Vampires Online - 10 years later

SandandStars · January 28

I dont play vamp and I still do extremely well in bgs, until I run into a player of equal skill on vamp, who is also running masterdw vatesh maarselok & dragons appetite.

Still like to duel them though, as they can no doubt tell that undeath and op proc gear is the only thing keeping them alive. Honor is not dead. 🥱

Akatron · January 28

The undead passiv give you only a short extansion of your reaction time at low HP-moments.

It makes you not unkillable but that reaction-moment can help, especially new pvp-ones and low APM-Player, against stealth-ganker. And with help i mean you have a chance to survive but no guarantee.

All in all an undead nerf is like an stealth-ganker buff.

Minno · January 30

vamp fire dmg used to REALLY hurt back in the day. But it was very popular back in 2014 because the ultimate used to make you invisible and wiped zergs. Back then classes that couldnt move had miss chance in their kit so they didnt look for mobility (dk's and templars). So vampire got REALLY popular when they took away that defense from these classes and they only had mist form for mobility.

It needs it's fire dmg weakness returned. Or a day/night cycle added so you are weaker in day cycles. Personally I like the day cycle RPG flare better for this, but mechanically the fire weakness is better to match across all game modes.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · January 30

Daruq wrote: »

[Snip]

The designers have over 25y experience, they are coming from DAOC, at least the initial ones.
However as with DAOC, they made the SAME MISTAKES.

Crippling some classes on PVP "just because" for no reason (DAOC- Champion, ESO initial Templar), making a class that is totally OP stupid (DAOC - Minstrel, ESO Vampires) and at any point when some skill or gear was able to push that class, got nerfed (DAOC - Lurikeen Ranger).

[Edited quote]

moo_2021 · January 31

Daruq wrote: »

[Snip]

Vampire is not a class but a bonus skill line you can add to all your non-ww characters. It costs zero and barely affects anything.

[Edited quote]

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · February 1

moo_2021 wrote: »

Daruq wrote: »

[Snip]

Vampire is not a class but a bonus skill line you can add to all your non-ww characters. It costs zero and barely affects anything.

[Edited quote]

And this post is prime example about my initial argument.

Vampire has ONLY benefits and ZERO drawbacks compared to a non-Vampire.

Especially Dark Elf Vampire which negates the fire weakness.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · February 1

Akatron wrote: »

The undead passiv give you only a short extansion of your reaction time at low HP-moments.

It makes you not unkillable but that reaction-moment can help, especially new pvp-ones and low APM-Player, against stealth-ganker. And with help i mean you have a chance to survive but no guarantee.

All in all an undead nerf is like an stealth-ganker buff.

Is not only the Undeath giving you 30% mitigation based on Health Missing.

Is also Strike from the Shadows, getting out mist and getting a 500+ Weapon/Spell Damage (300 + buffs) and Unnatural Movement which is making you Invisible when you sprint over 3 seconds.

A mortal DOES NOT have anything to counter this. That is why almost every single character is Vampire.

THERE ARE NO PENALTIES, only bonuses compared to a Mortal.

That is why ZOS either needs to drop the nerf hammer on Vampire or buff the Mortals to be able to compete in Cyrodiil.

moo_2021 · February 1

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

moo_2021 wrote: »

Daruq wrote: »

[Snip]

Vampire is not a class but a bonus skill line you can add to all your non-ww characters. It costs zero and barely affects anything.

[Edited quote]

And this post is prime example about my initial argument.

Vampire has ONLY benefits and ZERO drawbacks compared to a non-Vampire.

Especially Dark Elf Vampire which negates the fire weakness.

So why not get a vampire skill line? It's not a race. Would anyone refuse to join fighter's guild or mage's guild for roleplay reasons?

SmellyUnlimited · February 2

The only real counter to vampires are werewolves. Has Twilight taught us nothing!? Or Underworld?? Vampires should fear fur and fang. Give werewolves a hard counter to vampires and let Cyro rage with the legendary war to end all wars.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · February 2

moo_2021 wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

moo_2021 wrote: »

Daruq wrote: »

[Snip]

Vampire is not a class but a bonus skill line you can add to all your non-ww characters. It costs zero and barely affects anything.

[Edited quote]

And this post is prime example about my initial argument.

Vampire has ONLY benefits and ZERO drawbacks compared to a non-Vampire.

Especially Dark Elf Vampire which negates the fire weakness.

So why not get a vampire skill line? It's not a race. Would anyone refuse to join fighter's guild or mage's guild for roleplay reasons?

Because I DO NOT WANT TO PLAY A VAMPIRE. You exactly confirm my argument for 10 years.

There is no bonus to play a mortal, having resulted the game to be "Vampires Online" instead of Elder Scrolls Online.

If it was true Elder Scrolls game, at least daytime in Cyrodiil would be absolute lethal to vampires as they would have died instantly.

FluffyBird · February 2

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

The only real counter to vampires are werewolves. Has Twilight taught us nothing!? Or Underworld??

Baldur's Gate 3, for example, teaches us that "the biggest threat to a vampire is another vampire"

moo_2021 · February 3

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

Because I DO NOT WANT TO PLAY A VAMPIRE. You exactly confirm my argument for 10 years.

There is no bonus to play a mortal, having resulted the game to be "Vampires Online" instead of Elder Scrolls Online.

If it was true Elder Scrolls game, at least daytime in Cyrodiil would be absolute lethal to vampires as they would have died instantly.

What's the reason not to? It looks the same with custom skin, no skills, only passives.

Just get a bite and enjoy being superhuman.

Erickson9610 · February 10

Heals_With_Orbs wrote: »

What I would like to ask is who decided that vampires can run around in the day time with no penalty? They are creatures of the night, alongside werewolves, who transform under a full moon. There should be a severe penalty for players like this in PVP. Why has the lore of vampires changed in this game?

Werewolves in TES don't follow all of the modern day werewolf tropes — notably, they don't always transform on full moons. Consider how in TES III, you would automatically transform every night, or how in TES V (which inspired the implementation in ESO) you would only transform whenever you use the transformation ability, which can be used at any time of day.

It's important to keep in mind that ESO is a video game. Imagine locking players out of content like a werewolf transformation just because they didn't log in while both moons were full — then imagine their frustration when they want to do things in town but they're forced into werewolf form for several hours unwillingly.

Yes, the roleplaying factor suffers if you believe that all werewolves must transform on a full moon (you can thank the film The Wolf Man (1941) for that addition to modern day werewolf lore) but werewolves in TES operate slightly differently. It's not worth trying to enforce certain roleplay aspects if the gameplay suffers significantly because of it.

Besides, ESO and Skyrim already have their unique way of blending werewolf roleplay with gameplay — you extend your transformation as long as you keep slaughtering and devouring prey, and your transformation lasts longer for every transformed werewolf in your pack. It's a clever way to reinforce the roleplay fantasy that werewolves are bloodthirsty beasts who group together; it incentivizes players to act in this manner, rather than punishing them for not doing so.

If you want werewolves to be more prominent during the night of full moons, then give them a buff of some kind while the moons are full to incentivize players to transform at those times. Don't nerf werewolves just because the moons aren't currently full.

Oblivion_Protocol · February 11

I mean, if you don’t want to be a vampire, then don’t. No one is forcing you to do so. But if you want to PvP, you’ll need to accept that some things are more effective than others, and vampire is one of those things. That’s just the nature of a competitive game.

finehair · February 12

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

The only real counter to vampires are werewolves. Has Twilight taught us nothing!? Or Underworld?? Vampires should fear fur and fang. Give werewolves a hard counter to vampires and let Cyro rage with the legendary war to end all wars.

yeah the campaign "Grayhost" would deserve the name

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · February 13

Oblivion_Protocol wrote: »

I mean, if you don’t want to be a vampire, then don’t. No one is forcing you to do so. But if you want to PvP, you’ll need to accept that some things are more effective than others, and vampire is one of those things. That’s just the nature of a competitive game.

Whole Cyrodiil been a vampire fest with mortals been at severe disadvantage because Nord DK Vampire Emperors were crying at the forums back in May 2014 that it was outrageous a Templar could kill them with FG abilities. If ZOS hadn't listened to them, been a Vampire could have been an alternative play option, not MANDATORY. When back then those of us responded "you’ll need to accept that some things are more effective than others" there was more crying and threats to rage quit.

Competitive game is World of Warships and there is a pretty good balance between different type of ships each one with it's own strengths and weaknesses. But this is not the case here.

So why not ZOS balance ESO? This is Elder Scrolls after all on the title not Vampires.

I don't ask to hit Vampires with the much needed nerf hammer and be done with it, however could make the option to be mortal competitive too. So each one can pick what they want.

And the tweaking is easy and within the Lore.

In Cyrodiil & BGs, Vampires should NOT have access to Fighters Guild abilities, should NOT have access to any fire ability, glyph even Dragonknights fire skills should be unavailable at PVP zones and buff Fighters Guild skills to their 10 years old state, with chance to crit one shot any vampire while doing +100% more damage against them applying effects like staggering etc.

Also ZOS has resolve the bug with the Mist Form & the Coil mythic.

Kartalin · February 13

Imagine the rage if vampires were locked to only using their skill line abilities while transformed like werewolves ...

fizzylu · February 13

Too bad Zenimax couldn't figure out how to do vampires right even the second time around.

moo_2021 · February 13

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

In Cyrodiil & BGs, Vampires should NOT have access to Fighters Guild abilities, should NOT have access to any fire ability, glyph even Dragonknights fire skills should be unavailable at PVP zones and buff Fighters Guild skills to their 10 years old state, with chance to crit one shot any vampire while doing +100% more damage against them applying effects like staggering etc.

Would people actually use guild skills? You don't know if your opponents are vampires, and the space for abilities is very limited. Even the current 20% boost would be great, if anyone uses them at all.

Also I'd still keep vampire in pvp because of being able to sprint across whole map in stealth, a very cheap spammable, and a second-life ultimate which beats all else.

Why can't people just accept the superior race?

huskandhunger · February 18

Aurrrrooo

[Incoherent werewolf noises]