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Official Discussion Thread for "Battlemaster's Corner: The Blood Rogue"
ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Community Manager
This is the official discussion thread for the blog article Battlemaster's Corner: The Blood Rogue. Tell us what you think of Elusid's personalized Nightblade build!
If you've got an ESO character build that you think is the best, share it with us (along with a character screenshot) at community@elderscrollsonline.com and we might feature you in an upcoming Battlemaster's Corner!
If you've got an ESO character build that you think is the best, share it with us (along with a character screenshot) at community@elderscrollsonline.com and we might feature you in an upcoming Battlemaster's Corner!
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kirnmalidus✭✭✭✭This is basically the build I've used to get through (almost) all of the faction vet content solo. It is quite effective.Life of a Nightblade (Screenshot Tumblr)
“Attention Zenimax: Stamina builds don't hold up to magicka builds, and this is causing most of your class imbalance. It makes melee weapons and bows weaker than staves and class abilities. It makes medium and heavy armor less desirable than light armor. Fix this imbalance, and you'll address most of your balance issues.”
- @ruze84b14_ESO4 -
mharris97_ESOSoul Shrivenkirnmalidus wrote: »This is basically the build I've used to get through (almost) all of the faction vet content solo. It is quite effective.
Agreed, while its not the fastest killing skill bar. a variation of this has given me the survivability to get through Vet content.1 -
luvtekeSoul ShrivenI have been playing NB also since the dawn of the elder scrolls online, and have always been burst dps, stam build, no defence, always having to count on dodge and rolls and Magnum shot lifesaver that skill is, and curious to what pieces you have swapped out for heavy, and glyphs and such.0
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Kimbyungmo✭✭Jejus.. this is terrible guide
Degeneration??? do you seriously believe its good skill? I say LOL
And use veiled blade rather than soul tether. its 100x better4 -
dragnier✭✭✭I have to say that this build is OK, but not great. Debilitate does more damage than Degeneration and slows the enemy weapon swings. With all the other health regen in this build, Degeneration is a bit overkill.
Outside of that, it is actually a workable build for questing, soloing, and possibly pvp. That is, if you don't mind doing less damage.
As for dungeons and trials, this build just doesn't cut it. If everyone had the lower dps for higher "survivability" this build advertises, nothing in trials would die and dungeons would take forever. I would love for this kind of build to be competitive in trials and dungeons, but it just isn't there yet.
Yes, people complete trials and dungeons with stamina and hybrid builds. Yes, they do decent dps sometimes. However, current state of the game doesn't allow them to be on par with magicka builds.
No matter how much ZoS and players who stick to stamina/hybrid builds sell those builds, they just aren't as effective as they should be yet. Which makes them not worth playing because you simply can't get the same enjoyment out of them.
I personally can't force myself to play something that doesn't perform at peak efficiency. It makes me feel like I'm letting my group members down. If I can change my build to do more damage, healing, tanking, or whatever it is I'm supposed to be doing, I'll research until I find it and make the change.
So far, I haven't found any stamina or hybrid build that out performs a pure caster build on NB for dps in trials or dungeons, which are my main focus. That isn't for lack of trying though. I've tested several builds that I thought might work, but they just don't have the same strength.4 -
kirnmalidus✭✭✭✭I have been playing NB also since the dawn of the elder scrolls online, and have always been burst dps, stam build, no defence, always having to count on dodge and rolls and Magnum shot lifesaver that skill is, and curious to what pieces you have swapped out for heavy, and glyphs and such.
Well with DW you can use sparks for an auto-win button against solo melee bosses.
I never used Entropy, but I bought it and started leveling it last night.
I use the Silver Shards skill from FG a lot, last night I combined that with basic bow attack kiting to take down a VR10 world boss solo in Bangkorai. The best defense for a nightblade in this game is an offense that keeps the enemy stunned/knocked down and unable to use their special attacks.Life of a Nightblade (Screenshot Tumblr)
“Attention Zenimax: Stamina builds don't hold up to magicka builds, and this is causing most of your class imbalance. It makes melee weapons and bows weaker than staves and class abilities. It makes medium and heavy armor less desirable than light armor. Fix this imbalance, and you'll address most of your balance issues.”
- @ruze84b14_ESO1 -
kirnmalidus✭✭✭✭Kimbyungmo wrote: »Jejus.. this is terrible guide
Degeneration??? do you seriously believe its good skill? I say LOL
And use veiled blade rather than soul tether. its 100x better
I'd agree that Veil of Blades is a better ultimate in PvP, but Soul Tether is pretty darn awesome as an ultimate in PvE. For Nightblades, it is (I think) our best AoE crowd control skill. If I have it up I am fearless about charging a pack of mobs.Life of a Nightblade (Screenshot Tumblr)
“Attention Zenimax: Stamina builds don't hold up to magicka builds, and this is causing most of your class imbalance. It makes melee weapons and bows weaker than staves and class abilities. It makes medium and heavy armor less desirable than light armor. Fix this imbalance, and you'll address most of your balance issues.”
- @ruze84b14_ESO2 -
kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Grats, with this build you will kill mobs (and maybe players if you are lucky) in about 3x the time that DK/Templars will and 10x the time of a sorc.3
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kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I have to say that this build is OK, but not great. Debilitate does more damage than Degeneration and slows the enemy weapon swings. With all the other health regen in this build, Degeneration is a bit overkill.
Outside of that, it is actually a workable build for questing, soloing, and possibly pvp. That is, if you don't mind doing less damage.
As for dungeons and trials, this build just doesn't cut it. If everyone had the lower dps for higher "survivability" this build advertises, nothing in trials would die and dungeons would take forever. I would love for this kind of build to be competitive in trials and dungeons, but it just isn't there yet.
Yes, people complete trials and dungeons with stamina and hybrid builds. Yes, they do decent dps sometimes. However, current state of the game doesn't allow them to be on par with magicka builds.
No matter how much ZoS and players who stick to stamina/hybrid builds sell those builds, they just aren't as effective as they should be yet. Which makes them not worth playing because you simply can't get the same enjoyment out of them.
I personally can't force myself to play something that doesn't perform at peak efficiency. It makes me feel like I'm letting my group members down. If I can change my build to do more damage, healing, tanking, or whatever it is I'm supposed to be doing, I'll research until I find it and make the change.
So far, I haven't found any stamina or hybrid build that out performs a pure caster build on NB for dps in trials or dungeons, which are my main focus. That isn't for lack of trying though. I've tested several builds that I thought might work, but they just don't have the same strength.
^ This. If you plan on being any sort of "serious" build in this game you must go full caster/magick/heavy/light. All this build proves is that the game is so easy you can flail around and still succeed.2 -
kirnmalidus✭✭✭✭kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »Grats, with this build you will kill mobs (and maybe players if you are lucky) in about 3x the time that DK/Templars will and 10x the time of a sorc.
Ok. But we don't all want to play DKs and Sorcs. I realize that for the min/max crowd the idea of playing a class like a Nightblade is an anathema, but for the rest of us that like the archetype we'd rather enjoy playing the class we want to play and be underpowered than be forced into an archetype we don't like.Life of a Nightblade (Screenshot Tumblr)
“Attention Zenimax: Stamina builds don't hold up to magicka builds, and this is causing most of your class imbalance. It makes melee weapons and bows weaker than staves and class abilities. It makes medium and heavy armor less desirable than light armor. Fix this imbalance, and you'll address most of your balance issues.”
- @ruze84b14_ESO6 -
Kvothe✭✭Nice build Kirnmalidus you've obviously put a lot of thought into creating one that matches your style of play. While it has some things in common with mine it is different enough to make me consider what difference the differences might make
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It's too bad there are those who feel obligated to criticize others for not following the cookie cutter mold and making it work. But only speaking for myself, I find it that much more rewarding in part because of that criticism. What can I say, I'm a rogue at heart and that's why I picked a Nightblade. Not to play a sorc.4 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think it's really cool that you guys are doing these features on various builds folks use... But do you think the editors and/or dev team could read through these and make notations here and there about things which appear uncertain. For instance (from the article):
"Strife (Swallow Soul): I think it's pretty obvious why I use this: it gives me HP back for the damage I deal, so as long as I keep fighting, I'll survive. That's a nice thought when fighting a boss. It also pumps up the healing I receive. This is always nice, and I secretly hope this works with my other heal over time abilities, but I'm not sure about that. Oh, I almost forgot—I also use this to deal damage from a distance when I don't feel like getting my bow."
Emphasis mine.
Would it be too hard for the Dev team to drop in like a little editor's note to say whether it does or does not? I mean, you've basically got a build guide here on your official page where the author is saying, "I'm not totally sure if this works or not."
I'd think some clarity would be in order before you guys make it a feature."As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?2 -
MonkeyAssassin24✭✭✭Solid idea with the build but could be improved without changing the overall feel. Degeneration is a nifty skill to add extra heals but as others have said there is already enough life-gain with this build that it's not really worth a precious spot on the skill bar (especially if you add the magic dmg+life gain enchant on your weapons). If you added Suprise Attack (or the other morph) from the Shadow tree it will give you a very good damage ability to spam with Leeching Strikes up.
Also I love using Soul Tether on my bow bar as well for a nifty lifesteal+ aoe stun as well as an ally synergy, but Veil of Blades is simply so damn awesome when you are going toe-to-toe in melee range on your dw bar. Great offensive/defensive ultimate with yet another ally synergy.
Still a fun setup though, I had the exact same thought when I looked at the nightblade class...a life-stealing assassin
On second thought, let's not go to the forums. 'Tis a silly place.1 -
Xexpo✭✭✭✭✭Wow, the guy was just sharing his build. He didn't say it was the best, which he is probably damn well aware of.
EVERYONE knows the op faceroll fotgame builds, no one is debating skirt jerkin and stick.
Why are you guys jumping all over him?Kiki Dickson ~~~ Dixmanian Devil ~~~ Cornelius Buckshank Jr.
Histy-Fitz ~~~ Boozemer ~~~ Chace X'expo
Lluvia De'Fuego ~~~ Shakes Spear
Macro and Cheese NA/PC1 -
RatsnevE✭✭✭It's still a better NB build then I could put together myself. Thanks for that.Edited by RatsnevE on 18 July 2014 16:311 -
RatsnevE✭✭✭Will ZOS or Elusid be updating/maintaining this build in this thread as needed or elsewhere?
I cannot locate Elusid or Daan Schreuder?
I would hesitate to make any changes unless ZOS or the original creator of the build deems a change appropriate. There is always argument going on about this or that with any build--especially when the hardcore go hybrid and in this case ZOS lets them.Edited by RatsnevE on 12 July 2014 20:400 -
RatsnevE✭✭✭I have been wondering why ZOS would feature a NB build when it seems to be the weakest class one could build. Then it dawned on me that that might be why--to show an effective NB build was possible. Good job. This build has turned the game around for me so far and I'm now VR-2 almost finishing Deshaan.
It looks like I'll have to get updates on this build directly from ZOS.
Edited by RatsnevE on 20 July 2014 06:170 -
fafnircorrinoSoul ShrivenThanks for posting this, there aren't enough NB builds for a lot of people to go off of. I use a similar type, only using medium armor for better stamina and crits. I think the problem a lot of people have is the while playing as a NB, it requires a greater amount of forethought and strategy, using shadowy disguise backstabs, long range shots and health siphoning. It's rare that a NB can charge into anything, so people who want to play a normal hack and slash will obviously see the NB as weak, as well would people who want to summon creatures and do massive area attacks. However, a group of four NBs is pretty devastating. A good tactic I have used in pvp, is to sneak around behind an enemy line with a couple of NBs and use coordinated teleport strikes, followed by shadowy disguise and concealed weapon hits, sneak out, then strike again. Works especially well on groups of healers and archers, you can annihilate them easily by using teleport strikes, it just requires a little strategy and finesse. The Reaper's Mark is especially useful in this regard, as you can mark someone and take them out in 4 or 5 hits. I found this guide to be pretty useful as well for NB builds forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/62384/class-guide-in-depth-nightblade-class-guide/p1. If anything, it provides a strong basis to draw from.0 -
GreenElusidSoul ShrivenI have to say that this build is OK, but not great. Debilitate does more damage than Degeneration and slows the enemy weapon swings. With all the other health regen in this build, Degeneration is a bit overkill.
Outside of that, it is actually a workable build for questing, soloing, and possibly pvp. That is, if you don't mind doing less damage.
As for dungeons and trials, this build just doesn't cut it. If everyone had the lower dps for higher "survivability" this build advertises, nothing in trials would die and dungeons would take forever. I would love for this kind of build to be competitive in trials and dungeons, but it just isn't there yet.
Yes, people complete trials and dungeons with stamina and hybrid builds. Yes, they do decent dps sometimes. However, current state of the game doesn't allow them to be on par with magicka builds.
No matter how much ZoS and players who stick to stamina/hybrid builds sell those builds, they just aren't as effective as they should be yet. Which makes them not worth playing because you simply can't get the same enjoyment out of them.
I personally can't force myself to play something that doesn't perform at peak efficiency. It makes me feel like I'm letting my group members down. If I can change my build to do more damage, healing, tanking, or whatever it is I'm supposed to be doing, I'll research until I find it and make the change.
So far, I haven't found any stamina or hybrid build that out performs a pure caster build on NB for dps in trials or dungeons, which are my main focus. That isn't for lack of trying though. I've tested several builds that I thought might work, but they just don't have the same strength.
My build is indeed intended to be a PvE solo build.
It works fine in pvp, but there are way better pvp nightblade builds.
Right now i'm working on more of a PvP build with the same character.
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GreenElusidSoul Shrivenfafnircorrino wrote: »Thanks for posting this, there aren't enough NB builds for a lot of people to go off of. I use a similar type, only using medium armor for better stamina and crits. I think the problem a lot of people have is the while playing as a NB, it requires a greater amount of forethought and strategy, using shadowy disguise backstabs, long range shots and health siphoning. It's rare that a NB can charge into anything, so people who want to play a normal hack and slash will obviously see the NB as weak, as well would people who want to summon creatures and do massive area attacks. However, a group of four NBs is pretty devastating. A good tactic I have used in pvp, is to sneak around behind an enemy line with a couple of NBs and use coordinated teleport strikes, followed by shadowy disguise and concealed weapon hits, sneak out, then strike again. Works especially well on groups of healers and archers, you can annihilate them easily by using teleport strikes, it just requires a little strategy and finesse. The Reaper's Mark is especially useful in this regard, as you can mark someone and take them out in 4 or 5 hits. I found this guide to be pretty useful as well for NB builds forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/62384/class-guide-in-depth-nightblade-class-guide/p1. If anything, it provides a strong basis to draw from.
I agree, nightblade is i think the hardest class to play, i heard nightblade is getting buffed soon so i hope that will fix it. Right now i'm working on a more PvP oriented build with lots of dammage and still nice survivabillity. Works pretty wel so far.
I might send my new build to Bethesda, but it's not finnished yet.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback!
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GreenElusidSoul ShrivenRight now i'm working on a build which does way more dammage and still has great survivabillity, i might send that build to bethesda too, but i doubt they'll show 2 of my builds. If anyone really wants to know this build i'll send you a link so you can see.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback everyone!
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GreenElusidSoul ShrivenI have been wondering why ZOS would feature a NB build when it seems to be the weakest class one could build. Then it dawned on me that that might be why--to show an effective NB build was possible. Good job. This build has turned the game around for me so far and I'm now VR-2 almost finishing Deshaan.
It looks like I'll have to get updates on this build directly from ZOS.
Good to hear! i'm glad i could help 0 -
GreenElusidSoul ShrivenWill ZOS or Elusid be updating/maintaining this build in this thread as needed or elsewhere?
I cannot locate Elusid or Daan Schreuder?
I would hesitate to make any changes unless ZOS or the original creator of the build deems a change appropriate. There is always argument going on about this or that with any build--especially when the hardcore go hybrid and in this case ZOS lets them.
My account name is GreenElusid and my character name is just Elusid, that's why you couldn't find me
, i am sort of maintaining this build by making it do way more dammage while keeping his survivabillity, if you're interested i can send you a link so you can see this new build
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RatsnevE✭✭✭
Please send me the link! Thanks. You should consider this thread your thread to support your Blood Rogue build and improve on it. I have not taken anyone's suggestions here yet--waiting for ZOS or for you to make improvements. I started in AD and am now VR-3 in EP over half way through. I am playing solo drops only with all alchemy skills capped for 3 x attributes and invisibility potions. And lots of soul gems to solo through some encounters and dungeons if others are not around to help.GreenElusid wrote: »Right now i'm working on a build which does way more dammage and still has great survivabillity, i might send that build to bethesda too, but i doubt they'll show 2 of my builds. If anyone really wants to know this build i'll send you a link so you can see.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback everyone!
During many battles with others helping it often seems to me that the other classes are OP. When I'm soloing a battle of 2 or 3 it is critical to get in a sneak attack or first hit on the staff first and take them out first. If the mob is 3 then I often need Soul Tether and a potion. Four or more are impossible where I can use an Invisibility potion to sneak past. Full blown boss battles are quite impossible for me to solo. So far I am very glad I am not repeating the 'forced solo only boss battles' of AD. I hope to finish EP and all of DC but this could depend on my solo survivor-ability and I will have to put another $15 into the coffin--er coffer.
Two other things as a result of solo, self find, crafting only alchemy, and no need for a horse or pack and bank capacity greater then 90 items in each is I have 115,000 gold accrued and around 10 skill points unassigned from my last respecting at the end of AD before kiting Molag Bal. My DW and Bow skill lines are exactly as you have laid them out for your Blood Rogue.
And a final third thing is I have been using the Boon: The Lover exclusively--never changing it once throughout the entire game. I do not enjoy and in fact have refused applying hardcore die-hard strategy to the game. Unless I simply end up with a NB build needed in PvP I don't expect to see that aspect of this game but once or twice by misfortune.Edited by RatsnevE on 24 July 2014 18:560 -
GreenElusidSoul ShrivenWow, the guy was just sharing his build. He didn't say it was the best, which he is probably damn well aware of.
EVERYONE knows the op faceroll fotgame builds, no one is debating skirt jerkin and stick.
Why are you guys jumping all over him?
Thanks for helping me out here,
this build i
Please send me the link! Thanks. You should consider this thread your thread to support your Blood Rogue build and improve on it. I have not taken anyone's suggestions here yet--waiting for ZOS or for you to make improvements. I started in AD and am now VR-3 in EP over half way through. I am playing solo drops only with all alchemy skills capped for 3 x attributes and invisibility potions. And lots of soul gems to solo through some encounters and dungeons if others are not around to help.GreenElusid wrote: »Right now i'm working on a build which does way more dammage and still has great survivabillity, i might send that build to bethesda too, but i doubt they'll show 2 of my builds. If anyone really wants to know this build i'll send you a link so you can see.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback everyone!
During many battles with others helping it often seems to me that the other classes are OP. When I'm soloing a battle of 2 or 3 it is critical to get in a sneak attack or first hit on the staff first and take them out first. If the mob is 3 then I often need Soul Tether and a potion. Four or more are impossible where I can use an Invisibility potion to sneak past. Full blown boss battles are quite impossible for me to solo. So far I am very glad I am not repeating the 'forced solo only boss battles' of AD. I hope to finish EP and all of DC but this could depend on my solo survivor-ability and I will have to put another $15 into the coffin--er coffer.
Two other things as a result of solo, self find, crafting only alchemy, and no need for a horse or pack and bank capacity greater then 90 items in each is I have 115,000 gold accrued and around 10 skill points unassigned from my last respecting at the end of AD before kiting Molag Bal. My DW and Bow skill lines are exactly as you have laid them out for your Blood Rogue.
And a final third thing is I have been using the Boon: The Lover exclusively--never changing it once throughout the entire game. I do not enjoy and in fact have refused applying hardcore die-hard strategy to the game. Unless I simply end up with a NB build needed in PvP I don't expect to see that aspect of this game but once or twice by misfortune.
Ah my new build is right here:
http://esobuild.com/?MwbgbCCMCsIExwHQDNGOBayBcB2RAhkQQKaHEBG5x2C1R9Be5ZRrBOkicRt5YvLsgDGUOAE5IYACxVgwCQA5FBbtMXjFs9As3RYiRYeOqjq1WktogAA=
I had exactly the same problem, taking on 1 big tough enemy was no problem, but taking on 3 weaker ones was hard most of the time.
Nightblade really has some problems with group fights while the other classes just sweep right through them. However, with this build i never had any problems with anything, it works great in PvE, bosses are no problem and multiple targets are as easy as ever. I still need to test some more in PvP but it works great so far.
This build has the attack power, the healing factor, and with a buff (which has technically infinite uses in this build) i also gain huge bulk.
Before i enter combat i always use mutagen for nice regeneration, then i use unstopable to get lots of defenses. Then i go to my dual wielding bar, use Shadowy disguise for sneak and 100% crit bonus. first attack i use is suprise attack, If it's just a regular enemy his hp will drop down to like 20% which is huge, then i can easily finnish them with Killer's blade.
If it's a group i just continue to use shadowy disguise and suprise attack to land as much dammage as possible, when i have magicka/health/stamina shortage i go to my healing staff and leeching strikes to drain the enemy untill i have enough to go back to full dps. Although, regular enemies don't even get through the first dps fase. For this build you'll need alot of magicka because almost all abillities use it. Except unstopable. I also use 4 light armor and 3 heavy armor for magicka bonuses and still a little more bulk.
And if you want to become really bulky with this build you should use shadowy disguise and while in stealth use unstopable. A shadow passive named shadow barrier gives you a huge defense boost which together with unstopable make you... well unstopable. I often hit like 2800 defense and spell defense, which paired with nice healing, nice dammage and nice utillity make for a really deadly combination. Atleas, that's what it is like for now. I probably missed some mistakes in my build and some weaknesses but so be it for now
I hope this will help you!
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GreenElusidSoul ShrivenKimbyungmo wrote: »Jejus.. this is terrible guide
Degeneration??? do you seriously believe its good skill? I say LOL
And use veiled blade rather than soul tether. its 100x better
whatever floats your boat, it's certainly not the best build out there in the big wide world, but it worked for me so far.
0