Pulsar/Fiery Ring, I think it needs to be redesigned.

TheBull

It's a bad spell. Takes too much skill out the game. It's way too large for one. For two, it does to much damage for the amount thought needed. It's bad for the game. It takes away what could be amazing melee play and turns it into a mosh pit of one button spamming.

The rest of the combat system is too good to be dominated by such an unrefined spell.

Soloeus

1. I guess your actual problem is that AoE Caps create a situation in which a balanced spell (regarding damage, radius, etc.) becomes an extremely cheap tactic called "Zerg Balling" where 20+ players stealth in one group then begin spamming Negate Magic, Meteor, Impulse, Bat Swarm and Standard of Might.

2. The best counter is to stand on the outside of such a group and use Crushing Shock, Uppercut, Dark Talons, Encase, Silver Shards and Veil of Blades.

3. You can also make use of Harness Magicka, Immovable, Barrier, Bound Armor and the many other things that increase Spell Resistance and Fire Resistance (which is the most common Impulse Element).

Edit:

"Paper is fine and balanced, but Rock needs nerfed." - Scissors.

TheBull

1. That's not the issue at all. Two people using can cover the entire bottom floor of a keep. When compared to cleave which would take atleast 8 people to cover the same area. Why is Pulsar/Ring so big? There is no directional component. Does better dmg than all other PBAoEs or cones.

3. See 1.

3. you are innovative and brilliant.

Hypertionb14_ESO

AOE in general needs a major rethink.

For Impulse, i would like to see 2 things...

1. massively improved cast visually, where the staff builds power for a half second before the wave is released, adding a minor cast time.

2. Possibly a Repeated cast cost increase (similar to bolt escape), with particle effects showing the staff is still overcharged after casting. This cost increase should be at least 20-30%

This would make Impulse insanely badass visually, while balancing its mechanics quite nicely.

Anyways, i play almost exclusively as a mage, Mostly because its always the better option for dealing damage.. I am however all in for seeing mage builds taken down a bit or Warrior builds getting a buff and always have..

NorthernFury

Seriously, stahp. you're embarrassing the good melee players out there.

TheBull

You two make great arguments. Thanks North, thanks Solo.

kieso

I also think it's too powerful of a spell.

DenverRalphy

Does nobody have Fire Resist enchantments (perhaps coupled with a Pot) to just wade through the mayhem?

Francescolg

Right, you can go for resistances and, much more important, you should try to stay away from big mobs of players, even your own allies. Simply do not stand all together (btw, that is what 80% of the regular pvp'ers do
Second: Use a siege weapon. Get one, two friends and coordinate your targets and the possible ways to do damage --> reward = massive kill points!
Organized groups can be wiped just by enough (and coordinated!! that is most important) siege weapons. They do use Purge, etc., to defend. But they get tired sometimes or run out of mana, etc. etc. Just use siege weapons: You don't need more than 3-4 guys for an effective siege.
Of course, better groups, will try to attack you immediately

Oh, and I forgot: It is the class-ultimates and the ways to fastly reggen ultimates, that are OP, not the PULSAR AE... I invite anyone to test how much damage my templar (DC) is going to do to you with pulsar.. Of course, 5+ players hitting Pulsar should do much greater damage, as with every skill. Simply meet for a duel and test the "stand alone Pulsar damage". It might be that some Passives of DK/Mage/NB make pulsar much stronger: That, I do not now

Kvasir Silverpaw

TheBull wrote: »

1. That's not the issue at all. Two people using can cover the entire bottom floor of a keep. When compared to cleave which would take atleast 8 people to cover the same area. Why is Pulsar/Ring so big? There is no directional component. Does better dmg than all other PBAoEs or cones.

3. See 1.

3. you are innovative and brilliant.

And...if they balance this game for pvp and forget the pve you wont have a game left. Seems like every game I play its the 5-10% of the LOUD POSTING VOCAL pvp-ers that end up getting things changed for the other 90% that dont pvp. Go play a game thats centered around pvp if you want more pvp. Otherwise please stop crying.

TheBull

More great arguments and reasoning behind Pulse/Ring being so much bigger and doing so much more dmg than any other weapon AoE in the game.

Keep up the good work trolls!

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Id just give it the Whirlwind treatment. Make it really really suck against mobs with full health but really really awesome against mobs that have taken a decent amount of damage done to them.

Or make it work the other way less with wounded but more when full health. Just something to keep it from being the 1 button nonstop spam fest it is.

Or take the restriction off Whirlwind and morphs so i can be cool too!

SirenofEntropy

It's always the melee players who whine, perhaps rightfully so since they're still locked out of a lot of PvP groups and high-end PvE because of their playstyle.

However, I do not think the solution is simply "lol nerf mages" because it becomes very problematic to nerf everything to balance PvP, when ultimately all it does is make PvE far more difficult/frustrating for those of us who don't really care about PvP.

Most other MMOs have suffered from the same balance issues at one time or another. Some have gone the route of splitting PvE/PvP skills, so that once you enter PvP your skills will either have a completely different effect, or be less powerful. ESO may end up having to consider the same option at some point to avoid being in the situation where PvP is hopelessly unbalanced but they're not able to do anything about it for risk of screwing up PvE too much.

Another thought to consider: When a certain "OP" skill or skill combo gets rebalanced, most people will just end up coming up with some OTHER OP skill combo. That's just how people who don't want to strategize play PvP: come up with the most overpowered combo possible and mob up and spam it. One of the reasons so many people ball up in PvP is because there's generally a lot of newer PvP'ers in the mix and they feel more secure hiding in a mob with people who actually know what they're doing. Again, this happens in pretty much every MMO with open-map PvP.

TLDR: People will always find the most OP skills possible and exploit them. They can't nerf everything. It's important to learn tactics for avoiding or dealing with the zerg instead of whining about how it's so unfair.

Of course, I'd love to see the melee/stamina builds buffed a good bit, if only to shut up the people who carry on about it endlessly.

khele23eb17_ESO

Kvasir Silverpaw wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

1. That's not the issue at all. Two people using can cover the entire bottom floor of a keep. When compared to cleave which would take atleast 8 people to cover the same area. Why is Pulsar/Ring so big? There is no directional component. Does better dmg than all other PBAoEs or cones.

3. See 1.

3. you are innovative and brilliant.

And...if they balance this game for pvp and forget the pve you wont have a game left. Seems like every game I play its the 5-10% of the LOUD POSTING VOCAL pvp-ers that end up getting things changed for the other 90% that dont pvp. Go play a game thats centered around pvp if you want more pvp. Otherwise please stop crying.

The skill is stronger than other AoE skills regardless of the environment. Whether its PvE or PvP, comparing Impulse to... Whirlwind, Volley or Cleave its just a more effective skill - easier to use, less restrictions, better output.

Robocles

TheBull wrote: »

More great arguments and reasoning behind Pulse/Ring being so much bigger and doing so much more dmg than any other weapon AoE in the game.

Keep up the good work trolls!

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with your "assertion" here.

I will say, though, that the people responding don't have to make much of an argument. The simple fact is YOU made no argument.

Perhaps if you provided specific damage numbers and area of effect along with the other abilities you think it outshines, we could have a discussion.

As it stands, you haven't made an argument... you've just stated what is, frankly, something that is a personal complaint for which you have provided absolutely no sound argument. Unless, of course, simply saying: "It's bad and OP" is suddenly a compelling argument.

MasterFUNG_ESO

I don't PVP at all but you guys sure screw up PVE every time the small vocal mob screams "NERF". How about they change every skill in the game to do exactly the same damage? That would be absolute balance right? How much you wanna bet the same people would come back here to whine about that too.
Im so tired of my favorite classes getting slammed with the nerf bat in every mmo all over PVP.

murtugo

MasterFUNG_ESO wrote: »

I don't PVP at all but you guys sure screw up PVE every time the small vocal mob screams "NERF". How about they change every skill in the game to do exactly the same damage? That would be absolute balance right? How much you wanna bet the same people would come back here to whine about that too.
Im so tired of my favorite classes getting slammed with the nerf bat in every mmo all over PVP.

PVP is just one aspect of the game. If they nerf impulse (again) PVE players will greatly suffer.

Instead of calling for nerf, why not ask for other class/skill improvement?

khele23eb17_ESO

murtugo wrote: »

MasterFUNG_ESO wrote: »

I don't PVP at all but you guys sure screw up PVE every time the small vocal mob screams "NERF". How about they change every skill in the game to do exactly the same damage? That would be absolute balance right? How much you wanna bet the same people would come back here to whine about that too.
Im so tired of my favorite classes getting slammed with the nerf bat in every mmo all over PVP.

PVP is just one aspect of the game. If they nerf impulse (again) PVE players will greatly suffer.

Instead of calling for nerf, why not ask for other class/skill improvement?

Yes, because all PvE players dream of nothing but spamming impulse in fancy dresses.

People have been asking for improvements for months now. But since it seems like its much easier to get things nerfed than buffed...

'Greatly suffer'... what do you even mean?

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

To fix Fiery Ring/Impulse they need to add 50% to it's casting cost and reduce the radius to the same radius of Blazing Shield for example.

Atm the monkeys running around by just spamming it, without using any brains, and you need to use bow to kill them. But these are the same cloth wearers that cry on the other thread that a bow shot did 1500 damage on them........

Anyone who doesn't uses a bow or a staff, is just food.
Maybe also cap the non Ultimate 360 degrees AoE spells to 1-2 targets also.

Maulkin

Can I ask for some clarification? Is your complain targeted towards impulse as a skill or is towards trains/blobs/zergs (whatever you wanna call them) ruling through AoE?

murtugo

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

murtugo wrote: »

MasterFUNG_ESO wrote: »

'Greatly suffer'... what do you even mean?

I mean PVE players will be affected like this guy:

MasterFUNG_ESO wrote: »

I don't PVP at all but you guys sure screw up PVE every time the small vocal mob screams "NERF". How about they change every skill in the game to do exactly the same damage? That would be absolute balance right? How much you wanna bet the same people would come back here to whine about that too.
Im so tired of my favorite classes getting slammed with the nerf bat in every mmo all over PVP.

murtugo

As for me, I don't care if they nerf impulse. They can even eliminate destro staff and it won't affect me. Its just that I don't believe that impulse is dealing too much damage. Every time I die and check my death recap its shows different skills that kills me and its not always impulse. I have never noticed the "too much damage" dealt by it. There are always other skills that are dealing more damage.

Anyway, if you can show me a death recap that clearly shows the OP damage of Pulsar/Fiery Ring then I will join your cause.

Makkir

This argument constantly reminds me of the Austin Powers movie....remember this scene?





If you see it coming, MOVE!

SirenofEntropy

Makkir wrote: »

This argument constantly reminds me of the Austin Powers movie....remember this scene?





If you see it coming, MOVE!

I will never understand why some people are so compelled to fight a giant mob of enemies that they see coming toward them. Put it this way, if two giant zergs meet on the battlefield at least there's going to be a decent fight where either side could come out on top.

If two players wandering alone meet a giant zerg and decide to attempt to fight it off...well... you can see where that' s going to go. In this situation it doesn't even matter what skill the mob is spamming, you're still going to die if there's 20 of them and only 2 or 3 of you.

Makkir

Deep Thoughts w/ Makkir:

I wonder if horses, when an old topic is brought up multiple times, joke about kicking a dead human?

Sru

Geesh PvP'ers .. why not give everyone a tickle stick and paper diapers. That would even everything out.

There are a _lot_ of people playing this game who don't PvP .. stop screwing up PvE with all the PvP specific whines. We have had quite enough.

Devs .. one set of skills for PvP and one for PvE .. mess with the former as much as you want and leave us to explore in peace.

Tankqull

change it from an instant cast to a 1.5sec CT with increased dmg to match the same dmg over time. problem fixed.

beside that get rid of that awesomly stupid 6 target aoe cap.

synnerman

SirenofEntropy wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

This argument constantly reminds me of the Austin Powers movie....remember this scene?





If you see it coming, MOVE!

I will never understand why some people are so compelled to fight a giant mob of enemies that they see coming toward them. Put it this way, if two giant zergs meet on the battlefield at least there's going to be a decent fight where either side could come out on top.

If two players wandering alone meet a giant zerg and decide to attempt to fight it off...well... you can see where that' s going to go. In this situation it doesn't even matter what skill the mob is spamming, you're still going to die if there's 20 of them and only 2 or 3 of you.

You clearly don't PvP. Most of the time PvP consists of defending a resource, Keep breach or keep flag so to say don't try to fight them is ridiculous. as for 2 zergs meeting up for battle being a decent fight lol. Because of this impulse zerg tactic all that happens is that massive lag occurs and the server crashes etc. See the video posted last night in the alliance war section.

However Impulse is not the problem here, the problem is that it is a powerful instant AoE cast that can be cast on the move and is adopted by the blob because of that, just as batswarm has now been more adopted by them in favour of DK standards because batswarm can be used with more mobility.
The real problem is the AoE cap that prevents the large zerg being killed because the heals can outheal the numbers damaged because of the cap.

I pvp every single day and I can categorically say that the worst lag and crashes come from Impulse/healing zergs and I have fought in very large fights with no impulse/heals and its playable. The sooner ZoS see this the better as many people are leaving the game because of this boring, game spoiling/lag tactic.

khele23eb17_ESO

Sru wrote: »

Geesh PvP'ers .. why not give everyone a tickle stick and paper diapers. That would even everything out.

There are a _lot_ of people playing this game who don't PvP .. stop screwing up PvE with all the PvP specific whines. We have had quite enough.

Devs .. one set of skills for PvP and one for PvE .. mess with the former as much as you want and leave us to explore in peace.

This is not screwing up PvE. I dont PvP and I still think it needs balancing. Either by toning down Impulse or buffing AoEs from other weapon skill lines.

Rune_Relic

Fiery ring is proportional to the strength of the curry the night before.

Rune_Relic

synnerman wrote: »

SirenofEntropy wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

This argument constantly reminds me of the Austin Powers movie....remember this scene?





If you see it coming, MOVE!

I will never understand why some people are so compelled to fight a giant mob of enemies that they see coming toward them. Put it this way, if two giant zergs meet on the battlefield at least there's going to be a decent fight where either side could come out on top.

If two players wandering alone meet a giant zerg and decide to attempt to fight it off...well... you can see where that' s going to go. In this situation it doesn't even matter what skill the mob is spamming, you're still going to die if there's 20 of them and only 2 or 3 of you.

You clearly don't PvP. Most of the time PvP consists of defending a resource, Keep breach or keep flag so to say don't try to fight them is ridiculous. as for 2 zergs meeting up for battle being a decent fight lol. Because of this impulse zerg tactic all that happens is that massive lag occurs and the server crashes etc. See the video posted last night in the alliance war section.

However Impulse is not the problem here, the problem is that it is a powerful instant AoE cast that can be cast on the move and is adopted by the blob because of that, just as batswarm has now been more adopted by them in favour of DK standards because batswarm can be used with more mobility.
The real problem is the AoE cap that prevents the large zerg being killed because the heals can outheal the numbers damaged because of the cap.

I pvp every single day and I can categorically say that the worst lag and crashes come from Impulse/healing zergs and I have fought in very large fights with no impulse/heals and its playable. The sooner ZoS see this the better as many people are leaving the game because of this boring, game spoiling/lag tactic.

..or maybe nerf heals ?