What is the new "sustain" NB PvP build?

Nihili

In 1.5 I would have said the sustain PvP build for the NB class was the magicka S&B Resto staff build that anyone can see Sypher using in his youtube videos. Unfortunately I got so used to that build, I'm not sure what I should be moving on to (it seemed to have been nerved somehow). Apparently Magicka NBs have moved on to a destro/resto build... Anyone know the load-out of skills that would have to be used? I'm really struggling in PvP and any "wins" I get is legit thanks to zerging or pure skill/luck, never thanks to my build.

Xeniph

Sypher has a few video's of him using the build.

Destro bar

Destructive reach

Crushing shock

Cripple ( I think it would work with either morph)

Concealed weapon --- Interchangeable based on playstyle.

Dark cloak

Resto bar

Healing Ward

Harness magicka

Shadow image

The remaining skill slots can be filled to suit your playstyle/situation.


This is an over simplification of what I have seen him use. I believe his build video's should be coming out sometime soon, so keep an eye out for those on hit Youtube channel.

***** In no way am I responsible for this builds development or creation. I am just passing on my ovservations from watching his channels. All Credit goes to @Sypher and anyone else he may have collaborated with, none of which include me.

kokoandshinb14a_ESO

As much as I respect sypher, I personally hate the wizard type staff builds.

I for one do not want to play a staff wielding magic user, whether it be a nb, dk, temp, or sorc.

Xeniph

I'm partial to melee type specs myself. With that said, unless you run in groups or have self heals, melee can be frustrating as all get out.

Stamina users will likely gain AP quite slowly if they choose to play without vigor, as rally just doesn't cut it.

For the solo type small scale players, a magicka spec, be it melee or staff, will gain AP quicker. Or so it's looking like.
Still many things to test and builds to be theory crafted.

TheBucket

Xeniph wrote: »

I'm partial to melee type specs myself. With that said, unless you run in groups or have self heals, melee can be frustrating as all get out.

Stamina users will likely gain AP quite slowly if they choose to play without vigor, as rally just doesn't cut it.

For the solo type small scale players, a magicka spec, be it melee or staff, will gain AP quicker. Or so it's looking like.
Still many things to test and builds to be theory crafted.

Rally cuts it pretty well with a stamina build. Blood Craze mixed in..

Soulac

Nihili wrote: »

In 1.5 I would have said the sustain PvP build for the NB class was the magicka S&B Resto staff build that anyone can see Sypher using in his youtube videos. Unfortunately I got so used to that build, I'm not sure what I should be moving on to (it seemed to have been nerved somehow). Apparently Magicka NBs have moved on to a destro/resto build... Anyone know the load-out of skills that would have to be used? I'm really struggling in PvP and any "wins" I get is legit thanks to zerging or pure skill/luck, never thanks to my build.

You could try to find your very own playstyle and get some ideas by asking another people.
Both, magicka and stamina are very good now but in my opinion Destro range is just too boring compared to melee fights.
If I wanted to run crushing shock I wouldn't have made a NB..

I suggest you to test 2handed Stamina (not with uppercut) or siphoning NB, both doing well.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

I used to run Bow and 1h/shield (with 5 medium and 2 heavy armor: 5pc Hundings, 3pc dreugh king, 2pc shadow walker, 2pc night's silence), but since 1.6 have switched to 2h and resto staff. 2h has Ambush, Impale, Wrecking Blow, Mass Hysteria, and Rally, with either Flawless Dawnbreaker or Soul Harvest ults. Resto bar has long-duration (de)buffs, shields, and heals depending on the situation (e.g. Mirage, Reaper's Mark, Dark Cloak, Shades, Mutagen, Healing Ward, Bone Shield, Harness Magicka, etc) with Soul Tether ult. I can't decide if I like Siphoning Strikes on my bars or not. This setup seems to work well in big fights as I can get in, do damage and have the ability to tank some or get out of trouble and not die. Haven't been able to gank much, but 1v1 fights seem pretty even, but still can't manage the sustain against builds that force lots of CC breaks. I did manage to win a few 1v2 fights, or kill 2 out of 3 enemies in some situations.

kokoandshinb14a_ESO

Soulac wrote: »

Nihili wrote: »

In 1.5 I would have said the sustain PvP build for the NB class was the magicka S&B Resto staff build that anyone can see Sypher using in his youtube videos. Unfortunately I got so used to that build, I'm not sure what I should be moving on to (it seemed to have been nerved somehow). Apparently Magicka NBs have moved on to a destro/resto build... Anyone know the load-out of skills that would have to be used? I'm really struggling in PvP and any "wins" I get is legit thanks to zerging or pure skill/luck, never thanks to my build.

You could try to find your very own playstyle and get some ideas by asking another people.
Both, magicka and stamina are very good now but in my opinion Destro range is just too boring compared to melee fights.
If I wanted to run crushing shock I wouldn't have made a NB..

I suggest you to test 2handed Stamina (not with uppercut) or siphoning NB, both doing well.

so is the siphoning spec you mention the tank sap essence build?

if so does it overcome the absorption shields that players throw up? fear?

thanks

Soulac

No, I mean swallow soul, but Shield spam is a huge problem for this kind of build.
I'd suggest something in direction of Araxleons build (melee Magicka) or a Stamina one.

You could try a dot-syphoning build with Valkyn, but it relays too much on luck and shields doesn't give a damn against dots.

Anyway Sap tank is quit effective, but not in 1v1 in my opinion.

tinythinker

This looks interesting, anyone have links to video or more detailed descriptions of the magicka/sustain NB builds alluded to here? I have a VR1 NB that I skipped really developing during 1-50, but in the coming weeks I'd like to take it out of storage and see what it can do in the post 1.6/2.0 version of the game.

Tankqull

kokoandshinb14a_ESO wrote: »

As much as I respect sypher, I personally hate the wizard type staff builds.

I for one do not want to play a staff wielding magic user, whether it be a nb, dk, temp, or sorc.

well astheir is no option for stamina sustain (wich would be totally over the top with the burst stam skills provide) you are forced to use magica for the option to shield yourself for the sustain part and to deliver any meaningfull dmg you are forced to use a destro staff as the left magica NB skills are horrible dmg options beside strife and cripple.

kokoandshinb14a_ESO wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Nihili wrote: »

In 1.5 I would have said the sustain PvP build for the NB class was the magicka S&B Resto staff build that anyone can see Sypher using in his youtube videos. Unfortunately I got so used to that build, I'm not sure what I should be moving on to (it seemed to have been nerved somehow). Apparently Magicka NBs have moved on to a destro/resto build... Anyone know the load-out of skills that would have to be used? I'm really struggling in PvP and any "wins" I get is legit thanks to zerging or pure skill/luck, never thanks to my build.

You could try to find your very own playstyle and get some ideas by asking another people.
Both, magicka and stamina are very good now but in my opinion Destro range is just too boring compared to melee fights.
If I wanted to run crushing shock I wouldn't have made a NB..

I suggest you to test 2handed Stamina (not with uppercut) or siphoning NB, both doing well.

so is the siphoning spec you mention the tank sap essence build?

if so does it overcome the absorption shields that players throw up? fear?

thanks

nope but fear is really nice though^^

AllPlayAndNoWork

I use Swallow Soul in PvP as my main weapon with Piercing Mark....... I have never run out of magicka and I have gone toe to toe with every other class and done very well against all of them. Main bar is sword and board 1) Swallow soul 2) Piercing Mark 3) Mass Hysteria 4) Sap Essence 5) Inner Light : Veil of Blades or Soul Tether as Ulti. Restro bar backup. 1840 spell power 1008, magicka recovery. 5 light 1 medium 1 heavy with the undaunted 6% passive.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

AllPlayAndNoWork wrote: »

I use Swallow Soul in PvP as my main weapon with Piercing Mark....... I have never run out of magicka and I have gone toe to toe with every other class and done very well against all of them. Main bar is sword and board 1) Swallow soul 2) Piercing Mark 3) Mass Hysteria 4) Sap Essence 5) Inner Light : Veil of Blades or Soul Tether as Ulti. Restro bar backup. 1840 spell power 1008, magicka recovery. 5 light 1 medium 1 heavy with the undaunted 6% passive.

I'd love to get some advice from you on gearing and Champion Points, if you don't mind.

The closest thing I could get to an unarmed monk build is the nifty "psi-blade" animations of Teleport Strike, Veiled Strike, and Assassin's Blade. I went with a Magicka build because the light armor seemed more monk-like. I went with an Altmer for the obvious Magicka boost. I'm doing the 5/1/1 for the Undaunted bonus.

I'm only level 17 (grinding skyshards in Cyrodiil at the moment) but my main bar is Impale, Dark Cloak, Teleport Strike (I haven't morphed it yet), Concealed Weapon, and Swallow Soul. I'm using twin daggers because everything else gets in the way of my animations, and that just grinds my gears. I know it's going to be suboptimal, but I'm hoping to make up for it with set bonuses, since I have one in each hand.

My second bar will be Resto staff for the shielding, escapes, and heals, but I haven't started building it yet.

Am I gimping myself too much using Dual Wield? And in PvP, which should I be gearing for damage-wise: high crit and crit damage, or ignoring spell resistance?

And is there a way to offset my lack of stealth in a Magicka build, or should I be spamming the hell out of Dark Cloak when trying to close?

Final question: I haven't morphed Teleport Strike yet. Should I leave it alone for the damage, or is the snare from Lotus Fan more useful since I'll be using Concealed Weapon, Swallow Soul, and Impale to burst with?

Thanks in advance!

Fatalyis

If you're going Magicka, do NOT morph Teleport Strike! Lotus Fan isn't worth it. As for using daggers, go for it. Using two Sharpened daggers will up your damage (or precise for your crit chance) and it adds one more item for set bonuses.

As for PvP, you can focus on crit damage if you want, but it seems the meta right now (for Magicka builds) is focusing on spell power. I know for me on my Magicka NB, I found it tough to choose between using food vs. drink (stat increase vs. regen). Higher Magicka equals more damage, but higher regen equals greater sustainability. If you're going for burst, then I'd aim for food buff and more magicka.

As far as Dark Cloak is concerned, you'll be using it quite often. Coupled with the speed boost from Concealed Weapon (and Cripple if you aim for using that) you'll be zooming around Cyrodiil. The other three classes were given damage shields....but NBs were given Cloak....so use it and use it well!

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Fatalyis wrote: »

If you're going Magicka, do NOT morph Teleport Strike! Lotus Fan isn't worth it. As for using daggers, go for it. Using two Sharpened daggers will up your damage (or precise for your crit chance) and it adds one more item for set bonuses.

As for PvP, you can focus on crit damage if you want, but it seems the meta right now (for Magicka builds) is focusing on spell power. I know for me on my Magicka NB, I found it tough to choose between using food vs. drink (stat increase vs. regen). Higher Magicka equals more damage, but higher regen equals greater sustainability. If you're going for burst, then I'd aim for food buff and more magicka.

As far as Dark Cloak is concerned, you'll be using it quite often. Coupled with the speed boost from Concealed Weapon (and Cripple if you aim for using that) you'll be zooming around Cyrodiil. The other three classes were given damage shields....but NBs were given Cloak....so use it and use it well!

Fatalyis, thank you SO much for this excellent break-down. It is the EXACT sort of breakdown I was looking for.

And knowing that Spell Damage is the current meta gives me the direction I need to go in.

Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU!

Cody

nowadays, if you dont have any damage shields and self heals, you cannot play PvP. It sucks:(

magicka NB has to be destro/resto. melee magicka NBs don't do so well anymore due to the changes to the NB skills.

Lava_Croft

Nightblades in full Light Armor are my favorites. They melt like ice cream on a hot summer day.

olsborg

I fought a nb today, he was using 5 heavy and 2 light, not sure on what sets. But he said he maxed his spelldmg as much as possible, 25k magicka and using siphoning attacks. He was spamming funnel health while blocking then when his targets was low used soul harvest and something else to finish off.

Now this build worked well on average - bad players, but he was pretty harmless to me. I couldnt kill him tho, not even close, his permblocking while spamming funnel to procc siph attacks was just stupidly defencive.

Fatalyis

olsborg wrote: »

I fought a nb today, he was using 5 heavy and 2 light, not sure on what sets. But he said he maxed his spelldmg as much as possible, 25k magicka and using siphoning attacks. He was spamming funnel health while blocking then when his targets was low used soul harvest and something else to finish off.

Now this build worked well on average - bad players, but he was pretty harmless to me. I couldnt kill him tho, not even close, his permblocking while spamming funnel to procc siph attacks was just stupidly defencive.

Defensive, sure, but utter trash for offense. Seems like a nice sustain build, if his regen was good, because Funnel doesn't cost anything (500 magicka on my toon). Without the 7 light, he lost a lot of his spell penetration. I tried the 5h/2l setup with as much spell damage as I could muster from heavy set bonuses from Storm Knight/Lords etc and it was garbage.

With a 7 Light set up, Magicka NB can be really effective, but you've got to be smart about it and use cloak + healing ward a LOT. My biggest frustration was popping Healing Ward, only to realize that some random had joined the fight and he got the ward instead.

Cthalion

Cody wrote: »

nowadays, if you dont have any damage shields and self heals, you cannot play PvP. It sucks:(

magicka NB has to be destro/resto. melee magicka NBs don't do so well anymore due to the changes to the NB skills.

I don't have damage shields or self heals, and I get by. I ran into you on my NB, so there's your demonstration=p

kaithuzar

7 light isn't needed, 5 light is all it takes, but if you're worried about spell pen, just use reapers mark, if you want more use sharpened or nirnhoned, or even the mundus stone that give spell pen.

I actually think heavy armor is OP, right now I'm rocking storm knight & the lord w/2 torugs pact, it's decent, with sp dmg+ magic recovery
Staying alive is #1, dmg is #2

Draehl

olsborg wrote: »

I fought a nb today, he was using 5 heavy and 2 light, not sure on what sets. But he said he maxed his spelldmg as much as possible, 25k magicka and using siphoning attacks. He was spamming funnel health while blocking then when his targets was low used soul harvest and something else to finish off.

Now this build worked well on average - bad players, but he was pretty harmless to me. I couldnt kill him tho, not even close, his permblocking while spamming funnel to procc siph attacks was just stupidly defencive.

That felt exactly like I did back when I ran the 5h/2l - It's amazing against really bad players- you can tank it out against 2-3 of them, but the MOMENT you run into a player with some decent burst and/or coordination your lack of passive regen makes you fall flat on your face due to the inability to sustain self heals/shadow cloak. Simply, a lot of the current burst damage is so high even heavy armor won't save you. Shadow Cloak/Healing Ward spam to outright avoid taking damage is the name of the game until a handful of the burst combos get looked at.

I've switched to 5l/2h and completely dropped Siphoning Attacks- pumped health higher at the expense of magicka- which unlocks 2 extra skills that you can use for more defense/utility (I opted for Mirage + Structured Entropy)

-5pc Seducer/2pc Potenates (on bar1)/2 Lights of Cyrodiil/2 Death's Wind (just to round the build out with a little more armor/max hp)
-Sword & Board (Main bar- Damage/Absorb Magic/Fear)
-Resto Staff (Heals/Shadow Cloak/utility bar- varies but *** like mirage/piercing mark/dark shades/etc.)

I hate to say it, but this is far more survivable than the 5heavy build can ever hope to be in PvP. I still like 5heavy/2l with Siphoning Attacks better in PvE, but until heavy armor get buffed/PvP burst gets reduced I think we'll all start reverting back to light.

AllPlayAndNoWork

olsborg wrote: »

I fought a nb today, he was using 5 heavy and 2 light, not sure on what sets. But he said he maxed his spelldmg as much as possible, 25k magicka and using siphoning attacks. He was spamming funnel health while blocking then when his targets was low used soul harvest and something else to finish off.

Now this build worked well on average - bad players, but he was pretty harmless to me. I couldnt kill him tho, not even close, his permblocking while spamming funnel to procc siph attacks was just stupidly defencive.

Just like a DK spamming green dragon blood and trying to root someone....... Horses for courses.