Costumes in PvP

Baboonezz

Jamini wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

You keep saying that we get to keep our goblins, but some people choose to wear stuff to present an image for others to see. Your proposal would be removing that.

So you are basically saying you are doing it to get an artificial advantage over the other

Also, ESO is not like other popular games with distinctive archetypes. So comparing what works in other games is apples to oranges.

I very, very heavily disagree there. While ESO is quite freeform in how you CAN build, the actual effectiveness of a build is generally determined by your primary stat and armor type, with armor type being almost explicitly tied with what stat you are trying to boost. Magicka users wear robes, dodge-rolling stamina users use leathers, and people who want extra defense have heavy armor.

ESOs combat is not appreciably different in any form from other team-based games. We have, in effect, 12 major archtypes (one for each class in each style of play) with distinctive visual cues for each. Class cues are animations/effect based around buffs, role cues are based on armor type and health/shield values. ESO shares more with those games than it has distinct by a very, very large margin. (Compared to say... a game of Mafia, a Point and click adventure game, or a creative builder.)

As I said, ESO gives you more than enough information to know your opponent because they cannot hide their weapons no matter what they wear. There is no need to remove the other customization options.

Nothing is being removed in this proposal. It is an option that can be added.

Team uniform is not part of their strategy, it was a bad analogy I'll admit. Basketball have set positions, they constantly switch their positions and who they are defending. Guess during a timeout you'd be that guy walking over asking to see their board?

I'm not asking to see their board (skills and abilities assigned)

I'm asking to know their positions: https://www.breakthroughbasketball.com/basics/basics.html

Player Positions
Center. Centers are generally your tallest players. They generally are positioned near the basket.

Offensive -- The center's goal is to get open for a pass and to shoot. They are also responsible for blocking defenders, known as picking or screening, to open other players up for driving to the basket for a goal. Centers are expected to get some offensive rebounds and put-backs.

Defensive -- On defense, the center's main responsibility is to keep opponents from shooting by blocking shots and passes in the key area. They also are expected to get a lot of rebounds because they're taller.

Forward. Your next tallest players will most likely be your forwards. While a forward may be called upon to play under the hoop, they may also be required to operate in the wings and corner areas.

Offensive -- Forwards are responsible to get free for a pass, take outside shots, drive for goals, and rebound.

Defensive -- Responsibilities include preventing drives to the goal and rebounding.

Guard. These are potentially your shortest players and they should be really good at dribbling fast, seeing the court, and passing. It is their job to bring the ball down the court and set up offensive plays.

Offensive -- Dribbling, passing, and setting up offensive plays are a guard's main responsibilities. They also need to be able to drive to the basket and to shoot from the perimeter.

Defensive -- On defense, a guard is responsible for stealing passes, contesting shots, preventing drives to the hoop, and for boxing out.

Right now we have people that pretend to be guards, for all intents and purposes look like guards, but then suddenly rush across the floor, grow two feet in height, and dunk a basket while screaming something profane to the guy they just dashed past in /zone chat.

I'm exaggerating a little, but did I make my own position clear?

Yeah, much clearer. I think we should be able to ATLEAST see (which you can with an addon for PC right now, I know that's not ideal and think it should be base game component) players main resource, maybe like an icon to know they are either stam, mag or a hybrid. That would then allow you to read an opponent like you would a basketball players position, without giving up that layer of strategy.

FriedEggSandwich

I like costumes in pvp. I have no trouble working out what type of build someone is running after the first frag hits them. I don't even see them being an issue in battlegrounds. Learn to recognise particle effects, they can't be disguised or cancelled. If I choose to wear a costume to hide my hideous armour then I want everyone to see my costume and not my hideous armour.

Baboonezz

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I like costumes in pvp. I have no trouble working out what type of build someone is running after the first frag hits them. I don't even see them being an issue in battlegrounds. Learn to recognise particle effects, they can't be disguised or cancelled. If I choose to wear a costume to hide my hideous armour then I want everyone to see my costume and not my hideous armour.

Pretty much, not to mention that how can you tell what they are wearing based on non monster helm sets? Crafted sets have a plethora of styles and dropped set styles can just be crafted.

Also ZOS makes money off cosmetics, turning it off in part of the game will lower revenue needed for the ongoing life of the game.

Jitterbug

I like how people spend hours on google researching armor sets and then even more hours (upon hours) farming the "just right" sets they particularly picked out and then call the sets "forced". ^^

Jitterbug

Jamini wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

You keep saying that we get to keep our goblins, but some people choose to wear stuff to present an image for others to see. Your proposal would be removing that.

So you are basically saying you are doing it to get an artificial advantage over the other

Not what was said at all. I'm sure you choose not to wear a giant sombrero to you next job interview, or maybe you do. Either way, you're presenting an image.

Jamini wrote: »

I'm asking to know their positions

And you can, very easily, by poking them.
Did it hurt them a lot = LA.
Did it hurt them a little = HA.
Did they dodge it and now you are dead and your screen says "velidreth, viper, red mountain" = MA.

You will only be able to easily identify certain pieces of armor in the 10 fps black texture carnival that is Cyrodiil anyway like the iconic monster sets.

Jamini wrote: »

Right now we have people that pretend to be guards, for all intents and purposes look like guards, but then suddenly rush across the floor, grow two feet in height, and dunk a basket while screaming something profane to the guy they just dashed past in /zone chat.

I'm exaggerating a little, but did I make my own position clear?

Not really, no. Not to me anyway. I don't believe you have ever mistaken a player in Cyrodiil for not being a player and if you have I suggest you put on the alliance markers in the setting.

Like I said early in the thread, I don't want to step on anyone's wish for options, but this suggestion is hindering other people's options and is then in my terminology a bad suggestion. And any attempt to color the costumes "cheating" in PvP won't change that.

Sixth

Na, I buy my costumes so everyone gets to see my shizz. Man up and fight who you wanna fight, if you lose then you know not to try that again eh. Seems like you tried sniping the wrong target a few too many times and you're now salty over it

incite

Looks can be deceiving, lets keep it that way

Mmkkaaaayy?

Katahdin

As someone said, crafted armor makes this a moot point.

I can usually guess pretty well by looking at someone's class and health pool whether I want to attack them or not.

Seeing someone's armor isnt going to help you as much as people are thinking it will.

So no.

driosketch

Turn off disguises, see so much mismatched undyed gear running around everywhere. I guess if you have an encyclopedic visual memory of the pieces in 40+ motifs, and the sets that use them, plus a couple dozen monster sets, this would be helpful. Personally, I think watching the visual effects of skills and procs is a better heuristic of guessing play style, and can't be hidden by costume or crafted armor.

Cathexis

(1) You have costumes you can use too.
(2) Costumes and disguises make things more aesthetically pleasing when underlying armor is ugly.
(3) Costumes protect you from being stalked/harassed by players and specifically countered against.

The only edge it provides is that players have to actually fight you, which is minimal.