You're views on new v14 Levelling...

mtwiggz

djyrb wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

I've said this in many threads and the feedback has always been split, but I would love to see a Crown Store item that offers a VR14 boost to a character. You can even add stipulations; Must have one VR14 character already, must have character to at least VR1 to use, can only use once per 'x' amount of time, etc. In my opinion it wouldn't be pay to win, as you're not gaining an advantage over any other player - as any player can grind XP. It would be a convenience item, taking away the endless hours of grinding .

One issue I see with that (besides it being viewed as "P2W" by the community) is where does that potential 14 million XP go? After I leveled my first max level character a year ago, I now make it a point to level every single weapon/armor line and often multiple morphs of skills on the way up to VR14.

I figure one never knows when a skill might be changed/buffed/nerfed etc, so I might as well put that XP to good use, and make respeccing a viable option at endgame, instead of leveling a one-trick pony like I did with my first character.

At this point I really could careless. Just give me the VR14 status, and if there is anything else I want/need I will grind it out. The majority of skill lines I already have to 35+, all of the main ones I use at this point are 50 as well - just with the 1-50 + 4 VR levels I have done.

I would see that most players would view it as pay to win, but thats just something the community will have to get over. As it would not at all be pay to win. Being VR14 for 'x' amount of Crowns gives you no advantage over players who had to grind those levels. In actuality, as you stated, you will be at a disadvantage by not getting to level certain skill lines.

I'm 100% against pay to win. In no way do I view something like this as pay to win. Zenimax has marketed the Crown Store as a "convenience" store. This item would simply be just that, convenient.

Attorneyatlawl

mtwiggz wrote: »

djyrb wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

I've said this in many threads and the feedback has always been split, but I would love to see a Crown Store item that offers a VR14 boost to a character. You can even add stipulations; Must have one VR14 character already, must have character to at least VR1 to use, can only use once per 'x' amount of time, etc. In my opinion it wouldn't be pay to win, as you're not gaining an advantage over any other player - as any player can grind XP. It would be a convenience item, taking away the endless hours of grinding .

One issue I see with that (besides it being viewed as "P2W" by the community) is where does that potential 14 million XP go? After I leveled my first max level character a year ago, I now make it a point to level every single weapon/armor line and often multiple morphs of skills on the way up to VR14.

I figure one never knows when a skill might be changed/buffed/nerfed etc, so I might as well put that XP to good use, and make respeccing a viable option at endgame, instead of leveling a one-trick pony like I did with my first character.

At this point I really could careless. Just give me the VR14 status, and if there is anything else I want/need I will grind it out. The majority of skill lines I already have to 35+, all of the main ones I use at this point are 50 as well - just with the 1-50 + 4 VR levels I have done.

I would see that most players would view it as pay to win, but thats just something the community will have to get over. As it would not at all be pay to win. Being VR14 for 'x' amount of Crowns gives you no advantage over players who had to grind those levels. In actuality, as you stated, you will be at a disadvantage by not getting to level certain skill lines.

I'm 100% against pay to win. In no way do I view something like this as pay to win. Zenimax has marketed the Crown Store as a "convenience" store. This item would simply be just that, convenient.

Paying to skip 40-50 hours of leveling that you can then turn around and have fun PVP'ing with for alliance points to buy or sell great items with? Yeah, that's "Pay to win", though some might argue it's "pay to progress" or "pay to skip".

mtwiggz

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

djyrb wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

I've said this in many threads and the feedback has always been split, but I would love to see a Crown Store item that offers a VR14 boost to a character. You can even add stipulations; Must have one VR14 character already, must have character to at least VR1 to use, can only use once per 'x' amount of time, etc. In my opinion it wouldn't be pay to win, as you're not gaining an advantage over any other player - as any player can grind XP. It would be a convenience item, taking away the endless hours of grinding .

One issue I see with that (besides it being viewed as "P2W" by the community) is where does that potential 14 million XP go? After I leveled my first max level character a year ago, I now make it a point to level every single weapon/armor line and often multiple morphs of skills on the way up to VR14.

I figure one never knows when a skill might be changed/buffed/nerfed etc, so I might as well put that XP to good use, and make respeccing a viable option at endgame, instead of leveling a one-trick pony like I did with my first character.

At this point I really could careless. Just give me the VR14 status, and if there is anything else I want/need I will grind it out. The majority of skill lines I already have to 35+, all of the main ones I use at this point are 50 as well - just with the 1-50 + 4 VR levels I have done.

I would see that most players would view it as pay to win, but thats just something the community will have to get over. As it would not at all be pay to win. Being VR14 for 'x' amount of Crowns gives you no advantage over players who had to grind those levels. In actuality, as you stated, you will be at a disadvantage by not getting to level certain skill lines.

I'm 100% against pay to win. In no way do I view something like this as pay to win. Zenimax has marketed the Crown Store as a "convenience" store. This item would simply be just that, convenient.

Paying to skip 40-50 hours of leveling that you can then turn around and have fun PVP'ing with for alliance points to buy or sell great items with? Yeah, that's "Pay to win", though some might argue it's "pay to progress" or "pay to skip".

Since when do you need to be VR14 to gain alliance points? From level 15-50 I made over one million AP in BWB. Through your theory you have to be VR14 to farm AP? Well thats a complete lie. Any level character can join a great PvP guild and farm AP. Being VR14 simply lets you be more effective, it does not affect your AP gains at all.

We're all entitled to our own opinions, yes your opinion is valid. Though your example is completely wrong. You can think it is pay to win all you want, but until you come up with an actual example of something that a player would gain out of it to give an advantage over other players, you're dismissive in this conversation.

Gidorick

They could do THIS: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/169671/remove-vet-raise-level-cap-concept/p1

I want to refine this concept... anyone know of where I can find a list of how much XP it takes to go from 1-50, for each level?

Endurance

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

So, here I sit with a Breton Templar and a Breton Sorc. I'm working on putting together a couple of characters for PVE and PVP. However, I'm now at that junction in ESO Life where I question whether I can really be bothered grinding out 2 more v14's.

I mean, I really would like to try say a Redguard/Imperial Templar but...... well.... you know the thought process.

Getting to v1 is fine, takes a couple of nights maybe 3. I know the grind spots etc. But do I want to do another 14 million points after that. It's a LOT of time and more importantly, complete boredom.

So I suppose my question to you guys is:

What could ZOS implement to assist people who want a new v14 to play with but just cant stomach going through the 14 million point grind?

best way to avoid the grind is to not make more than one character.. now if everyones doing this for the sake of testing builds or just to dominate PVP, surely thats what they invented the test server for

leshpar

wayfarerb14_ESO wrote: »

@P3ZZL3
Sure, the maxed out gear is isn't available just yet, but there are plenty of lower vr gear sets to choose from, so saying you want max level for the best gear is maybe a little unimaginative. There are actually quite a few sets that look pretty awesome, but aren't available at max level (ex. Akatosh's Blessed Armor, Sanctuary). Bonus, since so many people prefer to grind through to max level, most of these low level items are dirt cheap. Play around with the sets as you level, maybe you'll find a combination that works better for your playstyle than the latest fotm said you should use.

If you're determined not to have fun with your toon until you reach max level, well, there's nothing we can do to stop you. I am 100% against being able to buy a vr14 toon from the crown store- with or without restrictions. If you don't want to grind, then don't. Just play the game.

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I have really found that seducer's armor with it's magicka regen and 8% spell cost reduction really helps me be a better healer. I've tried other sets and it just never felt right you know? I feel I do better with that, so I use it.

SickDuck

Am I the first one to point out it's only 13 million XP?

After all the changes it's still easy to grind a level within 3 hours - that's a casual evening play session. So getting to v14 is still can be done in less than 2 weeks no rush, given you know the content already. Even with questing I've found one level can be done conveniently in 6-8 hours which is more than double the time than grinding, but yields 100-120 skill points in the end. Those skill points allow you to get all skills (excluding AvA lines) levelled to max on one morph at least. Means, by the end of a 2 week session you will have an all-around alt, just one re-spec away from any role.

SirAndy

sadownik wrote: »

But in veteran campaigns its v 14 or you are f'ed.

I beg to differ. My new main PvP chars has been on Chillrend since level 10 and she's a ton of fun to play. She's level 46 now and kicking butt on a regular basis.

P3ZZL3

SirAndy wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

But in veteran campaigns its v 14 or you are f'ed.

I beg to differ. My new main PvP chars has been on Chillrend since level 10 and she's a ton of fun to play. She's level 46 now and kicking butt on a regular basis.

Said the guy who's been around almost 2 years Slightly different when you know and understand all the game play/mechanics and such

Cuyler

Can anyone tell me after yesterdays patch if grinding in a group of 2 is still the optimal? or if we can now group in larger groups again.....

Junkogen

With the new champion system, VR rank isn't as big of a deal. If someone with 600 cp at vr 1 goes up against someone with 100 cp at vr 14, I bet the odds are a little different than they were before the champion system. Now the imbalance is in champion points. They keep shifting the imbalance to new systems. The fact is the grinders always win. That seems to be the way MMOs are made. I think it sucks as a casual gamer, but others think it sucks if there isn't a way to become way more powerful than others simply by investing tons and tons of time grinding. You can't please everyone, but it seems like the developers err on the side of whatever gets people playing more. As to the quality of that play, that's another discussion. Maybe some don't mind the grind. I abhor it.

The other side of this is that the casual gamers or new players feel like they're too outmatched and get overwhelmed and just stop playing, which isn't good for the population. So ZOS has to ask themselves if there are enough grinders and hard core gamers to support this game. If not, then they need to rethink how they've done things and not alienate those that can't spend their life grinding champion points or vr levels or whatever new name you want to call it.

Sensesfail13

Currently the worst game I have ever tried to level in.
The first run through every quest in every zone = Awesome
The second run through every quest in every zone = Meh
The third run through every quest in every zone = Kill me now why have they gotten rid of EVERY MOB THAT GIVES DECENT EXPERIENCE IN THIS MF'ING GAME.

And this is after living through the hell levels in the orginal Everquest. There is nothing worse than watching a mediocre storyline over and over and over on repeat and being FORCED into it.

Attorneyatlawl

mtwiggz wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

djyrb wrote: »

mtwiggz wrote: »

I've said this in many threads and the feedback has always been split, but I would love to see a Crown Store item that offers a VR14 boost to a character. You can even add stipulations; Must have one VR14 character already, must have character to at least VR1 to use, can only use once per 'x' amount of time, etc. In my opinion it wouldn't be pay to win, as you're not gaining an advantage over any other player - as any player can grind XP. It would be a convenience item, taking away the endless hours of grinding .

One issue I see with that (besides it being viewed as "P2W" by the community) is where does that potential 14 million XP go? After I leveled my first max level character a year ago, I now make it a point to level every single weapon/armor line and often multiple morphs of skills on the way up to VR14.

I figure one never knows when a skill might be changed/buffed/nerfed etc, so I might as well put that XP to good use, and make respeccing a viable option at endgame, instead of leveling a one-trick pony like I did with my first character.

At this point I really could careless. Just give me the VR14 status, and if there is anything else I want/need I will grind it out. The majority of skill lines I already have to 35+, all of the main ones I use at this point are 50 as well - just with the 1-50 + 4 VR levels I have done.

I would see that most players would view it as pay to win, but thats just something the community will have to get over. As it would not at all be pay to win. Being VR14 for 'x' amount of Crowns gives you no advantage over players who had to grind those levels. In actuality, as you stated, you will be at a disadvantage by not getting to level certain skill lines.

I'm 100% against pay to win. In no way do I view something like this as pay to win. Zenimax has marketed the Crown Store as a "convenience" store. This item would simply be just that, convenient.

Paying to skip 40-50 hours of leveling that you can then turn around and have fun PVP'ing with for alliance points to buy or sell great items with? Yeah, that's "Pay to win", though some might argue it's "pay to progress" or "pay to skip".

Since when do you need to be VR14 to gain alliance points? From level 15-50 I made over one million AP in BWB. Through your theory you have to be VR14 to farm AP? Well thats a complete lie. Any level character can join a great PvP guild and farm AP. Being VR14 simply lets you be more effective, it does not affect your AP gains at all.

We're all entitled to our own opinions, yes your opinion is valid. Though your example is completely wrong. You can think it is pay to win all you want, but until you come up with an actual example of something that a player would gain out of it to give an advantage over other players, you're dismissive in this conversation.

Why is it wrong? I already provided an example: I save 50 hours of leveling for a trivial crown store cost, and can then go play on a level-capped character to earn anything I want with at a far more effective rate thanks to the increased power, plus 50 extra hours saved to do so in! The fix for a recently-changed and not as fun EXP system isn't to beg to pay cash to bypass it. The fix is to ask for the devs to revise it to be fun again.

P3ZZL3

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

The fix for a recently-changed and not as fun EXP system isn't to beg to pay cash to bypass it. The fix is to ask for the devs to revise it to be fun again.

I would agree. But from my limited experiences, quick fixes are the trend from ZoS to fix things. They are never going to do a complete overhaul on the system, re-write the story line or add to it significantly in a short period of time. Especially if their focus over the next 1-3 mths will be on console. Just reading all the threads about the changes or bugs that need to be addressed yet are avoided time and time again.

Hell, look at the 2.0.10 patch. That's not exactly a 2 week patch taking things seriously. It's a "sticky tape" fix whilst they continue to get out the Console version.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the XP Potions. The only downside is that the limited grind spots that are half decent for grinding will be absolutely flooded

Johngo0036

I am currently leveling a Magicka NB(V4), Templar(V1), DK(lvl35)

On my Templar and NB i do Bruma and Cheydinhal quests every day,
I earn close to 200k Exp on each daily.

sadownik

Johngo0036 wrote: »

I am currently leveling a Magicka NB(V4), Templar(V1), DK(lvl35)

On my Templar and NB i do Bruma and Cheydinhal quests every day,
I earn close to 200k Exp on each daily.

So?

Septimus_Magna

sadownik wrote: »

Johngo0036 wrote: »

I am currently leveling a Magicka NB(V4), Templar(V1), DK(lvl35)

On my Templar and NB i do Bruma and Cheydinhal quests every day,
I earn close to 200k Exp on each daily.

So?

So that would be: 14m XP total / 200k XP per day = 70 days worth of questing, probably less if you also do the main quests from Cadwell's Silver and Gold because those give a lot of XP and dont take long to complete.

I really dont get why everyone wants to be instant VR14 when once they reach VR1?
Only to complain that the game has no end game progression and not enough content, please make up your mind.

If you want you can level from VR1 to VR14 within a week if you start grinding 14 boring hours a day.

P3ZZL3

It's interesting reading everyones views on the reasons why they do or do not feel people should want to get to v14.

There are various reasons why some do, some don't. It's all subjective to the player.

That being said, to grind as quick as possible to v14 and then complain there's nothing else, doesn't make sense to me either but some do I guess *shrugs*

It's mainly the sets and your capability going into the Undaunted Vet pledges and the Trails. You chances of completing, doing well, etc is increased a decent level by the time you get to v14

sadownik

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

It's interesting reading everyones views on the reasons why they do or do not feel people should want to get to v14.

There are various reasons why some do, some don't. It's all subjective to the player.

That being said, to grind as quick as possible to v14 and then complain there's nothing else, doesn't make sense to me either but some do I guess *shrugs*

It's mainly the sets and your capability going into the Undaunted Vet pledges and the Trails. You chances of completing, doing well, etc is increased a decent level by the time you get to v14

For me PvE content could be non existant - i had more than enough of boring repetitive quests getting to vr 6 on my main and to vr 2 and lvl 38 on 2 other chars. PvP is the only element of the game that has some fun for me. And to fully ejoy it i need a vr 14 with decent (not best) gear.

BloodWolfe

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Paying to skip 40-50 hours of leveling that you can then turn around and have fun PVP'ing with for alliance points to buy or sell great items with? Yeah, that's "Pay to win", though some might argue it's "pay to progress" or "pay to skip".

That is NOT Pay 2 Win! At most it would be borderline questionable but to buy a VR14 who has no special gear, only the base skill and attribute points is NOT P2W! They would still need to do main quests for the additional skill points, would have to PvP (anyone can from level 10 I think it is can join PvP) to gain AP so this is NOT P2W! P2W is purchasing something that cannot be earned in-game other than paying for it that will give you an advantage. This simply does not give any advantage over other players so it's not P2W by definition.

This isn't an advantage, it's a time-saver/convenience thing. I don't agree with it if they ever sold vr14's on the crown shop but it's not P2W, borderline questionable at most. If they ever did this I hope it would at least have a stipulation that you must already have 1 vr14 character so that you have already played through the story/grind, all crafting will be at lvl 1, only the base skill and attribute points that you would earn each time you level and all skills at level 1.

wilsonirayb16_ESO

wayfarerb14_ESO wrote: »

OR! You can ignore grinding and enjoy the ride. You don't have to be vr14 to participate in PvP. My sorc hasn't even finished the 4th questing zone, and she's already vr2. All I do with her is PvP, with the occasional cyrodiil daily quest cycle for cp. If I didn't have several other toons (two of which are vr14), she would probably be a higher vr rank by now. There are lots of ways to play this game. If you like grinding, then go for it. If you like questing, go for it. I like to PvP, so that's how I level my toons.

The point is, you don't have to be vr14 to PvP.

Problem is you can't enjoy the ride. The ride consists of :

• Silly shared dungeons that are never populated with mobs.
• Easy content and an extremely fast levelling /experience gain.
• Zones that are top heavy with inane quests that serve more as a chore than something entertaining.

And why the talk of alt characters? ;shudder;

Isn't the whole purpose of the Veteran system to give you a lore specific 'justification' to be able to go to other alliance areas and do it again? If not, then why bother with it - they could have just increased the level cap.

newtinmpls

My question is what are all the people who are "grinding" actually grinding to?

It the process isn't fun, what makes anyone think that it's magically going to be different once you hit some arbitrary level/rank?

leeux

For me, it's the exactly opposite... now that I have a fully leveled VR14 (with most skills with both morphs already maxed) and almost all quests in-game completed (except most of Craggy, ofc...) I find that I don't know what to do with her...

I mean, since most things you'd want to do with a VR14 requires grouping and coordination, and other players... and teamspeak, and... and... etc. you get the point...

I normally don't have the time for that, so she stays parked during the weekdays waiting for some guild event on weekends

So, I tend to concentrate in leveling up my older alts and my newer baby alts, since that's a more mindless activity that you can dedicate alone and when short on time.

Bottom line, I (completely subjective opinion here...) find that the game became less enjoyable after reaching that "golden" line of VR14... YMMV, of course

PBpsy

newtinmpls wrote: »

My question is what are all the people who are "grinding" actually grinding to?

It the process isn't fun, what makes anyone think that it's magically going to be different once you hit some arbitrary level/rank?

We know that it is fun or we try to find out if it fun.
-End game group content and PVP can be fun in the rare ocasion when they are fun.
-Doing the main quest and CG and CS for the 5th time is not fun.
-Trying a trial or dungeon with my VR14 DK after just doing it with my VR 14 NB or healing or tanking a V14 dungeon after DPSing is fun and adds a lot of replayability to the very thin end game content.
-DPSing that dungeon for the 100th time on my main is not as fun as it used to be.
-Leveling My V10 temp so I can maybe start healing trials and DSA because I think it will be fun is not very fun it is a freaking chore.
-We want relatively fast leveling because we want to experiment with new stuff in somewaht limited content.The current system does not encourage that even a litle bit.The amount of time between me geting the crazy idea that I want to try to see how I would do in this content with a sorc or even crazier stam sorc and the amount of time it would take for me to do it is to great. Also the road would definitely not be fun since I done it 4 fraking times already and ESO is as much of a linear non branching,no deicision no repercusions crpg as you can get.Absolutely no decision matter.I decide to save the freaking super necro WMD for the DC . Does it ever freaking mater? NO.Never.... If you done it once you done it enough.

-This may be just me though. I played a lot of Diablo and Diablo like games in which I deleted or permakilled more max level character then I can count.The fact that one could start over and try something new without much loss was want kept them alive even with the minute amounts of content they had.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Deleted. Wrong thread. Sowwy.

Johngo0036

Leveling is what you make it,

Yes if you keep telling yourself its a PLOD it will be a plod,
Approach it positively and try different things,

Each class has a different play style, so just enjoy it,

I have leveled a load of chars and i still enjoy it.

I also go to Cyrodiil as soon as I can and quest there,
it makes it more enjoyable for me.

leshpar

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

Johngo0036 wrote: »

I am currently leveling a Magicka NB(V4), Templar(V1), DK(lvl35)

On my Templar and NB i do Bruma and Cheydinhal quests every day,
I earn close to 200k Exp on each daily.

So?

So that would be: 14m XP total / 200k XP per day = 70 days worth of questing, probably less if you also do the main quests from Cadwell's Silver and Gold because those give a lot of XP and dont take long to complete.

I really dont get why everyone wants to be instant VR14 when once they reach VR1?
Only to complain that the game has no end game progression and not enough content, please make up your mind.

If you want you can level from VR1 to VR14 within a week if you start grinding 14 boring hours a day.

it would be 13 million xp. 14-1= 13 you don't start at VR0.

Septimus_Magna

leshpar wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

Johngo0036 wrote: »

I am currently leveling a Magicka NB(V4), Templar(V1), DK(lvl35)

On my Templar and NB i do Bruma and Cheydinhal quests every day,
I earn close to 200k Exp on each daily.

So?

So that would be: 14m XP total / 200k XP per day = 70 days worth of questing, probably less if you also do the main quests from Cadwell's Silver and Gold because those give a lot of XP and dont take long to complete.

I really dont get why everyone wants to be instant VR14 when once they reach VR1?
Only to complain that the game has no end game progression and not enough content, please make up your mind.

If you want you can level from VR1 to VR14 within a week if you start grinding 14 boring hours a day.

it would be 13 million xp. 14-1= 13 you don't start at VR0.

I used 14m XP because thats what the OP was talking about.

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

What could ZOS implement to assist people who want a new v14 to play with but just cant stomach going through the 14 million point grind?

Animal_Mother

newtinmpls wrote: »

My question is what are all the people who are "grinding" actually grinding to?

It the process isn't fun, what makes anyone think that it's magically going to be different once you hit some arbitrary level/rank?

Grind for CP; it's the new end game.

I really don't care if someone wishes to purchase a V14 character boost. They'll have no CPs, no Alliance rank, no costumes, a horse worthy of glue and lack gear. So long as there are no boosts for these deficiencies, I'll be cool with insta-V14s.

Hell, the reason to grind an alt to v14 is to increase your CP count for your main - 13m XP is what 130 CP? To make your main better at PVP or running trials.

PBpsy

Animal_Mother wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

My question is what are all the people who are "grinding" actually grinding to?

It the process isn't fun, what makes anyone think that it's magically going to be different once you hit some arbitrary level/rank?

Grind for CP; it's the new end game.

I really don't care if someone wishes to purchase a V14 character boost. They'll have no CPs, no Alliance rank, no costumes, a horse worthy of glue and lack gear. So long as there are no boosts for these deficiencies, I'll be cool with insta-V14s.

Hell, the reason to grind an alt to v14 is to increase your CP count for your main - 13m XP is what 130 CP? To make your main better at PVP or running trials.

No. 13 mil XP will net you 33CP unless you really do it all when enlightened for a period of 130 days. If you really want CP it's much better to just grind it with your main.