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ZOS didn't raise pop cap for MYM event, cap lowest in history of Cyrodiil, queue times longest ever
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Crown✭✭✭✭✭
✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Edited by Crown on 3 March 2024 21:59Crown | AD NB | First AD/NA Grand Overlord (2015/12/26)
PvP Guides @ DarkElves.com3 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
@Crown
I would expect Miats would only count a character once but are we sure that is the case?
If so it is very interesting since some say they have access to an addon that tells them how many players are in Cyrodiil but the rest of us cannot use the addon and others say that anyone who PvPs regularly "knows" the pop cap is 60. So much for that super secret mysterious addon.
What is the highest number you have seen outside of MYM?
Just a couple of quotes in reference to comments asking for something to support claims that the pop cap is 60.It's so bizarre the lengths people will go to trying to prove that these claims are "misinformation or conspiracy".SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »Necrotech_Master wrote: »Reginald_leBlem wrote: »60 per faction is not very many... how did we find that number?
guesses/speculation, thats it (i dont believe its that low, but i also believe that what we have is too low still)
the last like 3 years the queue times for grey host have had 2 hour queue times during the whitestrake event, always
even blackreach gets like nearly 40-60 in the queue during the event, so i always end up playing in one of the 7 day cp camps which usually dont have queue or small queues
I agree that the numbers are pure speculation. Even what the original cap was years ago is probably speculation but it does not matter since there is no reasonable expectation that we would see 600 players per faction in one campaign.SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »alternatelder wrote: »Did you go around and do a head count to get that accurate number?
Yes, it's possible to do an exact head count. The cap is 60 players/faction now. The original cap was 600/faction, just for reference.
How is it possible? If it is possible the supporting information for such a claim can be provided here in the forums. I say that because we are not able to run around counting players.
There is at least one add on that can do a head count. It was created because ZOS won't tell us what the cap is, and the add on is not available on minion.
Why not name the addon and provide a link to download it? The suggestion that the cap is set to 60 has seemed to cryptic.
I'm also aware of a private software program that can do a head count of the zone a player is in. It's private though, and I wouldn't call it an add on, and the author specifically stated that the software is not to be shared publicly. It was created specifically to determine populations in cyrodiil and doesn't do anything else. I'm sure if you looked hard enough you could find out what it's called and where to get it. If ZOS would just tell us what the cap was and when they made changes to the cap software like this would not be necessary.
If it is private it is not open for us to know it is accurate or even close to it. As such we have no reason to take anyone's word on the matter.
Show me the real data is how I roll.
When you get ZOS to tell us what the population cap is in cyrodiil with an official announcement then you'll have a valid point.
My point is solid and precise. It is the existence, let alone accuracy, of the mysterious addon that is in question.
Claiming something doesn't exist because a person doesn't know about it is a logical fallacy. I'll leave it to you to look up which specific logical fallacy it is.
The software exists. I've seen it and it confirms the population cap estimates people are citing. I'm guessing that this software is not released widely to the public because ZOS wouldn't appreciate it very much and/or it might be using the UI interface in a manner not approved by ZOS.
I was able to find the software online when someone told me about it, so it's likely you could find it too if you looked hard enough.
Edited by Amottica on 4 March 2024 05:141 -
FlopsyPrince✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭One of the worst parts about a pop cap is that you can be kicked waiting to get through the queue. (Yeah, I do run with groups at times. I die a lot, but at least I have a chance with a group.)PC
PS4/PS51 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Doesn't Miats count guards as friendlies too in some situations?@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Roleplay Circle (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Banana Squad)1 -
SaffronCitrusflower✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Miats is showing 82 fellow AD players, while only two other group members are showing on your map, and you're not in combat? I thought Miats only counted players you were in combat with? That's what it says in the Miats add on description.3 -
Crown✭✭✭✭✭
✭I would expect Miats would only count a character once but are we sure that is the case?
If so it is very interesting since some say they have access to an addon that tells them how many players are in Cyrodiil but the rest of us cannot use the addon and others say that anyone who PvPs regularly "knows" the pop cap is 60. So much for that super secret mysterious addon.
What is the highest number you have seen outside of MYM?
Just a couple of quotes in reference to comments asking for something to support claims that the pop cap is 60.It's so bizarre the lengths people will go to trying to prove that these claims are "misinformation or conspiracy".
I'm not aware of an addon that can show the entire population, but I'm 100% certain that it's way above 60. Every Friday when our group of 12 runs (7-9pm eastern) there's an AD guild raiding at the same time that regularly has 50-60 people in their discord, another that often has 10-12 semi-comped as some of us move over to their raid at 9pm. There's also a pick up running at the same time, and there's always the notable solos. Just from that, there's at least 50 +12 +10 + a few 5/6's and solos = at least 80 outside of mayhem on Friday evenings. The largest Miat counter I recall seeing in the past few months was just over 100 for AD when defending Fare, and just over 100 for EP when we were farming Arrius.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Doesn't Miats count guards as friendlies too in some situations?
I vaguely remember it doing so in the long long ago. In this case the number was consistent before and after the flip, so probably not. I just tested porting to an AD keep and it's showing 2 AD here.Crown | AD NB | First AD/NA Grand Overlord (2015/12/26)
PvP Guides @ DarkElves.com3 -
alternatelder✭✭✭✭✭
✭SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Miats is showing 82 fellow AD players, while only two other group members are showing on your map, and you're not in combat? I thought Miats only counted players you were in combat with? That's what it says in the Miats add on description.
It doesn't say that, neither does it say it counts friendly guards as someone mentioned. It counts players you've encountered."Provides the numbers of players that attacked/buffed/healed you or get attack/buffed/healed by you or those you mouseovered within the last 10 seconds"Edited by alternatelder on 4 March 2024 16:460 -
Necrotech_Master✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
based on my experience i would believe the pop caps are something around there too, though i think it still feels too low for the overall size of cyrodiil
was it mentioned what the pop cap was adjusted to during the population stress test last year?plays PC/NA
handle @Necrotech_Master
active player since april 2014
i have my main house (grand topal hideaway) listed in the housing tours, it has multiple target dummies, scribing altar, and grandmaster stations (in progress being filled out), as well as almost every antiquity furnishing on display to preview them
feel free to stop by and use the facilities1 -
SaffronCitrusflower✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭alternatelder wrote: »SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Miats is showing 82 fellow AD players, while only two other group members are showing on your map, and you're not in combat? I thought Miats only counted players you were in combat with? That's what it says in the Miats add on description.
It doesn't say that, neither does it say it counts friendly guards as someone mentioned. It counts players you've encountered."Provides the numbers of players that attacked/buffed/healed you or get attack/buffed/healed by you or those you mouseovered within the last 10 seconds"
If "players that attacked/buffed/healed you or get attack/buffed/healed by you" doesn't mean "in combat with", what does it mean?
There is very obviously something not adding up right with the picture Crown posted.
Edited by SaffronCitrusflower on 4 March 2024 19:213 -
alternatelder✭✭✭✭✭
✭SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »alternatelder wrote: »SaffronCitrusflower wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
Miats is showing 82 fellow AD players, while only two other group members are showing on your map, and you're not in combat? I thought Miats only counted players you were in combat with? That's what it says in the Miats add on description.
It doesn't say that, neither does it say it counts friendly guards as someone mentioned. It counts players you've encountered."Provides the numbers of players that attacked/buffed/healed you or get attack/buffed/healed by you or those you mouseovered within the last 10 seconds"
If "players that attacked/buffed/healed you or get attack/buffed/healed by you" doesn't mean "in combat with", what does it mean?
You don't actually need to be in combat with anyone to get buffed by them. I mean, that last part is what was targeting your comment anyway.Edited by alternatelder on 4 March 2024 20:210 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I would expect Miats would only count a character once but are we sure that is the case?
If so it is very interesting since some say they have access to an addon that tells them how many players are in Cyrodiil but the rest of us cannot use the addon and others say that anyone who PvPs regularly "knows" the pop cap is 60. So much for that super secret mysterious addon.
What is the highest number you have seen outside of MYM?
Just a couple of quotes in reference to comments asking for something to support claims that the pop cap is 60.It's so bizarre the lengths people will go to trying to prove that these claims are "misinformation or conspiracy".
I'm not aware of an addon that can show the entire population, but I'm 100% certain that it's way above 60. Every Friday when our group of 12 runs (7-9pm eastern) there's an AD guild raiding at the same time that regularly has 50-60 people in their discord, another that often has 10-12 semi-comped as some of us move over to their raid at 9pm. There's also a pick up running at the same time, and there's always the notable solos. Just from that, there's at least 50 +12 +10 + a few 5/6's and solos = at least 80 outside of mayhem on Friday evenings. The largest Miat counter I recall seeing in the past few months was just over 100 for AD when defending Fare, and just over 100 for EP when we were farming Arrius.Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Doesn't Miats count guards as friendlies too in some situations?
I vaguely remember it doing so in the long long ago. In this case the number was consistent before and after the flip, so probably not. I just tested porting to an AD keep and it's showing 2 AD here.
Thank you for all the verification and actual information to support it from an app that is not super secret.
Those of us that PvP in Cyrodiil often now know the cap is not 60.
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Stridig✭✭✭✭✭
✭Thank goodness! That was a ton of energy from alot of people, just to find out some guesses may be closer than others. Great work!Enemy to many
Friend to all1 -
Tiphis✭✭✭✭There was always campaign with open spots. We have fewer and fewer people pvping every year. They did the right thing and didn't bother stressing servers for those few that did pvp.0 -
TheDink✭✭✭Whatever the population cap was for the Mayhem event, it was not high enough.
There is no reason for there to be an hour+ long queue to play something that is losing its playerbase.
I didn't lag at all during my time playing this event. I would much rather have more players and be lagging if that's truly the cost.Also known as One Calorie
HAIL NIGHT BLADER
rip bwb1 -
Ashryn✭✭✭✭✭I enjoyed MYM very much this year. The only campaign that I noticed that had a long wait to get in was Gray Host on PC NA. Although I started on Gray Host before the event even started, it was too long to get in at all hours. I just switched then to Ashpit and had a blast. This was the first MYM that I had no problem getting into a group, didn't crash, and only had the 'still in combat' bug on rare occasions. Perhaps there needs to be more Alliance -locked campaigns around then just Gray Host.2 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Whatever the population cap was for the Mayhem event, it was not high enough.
There is no reason for there to be an hour+ long queue to play something that is losing its playerbase.
I didn't lag at all during my time playing this event. I would much rather have more players and be lagging if that's truly the cost.
I think many of us would agree that having a high pop cap would be nice. I wish I had played ESO back when it had a higher pop cap. It would be interesting to see the pop cap of 600/faction if it was ever that high.
I think the design GW2 has might serve the game well. The pop cap per map is not in the hundreds per team but there are four maps tied together into one match. One can freely move between maps as long as that specific map is not pop-capped for their team. It does change some dynamics but works to reduce population-related lag to a minimum. Peak Times would still have all maps pop-locked as long as ESO has enough players interested in AvA.
I like how ESO is different from other games so I do not want it to be like GW2. Just thinking of a way that more action can be in one campaign yet not increase lag due to the number of players that are in one area or on one map.
Edited by Amottica on 7 March 2024 07:060 -
StackonClown✭✭✭✭✭Dont people claim ESO has millions of players yet 0.00000001% play PVP on a given campaign / platform?
Why do you need 'mega' servers for few hundred players, guess a mini-server might be better.0 -
alternatelder✭✭✭✭✭
✭StackonClown wrote: »Dont people claim ESO has millions of players yet 0.00000001% play PVP on a given campaign / platform?
Why do you need 'mega' servers for few hundred players, guess a mini-server might be better.
When you forget that pve, the most popular part of a game, exists in an mmo...0 -
RetPing✭✭✭✭✭StackonClown wrote: »Dont people claim ESO has millions of players yet 0.00000001% play PVP on a given campaign / platform?
Why do you need 'mega' servers for few hundred players, guess a mini-server might be better.
Has million of accounts, not players.
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CrazyKitty✭✭✭✭✭The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
82/0/1 ???
How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.3 -
Desiato✭✭✭✭✭
✭StackonClown wrote: »Dont people claim ESO has millions of players yet 0.00000001% play PVP on a given campaign / platform?
Why do you need 'mega' servers for few hundred players, guess a mini-server might be better.
The term "Megaserver" doesn't refer to a single massively powerful server, but rather a load balancing strategy and instancing technologies that allow each region/platform to have a single unified "server" instead of multiple like a game like WoW. (maybe wow is different now, I don't know anything about it anymore). Even in WoW, a single server is actually a cluster of VMs composed of probably hundreds or possibly thousands of individual physical servers.
Each overland PVE zone in ESO is composed of sub zones with a population cap. When the cap is reached, the game dynamically creates new instances of the subzone. You can see this in effect during prime time in busy subzones like mournhold in deshaan.
I've read that Cyrodiil is also composed of subzones that work without instances, which helps isolate lag to specific high load areas, although it does not work as intended as the entire map will feel at least some impact from a high load fight in one subzone.CrazyKitty wrote: »How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
That screenshot would probably have been taken in the aftermath of a large fight in which the OP's alliance won. The enemies were all dispatched and the winning alliance was taking resources and probably chilling for a minute.Edited by Desiato on 7 March 2024 18:17spending a year dead for tax reasons0 -
Crown✭✭✭✭✭
✭CrazyKitty wrote: »82/0/1 ??? How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
AD faction stack mostly PvDoored BRK while DC hit Arrius. Typical team green stuff.Crown | AD NB | First AD/NA Grand Overlord (2015/12/26)
PvP Guides @ DarkElves.com0 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭.CrazyKitty wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
82/0/1 ???
How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
The addon counts the alliance of characters they came in contact with. If they came in contact with players that were part of only one alliance then this is the type of results players would see.
View the video that is linked in a post on the second page of this thread. It shows the same addon in use and the count is pretty much only in one alliance.
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CrazyKitty✭✭✭✭✭.CrazyKitty wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
82/0/1 ???
How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
The addon counts the alliance of characters they came in contact with. If they came in contact with players that were part of only one alliance then this is the type of results players would see.
View the video that is linked in a post on the second page of this thread. It shows the same addon in use and the count is pretty much only in one alliance.
Please refrain from posting in reply to anything I may post in the future.
Edited by CrazyKitty on 9 March 2024 13:324 -
alternatelder✭✭✭✭✭
✭CrazyKitty wrote: ».CrazyKitty wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
82/0/1 ???
How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
The addon counts the alliance of characters they came in contact with. If they came in contact with players that were part of only one alliance then this is the type of results players would see.
View the video that is linked in a post on the second page of this thread. It shows the same addon in use and the count is pretty much only in one alliance.
It was a rhetorical question. [snip]
If they can read the description of the addon and understand how it works, they are qualified to answer a simple question.
[edited to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on 9 March 2024 12:194 -
heng14rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭Greetings,
We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.
Thank you for your understanding.
ZOS, can we have the pop locked number plz ?0 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CrazyKitty wrote: »
Please refrain from posting in reply to anything I may post in the future..CrazyKitty wrote: »The most players I've seen together in the current Mayhem is was 94 AD, 70 DC and 40 EP based on Miat's counter. We were zerging pretty hard, and I don't believe that there would have been more than 20 something other AD on the whole map. My best guess for population cap during the event in the mid-evening is 120.
Here's us around 2pm. This was everything happening on the map with AD swords, so other than the folks RP'ing at the gates we are pop locked with a rather large queue:
82/0/1 ???
How does that happen? Something is very obviously off with this.
The addon counts the alliance of characters they came in contact with. If they came in contact with players that were part of only one alliance then this is the type of results players would see.
View the video that is linked in a post on the second page of this thread. It shows the same addon in use and the count is pretty much only in one alliance.
Creating a thread or even posting in a thread is asking for feedback on the topic or post.
Furthermore, my request for the source of suggestions that the pop cap is 60, which is very much germane to the thread, has been proven to be a worthy line of questioning as demonstrated by the screenshot from Crown showing that miats counted 82 from one faction and that they had seen as high as 94 from a single faction.
I agree that it would be nice to know what the actual pop cap.
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CrazyKitty✭✭✭✭✭Can a moderator please close this thread?
[snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on 10 March 2024 16:283 -
ZOS_IcymodGreetings,
We would like to remind everyone to please keep conversations constructive and relevant to the forum topic. With that being said, we are going to go ahead and close this thread as per the request of the OP.
Thank you for your understanding.
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This discussion has been closed.