1.6.2 Sorc Magicka Builds Still Ruined!!! I'm Done! ZoS Read!

ZOS_UlyssesW

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ZOS_UlyssesW

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Fayaburn

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

@Derra‌ so you cant weave overload light and class spells anymore?

Nope, not since 1.6.1

EDIT: Though they did buff the damage since ofc. Worth mentioning

The damage buff was nice. However it didn't make up for the loss of light attack weaving. Rumor has it further nerfs are coming next week and Overload is one of them.

In my mind this roughly translates to

"I hope there will be further nerfs as it's starting to get harder to complain about the DPS of the top ranged DPS class. The argument that only melee does more DPS is starting to make sense."

But what do I know.. I mean, I use a pet. *gasp*

No that's not what it translates too. I am the starter of this thread. I don't want further nerfs. Maybe learn to read? If you insist on taking so much skooma...go trip out somewhere else dude.

Haha, I know you started the thread. That's the joke, by now half of this thread is just complaining to complain. Not about any sort of legitimate issues. It's almost like you'd want further nerfs so that you can continue complaining.

Tankqull wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

Nybling wrote: »

xherics wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

I just watched a sorc get 14k dps with a caster build. Before you ask they had 90 champion points spent.

Build and rotation pls?

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/1-6-x-nyblings-magicka-based-sorc-dps-champion-rank-71/page/4/#post-567158

The current last post in thread.

I want to see this man to do the DPS for more than 100 seconds... Impossible, the dps drops to 8k all the time...

I think you underestimate how sustainable overload is. Light Attacks w/ Overload regenerate Ultimate. After a minute I still had almost 700 ultimate left and that was with constant weaving after each crystal frags.

Nybling...not trying to be rude. However you're the same person champing pet builds along with Erlexx on Tamriel Foundry. I don't think anyone here respects you for that or that you are helping the further downfall of our class.

If you hadn't noticed. The major of the people who play this class, are seriously unhappy with it, and we are all calling for change. This thread alone is proof of that.

Overload is bugged and has been reported 101 times. It will be fixed.

As a member of Entropy Rising you have the Developers ear some what. You of all people should be using to pull out class out of the dump.

Let's be honest here, most of you wont be happy with the sorc till you have the best dps, healing, tanking, mobility in the game. Frankly I'm getting tired of people whining about pet builds just like nightblades who whined their class sucked and would always say something moronic like "they're nightBLADES not nightSTAFFS."

It gets old and your class doesn't suck so quit whining.

nope all i want is the sorc atleast on the same lvl in 1.6 as it is in 1.5 compared to other classes. and thats not the case instead of buffs we recieved nerfes all overthe place hidden behind nice formulations in the patch notes.

Sorcs are much, much better compared to other classes in 1.6 over 1.5. By far. If you don't see this, sorry..

Keep smoking that Skooma and move along dude. You just proved yourself ignorant.

There's no easy way of saying this but if your Sorc is bad still.. it's you that's bad, not your class. Sorry, but someone had to tell ya.

Alcast wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

Exstazik wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

ArconSeptim wrote: »

as I said sorcerer style players biggest whiners in the game but have the best dps in game

You either adapt or you don't, but this thread, is not feedback. This thread is the ultimate QQ and can only lead to people getting completely fed up with you. It's not too much to ask for some real in-game examples if you want people to listen to you.

How about the 10000+ times where we gave feedback about how a build requiring to run 3 toggles is not viable? You even included a paragraph about this toggle issue in your extensive post about 1.6...

What about I provide you one single target skill that you spam to reach 12k dps (no more, no less) when you manage to keep entropy up. You will have only 1 slot per bar and can't cast anything than that skill and entropy and at the same time struggle with the broken weapon swap (cooldown inside). Do you still think that would be a viable and nice build? Even if it grants 12k on serpent where other people get 11.5k?

Please don't focus on the crushing shock nerf and other peripheral issues and realize that currently PvE sorcs are trapped in a deep pit caused by bad gamedesign.

If you feel that's too restrictive I'd just drop Bound Aegis. I'm probably gonna do that anyway, sure 5% magicka is nice but it's not like "OH I MUST HAVE IT". Plus in 1.5 you'd pretty much have to have either ele drain and/or spell sym anyway which you could technically drop now so...

Sure, I'd also like more skill slots just like pretty much everyone else, but the difference is I'm not going to say my class(es) is(are) broken as a result. Actually the opposite, imagine these skills are actually so useful that you'd want to have them on your bar now.. that's a huge buff to the skills imo.

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/1-6-pve-endgame-dps-zappy-mage/

I can't bear having only 2 actives per skill bar. Which is why I worked on this build and am using it on PTS. Yeah I can drop Bound Armor to gain 2 skill slots, however I am losing DPS compared to Nybling's build (1-2k) even before the CS nerf.

And even without sloting bound armor, I cannot use AOE and ST within the same fight. And yes some fights require AOE and ST without allowing to swap skills as you don't leave combat inbetween (e.g. many vet dsa fights).

And btw, you say that magicka sorc is the only build to produce good numbers in ranged ST. I think this is because most people are currently testing/theorycrafting melee stamina builds (other than sorcs that have really bad synergies with PvE 1.6 stamina builds). As soon as more people from other classes start to really try to min-max magicka builds, good numbers will come up as well.

What is your point?
We all know that currently, melee stamina builds have advantage regarding ST DPS on tank and spank fights.

I was just saying that other classes than sorcerers can produce proper numbers with a range magicka build.

nope, not true

All ranged builds are approx 8-9k dps
And dont tell me magicka DK get 12k ranged, that is melee also with their DoTs.

Exactly what I've been trying to say, good luck in getting rabid, angry sorcerers to listen.

If anything the sorcerer is actually in a great place as it can actually get almost as good ranged DPS as melee ~12-14k at least on blood spawn has been proven.

So ya you're a troll, enjoy those crickets you hear in the background.

Hello troll, how's that fire weakness going for ya?

Anyway, I'll stop responding to you as I have a feeling you're one of those people pulling 800 DPS and complaining about your class. It works until you run out of things to complain about. I don't care as I don't have that issue. ^^

Now that you have more time to answer to other posts, can you explain me how providing opinion and feedback about my class in the PTS section is whining please?

Also, as you are saying that sorcerers are whining only because they need to learn to play. Can you please explain me why I do not see so much negative feedback from other classes please?
Are you trying to say that among all the eso players population, all the bad players and whiners are concentrated only in the sorcerer class?

About the DK being melee because of this DoTs, again, this is your opinion. I consider spending 80% of the fight time at range and only 20% at 8m to reapply DoTs not being melee. If the moment when I need to reapply them is not melee friendly due to boss mechanics, then I will just wait a few seconds more to reapply then and will still be granted a better overall DPS.

@pppontus‌
Now that the thread is reopened, can you adress those questions please?

pppontus

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

@Derra‌ so you cant weave overload light and class spells anymore?

Nope, not since 1.6.1

EDIT: Though they did buff the damage since ofc. Worth mentioning

The damage buff was nice. However it didn't make up for the loss of light attack weaving. Rumor has it further nerfs are coming next week and Overload is one of them.

In my mind this roughly translates to

"I hope there will be further nerfs as it's starting to get harder to complain about the DPS of the top ranged DPS class. The argument that only melee does more DPS is starting to make sense."

But what do I know.. I mean, I use a pet. *gasp*

No that's not what it translates too. I am the starter of this thread. I don't want further nerfs. Maybe learn to read? If you insist on taking so much skooma...go trip out somewhere else dude.

Haha, I know you started the thread. That's the joke, by now half of this thread is just complaining to complain. Not about any sort of legitimate issues. It's almost like you'd want further nerfs so that you can continue complaining.

Tankqull wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

Nybling wrote: »

xherics wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

I just watched a sorc get 14k dps with a caster build. Before you ask they had 90 champion points spent.

Build and rotation pls?

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/1-6-x-nyblings-magicka-based-sorc-dps-champion-rank-71/page/4/#post-567158

The current last post in thread.

I want to see this man to do the DPS for more than 100 seconds... Impossible, the dps drops to 8k all the time...

I think you underestimate how sustainable overload is. Light Attacks w/ Overload regenerate Ultimate. After a minute I still had almost 700 ultimate left and that was with constant weaving after each crystal frags.

Nybling...not trying to be rude. However you're the same person champing pet builds along with Erlexx on Tamriel Foundry. I don't think anyone here respects you for that or that you are helping the further downfall of our class.

If you hadn't noticed. The major of the people who play this class, are seriously unhappy with it, and we are all calling for change. This thread alone is proof of that.

Overload is bugged and has been reported 101 times. It will be fixed.

As a member of Entropy Rising you have the Developers ear some what. You of all people should be using to pull out class out of the dump.

Let's be honest here, most of you wont be happy with the sorc till you have the best dps, healing, tanking, mobility in the game. Frankly I'm getting tired of people whining about pet builds just like nightblades who whined their class sucked and would always say something moronic like "they're nightBLADES not nightSTAFFS."

It gets old and your class doesn't suck so quit whining.

nope all i want is the sorc atleast on the same lvl in 1.6 as it is in 1.5 compared to other classes. and thats not the case instead of buffs we recieved nerfes all overthe place hidden behind nice formulations in the patch notes.

Sorcs are much, much better compared to other classes in 1.6 over 1.5. By far. If you don't see this, sorry..

Keep smoking that Skooma and move along dude. You just proved yourself ignorant.

There's no easy way of saying this but if your Sorc is bad still.. it's you that's bad, not your class. Sorry, but someone had to tell ya.

Alcast wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

Exstazik wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Fayaburn wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

ArconSeptim wrote: »

as I said sorcerer style players biggest whiners in the game but have the best dps in game

You either adapt or you don't, but this thread, is not feedback. This thread is the ultimate QQ and can only lead to people getting completely fed up with you. It's not too much to ask for some real in-game examples if you want people to listen to you.

How about the 10000+ times where we gave feedback about how a build requiring to run 3 toggles is not viable? You even included a paragraph about this toggle issue in your extensive post about 1.6...

What about I provide you one single target skill that you spam to reach 12k dps (no more, no less) when you manage to keep entropy up. You will have only 1 slot per bar and can't cast anything than that skill and entropy and at the same time struggle with the broken weapon swap (cooldown inside). Do you still think that would be a viable and nice build? Even if it grants 12k on serpent where other people get 11.5k?

Please don't focus on the crushing shock nerf and other peripheral issues and realize that currently PvE sorcs are trapped in a deep pit caused by bad gamedesign.

If you feel that's too restrictive I'd just drop Bound Aegis. I'm probably gonna do that anyway, sure 5% magicka is nice but it's not like "OH I MUST HAVE IT". Plus in 1.5 you'd pretty much have to have either ele drain and/or spell sym anyway which you could technically drop now so...

Sure, I'd also like more skill slots just like pretty much everyone else, but the difference is I'm not going to say my class(es) is(are) broken as a result. Actually the opposite, imagine these skills are actually so useful that you'd want to have them on your bar now.. that's a huge buff to the skills imo.

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/1-6-pve-endgame-dps-zappy-mage/

I can't bear having only 2 actives per skill bar. Which is why I worked on this build and am using it on PTS. Yeah I can drop Bound Armor to gain 2 skill slots, however I am losing DPS compared to Nybling's build (1-2k) even before the CS nerf.

And even without sloting bound armor, I cannot use AOE and ST within the same fight. And yes some fights require AOE and ST without allowing to swap skills as you don't leave combat inbetween (e.g. many vet dsa fights).

And btw, you say that magicka sorc is the only build to produce good numbers in ranged ST. I think this is because most people are currently testing/theorycrafting melee stamina builds (other than sorcs that have really bad synergies with PvE 1.6 stamina builds). As soon as more people from other classes start to really try to min-max magicka builds, good numbers will come up as well.

What is your point?
We all know that currently, melee stamina builds have advantage regarding ST DPS on tank and spank fights.

I was just saying that other classes than sorcerers can produce proper numbers with a range magicka build.

nope, not true

All ranged builds are approx 8-9k dps
And dont tell me magicka DK get 12k ranged, that is melee also with their DoTs.

Exactly what I've been trying to say, good luck in getting rabid, angry sorcerers to listen.

If anything the sorcerer is actually in a great place as it can actually get almost as good ranged DPS as melee ~12-14k at least on blood spawn has been proven.

So ya you're a troll, enjoy those crickets you hear in the background.

Hello troll, how's that fire weakness going for ya?

Anyway, I'll stop responding to you as I have a feeling you're one of those people pulling 800 DPS and complaining about your class. It works until you run out of things to complain about. I don't care as I don't have that issue. ^^

Now that you have more time to answer to other posts, can you explain me how providing opinion and feedback about my class in the PTS section is whining please?

Also, as you are saying that sorcerers are whining only because they need to learn to play. Can you please explain me why I do not see so much negative feedback from other classes please?
Are you trying to say that among all the eso players population, all the bad players and whiners are concentrated only in the sorcerer class?

About the DK being melee because of this DoTs, again, this is your opinion. I consider spending 80% of the fight time at range and only 20% at 8m to reapply DoTs not being melee. If the moment when I need to reapply them is not melee friendly due to boss mechanics, then I will just wait a few seconds more to reapply then and will still be granted a better overall DPS.

I had a long answer written down to this when the thread closed. I'll just finish it up quickly.

@Fayaburn‌ I don't consider you to be one of the people whining. I see you've actually put some effort in testing, I'm sure it can be made much better but I can see that you're actually trying whereas 70% of the posters here haven't even been on the PTS and are just complaining because they think sorcerers are still worse than other classes.

My guess is people got used to being turned down by some guilds/groups for raids and are now just trying to take all that rage out on something, without making any accurate tests.

In short: If your feedback is constructive, not "pets are ugly", it's good. If your feedback is accurate, not "sorcerers do the worst dps in the world", it's good. I've seen very many remarks that aren't far from these above, or people comparing tooltip values and deciding that Sorcs are bad.

Anyway, I like your build on TF and I think with a better gear setup it will rock. It is already completely owning all magicka NBs, templar ranged and bow builds of all classes.

In regards to toggles, I feel your pain, I've played with 2 constant toggles since day one on my Magicka NB. But with the current system it is what it is, and unless they rework that system .. well.

Faulgor

Frankly I don't think that a dedicated (!) pet build with both pets, necropotence gear and what not is enough to call Sorcerers fine.
They had almost a year to collect data which skills are used often and which are almost never touched, and with 1.6, they could have made every skill useful - not just pets. Which Sorcerer is actually using Encase? Rune Prison? Daedric Mines? Lightning Splash as an alternative to Impulse? Which passives actually contribute to different playstyles? Which morphs are never used?

Templars complained since forever that Healing Ritual is pointless - at least it got a 70% heal buff last patch. Why should sorcerers shut up about such things only because their Twilight adds a little more dps than before? I expect every ability in the game to be interesting and useful in certain situations - and I don't think that's too much to ask.

I'm going to add some suggestions in spoiler tags here, because I don't want to suggest that this is how it has to be - but it would improve things quite a bit.

Dark Magic

Encase has been removed and replaced by a new ability, Bloodbile

Bloodbile
- Call on Peryites powers to deal X bleed, poison and disease damage over 5 seconds.
Blood Fountain
- After 5 seconds, explodes for x disease damage, damaging everything in 6 meter radius.
Blight
- This ability now scales with stamina and weapon power. Also applies Major Defile debuff to target.

Rune Prison
- Reduced cast time to 0.5 seconds.

Dark Exchange
- This ability is now a toggle (because I know you love those)
- While toggled, disables Stamina Recovery, but doubles Magicka Recovery and tripples Health Recovery.
Dark Conversion
- While toggled, disables Magicka Recovery, but doubles Stamina Recovery and tripples Health Recovery.
Dark Deal
- While toggled, disables Health Recovery, but doubles Magicka and Stamina Recovery and grants the Major Mending buff.

Daedric Mines has been removed and replaced by a new ability, Fatigue

Fatigue
- Creates a minor absorption field for 20 seconds, draining x Stamina per second from enemies inside the field and reducing their movement speed. Also applies the Major Endurance buff to the caster.
Lifeforce Trap
- Also drains x Magicka per second from enemies inside the field and applies the Major Intellect buff to the caster.
Trespasser's Bane
- Applies the Major Endurance buff to group members inside the field.

These changes give Sorcerers a short duration spamable DOT (Bloodbound) to trigger Crystal Fragments, aswell as improving this trees original purpose: Crowd control and support. Rune Prison can be used more deliberately if the situation demands it, while Fatigue is especially useful in PvP and in supporting group members. One of Dark Exchange's morphs is also designed to improve the healing role for Sorcerers. In conjunction with the Blood Magic passive (which could be reduced in magnitude), the spamability of most spells allows for a good healing method.
In essence, Dark Magic is used to annoy your enemies, as well as buffing yourself and your group members.

Storm Calling

Lightning Form
- Doubled damage.
Boundless Storm
- Removed Major Resolve and Major Armor buffs; Increase damage by 300% to base damage.

Lightning Splash
- Doubled damage.

Surge
- Removed healing effect.
- Applies the Major Brutality buff for x seconds. All weapon attacks have a 20% chance to disorient target.
Power Surge
- Also applies the Major Sorcery buff.
Critical Surge
- Critical hits disorient target.

Energized
- 5/10% chance on damaging with a Storm Calling ability to restore x Magicka.

Lightning Form is a nice buff for armor, but not much else. These changes increase its viability as a close-up DOT, even more so with its morph that forsakes the armor buff for more damage. Lightning Splash simply deserves up to twice its current damage to be an alternative to other AoEs, considering it's not a PBAoE like Impulse, Carve or Whirlwind. Surge is simply gone as a useful heal - that functionality has been moved to the Dark Magic tree. Instead, Surge improves survivability by disorienting targets, which can be easily CC broken in PvP but offers quite a bit utility in PvE.

Holycannoli

I would prefer the Dark Magic line have life leeches and DoTs over the useless skills nobody ever uses. I've never once seen Encase, Rune Prison or Daedric Mines used. They could ninja replace them and nobody would notice.

They could replace them with a life leech, a poison attack and maybe a disease-based DoT. To me those are proper "dark" type spells.

Who here would be opposed to replacing Encase, Rune Prison and Daedric Mines with a life leech, a poison attack and a disease DoT? My guess is nobody.

I'm aware Entropy is a life leech but it doesn't benefit from the Dark Magic passives.

Merlin13KAGL

Faulgor wrote: »

Frankly I don't think that a dedicated (!) pet build with both pets, necropotence gear and what not is enough to call Sorcerers fine.
They had almost a year to collect data which skills are used often and which are almost never touched, and with 1.6, they could have made every skill useful - not just pets. Which Sorcerer is actually using Encase? Rune Prison? Daedric Mines? Lightning Splash as an alternative to Impulse? Which passives actually contribute to different playstyles? Which morphs are never used?

Templars complained since forever that Healing Ritual is pointless - at least it got a 70% heal buff last patch. Why should sorcerers shut up about such things only because their Twilight adds a little more dps than before? I expect every ability in the game to be interesting and useful in certain situations - and I don't think that's too much to ask.

I'm going to add some suggestions in spoiler tags here, because I don't want to suggest that this is how it has to be - but it would improve things quite a bit.

Dark Magic

Encase has been removed and replaced by a new ability, Bloodbile

Bloodbile
- Call on Peryites powers to deal X bleed, poison and disease damage over 5 seconds.
Blood Fountain
- After 5 seconds, explodes for x disease damage, damaging everything in 6 meter radius.
Blight
- This ability now scales with stamina and weapon power. Also applies Major Defile debuff to target.

Rune Prison
- Reduced cast time to 0.5 seconds.

Dark Exchange
- This ability is now a toggle (because I know you love those)
- While toggled, disables Stamina Recovery, but doubles Magicka Recovery and tripples Health Recovery.
Dark Conversion
- While toggled, disables Magicka Recovery, but doubles Stamina Recovery and tripples Health Recovery.
Dark Deal
- While toggled, disables Health Recovery, but doubles Magicka and Stamina Recovery and grants the Major Mending buff.

Daedric Mines has been removed and replaced by a new ability, Fatigue

Fatigue
- Creates a minor absorption field for 20 seconds, draining x Stamina per second from enemies inside the field and reducing their movement speed. Also applies the Major Endurance buff to the caster.
Lifeforce Trap
- Also drains x Magicka per second from enemies inside the field and applies the Major Intellect buff to the caster.
Trespasser's Bane
- Applies the Major Endurance buff to group members inside the field.

These changes give Sorcerers a short duration spamable DOT (Bloodbound) to trigger Crystal Fragments, aswell as improving this trees original purpose: Crowd control and support. Rune Prison can be used more deliberately if the situation demands it, while Fatigue is especially useful in PvP and in supporting group members. One of Dark Exchange's morphs is also designed to improve the healing role for Sorcerers. In conjunction with the Blood Magic passive (which could be reduced in magnitude), the spamability of most spells allows for a good healing method.
In essence, Dark Magic is used to annoy your enemies, as well as buffing yourself and your group members.

Storm Calling

Lightning Form
- Doubled damage.
Boundless Storm
- Removed Major Resolve and Major Armor buffs; Increase damage by 300% to base damage.

Lightning Splash
- Doubled damage.

Surge
- Removed healing effect.
- Applies the Major Brutality buff for x seconds. All weapon attacks have a 20% chance to disorient target.
Power Surge
- Also applies the Major Sorcery buff.
Critical Surge
- Critical hits disorient target.

Energized
- 5/10% chance on damaging with a Storm Calling ability to restore x Magicka.

Lightning Form is a nice buff for armor, but not much else. These changes increase its viability as a close-up DOT, even more so with its morph that forsakes the armor buff for more damage. Lightning Splash simply deserves up to twice its current damage to be an alternative to other AoEs, considering it's not a PBAoE like Impulse, Carve or Whirlwind. Surge is simply gone as a useful heal - that functionality has been moved to the Dark Magic tree. Instead, Surge improves survivability by disorienting targets, which can be easily CC broken in PvP but offers quite a bit utility in PvE.

@Faulgor, agreed, there needs to be options and alternatives. Obviously there will be optimized builds, but there should be more than one or two functional ones.

The trick is, it's going to take time to find those, as everything's changed. In the process of cranking up familiars, they inadvertently had to be careful not to overcharge the remaining skills.

This is the conundrum in which the Dev's find themselves.

I'm not justifying it, merely pointing it out.

I've had some things work remarkably well in PTS, some things feel too easy (don't stone me), and some things feel, at first glance, nigh impossible.

There is more work to be done, and I want to give it fair chance. I would like non-summon options to be viable again, without relying on particular weapon lines either.

A caster should be what a caster is. The rest should be bonus.

Holycannoli wrote: »

I would prefer the Dark Magic line have life leeches and DoTs over the useless skills nobody ever uses. I've never once seen Encase, Rune Prison or Daedric Mines used. They could ninja replace them and nobody would notice.

They could replace them with a life leech, a poison attack and maybe a disease-based DoT. To me those are proper "dark" type spells.

Who here would be opposed to replacing Encase, Rune Prison and Daedric Mines with a life leech, a poison attack and a disease DoT? My guess is nobody.

I'm aware Entropy is a life leech but it doesn't benefit from the Dark Magic passives.

@Holycannoli‌ , interesting, as I've used (and still use) all three situationally.

Sometimes it the subtleties of the skills that make it shine.

Incidentally, if you have the Blood Magic passive maxed, every dark magic spell offensive spell is already a heal, if not two.

Holycannoli

Wouldn't you rather hit them with a life leech or disease DoT than a CC that breaks with damage?

shiva7663

One day, I would like to play a balanced MMO that doesn't require different builds for PvE, PvP and hard endgame content like Trials..

Aimelin

they just want everyone to play DKs so they don't have to balance other classes

so we can all be dks in light armor perma block casting & dropping standards every 10 seconds without doing anything

Pyatra

Encase is an awesome skill and should be used often.
Daedric Mines is situational but ok and is good to lay in choke point in PvP.

Rune Prison, it has a single decent morph as an anti-gank surprise but the cast on the other morph is too long. I can't use it in combat, only before combat to maybe lock down an Illusionist in Craglorn while I kill everyone else, god forbid there are two illusionists. One morph is okay for PvP, the other morph is barely passible as an opener in PvE trash mob fights.

Holycannoli

Pyatra wrote: »

Encase is an awesome skill and should be used often.
Daedric Mines is situational but ok and is good to lay in choke point in PvP.

Rune Prison, it has a single decent morph as an anti-gank surprise but the cast on the other morph is too long. I can't use it in combat, only before combat to maybe lock down an Illusionist in Craglorn while I kill everyone else, god forbid there are two illusionists. One morph is okay for PvP, the other morph is barely passible as an opener in PvE trash mob fights.

I've never seen a sorc build that dedicated a slot to Encase. It's even worse in 1.6 where you have to dedicate 6 slots to toggles for best DPS.

Is Encase ever used in Cyrodiil? I'm sure a few people at times use it but I haven't seen it. Same with Daedric Mines.

Iyas

you never saw a sorc with daedric mines? the melee killer spell.

Darkintellect

Pets would so easily be fixed with this simple design concept. You can then more easily balance using the pets with damage so ZOS won't ignore damaging spells, while leaving the class to feel forced to use pets.

Link below takes you to that forum thread
Changes to Sorcerer Summoning and Pets

c0rp

The Togglemancer is real folks.

cozmon3c_ESO

c0rp wrote: »

The Togglemancer is real folks.

They need to put this on there front page like other builds lol. THE TOGGLEMANCER, try it now.

ZoS: so how does your build work?
You: well i put like 9 toggle abilities across my bars and then cast frag because you know it's a 1.1 second cast, lol what??
ZoS: sounds damn exilerating! How would you rate your new original awesome sauce build?
You: it's 10 out of 10 fabulous, i can do so much stuff!

Dracane

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

The Togglemancer is real folks.

They need to put this on there front page like other builds lol. THE TOGGLEMANCER, try it now.

ZoS: so how does your build work?
You: well i put like 9 toggle abilities across my bars and then cast frag because you know it's a 1.1 second cast, lol what??
ZoS: sounds damn exilerating! How would you rate your new original awesome sauce build?
You: it's 10 out of 10 fabulous, i can do so much stuff!

Are you serious ? this must be the strongest and most efficient build of aaaaall time and must be so much fun to play.

#SorcOP #NerfSorc

Wylander

Well i think just whining the entire thread about how low non Pet DPS is for now dosn't help ZOS to adress want we want.
I think personally it's a good idea to replace the mines or to rework them.
Also i think runic Prison has to be replaced with a something simmilar to Shattering Rocks from the DK.
i don't mean just copy the function i think give the Spell no Cast time and something else than disorientation function.
Something like:
"Target gets snared by 30% for 3s. While target is moving in this time the snare becomes stronger up to 50% after 3s and root them for another 2s."

So something like this. But this sounds to me like a "Dark Magic" Spell then Runic Prison.

And for the Mines until just a few people are using this can be replaced with something that works like Spell Semetry.

"Inflicts the Target with Deadric (7-12% of Max magica pool) dmg every second for 12s and consumes X (0.5% from Max Health pool)Health every second"

Morph one "Gain Major Sorcery while skill is Active increasing you Spell Dmg by 20% for 15s and sosn't applied to summoned Pets"

Morph two "While skill is Active reduces enemy recived healing by 30% and restores your Health by 5% of your max Health for every incoming Heal applied to your enemy"

I think this is not OP but you get a vailable option for PvE and PvP thats not to strong for PvP and provides a decent DPS option for the trade of HP.

c0rp

Dracane

Wylander wrote: »

Well i think just whining the entire thread about how low non Pet DPS is for now dosn't help ZOS to adress want we want.
I think personally it's a good idea to replace the mines or to rework them.
Also i think runic Prison has to be replaced with a something simmilar to Shattering Rocks from the DK.
i don't mean just copy the function i think give the Spell no Cast time and something else than disorientation function.
Something like:
"Target gets snared by 30% for 3s. While target is moving in this time the snare becomes stronger up to 50% after 3s and root them for another 2s."

So something like this. But this sounds to me like a "Dark Magic" Spell then Runic Prison.

And for the Mines until just a few people are using this can be replaced with something that works like Spell Semetry.

"Inflicts the Target with Deadric (7-12% of Max magica pool) dmg every second for 12s and consumes X (0.5% from Max Health pool)Health every second"

Morph one "Gain Major Sorcery while skill is Active increasing you Spell Dmg by 20% for 15s and sosn't applied to summoned Pets"

Morph two "While skill is Active reduces enemy recived healing by 30% and restores your Health by 5% of your max Health for every incoming Heal applied to your enemy"

I think this is not OP but you get a vailable option for PvE and PvP thats not to strong for PvP and provides a decent DPS option for the trade of HP.

I think, replacing daedric mines is a bad idea. They are our only defense against overmighty melee fighters.

Better replace rune prison and lightning splash. And I would chance dark exchange.

Morvul

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

Drazek wrote: »

Double/triple the damage of lighting flood and double the duration.

Double the damage of Mages Wrath/fury. Maybe even have one of the morphs able to hit 3 targets, similar to one of Templars spells.

Scrap the whole pet tree.

This is the smartest thing said on this thread thus far. I'd take it one step further though.

#1 Triple damage of Lighting Flood and all it's morphs. Their duration is increased to 15 seconds.

#2 Double damage on Mages Wrath and all it's morphs. Once target hits 50% it can be executed, and the damage increases as targets health gets lower.

#3 Double damage of Velcious Curse only.

#4 Increase Crystal fragments damage by 25%

o.O
I'm also of the opinion that sorcerers still need some help (less toggles and some spam-able dps skill, basically); but that suggestions would turn us from "might need help" into "crazy op", ironically without fixing the mechanical problems of the class...

Dracane

Morvul wrote: »

rogue_gamer32b14_ESO wrote: »

Drazek wrote: »

Double/triple the damage of lighting flood and double the duration.

Double the damage of Mages Wrath/fury. Maybe even have one of the morphs able to hit 3 targets, similar to one of Templars spells.

Scrap the whole pet tree.

This is the smartest thing said on this thread thus far. I'd take it one step further though.

#1 Triple damage of Lighting Flood and all it's morphs. Their duration is increased to 15 seconds.

#2 Double damage on Mages Wrath and all it's morphs. Once target hits 50% it can be executed, and the damage increases as targets health gets lower.

#3 Double damage of Velcious Curse only.

#4 Increase Crystal fragments damage by 25%

o.O
I'm also of the opinion that sorcerers still need some help (less toggles and some spam-able dps skill, basically); but that suggestions would turn us from "might need help" into "crazy op", ironically without fixing the mechanical problems of the class...

I actually like some of these ideas.
Increasing the executing range of Mage's Fury would make it worth slotting again. Since daedric curse is blockable now, the damage could be increased abit.

And lightning splash.... I see no future for this spell. I would remove it, or highly increase the damage (the duration is fine now)
In my opinion, Sorcerer's lack of damage is the only problem.

Wylander

I agree to @Morvul‌. Simply doubling the dmg isn't the way we want because we have only for 4 weeks something fromt it hen the OP crys makes ZOS starting the nerf hammer again.

I think that the explosion of Mage Wrath hast to be applied everytime and becomes stronger with lesser HP the enemy has. Like Radiant Destruction from the Templars.

cozmon3c_ESO

Lightening splash should turn into chain Lightening insta cast.

Morvul

Holycannoli wrote: »

I would prefer the Dark Magic line have life leeches and DoTs over the useless skills nobody ever uses. I've never once seen Encase, Rune Prison or Daedric Mines used. They could ninja replace them and nobody would notice.

They could replace them with a life leech, a poison attack and maybe a disease-based DoT. To me those are proper "dark" type spells.

Who here would be opposed to replacing Encase, Rune Prison and Daedric Mines with a life leech, a poison attack and a disease DoT? My guess is nobody.

I'm aware Entropy is a life leech but it doesn't benefit from the Dark Magic passives.

I would be opposed.
I know this thread is primarily about PvE, and I agree sorcs need a bit of a mechanics rework for PvE.
But: Mines are awesome in small-scale PvP!
and while encase is not quite as good as DKs talons, it does server a similar role (and I do happen to use it frequenlty in group-pvp)

Dracane

Wylander wrote: »

I agree to @Morvul‌. Simply doubling the dmg isn't the way we want because we have only for 4 weeks something fromt it hen the OP crys makes ZOS starting the nerf hammer again.

I think that the explosion of Mage Wrath hast to be applied everytime and becomes stronger with lesser HP the enemy has. Like Radiant Destruction from the Templars.

Very good idea.

Wylander

On live server is use encase also often in PvE.
Root the enemy and you have +15% crit chance. Thats not that bad while using AoE.
But now it becomes useless after the passiv nerf of "Exploitation"

daemonios

Morvul wrote: »

Holycannoli wrote: »

I would prefer the Dark Magic line have life leeches and DoTs over the useless skills nobody ever uses. I've never once seen Encase, Rune Prison or Daedric Mines used. They could ninja replace them and nobody would notice.

They could replace them with a life leech, a poison attack and maybe a disease-based DoT. To me those are proper "dark" type spells.

Who here would be opposed to replacing Encase, Rune Prison and Daedric Mines with a life leech, a poison attack and a disease DoT? My guess is nobody.

I'm aware Entropy is a life leech but it doesn't benefit from the Dark Magic passives.

I would be opposed.
I know this thread is primarily about PvE, and I agree sorcs need a bit of a mechanics rework for PvE.
But: Mines are awesome in small-scale PvP!
and while encase is not quite as good as DKs talons, it does server a similar role (and I do happen to use it frequenlty in group-pvp)

I also don't see a problem with Daedric Mines. They hit quite hard and are a boon if you want to go spell-based melee. Just reduce the camera shake a notch

I do find some ideas about DoT's in the Dark Magic skill line very interesting, though.

Jahosefat

lol I remember hearing something along the lines of "With the changes in 1.6 we want people to still be able to play the sorts of builds they have been playing all along, just open up potential for new builds..."

Practically every damage/utility ability in my pre-1.6 build is being nerfed into uselessness.

1.) Encase- Exploitation nerf and delay added
2.) Wall of Elements- Damage greatly reduced, only one copy can be placed now (plus no ult gen from it anymore)
3.) Crushing shock- Already had taken a damage hit from surge changes, now a second damage nerf
4.) Negate- whole host of huge nerfs making it a pretty *meh* ult for the cost. Since it is so weak now it should be doing damage or something.
5.) Surge- The damage bonus provided by this took a huge drop when it was switched from ~+85 weapon damage to a flat %. The healing provided by it is still low and with the mag cost most people will probably go with entropy. Also, everyone has access to entropy so surge lost its special place; sorc already had low damage and now the other high damage dealing classes have the same access to damage buffs... They also removed the 42 second power surge option which I preferred for mag conservation and less bar swapping.

So 5/12 skills I have been rolling with for 3+ months are being nerfed hard. And we thought sorcs were getting buffs.... "But they buffed pets".... woo hoo. But hey, at least I can streak 20 times in a row now... oh wait that's probably getting nerfed in next weeks hotfix.

The clouds are setting and the dark days of the sorcs are upon us!

McDoogs

I wish my class was as beefy as magicka sorcs are in pvp. #nosympathy