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VOTE - What is the MAIN thing the champion system reinforces and gives to players.
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Costismaros✭✭✭This damn balance.
Guys really u muCostismaros wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
Fine by me. If MMORPGs are only available to those who can play 10hrs a day now I'm ok with that, I'll find something else to do. Considering most of the community in this game is 18+ however I can't imagine they get to keep very many plaers that way tho.
This is how it goes on mmorpg. There are really hardcore games that greeding going up for more than 2 years just to catch up the lvl. And then you need more than 2 years to catch up on gear. There are 3 speeds on exp gain. You will see at all mmorpg sites thats ESO has really hight speed on exp gain. They cannot do it easier because then people will loose the interest of the game. Like i said there are 3 speeds on exp gain. Hight = fast exp, medium = normal exp gain and low = low exp gain.
To be honest in eso we have alot new mmorpg players who complain about everythink because the came from single player rpg games.
Because MOBAs have deep gameplay and provide interest for months and years.Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
ESO post-50 is becoming the kind of game where the unemployed and students get an advantage denied to those with jobs or real-lives and any sort.
Because MOBAS you start every game at same time with others and the game holds 45 min.
Well, I'll be interested to see how well a game can sustain itself through income only from students and the unemployed. But you enjoy your 2 years of grinding and 2 years of acquiring gear, I will not be here because I need to pay my bills and ESO doesn't do that.
I dont understand your point ? I never mentioned students and unemployed.
You have got it wrong.
The progression and greeding is part of the game. There is no need to rush it. You are playing and progressioning by playing.
They way you are talking about it is like that u have to reach top lvl and top items for start playing.
It is not like this. Not at mmorpg games at least.0 -
Costismaros✭✭✭
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.0 -
RoamingRiverElk✭✭✭✭✭Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.Edited by RoamingRiverElk on 3 March 2015 12:13Dalris Aalr - Magicka (Stamina) DK | Dalfish - Magicka Sorc | Dal Aalr - Magicka Warden | Dalrish - Mag/Stam NB | Irana Aalr - PvE Templar2 -
Birdovic✭✭✭✭✭Ofc you still can play with others who didnt Start 1.6 with vr14.
But you forget there are people who want to play competitive and be successful On trials leaderboards etc.
Thats where the new people wont have a Chance.Attempt and Thoughts to Overhaul Scaling, Attribute System and Enchantments
Improving the Sorcerer class: Ideas
"We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of Combat to feel awesome"1 -
byrom101b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭1, 4 & 6.
It should instead be linked to the following;
1% of Acheivement APs (past and present)
First of the week Trial, & Veteran Dungeon completions
Trial Leaderboards (once per character)
General Questing (with decent XP for Dailies)
Crafting Writs
Undaunted Pledge completions
The only mob kills that should add anything are world bosses of appropriate level and then only 1/day.
But no - we have the lowest common denominator system which will encourage all the most boring play and hate between groups farming the same hotspots.
Moreover, and the worst element of this by far is that 24/7 players will race ahead of everyone else to an extreme degree, disincentivising the majority of players and ironically hitting the financial model of the game unless they introduce sizeable AP gain potions or something like that which will blacken their names forever.
The temporary increased CP XP gain for being offline isn't going to make a significant dent in this disparity, the maths doesn't stack up.
The whole thing seems to have been planned on the bag of a *** packet...
Very dissapointing...Edited by byrom101b16_ESO on 3 March 2015 12:331 -
Costismaros✭✭✭RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).0 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Costismaros wrote: »RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
Wtf are you on about? Racist behaviour?
Yes, there is a very clear difference between skilled and not skilled players.. experience has NOTHING to do with it. There are plenty of people who have played this game since launch and still suck at it (people who spam lethal arrow at scales comes to mind). The only difference now is that those players actually don't have to develop at all, they just have to have more CP. In 12 months time, people who can't do anything right will still get more DPS than me as long as they can stand in one spot and just press one key repeatedly with their 2000 CP from playing 24/7. And I can develop however sophisticated builds I want but because I have a job that takes up the majority of my time, I will be less useful in raids than a complete moron with too much time on their hands.
Time does not in any way equate to skill. Never. But it sounds like you will probably think you are skilled when you're killing VR1s with 2CP whilst you have your 2000CP. Let me tell you in advance: you aren't.
Without massive changes to the CS, this game will most definitely die and that is really sad. Whoever thought that people will put up with a mandatory 2-year grind to catch up.. like what the ***. People complained that VR grinding was too slow, not that we wanted to do it 500 times over.. Honestly, are you completely out of your minds?3 -
RoamingRiverElk✭✭✭✭✭Costismaros wrote: »RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
..."racist" behaviour... -.-
However, clarification is probably in order: my comment applies to those groups that are formed with the intent to do the very best in trials or pvp. Naturally this game is a big community and not all gameplay is about optimization. A lot of it is about doing things together and having fun with not particularly ambitious goals. But are you saying that Trials leaderboards, for instance, should not be more about skill than about passives?
My comment was in reply to the question "Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you?", I hope you can now see the comment in its context.
And... I said nothing about smartness... I said, skilled and willingness to learn.Dalris Aalr - Magicka (Stamina) DK | Dalfish - Magicka Sorc | Dal Aalr - Magicka Warden | Dalrish - Mag/Stam NB | Irana Aalr - PvE Templar0 -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭Costismaros wrote: »This damn balance.
Guys really u muCostismaros wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
Fine by me. If MMORPGs are only available to those who can play 10hrs a day now I'm ok with that, I'll find something else to do. Considering most of the community in this game is 18+ however I can't imagine they get to keep very many plaers that way tho.
This is how it goes on mmorpg. There are really hardcore games that greeding going up for more than 2 years just to catch up the lvl. And then you need more than 2 years to catch up on gear. There are 3 speeds on exp gain. You will see at all mmorpg sites thats ESO has really hight speed on exp gain. They cannot do it easier because then people will loose the interest of the game. Like i said there are 3 speeds on exp gain. Hight = fast exp, medium = normal exp gain and low = low exp gain.
To be honest in eso we have alot new mmorpg players who complain about everythink because the came from single player rpg games.
Because MOBAs have deep gameplay and provide interest for months and years.Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
ESO post-50 is becoming the kind of game where the unemployed and students get an advantage denied to those with jobs or real-lives and any sort.
Because MOBAS you start every game at same time with others and the game holds 45 min.
Well, I'll be interested to see how well a game can sustain itself through income only from students and the unemployed. But you enjoy your 2 years of grinding and 2 years of acquiring gear, I will not be here because I need to pay my bills and ESO doesn't do that.
I dont understand your point ? I never mentioned students and unemployed.
You have got it wrong.
The progression and greeding is part of the game. There is no need to rush it. You are playing and progressioning by playing.
They way you are talking about it is like that u have to reach top lvl and top items for start playing.
It is not like this. Not at mmorpg games at least.
You heard of PVP right ?
Bad enough I get owned V1 against V14 as it is...now I have to suffer those with 1000 more CP than me too ?
There is a good reason battle levelling was applied level 1-50.
What exactly is battle levelling there for ?
@ OP....
#6. Veteran runaway will simply turn off new players.Edited by Rune_Relic on 3 March 2015 13:44Anything that can be exploited will be exploited0 -
Exstazik✭✭✭✭well nothing from this.
my 2 cents....a lot of players can receive more CP for the post v14 exp.....ZOS didn't this to compare new and old players.
I think ~5-6 month later ZOS will introduce Champion_PAck.What it means:ZOS count avr CP on each account(let's take 1000 as example) after take 30% from this number(700 CP).And put CHampion_pack which will granted you let's say 50 CP for 20$,but you will not up CP constantly, the restriction will 700 CP.Why i think so?Well it will be done to compare new and old players.It will not break any rules because ZOS said that "all what can reduce gametime can be in Crown Store".So players will choose pay(to reduce time to get CP) or grind.
So total why it will works.
Old players (especially "funs") will play the game because they don't want to loose progression
New ones will be glad to pay to reduce gap beetween "top" players.
*this is just one stroke of marketingEdited by Exstazik on 3 March 2015 14:120 -
TheLaw✭✭✭✭#6, there needs to be restrictions put on the champion system. 3600 points is nice, but will ruin the game.-= Shahrzad the Great |Sorc| =-0 -
TheBull✭✭✭✭✭
✭What about player customization?Killed by Sunshine 1vX How I see it.
Killed by Early Bright - Blood Flow - Magicka NB Build
Twitch - SunshineNB
Youtube - The Redguard0 -
Yolokin_Swagonborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭6. Get ready for this.
Wrecking blow everywhere. For half your heath or more. Biggest WBs will come from DKs using physical crit stack or armor debuffs - all new class abilities. DKs powerful in PvP? Didn't see that coming.
Also full plate regen stacking will be fun to deal with.Edited by Yolokin_Swagonborn on 3 March 2015 21:090 -
Costismaros✭✭✭Costismaros wrote: »RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
Wtf are you on about? Racist behaviour?
Yes, there is a very clear difference between skilled and not skilled players.. experience has NOTHING to do with it. There are plenty of people who have played this game since launch and still suck at it (people who spam lethal arrow at scales comes to mind). The only difference now is that those players actually don't have to develop at all, they just have to have more CP. In 12 months time, people who can't do anything right will still get more DPS than me as long as they can stand in one spot and just press one key repeatedly with their 2000 CP from playing 24/7. And I can develop however sophisticated builds I want but because I have a job that takes up the majority of my time, I will be less useful in raids than a complete moron with too much time on their hands.
Time does not in any way equate to skill. Never. But it sounds like you will probably think you are skilled when you're killing VR1s with 2CP whilst you have your 2000CP. Let me tell you in advance: you aren't.
Without massive changes to the CS, this game will most definitely die and that is really sad. Whoever thought that people will put up with a mandatory 2-year grind to catch up.. like what the ***. People complained that VR grinding was too slow, not that we wanted to do it 500 times over.. Honestly, are you completely out of your minds?
You still presist on rachist behavour.
I still believe that for gain skill u need game expirience. Your first try on trials was the same first try for the others.You cannot seperate skill and expirience. Your first visit at Pvp was same with the others.There are always exceptions for talented people.
Well the cp points and exp points comming as reward to those players who expirienced the game more than you.
Im really sure that the game that you are looking for is a moba game. Moba games can be transleted as low time period mmorpg games. You can get exp, stats, items, you can pve and pvp in short time of period and then you start again from begining.
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Costismaros✭✭✭Rune_Relic wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »This damn balance.
Guys really u muCostismaros wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
Fine by me. If MMORPGs are only available to those who can play 10hrs a day now I'm ok with that, I'll find something else to do. Considering most of the community in this game is 18+ however I can't imagine they get to keep very many plaers that way tho.
This is how it goes on mmorpg. There are really hardcore games that greeding going up for more than 2 years just to catch up the lvl. And then you need more than 2 years to catch up on gear. There are 3 speeds on exp gain. You will see at all mmorpg sites thats ESO has really hight speed on exp gain. They cannot do it easier because then people will loose the interest of the game. Like i said there are 3 speeds on exp gain. Hight = fast exp, medium = normal exp gain and low = low exp gain.
To be honest in eso we have alot new mmorpg players who complain about everythink because the came from single player rpg games.
Because MOBAs have deep gameplay and provide interest for months and years.Costismaros wrote: »2. progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
ESO post-50 is becoming the kind of game where the unemployed and students get an advantage denied to those with jobs or real-lives and any sort.
Because MOBAS you start every game at same time with others and the game holds 45 min.
Well, I'll be interested to see how well a game can sustain itself through income only from students and the unemployed. But you enjoy your 2 years of grinding and 2 years of acquiring gear, I will not be here because I need to pay my bills and ESO doesn't do that.
I dont understand your point ? I never mentioned students and unemployed.
You have got it wrong.
The progression and greeding is part of the game. There is no need to rush it. You are playing and progressioning by playing.
They way you are talking about it is like that u have to reach top lvl and top items for start playing.
It is not like this. Not at mmorpg games at least.
You heard of PVP right ?
Bad enough I get owned V1 against V14 as it is...now I have to suffer those with 1000 more CP than me too ?
There is a good reason battle levelling was applied level 1-50.
What exactly is battle levelling there for ?
@ OP....
#6. Veteran runaway will simply turn off new players.
You can still do pvp but it is normal that you cannot stand against a higter lvl player than you. Well if you are talented, you can always try and kill them. Shypher did that when he killed solo the emperor. It is normal that someone who played much longer than you to be able to kill you. This is how the MMORPG worked until now.
There are games that you can found these style. We called those MOBA.0 -
byrom101b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Costismaros wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
Wtf are you on about? Racist behaviour?
Yes, there is a very clear difference between skilled and not skilled players.. experience has NOTHING to do with it. There are plenty of people who have played this game since launch and still suck at it (people who spam lethal arrow at scales comes to mind). The only difference now is that those players actually don't have to develop at all, they just have to have more CP. In 12 months time, people who can't do anything right will still get more DPS than me as long as they can stand in one spot and just press one key repeatedly with their 2000 CP from playing 24/7. And I can develop however sophisticated builds I want but because I have a job that takes up the majority of my time, I will be less useful in raids than a complete moron with too much time on their hands.
Time does not in any way equate to skill. Never. But it sounds like you will probably think you are skilled when you're killing VR1s with 2CP whilst you have your 2000CP. Let me tell you in advance: you aren't.
Without massive changes to the CS, this game will most definitely die and that is really sad. Whoever thought that people will put up with a mandatory 2-year grind to catch up.. like what the ***. People complained that VR grinding was too slow, not that we wanted to do it 500 times over.. Honestly, are you completely out of your minds?
You still presist on rachist behavour.
I still believe that for gain skill u need game expirience. Your first try on trials was the same first try for the others.You cannot seperate skill and expirience. Your first visit at Pvp was same with the others.There are always exceptions for talented people.
Well the cp points and exp points comming as reward to those players who expirienced the game more than you.
Im really sure that the game that you are looking for is a moba game. Moba games can be transleted as low time period mmorpg games. You can get exp, stats, items, you can pve and pvp in short time of period and then you start again from begining.
To be entirely CLEAR.
Pppontus is NOT indulging in 'racist' bahaviour, and it is entirely innapropriate for you to say so. Were you to to do so publically he could probably sue you for defammatory remarks.
You need to stop.
You are confusing 'condescension' for 'racism'. They aren't the same thing.1 -
Like many have said. #6
However, a good strategy they might take to make players enjoy earning CP is to create DLCs where you can solo or group and explore the world doing quests or grinding if you wish, to gain XP that equates to a certain amount of CP. Then the highest level dungeons or Trials will require a certain level of Champion Rank to complete effectively. So the amount you have earned by exploring the new DLC area is enough to get you to the minimunm rank requirment for the Trial Dungeon for example. Perhaps players will be happy if there is content to actually engage in and be a proper champion rather than a bump and grind robot!
So in other words make a DLC that rewards enough XP through quests and or other means for players to earn enough CP which allows them to be able to tackle the most difficult content in that DLC.
Still allienates new players and opens the window for purchasing max level with some base Champion points for Crown coins. It is only a matter of time. Step by step they may end up following in the shadow of many MMOs.0 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Costismaros wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Costismaros wrote: »
I'm not sure the niche you play in is a good indicator of what MMOs are about either, considering the trivially small percentage of players in all MMOs that are the hardcore raiders in guilds like Hodor.Costismaros wrote: »2. Progression.
The rest are symptoms of progression.
If you dont like it. You should change of playing mmorpg for MOBA games.
#2! Thank you! Someone finally said it.
The whole point of creating new content for an MMO, is to keep the players interested and provide something to work towards. The system will not be perfect in the begining, but ZOS wants to keep people playing. If the system needs to be adjusted down the road, it will be. I think most people forget that an MMO is a living, breathing entity. ESO is just a toddler, learning how to walk for the first time.
Finally, a company has created a game for the "True MMO'er," (a.k.a. we throwbacks from the EQ era), and it's about time. Thank you, ZOS! Thank you for making a real MMO, not an FPS disguised as one.
You guys clearly know nothing about MMOs or progression.
Fact is, no MMO released this century could ever survive on the small number of players bleeding-edge raiding attracts, raiders seriously over-estimate their importance when it comes to long-term sustainability of a large-scale MMO.
#1: Just because I play Hardcore end game PVE, I don't consider it to be everything there is to be about MMOs nor that a "True MMO" is only about end game (nor did I even imply it, you got to that conclusion by yourself). If experience has taught me anything is that for games to be successful they need to be balanced and all populations usually need each other (Poor but usually true example: raiders get items for casuals, casuals make potions, crafts, food for raiders). You cant have a game only for hardcore raiders, look at Wildstar.
#2: If there is a "niche" that is actually going to be advantaged by the Champion system, it's the Hardcore community, those couple of hundred hardcore players that are still in the game and that by then end of one week of Champion system will have farmed ~ 50 CP (at least), after that, good luck for any casual (aka the people complaining about VR14) to catch up with us till the effects of CP diminishing returns begin to actually be felt, which is at about 1800 CP
When you see the first QQ posts: "I can't get in raid cuz I don't have 500 CP", or "We both are VR14 using same skills & abilities but this guy is hitting for 3x as much damage as I do": think fondly of me.
Ofcourse you will not able to raid with someone who played much more hours than you. But you can always raid with players who played the same amount hours with you. Why you should be able to do the same thinks with someone who have done much more playing than you? I think the game you are looking for is the game that im boring to play (see gw2) no progression at all. Sorry for mantioning another game on this forum but i believe it is the perfect example.
Because it would be nice if the deciding factor on whether you're invited to a group had more to do with your skill and willingness to learn than with how many hours you've put in over the past few months every day.
This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
Wtf are you on about? Racist behaviour?
Yes, there is a very clear difference between skilled and not skilled players.. experience has NOTHING to do with it. There are plenty of people who have played this game since launch and still suck at it (people who spam lethal arrow at scales comes to mind). The only difference now is that those players actually don't have to develop at all, they just have to have more CP. In 12 months time, people who can't do anything right will still get more DPS than me as long as they can stand in one spot and just press one key repeatedly with their 2000 CP from playing 24/7. And I can develop however sophisticated builds I want but because I have a job that takes up the majority of my time, I will be less useful in raids than a complete moron with too much time on their hands.
Time does not in any way equate to skill. Never. But it sounds like you will probably think you are skilled when you're killing VR1s with 2CP whilst you have your 2000CP. Let me tell you in advance: you aren't.
Without massive changes to the CS, this game will most definitely die and that is really sad. Whoever thought that people will put up with a mandatory 2-year grind to catch up.. like what the ***. People complained that VR grinding was too slow, not that we wanted to do it 500 times over.. Honestly, are you completely out of your minds?
You still presist on rachist behavour.
I still believe that for gain skill u need game expirience. Your first try on trials was the same first try for the others.You cannot seperate skill and expirience. Your first visit at Pvp was same with the others.There are always exceptions for talented people.
Well the cp points and exp points comming as reward to those players who expirienced the game more than you.
Im really sure that the game that you are looking for is a moba game. Moba games can be transleted as low time period mmorpg games. You can get exp, stats, items, you can pve and pvp in short time of period and then you start again from begining.
You can stop telling me what game I'm looking for, I don't give a *** about your opinion in regards to what games I play. Also no, telling you that time does not equal skill is not racist, no matter how much you want it to be.
Clearly you need a certain amount of experience to know what you are doing, but after that it's mostly down to skill (pre champion system) because you need to know when to dodge, block, how to manage your resources and what skills to use when etc. Now, as long as you have 12 hours per day to dedicate to gaming, you don't have to care about that stuff anymore. You can just block to get a 10K damage shield. Meanwhile for someone like me who doesn't play much but is smarter than you, we can't beat you because you have a 10K damage shield all the time while also having double the stats and other crap.
So in essence, this game is only about time played and no one who doesn't have 12 hours a day to play will like that. Unless they offer CP in the Crown Store in which case I can buy them all since I have a well-paid job that I dedicate my days to and then I can roflstomp you.. but neither of those options are really good are they?
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Liea✭✭Costismaros wrote: »This is racist behavior , you really believe that you are better than others or there are people smarter than others? There is no better than others, there is only expirienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).Costismaros wrote: »You still presist on rachist behavour.
I still believe that for gain skill u need game expirience. Your first try on trials was the same first try for the others.You cannot seperate skill and expirience. Your first visit at Pvp was same with the others.There are always exceptions for talented people.
Well the cp points and exp points comming as reward to those players who expirienced the game more than you.
Im really sure that the game that you are looking for is a moba game. Moba games can be transleted as low time period mmorpg games. You can get exp, stats, items, you can pve and pvp in short time of period and then you start again from begining.
I am turning your argument against you here:
/sarcasm on
This is racist behavior, do you really believe that you are more talented than others or that there are people more talented than others? There is no 'more talented' than others, there is only experienced players and we have currency for that (XP GAIN).
/sarcasm off
Fact is: some people are more talented than others and some are dumber than others; otherwise all people would be a Mozart or all would have the same IQ.
In contrast: a racist is somebody that believes that talent, intellect etc. are inevitably linked to or caused by skin color, cultural heritage, religion etc. and I can nowhere in RoamingRiverElk's post read anything resembling that.
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