Official Discussion Thread for "Update 18’s Gifting, Daily Rewards, & Combat Changes"

Ley

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

tinythinker

Is there a secret early access program on the live server?








*casually leaves a plate of fresh-baked cookies*



*thinks*



*also leaves a bottle of Irish whiskey*


*...and a fine new pair of not-pants*

Feric51

VaranisArano wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So in essence the original statement and marketing on all websites that say a subscription isn’t required is 100% false for this

Further your article requires they purchase crowns in one way or another. Please change all your listings....

I mean, how are they gonna gift crown store items if they've never bought crowns or received them through ESO+? The only thing is they have to wait a month afterward.

Gifting is unlocked by buying crowns or receiving crowns through ESO+. You gotta have crowns to gift stuff. I dont think its that complicated.

This answers a fundamental question I had about a potential exploit on consoles. Once gifting was announced, some guildmates and I discussed the probability of folks trying to work the system of creating hundreds of alt accounts, each getting 500 crowns to start, then using those to gift things to their main account (or others).

On PC I believe it is much more intensive to create alt accounts, but (at least on Xbox) setting a console as your "home" device allows for unlimited amounts of gamertags to be created and linked to an ESO account via unique, valid email addresses.

By placing the ESO+ or additional crown purchase (not the "free" 500 starter crowns) this eliminates that threat. Yeah, theoretically you could purchase 1500 crowns on any number of alternate accounts and get the additional 500 free, but that requires a significant financial investment, not to mention the 30-day waiting period.

I'm glad to see this type of regulation put into place, otherwise we would have seen a huge devaluing of crown store purchases on Xbox.




Edit for missing digit.

NewBlacksmurf

VaranisArano wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So in essence the original statement and marketing on all websites that say a subscription isn’t required is 100% false for this

Further your article requires they purchase crowns in one way or another. Please change all your listings....

I mean, how are they gonna gift crown store items if they've never bought crowns or received them through ESO+? The only thing is they have to wait a month afterward.

Gifting is unlocked by buying crowns or receiving crowns through ESO+. You gotta have crowns to gift stuff. I dont think its that complicated.

@VaranisArano

-crowns from service issues
-crowns from the old time cards

I’m not questioning how it’s unlocked, I’m questioning the big banner on the websites and the retail boxes that literally read “No Game Subscription Required” that hasn’t been changed for a few years even after subscription exclusive features that have been added.

Turelus

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

Feric51

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So in essence the original statement and marketing on all websites that say a subscription isn’t required is 100% false for this

Further your article requires they purchase crowns in one way or another. Please change all your listings....

I mean, how are they gonna gift crown store items if they've never bought crowns or received them through ESO+? The only thing is they have to wait a month afterward.

Gifting is unlocked by buying crowns or receiving crowns through ESO+. You gotta have crowns to gift stuff. I dont think its that complicated.

@VaranisArano

-crowns from service issues
-crowns from the old time cards

I’m not questioning how it’s unlocked, I’m questioning the big banner on the websites and the retail boxes that literally read “No Game Subscription Required” that hasn’t been changed for a few years even after subscription exclusive features that have been added.

I'm confused... Are you referencing ZOS prior mention that a subscription isn't required to gift crown store items - and thereby saying those claims are "100% false" by way of this most recent announcement?

I read this line in the official announcement "you need to become an ESO Plus member or make a Crown Pack purchase" to unlock crown gifting. At no point do you need to have a "subscription" to purchase a crown pack. So that means that you also do NOT need a subscription to gift crown store items.

Am I missing something in your argument?

Ley

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

NewBlacksmurf

Feric51 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So in essence the original statement and marketing on all websites that say a subscription isn’t required is 100% false for this

Further your article requires they purchase crowns in one way or another. Please change all your listings....

I mean, how are they gonna gift crown store items if they've never bought crowns or received them through ESO+? The only thing is they have to wait a month afterward.

Gifting is unlocked by buying crowns or receiving crowns through ESO+. You gotta have crowns to gift stuff. I dont think its that complicated.

@VaranisArano

-crowns from service issues
-crowns from the old time cards

I’m not questioning how it’s unlocked, I’m questioning the big banner on the websites and the retail boxes that literally read “No Game Subscription Required” that hasn’t been changed for a few years even after subscription exclusive features that have been added.

I'm confused... Are you referencing ZOS prior mention that a subscription isn't required to gift crown store items - and thereby saying those claims are "100% false" by way of this most recent announcement?

I read this line in the official announcement "you need to become an ESO Plus member or make a Crown Pack purchase" to unlock crown gifting. At no point do you need to have a "subscription" to purchase a crown pack. So that means that you also do NOT need a subscription to gift crown store items.

Am I missing something in your argument?

@Feric51

It’s no argument just that the communication hasn’t aligned for over 2 years due to changes and I believe it would be in their best interest to keep the alignment or update their communication.

You all are focused on something I’m not.

Ley

While I think it's nice that players can now send each other crown store gifts. Let's not pretend that this isn't just a nicer way of saying, "Players can sell/trade crown store items in game now."

I also find it interesting that they decided to make gifts permanent. In the sense that once you buy an item from the crown store with the intent of gifting it, if it is sent back to you, you cannot claim the item yourself and are forced to hold onto it until you find someone else to "gift" it to. I think a much more fair approach to this would be, if the person receiving the gift declines the gift or the gift expires, then the sender gets their crowns refunded for that item and the item goes away. Otherwise this is inviting players to troll/scam each other by agreeing to an exchange and then backing out after the item has already been gifted. This is assuming there is some form of CoD in place and the other player can't just steal them item outright and not hold up their end of the bargain.

I don't want to even imagine how many support tickets ZOS will have to deal with of players getting scammed.

Chufu

VaranisArano wrote: »

I love that this is the picture for the Gifting section of the article:


Its like someone saw some squishly lowbie and was like "Man, you really need a a food buff in group content. Let me gift you some crown consumables!"

Wait... orcs are not always eating... but this one is training his (eating) muscles!

CaffeinatedMayhem

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

How to you PROVE that 720 you attacks like a noob but has Monster Hunter title wasn't an account sale? You can't.

VaranisArano

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

How to you PROVE that 720 you attacks like a noob but has Monster Hunter title wasn't an account sale? You can't.

Easy. Monster Hunter is a purely PVE title.

I mean, I was strictly PVE for the first year or so that I played the game, so when I went into PVP seriously for the first time, I was the epitome of high CP noob.

It happens legit, too.

bottleofsyrup

What happens if you gift something to someone and they already own it, like a pet or costume? Are the crowns just wasted in that case?

VaranisArano

bottleofsyrup wrote: »

What happens if you gift something to someone and they already own it, like a pet or costume? Are the crowns just wasted in that case?

Presumably they'd return it to you, so you wouldnt get to use it yourself but you could gift it to someone else.

This system is not set up well for "surprise!" gifts. It seems like its intended more for people who know each other to gift things they know the other person doesnt have and wants.

NewBlacksmurf

bottleofsyrup wrote: »

What happens if you gift something to someone and they already own it, like a pet or costume? Are the crowns just wasted in that case?

Says after x days it comes back and u can give it to someone else

bottleofsyrup

VaranisArano wrote: »

bottleofsyrup wrote: »

What happens if you gift something to someone and they already own it, like a pet or costume? Are the crowns just wasted in that case?

Presumably they'd return it to you, so you wouldnt get to use it yourself but you could gift it to someone else.

This system is not set up well for "surprise!" gifts. It seems like its intended more for people who know each other to gift things they know the other person doesnt have and wants.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

bottleofsyrup wrote: »

What happens if you gift something to someone and they already own it, like a pet or costume? Are the crowns just wasted in that case?

Says after x days it comes back and u can give it to someone else

Guess that makes sense, though I feel like it would be better if it had a dialogue to indicate the person you're gifting the item too already has it, otherwise if you want to surprise someone you have to make yet another purchase and try that item (though I suspect ZOS likes this) and then you still have to find someone to give the other gift to.

MisterBigglesworth

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

That's besides the point though. No actual cash is being exchanged here. ZOS are the only party who profits in actual money.

It's the exact same scenario as WoW Token system, totally sanctioned and designed by Blizzard, to allow a player to spend real money (which goes to Blizzard) then sell that token to another player in exchange for in-game gold. Nobody apart from the developer makes a profit.

smacx250

I didn't see Morrowind in the crown store at all, and as such, no way to gift it. Am I missing it somewhere? Or is that intentional, or a known issue at this point?

smacx250

Feric51 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So in essence the original statement and marketing on all websites that say a subscription isn’t required is 100% false for this

Further your article requires they purchase crowns in one way or another. Please change all your listings....

I mean, how are they gonna gift crown store items if they've never bought crowns or received them through ESO+? The only thing is they have to wait a month afterward.

Gifting is unlocked by buying crowns or receiving crowns through ESO+. You gotta have crowns to gift stuff. I dont think its that complicated.

This answers a fundamental question I had about a potential exploit on consoles. Once gifting was announced, some guildmates and I discussed the probability of folks trying to work the system of creating hundreds of alt accounts, each getting 500 crowns to start, then using those to gift things to their main account (or others).

On PC I believe it is much more intensive to create alt accounts, but (at least on Xbox) setting a console as your "home" device allows for unlimited amounts of gamertags to be created and linked to an ESO account via unique, valid email addresses.

By placing the ESO+ or additional crown purchase (not the "free" 500 starter crowns) this eliminates that threat. Yeah, theoretically you could purchase 1500 crowns on any number of alternate accounts and get the additional 500 free, but that requires a significant financial investment, not to mention the 30-day waiting period.

I'm glad to see this type of regulation put into place, otherwise we would have seen a huge devaluing of crown store purchases on Xbox.




Edit for missing digit.

Well, according to the description of gifting, in order for it to be enabled, you either need to enroll in ESO+, or purchase crowns and then wait 30 days. I don't understand all the console stuff so not sure if that covers the case you describe, or not.

Edit: Never mind - reading comprehension fail!!!

CaffeinatedMayhem

VaranisArano wrote: »

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

How to you PROVE that 720 you attacks like a noob but has Monster Hunter title wasn't an account sale? You can't.

Easy. Monster Hunter is a purely PVE title.

I mean, I was strictly PVE for the first year or so that I played the game, so when I went into PVP seriously for the first time, I was the epitome of high CP noob.

It happens legit, too.

Um - what does that have to do with anything? What does not being able to live up to a PvE title have to do with PvP?

VaranisArano

thatlaurachick wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

How to you PROVE that 720 you attacks like a noob but has Monster Hunter title wasn't an account sale? You can't.

Easy. Monster Hunter is a purely PVE title.

I mean, I was strictly PVE for the first year or so that I played the game, so when I went into PVP seriously for the first time, I was the epitome of high CP noob.

It happens legit, too.

Um - what does that have to do with anything? What does not being able to live up to a PvE title have to do with PvP?

"How to you PROVE that 720 you attacks like a noob but has Monster Hunter title wasn't an account sale? You can't."

When I started to PVP as a high CP PVEer, I would have been perfectly capable of getting the Monster Hunter title AND dying like a noob in a fight. In my experience, PVE experience doesn't necessarily translate well into surviving and fighting in PVP. At least, it didn't in my case.

I didn't need an account sale to be an experienced PVEer who sucked at PVP when I started, is what I'm saying.

Either that or I'm completely misunderstanding your original point.

Aliyavana

Will trading gold to crown items be against the rules? If not will there be a c.o.d system?

timb16_ESO85

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

I don't disagree but if it is against ToS then they can at least pretend to not endorse the exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the exchange process not conducive to actually exchanging safely. Trade crowns for gold/items/services at your own risk.

If it isn't against ToS then they may as well embrace the inevitable exchange of crowns for gold/items/services and make the system user friendly and as scam-proof as possible.

Trading anything in game for real life cash is against TOS, period. Does it happen? Yes. But if you're caught it's a ban (supposedly).

That's besides the point though. No actual cash is being exchanged here. ZOS are the only party who profits in actual money.

It's the exact same scenario as WoW Token system, totally sanctioned and designed by Blizzard, to allow a player to spend real money (which goes to Blizzard) then sell that token to another player in exchange for in-game gold. Nobody apart from the developer makes a profit.

One mayor difference. The WoW system actually uses an in-game way to exchange the gold for the tokens, and thus preventing people from getting scammed. The eso system doesn't offer a c.o.d. option (or any trade option) and only offers a send this as a gift and hope the other person keeps his promise to send gold. I agree that this is slightly different than directly buying gold, since no actual money gets transfered (and thus noone can make a real life profit by this system), but a nice and user-friendly system would be more WoW like, with the items being able to be send c.o.d. or posted on guild-stores (like the auction house is used in WoW).

Wolfkeks

@ZOS_GinaBruno about those rewards...
Looks like we could get pets and other nice things. Will those things be all new (like the pet guar) or will we also get returning crown store stuff (like the fennec fox pet)?

LittlePumpkin030

SantieClaws wrote: »

Is it possible to gift away items you already posess yes?

Khajiit has some dogs the orc girl found that this one would like to rehome ...

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

That would be actually cool

anitajoneb17_ESO

Turelus wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

Will it be against ToS to gift crown store items in exchange for in game gold/items/services?

If not will gifting behave similarly to the mailing system's CoD?

I don't see any way they could stop this even if it was against ToS.

^^This^^

It WILL be against TOS (that's why it's called "gifting" and not "trading"), therefore there will be no "system" similar to COD. But there's nothing noone could ever do against "reciprocal gifting". ZOS made that decision in plain knowledge imho. They will, however, stay out of any responsibility in the inevitable cases of scamming.

anitajoneb17_ESO

LittlePumpkin030 wrote: »

SantieClaws wrote: »

Is it possible to gift away items you already posess yes?

Khajiit has some dogs the orc girl found that this one would like to rehome ...

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

That would be actually cool

It's already impossible to reclaim a returned gift for oneself so I highly doubt we can gift something from our own inventory. Only from the store ! Don't forget ZOS does this for selling more, not to promote the recycling of pixels

ak_pvp

IMO it should be against the rules to trade crowns for gold, but doesn't have to be directly enforced. That way, it can happen, but it is dissuaded because if you get scammed, you were in the wrong in the first place. I.e. you can already buy gold for IRL money, but since it isn't sanctioned, its not safe.

Dolgubon

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Ashryn wrote: »

Can you gift across platforms? (I'm on PC, but my daughter is on Xbox)

You can only gift something to an account on the same platform.

Does the EU server count as the same platform as the NA server? Also, if they do count as the same platform would a player be able to decide on which server they receive the gift, or is it locked to the server the gifter was on?

cyberjanet

So... I'm looking at the log-in rewards system right now, and I see there are a few that I cannot use at all, like riding lessons, and possibly even the instant blacksmithing research. Will there be a way to turn these into crown gems, or similar, or trade them for a more useful item of similar value, or do we just destroy them? A destroyed item is not much of a reward.

I see you can deposit stuff into the bank, so at least it's not character bound. However, it is bound, so you can't trade the items you can't use.