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Nerf dizzing swing. Period.
Raideen
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EVERY. SINGLE. MATCH the core of what kills me, regardless of what character, regardless if its a tank, healer or DPS, regardless of 33k resist and 5k health...is dizzing swing. Its broken ZOS, FIX IT.
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Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It doesn’t matter what character you’re on or what you’re stats are if you just stand there and let them hit you. Just walk or roll dodge through them. Backing away just makes it easier for them to hit you. Can’t fix something that isn’t broke.
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Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I know how to roll dodge, I know how NOT to back peddle, that is not the point. I get jumped, stunned, dizzying swing, executioner dead.
On a tank today over resist cap without buffs (warden). 55k health. Got globaled by 2 people in 2 seconds while blocking.
Something is broken with the game, or people are exploting...I am seeing things like this all day.9 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I definitely agree with you on the “something is broken with the game” part, but that has nothing to do with dizzy being op or exploits.
Desyncs are at an all time high, so abilities can que up or worse you get hit by people that aren’t even on your screen yet and you see them hit you with skills 3 seconds after your dead lying on the ground.
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olsborg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Whats wierd is the CC from it is super hard to break, as if that insane skill needs a cc on it.
PC EU
PvP only8 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well think of it this way, the reason it's always there is because ZOS did a terrible job making its competitors well... competitive.PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK5 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Never a fan of begging for nerfs, but anything relied on this heavily by this many people is a sign that something's broken. That doesn't necessarily mean it's the ability itself that's that the problem, but it's absolutely a crutch ability, and ZOS needs to take a good look at why people lean so heavily on it."A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle12 -
THEDKEXPERIENCE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I’ve died to dizzying swing hundreds of times. It’s not broken. You simply need more things like immovable potions and have enough magic, health or stamina to withstand the initial barrage.
The problem isn’t your defenses, it’s your resource management.
On side note the way to combat people in ESO is via more offense, not more defense. You only need enough defense to absorb a massive stamina barrage. Once they are gassed ... it won’t take long if they are using dizzying swing ... melt them.9 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭i agree op. dizzing swing is used by a lot of people because its too good. i think people exploit too, i mean there are lots of videos of people showing exploits but covering their names and skills so i know exploits are true.
i die a lot to dragon knights leaping on me, stunning me then using dizzing swing 1 or 2 times. its dumb how much damage they do and this happens a lot.
when u see people all using similar builds and skills, its because they r op."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes12 -
Pixiepumpkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Whats wierd is the CC from it is super hard to break, as if that insane skill needs a cc on it.
clearly not if 2 dps can kill a tank like that is a couple seconds. i have had it happen to me too."Class identity isn’t just about power or efficiency. It’s about symbolic clarity, mechanical cohesion, and a shared visual and tactical language between players." - sans-culottes5 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Well think of it this way, the reason it's always there is because ZOS did a terrible job making its competitors well... competitive.
^Exactly this, other than surprise attack and jabs which are class specific, there are no other options. Bleed builds used to be viable, but people complained too much and they nerfed them into uselessness.
Nerfing dizzy would eliminate most stamina classes except stamblade and then everyone would start complaining about gankers again.
Personally I’d rather they leave dizzy alone and add a high damage spammable to duel wield to add more variety.
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HankTwo✭✭✭✭✭Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).PC EU
Stam DK, Magden, Magplar, Stamcro, Hybrid Sorc, Magblade & Mag DK3 -
wheem_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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Magicka builds can just go pound sand, I guess.Personally I’d rather they leave dizzy alone and add a high damage spammable to duel wield to add more variety.
Dizzying Swing is a major outlier among all "generic" spammable abilities, both Stam and Mag, and I think it would be a terrible idea to make it the measuring stick for other Stamina spammables while leaving Magicka in the dust.
Everyone with a modicum of PvP experience, especially from before the current proc meta, knows that any Stamina class with a delayed burst ability is incredibly dangerous when properly combo'ing it with Dizzying Swing (plus the off-GCD stun mechanic) and Dawnbreaker. It's actually still an incredibly potent combination in the current meta, especially since you can now stack the Vateshran 2h proc on top of it. This sort of gameplay forms the basis for the explosion of Stam Sorc builds recently, though it's obviously still viable on other classes as well (just with lesser mobility/sustain than is available to Stam Sorc).
But is the same true for Magicka builds? Is anyone scared of a Magicka Warden hitting them with a Crushing Shock -> Medium Attack -> Deep Fissure -> Dawnbreaker combo?10 -
Dunning_Kruger✭✭✭✭I know how to roll dodge, I know how NOT to back peddle, that is not the point. I get jumped, stunned, dizzying swing, executioner dead.
On a tank today over resist cap without buffs (warden). 55k health. Got globaled by 2 people in 2 seconds while blocking.
Something is broken with the game, or people are exploting...I am seeing things like this all day.
Or they are better
____________________________________
A G G R O - the legendary stamplar GM of <HALL MONITORS>
For the Queen bby10 -
wheem_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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Sounds like he's running something more akin to a PvE tank than the health-stacked, proc'd up Stamina Warden builds that people actually complain about.
Edit: And those Warden builds that everyone hates also typically utilize Dizzying Swing as well, since why wouldn't you? Even when wearing proc sets it'll hit harder than Magicka spammables from people in stat sets, while also allowing for an off-GCD stun to combo with your Shalks, Dawnbreaker, and procs.Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on 16 February 2021 15:025 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Not really dizzying swing that's the problem, but more the fact that medium weaves are considered the same as fully charges heavy attacks. A medium weave will therefore cause the target to get stunned once they're put off-balance from the initial hit. If the timing is good you can land the medium weave almost instantly after the dizzying swing lands (when checking combat metrics it's doable to land it anywhere from 0,1-0,2 seconds after dizzy hits).
The medium weave stun is one of the most unreliable stuns to break free from in the game. And against classes with delayed burst (stamden/stamcro), getting stunnes the medium weave is almost equal to a death in most cases. And with the only reliable counterplay being blockspaming or occasionally popping an immovable pot.
I'd rework medium weaves so they're not considered as heavy attacks, and therefore require a fully charged heavg attack if you wanna stun an offbalanced target.5 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
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The medium weave stun is one of the most unreliable stuns to break free from in the game.
Break Free is unreliable period. But that has nothing to do with DS. Fix break free or server performance. I'm convinced a lot skills people think are a problem are not. What makes them a problem is lag, positional desyncs, health desyncs, skills/abilities not firing, etc.
Besides next chapter you get auto CC break and almost permanent CC immunity in CP. DS is going away naturally.
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Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
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[snip] I made reference to dizzing swing being op REGARDLESS of what character/build type I am on. This ranges from healers, to magicka DPS, to stamina DPS and including 55k health, 4.5k health regen, 36k resist builds (a build made for PVP to be a ball carrier).
The fact that stamina classes can spam ONE ability to do gnarly DPS, Stun, and snare is plain broken.
[snip]
[Edited to remove Baiting]Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on 16 February 2021 15:035 -
Unified_Gaming✭✭✭✭Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).
I'd disagree with this - dizzy is bar far one of the best skills in the game. High burst, dirt cheap, sets off balance for bonus damage or resource return on heavy and acts as a pseudo stun and also snares the target if they're cc immune.
Add rally giving minor endurance for 20% regen, major brutality for more damage and a burst heal for also being cheap makes 2h even more of a necessity.
To compliment the two strong skills they have an execute that has the best scaling for pvp starting from 50% hp on a pretty high base skill which goes up to 400% stronger.
So what top tier people are you referring to? Are you referring to the stamsorcs that spec into azureblight to make dual wield possible?Unified Gaming - creating a shared and Unified Gaming community.
For some of the best and most up to date PVP builds around or useful tips and tricks from an experienced player for PvP and PvE, then check out my channel and consider subscribing if you want to see regular ESO content.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCorbta-fAHKJcxJ6ExbtPwg/10 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Unified_Gaming wrote: »Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).
I'd disagree with this - dizzy is bar far one of the best skills in the game. High burst, dirt cheap, sets off balance for bonus damage or resource return on heavy and acts as a pseudo stun and also snares the target if they're cc immune.
Add rally giving minor endurance for 20% regen, major brutality for more damage and a burst heal for also being cheap makes 2h even more of a necessity.
To compliment the two strong skills they have an execute that has the best scaling for pvp starting from 50% hp on a pretty high base skill which goes up to 400% stronger.
So what top tier people are you referring to? Are you referring to the stamsorcs that spec into azureblight to make dual wield possible?
Ty for all you do for the community. I appreciate your videos, they are very helpful.1 -
THEDKEXPERIENCE✭✭✭✭✭
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[snip] I made reference to dizzing swing being op REGARDLESS of what character/build type I am on. This ranges from healers, to magicka DPS, to stamina DPS and including 55k health, 4.5k health regen, 36k resist builds (a build made for PVP to be a ball carrier).
The fact that stamina classes can spam ONE ability to do gnarly DPS, Stun, and snare is plain broken.
[snip]
Like 3 years ago I thought that it was ridiculous how easy it was to pop hurricane and smash dizzying swing for easy wins.
Then I made a stam toon and realized that no, it’s not that easy. Some people are just good at the game.
I went back to my Magplar and all of his abilities that literally never miss.Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on 16 February 2021 15:037 -
L_Nici✭✭✭✭✭
✭I use D Swing, because I have no other choice on Stamsorc. There is no other Stamina Skill that I can use frequent in rotations since Stamsorcs class identity is basically hurricane. Templar doesn't use it, they have Jabs, Warden rarely uses it they have subs, NB doesn't use it, they have Surprise Attack, DK doesn't use it, because they play more with Claws and Dot.
Especially in that lag you call PvP D Swing gets more often stuck and stops you from using any skills than actually hitting for decent damage. Its extremely clunky, very unaccurate and to slow for the Positioning Desynch. Unlike Snipe that hits because it has autoaim and can only be avoided by dodging.Edited by L_Nici on 4 February 2021 17:17PC|EU1 -
WoppaBoem✭✭✭✭✭The skill itself is fine, them game play is so widely used because you pair this with executioner and is what makes it so much fun to play. But honestly if you die that fast and or so often if dizzy is nerfed whatever the next best new skill will be will be killing you a lot and you ask for another nerf.
Make sure you manage your resources, use block, try playing a dizzy character to see how it feels and learn how to counter it, be good in positioning, no mater how tanky if you don't block, heal and use line of sight you just die, over and over.
Asking for nerfs is easy, expanding your knowledge and skills is not but that will have more succes whatever flavor of skills will dominate. Have a good one.Xbox EU & NA - PVP Only4 -
Fawn4287✭✭✭✭✭
✭D swing is strong and the damage may be slightly overtuned, however there needs to be some damage benefits to fighting at melee range, if you give it the same damage as any old ranged spammable, why would you play at a melee range? A magsorcs combo is almost an entirely max ranged, c frags will travel around walls and hit twice as hard as any spammable.I find myself dying to unavoidable blindside by curse, endless + c frags, being hit by a hard incap from stealth or being snipe streamed far more often than obvious d swing + executioner spams which you can sprint away from.2 -
HankTwo✭✭✭✭✭@Unified_Gaming OK so first of all I have to say that I play PC EU no CP PvP. If you play on a different platform and/or CP instead of no CP, your personal experience might differ a lot from my own. Compared to 2h, dw is much more reliant on specific gear (for example master dw as I already mentioned, but there are other sets as well, like vate dw and draugrkin). However, if used correctly, it can be a very strong frontbar weapon on pretty much any class. That being said, here is a more detailed answer:Unified_Gaming wrote: »Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).
I'd disagree with this - dizzy is bar far one of the best skills in the game. High burst, dirt cheap, sets off balance for bonus damage or resource return on heavy and acts as a pseudo stun and also snares the target if they're cc immune.
Imo dizzy is great on paper, and gives a lot of utility for the cost. However, and this is the main point, the cast time on a melee skill makes it very clunky and unreliable in lag, where positional desyncs are rampant. This environment naturally favors true instant cast spammables, and therefore dizzy in a lot of real fight ends up being less useful than its tooltip suggest. Furthermore, good players can counter dizzy stamdens and necros quite well, by simply blocking the attacks when their respective burst skill (shalks/blastbones) is about to land (you don't need to hold block very long, roughly half a second every 3 seconds if the enemy is currently on the offense).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Yes, rally is a great skill, but this discussion was a bout dizzying. Apart from that two points to keep in mind:
1) You can actually use 2h quite well as a backbar weapon, especially with something like vate 2h (I do that). A powered 2h with rally, vigor, and your class heal will give you very strong healing. Biggest disadvantage is that you will lose the shield ult, but classes like stam DK and stamnecro can compensate with corrosive and goliath.
2) Stamden is far less reliant on rally since they already have a source of major brutality with netch and strong class healing, so they can play dw front snb backbar without much sacrifice. Other classes have less access, but stam DK still could use molten armaments (I've seen it successfully done by a stam DK friend of mine), sorcs have surge, and any class can use stam + crit + brutality pots (though admittedly they have limited use with a typical malacath + decent health regen build).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
1) Executioner doesn't have the highest scaling, that crown goes to the templar's jesus beam with up to 480% extra damage (which is undodgeable on top).
2) Executioner doesn't have a high base skill tooltip. Assuming same offensive stats, it is less than half of jesus beam, and pretty in line with both killers blade and poison injection's initial damage (and I've never seen someone claim poison injection's initial damage is high :P). A good example of an execute ability with rather high base damage would be whirling blades (roughly 45% higher than executioner).
3) This is mostly a gameplay style point, but imo executioner (I'm talking specifically about the morph here) doesn't synergize well with stamden, and only moderately with stamnecro and stam DK due to its pure single target nature. Especially stamden excels at high upfront aoe burst, so securing only one kill is not great if you could have killed multiple targets at once. So if you play like me and aim to get enemy groups into choke points and then aoe ult dump them for multiple kills at once, reverse slice and whirling blades are the better options. And when it comes to a comparison between those two I still prefer whirling blades due to its true aoe nature that doesn't require a target. For example, if your main target of reverse slice dodges, you wont do any damage to the enemy group.Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Honestly, with the current meta most good players I see play very gimmicky builds atm (health regen mist form with beam procs, proc healthden, shock heavy attack builds, stamsorcs abusing crystal weapons bug, some azureblight stamsorcs as you mentioned here and there, ...). Most of them don't even use dizzy and if they do then its the least of my concerns fighting them.
In my guild, we mostly switched to master dw frontbar with rending as our spammable and whirling blades as execute after greymoor went live, and every single player I recommended this play style to prefers it over dizzy after trying it out. It works well on stam DK, stamden, stamsorc, and I'm 100% sure it will work on stamnecro as well (a guildie will try it out the next couple of days). If the zergs are really big, master 2h with brawler as spammable is also a great option.PC EU
Stam DK, Magden, Magplar, Stamcro, Hybrid Sorc, Magblade & Mag DK5 -
Stahlor✭✭✭✭✭It doesn’t matter what character you’re on or what you’re stats are if you just stand there and let them hit you. Just walk or roll dodge through them. Backing away just makes it easier for them to hit you. Can’t fix something that isn’t broke.
That doesn't work, because it is so f... laggy, that you get hit by dizzy while sprinting and trying to escape, although there is nobody even close to you.2 -
Unified_Gaming✭✭✭✭@Unified_Gaming OK so first of all I have to say that I play PC EU no CP PvP. If you play on a different platform and/or CP instead of no CP, your personal experience might differ a lot from my own. Compared to 2h, dw is much more reliant on specific gear (for example master dw as I already mentioned, but there are other sets as well, like vate dw and draugrkin). However, if used correctly, it can be a very strong frontbar weapon on pretty much any class. That being said, here is a more detailed answer:Unified_Gaming wrote: »Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).
I'd disagree with this - dizzy is bar far one of the best skills in the game. High burst, dirt cheap, sets off balance for bonus damage or resource return on heavy and acts as a pseudo stun and also snares the target if they're cc immune.
Imo dizzy is great on paper, and gives a lot of utility for the cost. However, and this is the main point, the cast time on a melee skill makes it very clunky and unreliable in lag, where positional desyncs are rampant. This environment naturally favors true instant cast spammables, and therefore dizzy in a lot of real fight ends up being less useful than its tooltip suggest. Furthermore, good players can counter dizzy stamdens and necros quite well, by simply blocking the attacks when their respective burst skill (shalks/blastbones) is about to land (you don't need to hold block very long, roughly half a second every 3 seconds if the enemy is currently on the offense).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Yes, rally is a great skill, but this discussion was a bout dizzying. Apart from that two points to keep in mind:
1) You can actually use 2h quite well as a backbar weapon, especially with something like vate 2h (I do that). A powered 2h with rally, vigor, and your class heal will give you very strong healing. Biggest disadvantage is that you will lose the shield ult, but classes like stam DK and stamnecro can compensate with corrosive and goliath.
2) Stamden is far less reliant on rally since they already have a source of major brutality with netch and strong class healing, so they can play dw front snb backbar without much sacrifice. Other classes have less access, but stam DK still could use molten armaments (I've seen it successfully done by a stam DK friend of mine), sorcs have surge, and any class can use stam + crit + brutality pots (though admittedly they have limited use with a typical malacath + decent health regen build).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
1) Executioner doesn't have the highest scaling, that crown goes to the templar's jesus beam with up to 480% extra damage (which is undodgeable on top).
2) Executioner doesn't have a high base skill tooltip. Assuming same offensive stats, it is less than half of jesus beam, and pretty in line with both killers blade and poison injection's initial damage (and I've never seen someone claim poison injection's initial damage is high :P). A good example of an execute ability with rather high base damage would be whirling blades (roughly 45% higher than executioner).
3) This is mostly a gameplay style point, but imo executioner (I'm talking specifically about the morph here) doesn't synergize well with stamden, and only moderately with stamnecro and stam DK due to its pure single target nature. Especially stamden excels at high upfront aoe burst, so securing only one kill is not great if you could have killed multiple targets at once. So if you play like me and aim to get enemy groups into choke points and then aoe ult dump them for multiple kills at once, reverse slice and whirling blades are the better options. And when it comes to a comparison between those two I still prefer whirling blades due to its true aoe nature that doesn't require a target. For example, if your main target of reverse slice dodges, you wont do any damage to the enemy group.Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Honestly, with the current meta most good players I see play very gimmicky builds atm (health regen mist form with beam procs, proc healthden, shock heavy attack builds, stamsorcs abusing crystal weapons bug, some azureblight stamsorcs as you mentioned here and there, ...). Most of them don't even use dizzy and if they do then its the least of my concerns fighting them.
In my guild, we mostly switched to master dw frontbar with rending as our spammable and whirling blades as execute after greymoor went live, and every single player I recommended this play style to prefers it over dizzy after trying it out. It works well on stam DK, stamden, stamsorc, and I'm 100% sure it will work on stamnecro as well (a guildie will try it out the next couple of days). If the zergs are really big, master 2h with brawler as spammable is also a great option.
I play pc eu myself no cp and find that dizzy is better overall as it frees up a lot of bar space. Dual wield is reliant on a special weapon to be useful unless you are in a group and then spam whirling blade then yes it is better. You also need some extra sets like azureblight to make dual wield better which again shows that dual wield needs specific stuff to make it viable whereas dizzy doesn't. Works well with and without procs.
The issue with dizzy in my opinion is the number of extra effects and the issue with targeting isn't massive if you cast and then rotate rather than follow - you should never miss one then.
As for many of those builds - I've made videos on a lot of them - heavy attack builds, harbringer tank builds, mist form vate destro builds and recently a light attack build. The patch has a lot of options but I wouldn't say that the dizzying swing is weaker compared to them and if used right is phenomenal 1 v x. That is the angle I'm coming from - 1 v x it is too good to not use as you get so much free bar space.
Hope that helps.Edited by Unified_Gaming on 5 February 2021 19:10Unified Gaming - creating a shared and Unified Gaming community.
For some of the best and most up to date PVP builds around or useful tips and tricks from an experienced player for PvP and PvE, then check out my channel and consider subscribing if you want to see regular ESO content.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCorbta-fAHKJcxJ6ExbtPwg/0 -
HankTwo✭✭✭✭✭Unified_Gaming wrote: »@Unified_Gaming OK so first of all I have to say that I play PC EU no CP PvP. If you play on a different platform and/or CP instead of no CP, your personal experience might differ a lot from my own. Compared to 2h, dw is much more reliant on specific gear (for example master dw as I already mentioned, but there are other sets as well, like vate dw and draugrkin). However, if used correctly, it can be a very strong frontbar weapon on pretty much any class. That being said, here is a more detailed answer:Unified_Gaming wrote: »Most good PvPers I know don't even use dizzy since they feel like its too clunky (me included, master dw ftw).
I'd disagree with this - dizzy is bar far one of the best skills in the game. High burst, dirt cheap, sets off balance for bonus damage or resource return on heavy and acts as a pseudo stun and also snares the target if they're cc immune.
Imo dizzy is great on paper, and gives a lot of utility for the cost. However, and this is the main point, the cast time on a melee skill makes it very clunky and unreliable in lag, where positional desyncs are rampant. This environment naturally favors true instant cast spammables, and therefore dizzy in a lot of real fight ends up being less useful than its tooltip suggest. Furthermore, good players can counter dizzy stamdens and necros quite well, by simply blocking the attacks when their respective burst skill (shalks/blastbones) is about to land (you don't need to hold block very long, roughly half a second every 3 seconds if the enemy is currently on the offense).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Yes, rally is a great skill, but this discussion was a bout dizzying. Apart from that two points to keep in mind:
1) You can actually use 2h quite well as a backbar weapon, especially with something like vate 2h (I do that). A powered 2h with rally, vigor, and your class heal will give you very strong healing. Biggest disadvantage is that you will lose the shield ult, but classes like stam DK and stamnecro can compensate with corrosive and goliath.
2) Stamden is far less reliant on rally since they already have a source of major brutality with netch and strong class healing, so they can play dw front snb backbar without much sacrifice. Other classes have less access, but stam DK still could use molten armaments (I've seen it successfully done by a stam DK friend of mine), sorcs have surge, and any class can use stam + crit + brutality pots (though admittedly they have limited use with a typical malacath + decent health regen build).Unified_Gaming wrote: »
1) Executioner doesn't have the highest scaling, that crown goes to the templar's jesus beam with up to 480% extra damage (which is undodgeable on top).
2) Executioner doesn't have a high base skill tooltip. Assuming same offensive stats, it is less than half of jesus beam, and pretty in line with both killers blade and poison injection's initial damage (and I've never seen someone claim poison injection's initial damage is high :P). A good example of an execute ability with rather high base damage would be whirling blades (roughly 45% higher than executioner).
3) This is mostly a gameplay style point, but imo executioner (I'm talking specifically about the morph here) doesn't synergize well with stamden, and only moderately with stamnecro and stam DK due to its pure single target nature. Especially stamden excels at high upfront aoe burst, so securing only one kill is not great if you could have killed multiple targets at once. So if you play like me and aim to get enemy groups into choke points and then aoe ult dump them for multiple kills at once, reverse slice and whirling blades are the better options. And when it comes to a comparison between those two I still prefer whirling blades due to its true aoe nature that doesn't require a target. For example, if your main target of reverse slice dodges, you wont do any damage to the enemy group.Unified_Gaming wrote: »
Honestly, with the current meta most good players I see play very gimmicky builds atm (health regen mist form with beam procs, proc healthden, shock heavy attack builds, stamsorcs abusing crystal weapons bug, some azureblight stamsorcs as you mentioned here and there, ...). Most of them don't even use dizzy and if they do then its the least of my concerns fighting them.
In my guild, we mostly switched to master dw frontbar with rending as our spammable and whirling blades as execute after greymoor went live, and every single player I recommended this play style to prefers it over dizzy after trying it out. It works well on stam DK, stamden, stamsorc, and I'm 100% sure it will work on stamnecro as well (a guildie will try it out the next couple of days). If the zergs are really big, master 2h with brawler as spammable is also a great option.
I play pc eu myself no cp and find that dizzy is better overall as it frees up a lot of bar space. Dual wield is reliant on a special weapon to be useful unless you are in a group and then spam whirling blade then yes it is better. You also need some extra sets like azureblight to make dual wield better which again shows that dual wield needs specific stuff to make it viable whereas dizzy doesn't. Works well with and without procs.
The issue with dizzy in my opinion is the number of extra effects and the issue with targeting isn't massive if you cast and then rotate rather than follow - you should never miss one then.
As for many of those builds - I've made videos on a lot of them - heavy attack builds, harbringer tank builds, mist form vate destro builds and recently a light attack build. The patch has a lot of options but I wouldn't say that the dizzying swing is weaker compared to them and if used right is phenomenal 1 v x. That is the angle I'm coming from - 1 v x it is too good to not use as you get so much free bar space.
Hope that helps.
I checked out some of your recent videos and most of them show low or at best mid mmr bg gameplay. Not calling you a bad player, just saying that dizzy was always a bit of a potato digger skill working best against players who don't know yet how to effectively kite, block, roll dodge and counter stun. So depending on the angle you come from, sure, dizzy can be amazing skill. Doesn't change the fact though that an instant cast spammable will always be more reliable in lag than a cast time skill, especially against players who know how to kite when pressured.Edited by HankTwo on 5 February 2021 20:29PC EU
Stam DK, Magden, Magplar, Stamcro, Hybrid Sorc, Magblade & Mag DK5
