1 button wonders killing RvR

Tess_Phyreforge

I am a Vet member of ESO and a veteran gamer, I started playing Ulitma Online at release in 1997.
So I have experience in all types of PvP and RvR games in my history but what I am seeing as of late in ESO RvR is appalling.
Players being able to manipulate game mechanics with the use of macros is reeking havoc in RvR.

I am also a member of a very large gaming community and I have seen around 2000 members come through our ESO guild since launch, a small amount of that count has stayed, but I am worried most will leave if things don't change.
Most our members Sub and play this game for 4 to 8 hours a day, myself I play 6 to 10 hours a day.

I have talked to a few members and we all agree....
Skills make or break your character in RvR, finding the right build that works for your play style and be competitive is key.

ESO has allowed animation canceling , right?

So after months and being frustrated because Dev's don't see the big picture here...
You will lose your player base if nothing is done about the 1 button wonder macro that lets a player cast 3 to 4 even 5 skill with a tap of 1 button
This macro cast multiple skills and removing the animation and cast timer for each skill.

Game mechanics are game mechanics, The Developers of the game set up the game to have cast times and you've allowed animation canceling in game, that should ONLY cancel the animation, not remove the timer to cast skill.

A player has to know how to animation cancel and new players to RvR have no clue how to do it or what it even is.
I have never seen a video by a Dev member of a step by step how its done,
I have seen a few of the players websites how they do it but the video is very sketchy on how its done.

Players are manipulating the animation canceling to remove cast times with 1 button macros.
This is an Issue and should not be used, If it's a macro set in place by the Developers and works within the boundaries of the game mechanics, then it's fine to use.

There are reports of some player selling these macro build online and telling their buyers to keep it hush hush.
If I knew these website links I would report them in a heartbeat!
If I do run across any website selling ESO macros, gold or items I will report them!
Players like this are ruining ESO
I don't approve of players selling game items/gold or how to win macro builds online for real money.

NO player should benefit from ESO CEO, Developers and Team members hard work building us a beautiful game.
I pay 6 months game time, every 6 months since the release.
I fear If things don't look up for the future of RvR in ESO I can see players moving on to a game like Camelot Unchained to fill their RvR gaming habits.

Most of the gamers out there have a keyboard that has the ability to run or make macros, if your going to allow player to use these macros then why not have premade class macro builds added to the game options?

or better yet...

Remove animation canceling and cast timers from the game, this will solve the issue!
Then all players will be on the same playing field in RvR,
It will be up to the players to pick and choose the skills from their learned skill line to be competitive in RVR without the worrier of cast timers and animation canceling.

Let the Flaming begin! I don't care!
I am an Old school gamer and proud of it !!!!!!!!!

Waffennacht

Macros are already against the rules.

If you were to get rid of animation cancelling, then you are sol against a boss if you get stuck casting during a one hit wonder.

Most of the end game content (vMA) can only be completed (dps check) via cancelling (sorcs esp)

Im gonna say, the only way for you to cut back the macros... is to go console.

r.jan_emailb16_ESO

You can easily animation cancel without a single macro. It's been a long time since I heard a good PvP player complain about someone macroing, just saying.

Hyssia

I've played since release, and I don't think I've ever found a so-called "Macro user". And if I have, they sure as hell died before putting good use to their "macro". Heck, I'm even getting whispers from ppl claiming that I'm a macro user for ani-cancelling them to death.

Are you sure such things exist? It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

Tess_Phyreforge

I know macros are against the rules, then why is nothing being done to players using them, Thats the whole point of my post.
If they are not going to do anything to players using them, then make preset class skill macros part of the game options making to available to everyone.

That's why this post is posted in RvR and not PVE, not asking for timers or animation cancelling to be removed in PvE
Don't see how removing timers and animation will hurt our DPS in PvE, if anything it would help,
You would still have to manage your Mana and Stam regen with light and heavy attack weaving giving your skills time to be recast again.

As for console, old-timer here, really hate the controllers
My BF plays the Xbox but I never liked playing on it.

wayfarerx

Hyssia wrote: »

It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

This. It's not macros, it's people who know their skills and have practiced their animation canceling routines. A good player will beat a macro user every time in this game.

You may not like animation cancelling in ESO, but don't blame macros.

myrrrorb14_ESO

Cool, haven't seen a macro thread in about a week. Nice change of pace from the 3 day ban debauchery that is running rampant.

Suppose I could link a few threads, but too lazy today. I have never personally witnessed a macro that allowed a player to do something that couldn't be done by a player (often worse than a player). Rumors of macros allowing the use of multiple abilities at once is mostly just garbage. Lag / latency / buggy death recap / whatever you want to call it. The only times that it has happened is when ZOS broke the coding for certain skills (regeneration spam most recently).

Animation cancelling has been embraced by ZOS and is now a central to the game mechanics on how they design content.

r.jan_emailb16_ESO

Tess_Phyreforge wrote: »

I know macros are against the rules, then why is nothing being done to players using them, Thats the whole point of my post.
If they are not going to do anything to players using them, then make preset class skill macros part of the game options making to available to everyone.

That's why this post is posted in RvR and not PVE, not asking for timers or animation cancelling to be removed in PvE
Don't see how removing timers and animation will hurt our DPS in PvE, if anything it would help,
You would still have to manage your Mana and Stam regen with light and heavy attack weaving giving your skills time to be recast again.

As for console, old-timer here, really hate the controllers
My BF plays the Xbox but I never liked playing on it.

As has already been said, it's very, very unlikely that you got macro'ed. You can time multiple skills to hit an opponent in only 1-2 seconds, or cancel some animations very effectively manually (for example light attack - ransack - bash). No need for a macro of any sort to pull this off.

Tess_Phyreforge

I've been playing since beta and I know about canceling animations, cancel skills with bash/block and all this.
I know there are players out there that are GOOD at it, without using macros.
I don't use macros, Always felt they should never been allowed in any MMO.

I am posting about players using the Macros and players out there selling the macros to other players for real $$$$

Read the whole post and understand what you're reading before posting.
There is nothing bad about canceling animations, we all do it in PvP and PvE

It's all about players that DO use macros because they're LAZY and want a button set to auto kill.
These player are ruining the enjoyment of the RvR for most of us.

If you guys don't think there are players out there doing macros, then why are there website selling Macros for RvR for real $$$.
That alone tells me there are players using them and learning how to make them and selling that info to profit off it.

If you see any sites selling gold/items macros or anything please report the website to ZoS.
If they are not approved by ZoS then don't support them.

myrrrorb14_ESO

Tess_Phyreforge wrote: »

I've been playing since beta and I know about canceling animations, cancel skills with bash/block and all this.
I know there are players out there that are GOOD at it, without using macros.

I am posting about players using the Macros and players out there selling the macros to other players for real $$$$

Read the whole post and understand what you're reading before posting.
There is nothing bad about canceling animations, we all do it in PvP and PvE

It's all about players that DO use macros because they're LAZY and want a button set to auto kill.
These player are ruining the enjoyment of the RvR for most of us.

If you guys don't think there are players out there doing macros, then why are there website selling Macros for RvR for real $$$.
That alone tells me there are players using them and learning how to make them and selling that info to profit off it.

It's kind of like diet pills. They exist but do they really do anything?

People are desperate for an easy fix so will throw money at it for instant gratification instead of just working on it.

Wreuntzylla

I love these threads. All the macro users come out of the woodwork to say the devil doesn't exist.

Hyssia wrote: »

I've played since release, and I don't think I've ever found a so-called "Macro user". And if I have, they sure as hell died before putting good use to their "macro". Heck, I'm even getting whispers from ppl claiming that I'm a macro user for ani-cancelling them to death.

Are you sure such things exist? It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

How do you know? Seriously, nothing you say can be proven.

You are saying you don't think anyone since release has used them on you and if they did you killed them? Completely impossible to even have an inkling of whether any of that is true. Of course, if the "I think" part is true, that means you are a master macroer who knows exactly how to detect other macro users right? Or is the common patient able to tell if the surgeons work was done well?

Let me help you out for future posts. Normal people arguing macros don' exist would limit the argument to what they could possibly know. For example, arguing that everybody they know denies using macros.

wayfarerx wrote: »

Hyssia wrote: »

It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

This. It's not macros, it's people who know their skills and have practiced their animation canceling routines. A good player will beat a macro user every time in this game.

You may not like animation cancelling in ESO, but don't blame macros.

Again, how do you know? You have watched every good player that streams and watched their hands and setup? Oh wait, none of the streamers playing ESO ever show any of that... even though that is the e-sport norm... For all you know, every good player in the game is using one macro or another. Or do you swing by each of their houses to watch them play from time to time?

Do you folks even realize how bad these arguments are and how they immediately implicate you? No innocent person would argue that all successful robbers who are never caught do not use lockpicks. Why? Because they couldn't possibly know that... unless...

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

Tess_Phyreforge wrote: »

I know macros are against the rules, then why is nothing being done to players using them, Thats the whole point of my post.
If they are not going to do anything to players using them, then make preset class skill macros part of the game options making to available to everyone.

That's why this post is posted in RvR and not PVE, not asking for timers or animation cancelling to be removed in PvE
Don't see how removing timers and animation will hurt our DPS in PvE, if anything it would help,
You would still have to manage your Mana and Stam regen with light and heavy attack weaving giving your skills time to be recast again.

As for console, old-timer here, really hate the controllers
My BF plays the Xbox but I never liked playing on it.

As has already been said, it's very, very unlikely that you got macro'ed. You can time multiple skills to hit an opponent in only 1-2 seconds, or cancel some animations very effectively manually (for example light attack - ransack - bash). No need for a macro of any sort to pull this off.

Another great argument. All ESO players are of such high ethical standards that it's very unlikely they would macro just for convenience? Or so they could keep the animation cancelling going as they bunny hop across rocks? Or simply to avoid tunnel carpal syndrome from pressing various buttons 2-5 times per second?

Bottom line folks, nobody denies something exists when they have absolutely no evidence to back it up unless they have a vested interest. It's like interviewing kids at an inner city high school who say marijuana is never sold anywhere in the city let alone at their school... Who would argue that with a straight face?

These very forums debunk the hypothesis that nobody successfully macros... You can search for the word macro in the forum search bar and find several posts on how to macro with post after post either asking for clarification or thanking the OP. One is as simple as macroing to overcome ZoS' action on release instead of on press. So, in the off chance you are all eternal optimists that always see the good side before the bad, time to see the bad...

Tess_Phyreforge

VERY TRUE!!! myrrrorb14_ESO

In my Ulitma Online days the GM's had a way to track players using Macro, so if a GM found you they would jail you.
Yes they had an actual jail they would place your character in for a 3 day ban, your friends could come visit you if you logged into that toon during the ban.
2nd time your caught your whole account was ban for a week.
3rd time your perma ban.

I had a guildmate that casted a lighting spell on a GM during my UO wedding while Lord Blackthorn was present, he ended up in jail for 24hrs...lol

wayfarerx

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

wayfarerx wrote: »

Hyssia wrote: »

It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

This. It's not macros, it's people who know their skills and have practiced their animation canceling routines. A good player will beat a macro user every time in this game.

You may not like animation cancelling in ESO, but don't blame macros.

Again, how do you know? You have watched every good player that streams and watched their hands and setup? Oh wait, none of the streamers playing ESO ever show any of that... even though that is the e-sport norm... For all you know, every good player in the game is using one macro or another. Or do you swing by each of their houses to watch them play from time to time?

Do you folks even realize how bad these arguments are and how they immediately implicate you? No innocent person would argue that all successful robbers who are never caught do not use lockpicks. Why? Because they couldn't possibly know that... unless...

Have you played this game? With all the lag and the skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails? Macros are a handicap, I'm not even that great of a player and I can still do better just timing skills correctly and pushing buttons as I see the need. And the idea that someone saying macros are useless implicates them as using macros is... creative, at best.

Tess_Phyreforge wrote: »

If you guys don't think there are players out there doing macros, then why are there website selling Macros for RvR for real $$$.

Because there are many people with more money than sense?

Reevster

Most everyone who has a programmable keyboard and or mouse is using some type of macro in game, so thast what 95 percent of the players? Very few who have the means and know how to set it up are "not" using it, I hate macro users but I don't see how ZEN can stop it , but i am not a programmer so meh..

Waffennacht

Just to play devil's advocate...

To OP: if, as you say, ZoS is unwilling to enforce the rules that already exist... then why would they put in More work to change mechanics?

DHale

Marcos are not against any rule in ESO. Also those that use them they don't work well in lag which is what most of you are experiencing and that is what you are dieing too more than any macroing real or imagined. That said I don't use (being old and having a wife and job) them but would like to learn. Btw a lot of the devs use macros. It does not kill the game and there are no good players that bothers with thinking about Marcos or macro users. They have been in the game since PC launch so more than 2 years. I have given less than 10 minutes of thought to macros or Marco users and I am only an above average player. When I die to anyone in a couple of seconds or less it just makes me practice my animation canceling more regardless of how they did it. What I would like them to address is the ppl who can mitigate 90 percent of damage without casting anything... Just stand there. Like b used to do.

Wreuntzylla

wayfarerx wrote: »

Have you played this game? With all the lag and the skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails? Macros are a handicap, I'm not even that great of a player and I can still do better just timing skills correctly and pushing buttons as I see the need. And the idea that someone saying macros are useless implicates them as using macros is... creative, at best.

Well, at least one person has fessed up to at least trying macros. I applaud you for that.

But... are you saying manual play defeats skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails when macros don't? How does that work?

So, look, in an old thread I posed the question of why people chose crit rush over ambush. People posted different reasons but not one of them made sense, and damage parses clearly showed that using ambush in a rotation was significantly more DPS. But EVERYBODY used crit rush, just like the streamers do.

One guy finally came out and said that yeah, it's because ambush has no minimum range and was sucky for macroing. On the other hand, if you macro crit rush, which has a minimum range (3.5m), with a melee skill having a maximum range (e.g., 5m), you consistently stay on target and do damage regardless of lag. Because the server is going to determine the range and apply the first skill in the queue that meets the range requirements.

So, no, manual play apparently pales in comparison to macros in at least some cases.

As far as implications, how many facts do you argue that you could not possibly know the truth of? If you have no vested interest? It's a psychological fact that people protest more strenuously when guilty. You have heard of the saying, 'Thou dost protest too much?" Same thing here. What could possibly motivate a poster to continuously deflect arguments on a topic that has no relevance to them? It can't be reputation. In PvP, salt is an honor badge (see the duo templar video with the salt viewer).

myrrrorb14_ESO

ZOS_AlanGZOS_AlanG
admin
Idinuse wrote: »
"You agree not to use any hardware or software or any other method of support that is not authorized by ZeniMax or that may in any way influence or advantage Your playing abilities, or influence or advantage Your use of the Services. Third party tools, the use of ‘bots’, “speed hacks”, “deep-link”, “page-scrape”, “robot”, “spider”, algorithm or other programs that copy or monitor any part of the Services (including, but not limited to, the Game(s) and/or forums)."
ToS from Eso
Thank you for providing the quote, @Idinuse, using macros is against the terms of service. We certainly don't mind a thread being created to ask about this, but this is starting to delve into more detail than is acceptable on the forums so we are locking this thread.

The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios

So officially yes macros are not allowed

ColoursYouHave

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

You can easily animation cancel without a single macro. It's been a long time since I heard a good PvP player complain about someone macroing, just saying.

Well that's because all the good PVP players are clearly macroing.

Just like anybody who thinks that macroing would be less effective then being even half-decent at the game. Or anybody who thinks that macroing isn't commonly used in the game.

brandishsteel

I made a macro before from Visual Studio C# windows form application , quite easy to make and it bypass ESO anti cheat system.
I tested it , it works , but never use it once.
its about animation cancel wrecking blow + light attack + heavy attack from press 1 button and it allows u hit people with an unbreakable cc ( wrecking blow exploits)
BUT I NEVER USE IT AGAINST ANY PLAYER OR ANY PVE MOBS EXCEPT THE TESTING PROCESS
its not fun when u press 1 button and people can't break your cc, not fun at all
I am a student , I play game for fun , I am not a one button killer
that's all , not fun at all

Brrrofski

OP, come try the game on xbox. The same thing will happen. There is definitely no macros there.

Some people get good animation cancelling. Just how it is.

Vangy

Macros exist.... But do they really help in ESO's setting? With the current lag and FPS drops macros are a one-button suicide.....

To explain further im going to relate to an experience I have had last week playing ESO PvP...

Runnin to sej, I get ganked by a bush-blade.
I break free and try to swap to my bow bar. Hit swap key. Nothing registers. I mash dat swap button and after 2 tries and with me almost dead it works. Cast heal, cast buffs, dodgy dodgy now try to swap to 2h bar. Again dosent work. Mash mash mash.... FInally it worked. Continue fighting........

With macros, they execute a sequence of button presses in a pre-set order with respect to time. (I know this because I do play RTS games where macros are legal in single player mode. I have a razer mamba with quite a few keys mapped to huge sequences of buttons for that game). These work EXTREMELY well when game is responsive and things dont get skipped. If I had used macros in the above scenario I would have been dead....

What would have happened with macros: (for example if I had a macro for weapon swap>cast vigor>cast buff X&Y>swap bar)

1. Macro casts bar swap --> server dosent register
2. Macro dosent know that bar swap didnt work. It dont care. Macro now casts the ability on bar 4 (on my bow bar that is vigor) --> however im still on 2h bar. The ability on my 2h bar on slot 4 is searing strike.... --> GG dead Vangy cos he couldnt heal due to bad macro.....
3. The end.

Another thing to account for is latency. Macros can be programmed to work flawlessly in a certain ping range. Like maybe 100-150 ms. But if you experience any kind of latency fluctuations like lets say your ping goes up to 200 or 250, that macro will just F up so bad its gona get you killed. It is going to skip casting certain skills, your bar swaps might not work.... In essence, its just gona get you pwnt.

sneaky_t

macros in pvp really dont work, mainly because it wont help you at all, and its extremely unreliable in laggy situations. sure some players might try to use macros, but they will never be as good as someone who doesnt. people have gotta let this whole pvp macro thing go its bs. anyone who buys macros is getting scammed lol

WillhelmBlack

Although it's rare, it's sad to see. Some people care more about winning and their ego than having fun and meeting friends, that's just the way of life though not just computer games.

r.jan_emailb16_ESO

ColoursYouHave wrote: »

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

You can easily animation cancel without a single macro. It's been a long time since I heard a good PvP player complain about someone macroing, just saying.

Well that's because all the good PVP players are clearly macroing.

Just like anybody who thinks that macroing would be less effective then being even half-decent at the game. Or anybody who thinks that macroing isn't commonly used in the game.

Go make a macro and fight some of the really good players and see what happens.

Leandor

Oh, animation cancelling can stay. Effect cancelling needs to be implemented in addition.

Either you do the animation or you don't get the effect.

VoiDGhOs7

TL:DR.

To OP:You can't macro in ESO because there is a Global Cooldown between each attack/skill use set to 1.3 sec and there's nothing you can to do to ignore it on the other hand there were/are players able to use scripts in order to delay the skills attacks and make them hit all at the same time.

Animation cancelling is an INTENDED mechanic as devs already commented on it in another thread.Before TG went live ZOS tried to change the prioritization of animations but it was bad since the combat felt more clunky so the changes were delayed to DB tests.We'll see the changes as soon as DB goes live.

raasdal

LOL

Another one of these?

Funny how people feel the need to assert their knowledge of "exploits" and "macros" by listing how many years they have been gaming. I have been gaming since 1986, yet it does not make me any smarter or give me better understanding of how this game works.

ColoursYouHave wrote: »

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

You can easily animation cancel without a single macro. It's been a long time since I heard a good PvP player complain about someone macroing, just saying.

Well that's because all the good PVP players are clearly macroing.

Just like anybody who thinks that macroing would be less effective then being even half-decent at the game. Or anybody who thinks that macroing isn't commonly used in the game.

Please understand that there is no such thing as "macro" exploiting in this game. ANYTHING you can do with a macro in this game, I CAN DO BETTER without the Macro. So for any skilled gamer there is 0 incentive to use a Macro. For reference, see the other posts about how Macros react in laggy situations - which is what Cyrodiil is 90% of the time.

Hyssia wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

I love these threads. All the macro users come out of the woodwork to say the devil doesn't exist.

Hyssia wrote: »

I've played since release, and I don't think I've ever found a so-called "Macro user". And if I have, they sure as hell died before putting good use to their "macro". Heck, I'm even getting whispers from ppl claiming that I'm a macro user for ani-cancelling them to death.

Are you sure such things exist? It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

How do you know? Seriously, nothing you say can be proven.

You are saying you don't think anyone since release has used them on you and if they did you killed them? Completely impossible to even have an inkling of whether any of that is true. Of course, if the "I think" part is true, that means you are a master macroer who knows exactly how to detect other macro users right? Or is the common patient able to tell if the surgeons work was done well?

Let me help you out for future posts. Normal people arguing macros don' exist would limit the argument to what they could possibly know. For example, arguing that everybody they know denies using macros.

wayfarerx wrote: »

Hyssia wrote: »

It's not hard to set up 2-3-4 skills to land at the same time.

This. It's not macros, it's people who know their skills and have practiced their animation canceling routines. A good player will beat a macro user every time in this game.

You may not like animation cancelling in ESO, but don't blame macros.

Again, how do you know? You have watched every good player that streams and watched their hands and setup? Oh wait, none of the streamers playing ESO ever show any of that... even though that is the e-sport norm... For all you know, every good player in the game is using one macro or another. Or do you swing by each of their houses to watch them play from time to time?

Do you folks even realize how bad these arguments are and how they immediately implicate you? No innocent person would argue that all successful robbers who are never caught do not use lockpicks. Why? Because they couldn't possibly know that... unless...

edit: removed quote for post that was removed and reference to it

raasdal

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

wayfarerx wrote: »

Have you played this game? With all the lag and the skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails? Macros are a handicap, I'm not even that great of a player and I can still do better just timing skills correctly and pushing buttons as I see the need. And the idea that someone saying macros are useless implicates them as using macros is... creative, at best.

Well, at least one person has fessed up to at least trying macros. I applaud you for that.

But... are you saying manual play defeats skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails when macros don't? How does that work?

So, look, in an old thread I posed the question of why people chose crit rush over ambush. People posted different reasons but not one of them made sense, and damage parses clearly showed that using ambush in a rotation was significantly more DPS. But EVERYBODY used crit rush, just like the streamers do.

One guy finally came out and said that yeah, it's because ambush has no minimum range and was sucky for macroing. On the other hand, if you macro crit rush, which has a minimum range (3.5m), with a melee skill having a maximum range (e.g., 5m), you consistently stay on target and do damage regardless of lag. Because the server is going to determine the range and apply the first skill in the queue that meets the range requirements.

So, no, manual play apparently pales in comparison to macros in at least some cases.

As far as implications, how many facts do you argue that you could not possibly know the truth of? If you have no vested interest? It's a psychological fact that people protest more strenuously when guilty. You have heard of the saying, 'Thou dost protest too much?" Same thing here. What could possibly motivate a poster to continuously deflect arguments on a topic that has no relevance to them? It can't be reputation. In PvP, salt is an honor badge (see the duo templar video with the salt viewer).

Even though i just posted, i just found this funny part. So someone actually told you, that NB's have been using Crit Rush instead of Ambush because Crit Rush fits better in a Macro? Sorry, but that is beyond ignorant.

There is ONE single reason why NB's will choose Crit Rush over Ambush, which anybody who actually plays this game will know. It is called the Maelstrom Maul/Greatsword etc. Please try to google that, and you will quickly see the reason for ppl using Crit Rush. SPOILER: It has nothing to do with fitting better in a Macro.

I will be silent now, and let the illuminati reign supreme.

Kas

there is an add-on to automatically craft several things in a row. iirc this is against the rules as well. while i first thought this would be pretty-muhc a non-issue i've recently "heard" that if you still use it, you can craft potions way faster than someone manually spannign "r" (or whatever your button is). Now this is a HUGE problem, imho. Not because it matters if people have to waste 2minutes to craft pots or not (my appraoch was to swithc my monitor to TV and blindly spam R while watching something, btw also a sign of an unnessary game mechanic. if there is zero challenge to it, remove it) but because I'm afraid that some of the horror-stories about combat macros were actually true.

If the Add-on API can be used to outperform manual inputs by a large margin, this would be a terrible situation. It's still annoying that some people use marcos to get perfect timings without skill. But they lose flexibility and the ability to react to other circumstances such as lag. However, if said macros actually use the API and outperform the best theretically human input, something's broken as hell

while enforcing the rule against macro usage would be good, removing the possibility to outperform perfect manual controls should be a top priority and go without saying.

raasdal wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

wayfarerx wrote: »

Have you played this game? With all the lag and the skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails? Macros are a handicap, I'm not even that great of a player and I can still do better just timing skills correctly and pushing buttons as I see the need. And the idea that someone saying macros are useless implicates them as using macros is... creative, at best.

Well, at least one person has fessed up to at least trying macros. I applaud you for that.

But... are you saying manual play defeats skill bar freezes and weapon swap fails when macros don't? How does that work?

So, look, in an old thread I posed the question of why people chose crit rush over ambush. People posted different reasons but not one of them made sense, and damage parses clearly showed that using ambush in a rotation was significantly more DPS. But EVERYBODY used crit rush, just like the streamers do.

One guy finally came out and said that yeah, it's because ambush has no minimum range and was sucky for macroing. On the other hand, if you macro crit rush, which has a minimum range (3.5m), with a melee skill having a maximum range (e.g., 5m), you consistently stay on target and do damage regardless of lag. Because the server is going to determine the range and apply the first skill in the queue that meets the range requirements.

So, no, manual play apparently pales in comparison to macros in at least some cases.

As far as implications, how many facts do you argue that you could not possibly know the truth of? If you have no vested interest? It's a psychological fact that people protest more strenuously when guilty. You have heard of the saying, 'Thou dost protest too much?" Same thing here. What could possibly motivate a poster to continuously deflect arguments on a topic that has no relevance to them? It can't be reputation. In PvP, salt is an honor badge (see the duo templar video with the salt viewer).

Even though i just posted, i just found this funny part. So someone actually told you, that NB's have been using Crit Rush instead of Ambush because Crit Rush fits better in a Macro? Sorry, but that is beyond ignorant.

There is ONE single reason why NB's will choose Crit Rush over Ambush, which anybody who actually plays this game will know. It is called the Maelstrom Maul/Greatsword etc. Please try to google that, and you will quickly see the reason for ppl using Crit Rush. SPOILER: It has nothing to do with fitting better in a Macro.

I will be silent now, and let the illuminati reign supreme.

haven't played much NB but using crit rush and using two fingers to hit the charge button+some other skill in rapid succession is something i even do manually and very valuable in meele 1v1. especially so with both sides run pots with major expedition and know how to use movement to significantly reduce meele damage doen to it.

i can at least imagine that some NBs prefer crit rush for that reason. Especially those that use macros. But as I said, I've done the exact thing while playing manually. Just move down two fingers. If you have the finger for the charge slightly below the other finger, it can even be used with meele attacks without a max range like sweeps/jabs (but that's incredibly prone to lag). Do this, pop a major expedition pot and try to move a lot with a+s and s+d (i.e. backwards sideways). You'll notice improved performance in 1v1 meele vs meele situations.

vamp_emily

I am posting about players using the Macros and players out there selling the macros to other players for real $$$$

We may need to do research on a group of "Playing since beta" players. I think some beta players might be losing their mind. Maybe from lack of sleep for 2 year or getting WBed to many times?