Buff muh mageblade

Stoopid_Nwah

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

bowmanz607

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Stoopid_Nwah

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

bowmanz607

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

susmitds

LBxFinalDeath wrote: »

To be honest a properly spec'd out Magic Nightblade should beat a Stamina Nightblade in a 1v1 nine times out of ten if the Stamblade can't instantly kill the Magic Nightblade before the Mageblade gets going.

Can cloak a lot more, can put out as much dps if not higher once you add in the spectral bow that inherently does far more damage than the stam version of it that can be weaved into concealed weapon anim cancels...add in soul tether hitting a lot harder for a Magic NB and its GG R.I.P Stamblade...oh and can't forget the resto shield being infinitely better as a heal than vigor or rally (rally could be argued but still the fact resto shield has its own resistances ontop of a Magic NBs already slightly higher than Stamblade resistances pretty much seals the deal for resto shield being better tbh)

Where it gets shady is when Magic Nightblade fights other classes..primarily Magic Sorc whereas...a stamblade would shred a shield stacking magic sorc nowadays rather easily.

Impale is a trashy execute imo, it has a weird delay for some reason that kind of gives people who should have died a moment to heal themselves, soul tether is a much better execute tbh. =P

If you lose to a Magicka Nightblade as a Stamina Nightblade, then you need to learn to dodge. Dodge+Cloak can give insane survivability. The damage shield is strong but a Stamina Nightblade can consistently out maneuver a Magicka Nightblade as along immovable pots are used to avoid CC.


Edit: Soul Tether is hardly worth its cost in duels.

Stoopid_Nwah

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

The hype is because why would you have a passive dodge chance in PVP when active dodge chance exists. With everyone switching to stam, shuffle is used by a high percentage of players in Cyrodiil. In PVE I do not mind its existence for tanks...but in PVP it should go imo. And yes I realize magblades also get major evasion through double take.

And back to your rankings, my opinion
Healing: Templar, DK, NB, Sorc
Sustain: NB, Templar, Sorc, DK
Survivability: Templar, DK, Sorc, NB
Burst: NB (specifically gankers and bombers), Sorc, Templar, DK
Mobility: Sorc, NB, tie with templar and dk
Escapability: Sorc, NB, zero escape for templars and dks

So going off of that, yes everyone has strengths and weaknesses, but just looking at it I think shows sorcs and nbs could use a little love and dks could use a lot of love.

bowmanz607

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

The hype is because why would you have a passive dodge chance in PVP when active dodge chance exists. With everyone switching to stam, shuffle is used by a high percentage of players in Cyrodiil. In PVE I do not mind its existence for tanks...but in PVP it should go imo. And yes I realize magblades also get major evasion through double take.

And back to your rankings, my opinion
Healing: Templar, DK, NB, Sorc
Sustain: NB, Templar, Sorc, DK
Survivability: Templar, DK, Sorc, NB
Burst: NB (specifically gankers and bombers), Sorc, Templar, DK
Mobility: Sorc, NB, tie with templar and dk
Escapability: Sorc, NB, zero escape for templars and dks

So going off of that, yes everyone has strengths and weaknesses, but just looking at it I think shows sorcs and nbs could use a little love and dks could use a lot of love.

Healing: temp, nb, dk and sorc are a tie imo.
Sustain: there are many variables to consider here, but nb, dk and temp tie followed closely by sorc I give dk the nod because of battle roar.
Survivability: this will vary depending on mag v stam and group v solo, but taken as a whole, temp, dk, nb, sorc
Burst: nb, sorc, templar, dk
Mobility: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie
Escapability: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie

The problem is with ranks like this there are so many variables to consider.
Plus this list is hardly an idea of what is wrong with classes. This is an oversimplification. The problems are much more unique and diverse than general labels in most situations. Some problems are not even class related. But for fun a suppose.

-Nb has far superior and more options for healing than a dk and sorc
-nb has the best passive sustain because it requires no skill to get the benefit. However, dk battle roar is solid and temp can slot passive sustain
-survivability is a tricky one. Stam dk and temp are comparable but would give to dk. However, I would rankmag dk as lowest survivability. Nb and sorc survivability relies on their mobility and Escapability on the battlefield making this a tricky one to decide. Depending on the situation all of them can excel differently. The mag dk least of all though.
-burst I think is a given. The problem is sorc burst is the most predictable burst in game.
-I give nb the nod in mobility because of the various ways in which they can be mobile and the various counters needed. Sorc simply has one move which stacks in cost and is easily countered with gap closers. A stam nb can also utilize many mobility options where a stam sorc has 2 streaks at best.
-nb wins Escapability hands down. Various ways to do it. Plus everyone had a gap closer making streak less useful. Again you have the issue with stam sorcs getting one or 2 streaks only.

leepalmer95

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

The hype is because why would you have a passive dodge chance in PVP when active dodge chance exists. With everyone switching to stam, shuffle is used by a high percentage of players in Cyrodiil. In PVE I do not mind its existence for tanks...but in PVP it should go imo. And yes I realize magblades also get major evasion through double take.

And back to your rankings, my opinion
Healing: Templar, DK, NB, Sorc
Sustain: NB, Templar, Sorc, DK
Survivability: Templar, DK, Sorc, NB
Burst: NB (specifically gankers and bombers), Sorc, Templar, DK
Mobility: Sorc, NB, tie with templar and dk
Escapability: Sorc, NB, zero escape for templars and dks

So going off of that, yes everyone has strengths and weaknesses, but just looking at it I think shows sorcs and nbs could use a little love and dks could use a lot of love.

Healing: temp, nb, dk and sorc are a tie imo.
Sustain: there are many variables to consider here, but nb, dk and temp tie followed closely by sorc I give dk the nod because of battle roar.
Survivability: this will vary depending on mag v stam and group v solo, but taken as a whole, temp, dk, nb, sorc
Burst: nb, sorc, templar, dk
Mobility: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie
Escapability: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie

The problem is with ranks like this there are so many variables to consider.
Plus this list is hardly an idea of what is wrong with classes. This is an oversimplification. The problems are much more unique and diverse than general labels in most situations. Some problems are not even class related. But for fun a suppose.

-Nb has far superior and more options for healing than a dk and sorc
-nb has the best passive sustain because it requires no skill to get the benefit. However, dk battle roar is solid and temp can slot passive sustain
-survivability is a tricky one. Stam dk and temp are comparable but would give to dk. However, I would rankmag dk as lowest survivability. Nb and sorc survivability relies on their mobility and Escapability on the battlefield making this a tricky one to decide. Depending on the situation all of them can excel differently. The mag dk least of all though.
-burst I think is a given. The problem is sorc burst is the most predictable burst in game.
-I give nb the nod in mobility because of the various ways in which they can be mobile and the various counters needed. Sorc simply has one move which stacks in cost and is easily countered with gap closers. A stam nb can also utilize many mobility options where a stam sorc has 2 streaks at best.
-nb wins Escapability hands down. Various ways to do it. Plus everyone had a gap closer making streak less useful. Again you have the issue with stam sorcs getting one or 2 streaks only.

When people rank sorc as last in sustain, even though dark deal is the most op sustain skill in the game.. xD

bowmanz607

leepalmer95 wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

The hype is because why would you have a passive dodge chance in PVP when active dodge chance exists. With everyone switching to stam, shuffle is used by a high percentage of players in Cyrodiil. In PVE I do not mind its existence for tanks...but in PVP it should go imo. And yes I realize magblades also get major evasion through double take.

And back to your rankings, my opinion
Healing: Templar, DK, NB, Sorc
Sustain: NB, Templar, Sorc, DK
Survivability: Templar, DK, Sorc, NB
Burst: NB (specifically gankers and bombers), Sorc, Templar, DK
Mobility: Sorc, NB, tie with templar and dk
Escapability: Sorc, NB, zero escape for templars and dks

So going off of that, yes everyone has strengths and weaknesses, but just looking at it I think shows sorcs and nbs could use a little love and dks could use a lot of love.

Healing: temp, nb, dk and sorc are a tie imo.
Sustain: there are many variables to consider here, but nb, dk and temp tie followed closely by sorc I give dk the nod because of battle roar.
Survivability: this will vary depending on mag v stam and group v solo, but taken as a whole, temp, dk, nb, sorc
Burst: nb, sorc, templar, dk
Mobility: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie
Escapability: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie

The problem is with ranks like this there are so many variables to consider.
Plus this list is hardly an idea of what is wrong with classes. This is an oversimplification. The problems are much more unique and diverse than general labels in most situations. Some problems are not even class related. But for fun a suppose.

-Nb has far superior and more options for healing than a dk and sorc
-nb has the best passive sustain because it requires no skill to get the benefit. However, dk battle roar is solid and temp can slot passive sustain
-survivability is a tricky one. Stam dk and temp are comparable but would give to dk. However, I would rankmag dk as lowest survivability. Nb and sorc survivability relies on their mobility and Escapability on the battlefield making this a tricky one to decide. Depending on the situation all of them can excel differently. The mag dk least of all though.
-burst I think is a given. The problem is sorc burst is the most predictable burst in game.
-I give nb the nod in mobility because of the various ways in which they can be mobile and the various counters needed. Sorc simply has one move which stacks in cost and is easily countered with gap closers. A stam nb can also utilize many mobility options where a stam sorc has 2 streaks at best.
-nb wins Escapability hands down. Various ways to do it. Plus everyone had a gap closer making streak less useful. Again you have the issue with stam sorcs getting one or 2 streaks only.

When people rank sorc as last in sustain, even though dark deal is the most op sustain skill in the game.. xD

Ya, I rank nb higher because it is passive sustain with no interrupt and no skill slot required. Imo, the others can be interchangeable depending on situations. Sorc can be countered by interrupting. Dk needs ult. Temp uses a skill slot. As for the basic sustain anyway.

leepalmer95

bowmanz607 wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Stoopid_Nwah wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-garbage mobility????? only ma class with speed buff. plus cloak for psitioning. plus shade. they have great mobility. the more i read what you write the convinced i am you need to learn to magblade.

Sorcs? Not saying magblades don't have great mobility, but you're forgetting the other most mobile magicka class.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

-the whole point of a magblade is not range???? maybe your playstyle is. mag blade excells at melee also. hence conceled weapon and a gap closer.

Most competitive nbs run destro staves. I think I have seen all of one decent melee magblade (and no I am not counting bomblades).

bowmanz607 wrote: »

ya i over stated it. it is not overlly powerful or anything. but it does its job and hits high enough to use over a spammable dps when in range. Also, still the second best mag execute in game.

Lol no. I'd say it is 3rd best and only because mdks don't have an execute. Sorc's execute isn't reflectable, I don't think it's dodgeable or maybe part of it isn't?, and it allows for "pre-executing"...

-yes i will give a nod to sorcs for mobility. I think each class thrives more in different situations. Nb also has more tools for mobility where sorc really has streak which has cost increase and gap closer susceptible. That is not to say that nb does not have its weaknesses with their tools. but that is what each class has. strengths and weaknesses. For a nb they are in top two in almost every way for each kind of build you are looking for. the rare occasions it is third (never fourth) it is a competitive third.

-I know most competitive nb run desto. need that burst all day. Swords are to situational imo. but desto staff does not equal ranged nb either. just a typical example would be desto/resto with front bar being concealed/impale/lotus fan/ fear/ cloak (or mag light)/ soul harvest ult. I would consider that a melee build with a desto which provides burst you need.

-sorc execute hits like trash. it is fine for a little bump and the end of a timed burst, but is not good really outside of that. Although impale is not going to overwhelm you with power, it will hit harder than your standard dps when in execute range. who cares if it can be countered. everything should have a counter. I cloak RD all day. does that mean it needs a buff?? I dont think so.

nb have so many tools in their arsenal. when a person plays mag sorcs/dk/temp they all run many of the same things. Heck even stam, users run around with all the same abilities. A magblade, however, has trouble deciding which skills to use at any given time because there are so many options. coupled with strong passives and a natural ability at being vary good at all build types. They are the most versatile setup in the game and each buils is as viable as the next.

nb have the type of diversity that all classes should have. nb are in a fine place and other classes such as mag sorc and mag dk need help. The devs should be focused on those to classes and an overhaul to the resto/desto line. Perhaps some tweaks to mag guild to. Nb is fine for both stam and mag. Temp is fine for both. Stam sorc are in a good place and stam dk is obviously doing its thing.

Lol a little bump? It's used to ruin people with implosion+execute damage after a timed burst. Impale is super clunky with a shorter range, and I think a lot would agree it's not worth a slot in pvp. That destro setup you mentioned is super weird, but whatever works for people I guess.

I agree it's difficult picking which skills to slot, and I often find I wish I had a few more spots...but I am the exact same way on my mdk (if not moreso even). Heck I am the same way with my magsorc. (I avoid templars, but having had a couple in the past I would say it's the same case with them). And that doesn't mean mdks or sorcs are in an okay spot at all. I think some skill changes/additions, gear set changes, removal of major evasion, and removal of major mending/vitality/malubeth stacking would allow for more balance alone. Then it wouldn't be so painful that destro mnbs have predominantly projectiles that don't seem to hit very hard and would naturally make them feel more balanced without giving direct nerfs or buffs to classes.

And lol to you saying mnbs are just fine but yet you call them a competitive third...out of four magicka classes...

You take my sentence out of context. I stated they are in the top 2 for most categories mag wise. Sometimes one sometimes 2. In some instances where they are third at a playstyle the number 2 may just barely out edge a magblade. Which means it is still competitive and viable. Your not going to be the best at everything and shouldnt. But being competitive in really all build type is what each class should strive for. Sadly other classes like sorc don't have this.

And ya it used to be good. We are talking now though. That ability tickles. It provides a good burst boost for a timed burst. I find impale.much more reliable and effective. For a melee blade range shouldn't be an issue. Even as a Ranged player it is still pretty decent range.

I don't get all this hype about getting rid of major evasion. It has been in the game since it's inception yet it just now becomes an issue? This is crazy to me. Evasion is fine. Major Vitaliy is necessary with the heal debufff in the game. The issue, imo, is that healing is tied to same stats as damage. The devs need to separate the two. This creates more theory crafting and diversity. It will solve a lot of issues.

The hype is because why would you have a passive dodge chance in PVP when active dodge chance exists. With everyone switching to stam, shuffle is used by a high percentage of players in Cyrodiil. In PVE I do not mind its existence for tanks...but in PVP it should go imo. And yes I realize magblades also get major evasion through double take.

And back to your rankings, my opinion
Healing: Templar, DK, NB, Sorc
Sustain: NB, Templar, Sorc, DK
Survivability: Templar, DK, Sorc, NB
Burst: NB (specifically gankers and bombers), Sorc, Templar, DK
Mobility: Sorc, NB, tie with templar and dk
Escapability: Sorc, NB, zero escape for templars and dks

So going off of that, yes everyone has strengths and weaknesses, but just looking at it I think shows sorcs and nbs could use a little love and dks could use a lot of love.

Healing: temp, nb, dk and sorc are a tie imo.
Sustain: there are many variables to consider here, but nb, dk and temp tie followed closely by sorc I give dk the nod because of battle roar.
Survivability: this will vary depending on mag v stam and group v solo, but taken as a whole, temp, dk, nb, sorc
Burst: nb, sorc, templar, dk
Mobility: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie
Escapability: nb, sorc, temp and dk tie

The problem is with ranks like this there are so many variables to consider.
Plus this list is hardly an idea of what is wrong with classes. This is an oversimplification. The problems are much more unique and diverse than general labels in most situations. Some problems are not even class related. But for fun a suppose.

-Nb has far superior and more options for healing than a dk and sorc
-nb has the best passive sustain because it requires no skill to get the benefit. However, dk battle roar is solid and temp can slot passive sustain
-survivability is a tricky one. Stam dk and temp are comparable but would give to dk. However, I would rankmag dk as lowest survivability. Nb and sorc survivability relies on their mobility and Escapability on the battlefield making this a tricky one to decide. Depending on the situation all of them can excel differently. The mag dk least of all though.
-burst I think is a given. The problem is sorc burst is the most predictable burst in game.
-I give nb the nod in mobility because of the various ways in which they can be mobile and the various counters needed. Sorc simply has one move which stacks in cost and is easily countered with gap closers. A stam nb can also utilize many mobility options where a stam sorc has 2 streaks at best.
-nb wins Escapability hands down. Various ways to do it. Plus everyone had a gap closer making streak less useful. Again you have the issue with stam sorcs getting one or 2 streaks only.

When people rank sorc as last in sustain, even though dark deal is the most op sustain skill in the game.. xD

Ya, I rank nb higher because it is passive sustain with no interrupt and no skill slot required. Imo, the others can be interchangeable depending on situations. Sorc can be countered by interrupting. Dk needs ult. Temp uses a skill slot. As for the basic sustain anyway.

But no one runs regen anymore

zuto40

The only mageblades ive seen in the last month were 3 bombers I ran with last week

SlowMetabolism

The only problem I have is that Agony is broken when attacking with anything but DoTs. If you apply it quickly and keep weaving sometimes the CC will break because of your attacks before they get a chance to CC break. Kinda being punished for fluent gameplay. Makes killing the few good sorcs that there are almost impossible without getting them to eat a full CC.

thankyourat

SlowMetabolism wrote: »

The only problem I have is that Agony is broken when attacking with anything but DoTs. If you apply it quickly and keep weaving sometimes the CC will break because of your attacks before they get a chance to CC break. Kinda being punished for fluent gameplay. Makes killing the few good sorcs that there are almost impossible without getting them to eat a full CC.

Agony breaks on dots as well. if I have a crippling grasp on someone if the dot ticks the agony will break. I don't know if that is suppose to happen or not

SlowMetabolism

thankyourat wrote: »

SlowMetabolism wrote: »

The only problem I have is that Agony is broken when attacking with anything but DoTs. If you apply it quickly and keep weaving sometimes the CC will break because of your attacks before they get a chance to CC break. Kinda being punished for fluent gameplay. Makes killing the few good sorcs that there are almost impossible without getting them to eat a full CC.

Agony breaks on dots as well. if I have a crippling grasp on someone if the dot ticks the agony will break. I don't know if that is suppose to happen or not

My mistake, tooltip doesnt say anything about not breaking on DoTs.