Stamina Sorcerer Popularity

brandonv516

Anyone notice a rise in stamina sorcerers in BGs? One might think their popularity means they are overperforming just a bit (ahem...an AoE execute that can proc enchants and {poisons?}). Some really talented players I've played with don't even touch their mains; I'm always seeing them in this role instead.

I see them as an obvious counter to NBs with the caltrops, hurricane, atronach, steel tornado, etc. If you damage them, they just run away and dark deal for their resources and then return for more fun. Then there's bleeds which are very deadly. So overall there's a lot of power going on there.

Thoughts?

Sixty5

Stam Sorc does pretty well in no-CP given they can ignore a lot of the sustain issues thanks to Dark Deal, as well as Befoul not existing, meaning that you can actually heal.

Additionally, with all the Nightblades running around these days, Stam Sorc feels more powerful as it is a soft counter with Hurricane.

Plus people are realising that Bleeds are actually good.

Stam Sorc still is nowhere near as good as Stam Warden or either flavour of Nightblade, rather it just performs well in the current Battleground climate.

Grimlok_S

Yep. Tough to lock down a stam sorc as any mag class. Mobility is king in battlegrounds.

I use trap, fossilize and rending slashes on my stamdk, still struggle to put a good one down.

Thogard

When 40% of the BG population consists of nightblades that only know how to vanish and not how to kite, the Stam sorc’s hurricane begins to look very attractive.

Thogard

If there weren’t so many Nightblades, stamden would be a much better option.

GrigorijMalahevich

For most game mods stamsorc is very attractive and considering that there are trillions nightblades - stamsorc is quite good as a counter. I feel that my magsorc dominates 95% of stamnb's in BG, but it sucks in most game mods except death match.

If you don't change builds depending on game mode, stamsorc is a better choice on average.

Stamsorc walks in a bar - there is no counter.

Sixty5

Valera Progib wrote: »

For most game mods stamsorc is very attractive and considering that there are trillions nightblades - stamsorc is quite good as a counter. I feel that my magsorc dominates 95% of stamnb's in BG, but it sucks in most game mods except death match.

If you don't change builds depending on game mode, stamsorc is a better choice on average.

Stamsorc walks in a bar - there is no counter.

Honestly, Defile is your friend. They have no way to amp their healing, so reductions really hurt.

It's why CP PVP feels bad on the class.

Apache_Kid

I was just coming in here to post a thread about this.

Seems as if everyone in BGs now is on a DW/S&B stamsorc build spamming Spin 2 Win. Majority of my death re-caps in BGs now-a-days are Hurricane, Dawnbreaker, Twin slashes, and Spin 2 Win. Stamsorcs seem especially powerful in No-CP. Also these builds are even more annoying than endless fury spamming sorcs in terms of stealing kills too. Sure they seem over-powered in Bgs to me but I think that might just be because of No-CP as I do not have as much difficulty dealing with them in Cyrodiil. Although I feel they are still strong there as well. Since we can't balance classes between no-cp and cp, is this just a case of if you can't beat em, join em?

del9

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

Apache_Kid

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

I see way more Magplars and stamsorcs than NBs at this point. Am I the only one? Looking for what others are seeing. I'm on Xbox NA

del9

Apache_Kid wrote: »

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

I see way more Magplars and stamsorcs than NBs at this point. Am I the only one? Looking for what others are seeing. I'm on Xbox NA

pc na is overwhelmingly NB loaded. and then a good # of stamdens, stamsorcs at the moment is what I'm noticing

brandonv516

Apache_Kid wrote: »

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

I see way more Magplars and stamsorcs than NBs at this point. Am I the only one? Looking for what others are seeing. I'm on Xbox NA

I'm Xbox NA. I think it's definitely magplar, stamblade, stamsorc as top 3 in popularity (not necessarily that order).

wheem_ESO

Stamina in general is more popular, and Stam Sorcs are one of the most common of Stamina setups, probably due mostly to Hurricane and Dark Deal, plus Stamina builds in general having such good damage + defense. Over the last few days that I've been back playing on PC-NA, Stamblades do indeed seem to be the single most common class, followed by Stam Sorcs and Stam Wardens. There are also still a decent number of Magicka Templars, DKs, and Sorcs out there, but it's mostly Stamina that's ruling the roost.

Morgul667

I see a lot of stamblade magblade then magplars then stamsorc

Always mained a stamsorc and kinda feel bad they are getting popular for BG.

I guess this is linked to the bleed build suitable for noCP and hurricane to detect Nightblades

Not long ago when you did good in a bg you could get whisps to congratulate you for doing that on a stamsorc. Now that it is the counter to nightblades there are too many for my taste :-D

Morgul667

wheem_ESO wrote: »

Stamina in general is more popular, and Stam Sorcs are one of the most common of Stamina setups, probably due mostly to Hurricane and Dark Deal, plus Stamina builds in general having such good damage + defense. Over the last few days that I've been back playing on PC-NA, Stamblades do indeed seem to be the single most common class, followed by Stam Sorcs and Stam Wardens. There are also still a decent number of Magicka Templars, DKs, and Sorcs out there, but it's mostly Stamina that's ruling the roost.

I find BGs more easy on my magicka setups but i love my stamsorc so i keep playing it

Bg neds utility and single target burst. I guess theres room for every type of gameplay which is nice

The_Protagonist

WTH I hope this is not a nerf Sorc thread

brandonv516

The_Protagonist wrote: »

WTH I hope this is not a nerf Sorc thread

If it isn't, we aren't doing our job right.

TheYKcid

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

As far as straight-up fighting goes, magsorc definitely feels weaker in a no-CP environment. Our main defence—shields—gets double whammied by the loss of not only the Bastion CP star but also the boost to max mag that CP provides. Shields are really small in no-CP and having to constantly refresh them makes it incredibly difficult to find an offensive window against someone who knows how to pressure heavily.

The sheer mobility is great for playing objectives in BGs specifically, though.

Juhasow

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

Wow saying that magsorc performs better in non CP is a huge mistake. Shields are the most weakened defensive without CPs. Killing magsorc in non CP is much easier then in CP.

Thogard

Juhasow wrote: »

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

StamSorc overperforming? Probably not. But they are very nicely tuned for noCP BGs, And I won't play my warden as a spin-bot, so as long as NBs saturate BGs I am rocking that hurricane.

Wow saying that magsorc performs better in non CP is a huge mistake. Shields are the most weakened defensive without CPs. Killing magsorc in non CP is much easier then in CP.

True. But mag sorcs have a pretty fixed amount of damage that they can do. Their burst window takes a while to set up and if they don’t kill something in that window then it’ll be a while before they can burst again.

In No CP, mag sorcs just aren’t a threat. Theyre more of a utility class that’s used for negate, resto ults, wiz riposte, and execute.

Skander

Stamina overall it's easier to play then magicka. Thus the popularity

Thogard

Skander wrote: »

Stamina overall it's easier to play then magicka. Thus the popularity

That is definitely not true.

Maulkin

Yep quite popular atm. 3 reasons that I see.

1) Supreme mobility makes them helluva lot of fun in BGs
2) Bleed builds popular atm and very strong in small encounters. They seem to work fairly well with StamSorc class.
3) Rise in StamBlade popularity since Dragon Bones led to an eventual increase in the class that predates on them; StamSorcs. Hurricane is the strongest counter to Cloak out there, apart from Mark.

I'm levelling an Orc Sorc myself. I just see my friends having tons of fun with them and I'm getting jealous

Speed_Kills

Stam Sorc OP.

SaKGEE

del9

TheYKcid wrote: »

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

As far as straight-up fighting goes, magsorc definitely feels weaker in a no-CP environment. Our main defence—shields—gets double whammied by the loss of not only the Bastion CP star but also the boost to max mag that CP provides. Shields are really small in no-CP and having to constantly refresh them makes it incredibly difficult to find an offensive window against someone who knows how to pressure heavily.

The sheer mobility is great for playing objectives in BGs specifically, though.

I understand all this, but I have more of a problem with msorcs in nocp across multiple classes. There's a huge advantage to doing more with fewer skills used. Curse, wrath, surge, implosions all shine when sustain is universally nerfed. Hard to quantify that against CP stat modifiers. In CP group scenarios I only fear negates. In noncp group, I always know where the sorcs are. Given all numbers, from my side they still seem like much more of a factor. I know you don't play much CP @TheYKcid but any thought on ^?

Drachenfier

Hurricane hits too hard for a passive, fire and forget pbaoe.

Hg_9_5b16_ESO

Maulkin wrote: »

Yep quite popular atm. 3 reasons that I see.

1) Supreme mobility makes them helluva lot of fun in BGs
2) Bleed builds popular atm and very strong in small encounters. They seem to work fairly well with StamSorc class.
3) Rise in StamBlade popularity since Dragon Bones led to an eventual increase in the class that predates on them; StamSorcs. Hurricane is the strongest counter to Cloak out there, apart from Mark.

I'm levelling an Orc Sorc myself. I just see my friends having tons of fun with them and I'm getting jealous

A wise choice:) StamSorcs mobility is no joke...You can choose the fights u take and gtf out when u like:P

Sixty5

del9 wrote: »

TheYKcid wrote: »

del9 wrote: »

IMO sorcs of both colors are in a better place in non cp than in standard, especially in BGs. Passive damage and healing and streak mobility are great for BGs, Dark Deal very strong in noCP.

As far as straight-up fighting goes, magsorc definitely feels weaker in a no-CP environment. Our main defence—shields—gets double whammied by the loss of not only the Bastion CP star but also the boost to max mag that CP provides. Shields are really small in no-CP and having to constantly refresh them makes it incredibly difficult to find an offensive window against someone who knows how to pressure heavily.

The sheer mobility is great for playing objectives in BGs specifically, though.

I understand all this, but I have more of a problem with msorcs in nocp across multiple classes. There's a huge advantage to doing more with fewer skills used. Curse, wrath, surge, implosions all shine when sustain is universally nerfed. Hard to quantify that against CP stat modifiers. In CP group scenarios I only fear negates. In noncp group, I always know where the sorcs are. Given all numbers, from my side they still seem like much more of a factor. I know you don't play much CP @TheYKcid but any thought on ^?

Basically the thing about Mag Sorcs in no-CP is that they drop below thresholds in a lot of areas.

Hardened Ward plus Healing Ward aren't going to stack anywhere near as high with the lower base magicka pool, and the lack of Bastion CP, meaning that they can be at risk of a burst combo, even with full shields up.

Additionally, Mag Sorcs do pretty terrible sustained damage, and rely on the Curse/Frag/Wrath combo to kill. Again with the lower damage scaling in no-CP, this combo ends up needing either triple crits or an implosion proc to reliably kill squishy targets.

With capped resists, and 1k ish crit resist, a full Sorc combo is hitting for maybe 10k damage, assuming that the Wrath is going off. So as long as I stay above 12k health while the enemy sorc has agency, there is pretty much nothing that they can do to actually kill me, because of how their burst is structured.

On the other hand, if you tag a Mag Sorc with a bit of CC at the end of one of their shields, they will usually die to a full combo of your own.

The_Brosteen

Weird. On pc na It seems like I'm the only stamsorc in a given match the majority of the time.

Juhasow

Also it's worth to mention that changes to interrupts and adding interruption immunity maked stamsorc much easier and smoothier to play. You can just spam Dark Deal like crazy right now and because of immunity to interrupts people wont be able to do anything with it. Occasional 3 seconds cooldown if someone will succes to interrupt Dark Deal is nothing compared to fact that now You can literally spam it in front on soemones face and if You have immunity he wont be able to do anything about it. It's especially strong in no CP enviroment where this skill can be used sometiems as occasional spammable selfheal.