night cappers' an issue only when EP is winning the campaign? The players during that time zone switch campaigns and factions all the time, often being the deciding factor if a faction wins or not. Whataboutism the day cappers who are playing when I'm at work? Because when EP isn't winning, all I hear is "who still cares about the score".

Precisely. And where is the outrage over what AD and DC do in Blackreach every single day on PC NA? People are actually complaining about the scoreboard in Gray Host? Have they even seen Blackreach’s scoreboard? There’s nothing even remotely fair or balanced about that campaign. More EP-loyal Blackreach players are jumping ship and joining GH every day, and AD / DC appear to be quite content with that situation. If they weren’t happy about it, they’d have followed us over to GH.

TechMaybeHic

Deflection is always strong.

No matter who does it, where, or when, it can be addressed by better scoring mechanics that calculate population numbers in real time. Not this broken low pop bonus that lately doesn't appear much at all or in the past seemed to be gameable to win by not logging in.

A real-time scoring based on population ratio could allow players to contribute when they want and still gain without running the campaign out of reach. Or you could have the scoring impacted by actual battles more, rather than strictly on control points. Or both.

The only reason to be against encouraging competitive play is some over inflated sense of accomplishment, somehow from winning unchallenged

FireBreathingNord

3 Random Cents

1. Time zones naturally create uneven player activity, and this is an inherent aspect of GLOBAL multiplayer games. The advantage some factions gain during specific time periods is a normal outcome of having players from different regions, and attempting to level this out could disrupt the natural ebb and flow of player activity.

2. Night capping is just one of many strategies used in competitive play. Each faction has access to the same tools and tactics, and if a faction is losing due to night capping, it’s also a reflection of their inability to counteract these tactics. The issue may not be with the strategy itself but with how well it’s being countered.

3. Players might find ways to exploit a scaling system, such as by deliberately coordinating to have a low number of defenders or attackers to maximize their point gain. This could lead to new forms of manipulation rather than solving anything.

Blackrim

FireBreathingNord wrote: »

3 Random Cents

1. Time zones naturally create uneven player activity, and this is an inherent aspect of GLOBAL multiplayer games. The advantage some factions gain during specific time periods is a normal outcome of having players from different regions, and attempting to level this out could disrupt the natural ebb and flow of player activity.

2. Night capping is just one of many strategies used in competitive play. Each faction has access to the same tools and tactics, and if a faction is losing due to night capping, it’s also a reflection of their inability to counteract these tactics. The issue may not be with the strategy itself but with how well it’s being countered.

3. Players might find ways to exploit a scaling system, such as by deliberately coordinating to have a low number of defenders or attackers to maximize their point gain. This could lead to new forms of manipulation rather than solving anything.

Your statements are logical, but they do not address the issue of night capping, which is a significant problem within the game. The fact that one faction can achieve over 10 campaign victories indicates a systemic imbalance. In my view, the scoring system should be revised and linked to the population activity of all alliances to ensure fair competition between factions.

Blackrim

rprice1819_ESO wrote: »

There's already a low pop bonus that can let a faction win by not logging on, why punish folk that actually play the game more than that. There is nothing stopping people from all over the world from logging on any time they want. Except for the low pop bonus things are as fair as can be the way they are.

As of now, to my knowledge, there is no low population bonus in the Grey Host campaign. I have not observed such a feature. It was present a year or two ago. I believe reinstating it would help ensure a natural balance to open world PvP.

Blackrim

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Deflection is always strong.

No matter who does it, where, or when, it can be addressed by better scoring mechanics that calculate population numbers in real time. Not this broken low pop bonus that lately doesn't appear much at all or in the past seemed to be gameable to win by not logging in.

A real-time scoring based on population ratio could allow players to contribute when they want and still gain without running the campaign out of reach. Or you could have the scoring impacted by actual battles more, rather than strictly on control points. Or both.

The only reason to be against encouraging competitive play is some over inflated sense of accomplishment, somehow from winning unchallenged

I think this is a great solution. Tethering AP gain to population ratios may also promote activity and conflict between the factions.

Blackrim

Adamus wrote: »

Why are 'night cappers' an issue only when EP is winning the campaign? The players during that time zone switch campaigns and factions all the time, often being the deciding factor if a faction wins or not. Whataboutism the day cappers who are playing when I'm at work? Because when EP isn't winning, all I hear is "who still cares about the score".

The score is useful and fun to play, it helps guide me who to attack and tactics to use. But if EP loses the camp, we lose, end of story, onto the next campaign. There are mechanics in the game for Low Pop and even some for low score, I remember a camp where a faction won by their low pop bonus. To be frank, I think they should get rid of the low pop bonus altogether (except for the bonus AP from the bonus, like that part).

Camps are won and lost, groups hope factions and ballgroups peak only to burn out. This isn't the first time this has happened either, those who think double teaming EP during primetime is going to change anything... it's not. Almost no one that plays during primetime is part of the NA night time crews... b/c those players are on the other side of the world, playing during their primetime hours. All the EP that play during primetime have to work in the morning and most of us are past the 'all nighter' stages of our lives.

As for lessons being taught, there are only two EP is really learning, it takes 2 factions united to beat us, and the level of poor sportsmanship there is in gaming.

Sorry your side is losing, camp's not over yet. A 5-10k lead is easily lost, especially with over half a month to go. The pendulum will swing back eventually. When it does, will you be back on the forums complaining about winning a campaign because there are people on the other side the world, who like the same game you do, and are playing it when you can't?

Note that my forum level is a golf score.

I want to clarify that my intention is not to target any specific group, but rather to foster a productive discussion. Night capping has been a recurring topic on the forum for the past two years, affecting all factions. This post addresses night capping issues across every campaign, acknowledging the responsibility of all three factions. Currently, the Ebonheart Pact appears to be employing this strategy most effectively in the Greyhost campaign. My aim is to encourage a constructive dialogue that seeks to enhance fairness and competitiveness in Cyrodiil for all factions. I believe this will provide a more fun and competitive environment for all players in Cyrodiil. It will promote a competitive drive between all factions to improve their player base and compete between one another with high end strategy.

darvaria

I've just lived through years of night capping so I don't think about it I guess. It was so bad on Azura's Star that the zone chat general would ask DC to let EP and DC get some keeps so they wouldn't quit.

But you can't just call out GH because EP is winning. I think EP went 2 years without winning a campaign. I quit for almost a year because I was mostly playing at night and AD ran the map yellow and you couldn't even cap a resource. DC controlled the map, emp and everything for about 3 years back in the 2015-2018. I mean CONTROLLED. I actually rerolled with my guild to EP because there were no fights if you were DC.

Only balance will fix it where you it's X v X. Only way to fix. And transparency lets see those numbers. A much smaller map and 2 hour games.

You can't change the scoring. How about that 3 hour fight at Arrius yesterday? When DC and AD did NOT fight anywhere on the entire map? 3 sides will NEVER give you an even fight.

I know OP means well, but there just isn't a way. Wait a year or two and the tables will turn, as that has been my experience in 10 years of going to Cyro.