Templar Biting Jabs is OP !!!

Alphashado

I don't mind that it will cost more magicka. Within reason of course. I just want things to feel smooth again. Using BJ at all post patch felt like driving a car with 4 flat tires.

Dimar

Kreager wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom admin
May 23 Staff Post
Thank you all for your patience as we tracked this one down. We have an answer for you.

In patch 1.1.2, we increased the internal cooldown of Biting Jabs from 0.5 seconds to 1.2 seconds. Unfortunately, this change was not documented in the patch notes. This was not intended, and we do apologize.

This change was made to balance the ability's high single target damage. However we have been reading your feedback, and agree that the ability feels too unresponsive now. We will be reverting this change for the next patch (as soon as possible), and instead will slightly increase the ability's resource cost.

Let's see if I got this right, your going to give back the timing, but your going to raise the magicka cost? Hmmm, guess that means instead of being out if magicka 30 sec into the fight, we'll be out 10 seconds into the and have to rely on our ubber dps from swinging a one hand weapon. Gee thanks! Biting jabs may have done a little too much single target dps, but if it's the only DPS you can do, well maybe there's another problem to fix first. Like figuring out how a sword and board templar is going to kill anything at all.

Sakiri

Kreager wrote: »

I believe the cool down was intended not the issue of not being able to do anything for 1.5 seconds after the cast. The total lock out is a bug and it is the only reason they are changing it. A GCD should not affect other skills

Thats... the very definition of GLOBAL cooldown... to affect EVERYTHING.

WoW has a gcd. This game has an ability reuse timer.

tylarthb16_ESO

If the single target damage is the issue then alter the +100% damage bonus on nearest target. Is seems most expedient fix to have too high a single target dps. That's assuming the rational given is true and not an excuse for a stealth anti-bot measure, like the looting distance change.

Dimar

If all this crap is a result of Zenimax trying to deal with farmers, then put things back the way they were, there's a simpler method. Hire 6 people to play the game 24/7. All they need to do is go from instance to instance. You'll see a dozen players standing at a boss mob spawn point, as soon as the mob spawns they kill it and go right back to just standing there, amazingly you've just located a farmer and his bots. Bane the account, your done.
You can run from one instance to the next, see a train of a dozen or so players moving as one, guess what? You've found another farmer and his bots, bane the account and you done. Do this for a couple of weeks and you've shut down the farmers. The in a week or two, do it again. LEAVE THE REST OF US ALONE! Paying some kids to play the game is cheaper than losing half your market to nerfs.

Mortosk

Arsenic_Touch wrote: »

Kreager wrote: »

This was a bug and they are looking into it

Actually, it was an intended change.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Thank you all for your patience as we tracked this one down. We have an answer for you.

In patch 1.1.2, we increased the internal cooldown of Biting Jabs from 0.5 seconds to 1.2 seconds. Unfortunately, this change was not documented in the patch notes. This was not intended, and we do apologize.

This change was made to balance the ability's high single target damage. However we have been reading your feedback, and agree that the ability feels too unresponsive now. We will be reverting this change for the next patch (as soon as possible), and instead will slightly increase the ability's resource cost.

An intended change that not a single dev or tester decided to test, because there is no way in hell they would have let it go live had they tested it.

I'd rather level up provisioning to 50 on all my bank mules than play my Templar right now. That's how bad this change was. Not to mention the fact that the VR zones have been over tuned "unintentionally". Again, something that was not tested at all I suppose.

So that's exactly what I've been doing for the past 2 days--leveling provisioning on my bank mules. The bags, crates, and produce don't 1 shot me, and I don't have to wait 2.5 seconds to click on the next crate. Yay.

Hope they have biting jabs reverted by the time my sub renews, or I have some hard choices to make about my future and this game.

Mortosk

Azphira wrote: »

Nerf this, nerf that. No one ever asks to be buffed. Is it because watching someone else suffer feels better than seeing yourself get improved? No wonder this game, and the world for that matter, is a mess. It's full of sadists.

It's a much better approach to buff all the other abilities up instead of nerfing 1 ability down. There's 2 ways to balance something. Dev's always go for the lazy way.

dodgehopper_ESO

The way I see it, if you nerf my biting jabs, I want to get a couple good tanking morphs from the Restoring Light line if they nerf this. Lets also not forget that most of the other classes have better passives too. Templar is good, but its not without its downsides. Why nerf what makes the Templar tank good?

randomriffyrocksprerb18_ESO

Tannakaobi wrote: »

randomriffyrocksprerb18_ESO wrote: »

I agree with the poster
Before the patch, it wasn't OP. It dealt high damage but the magicka cost were high. And its not that useful in PvP, i've tried it, players tend to dodge, block or jump out before I can finish my 4 hits. So don't nerf it , just teach the NPCs how to block...

Righto! Now find me another skill that you can spam 3 times in succession and everything in range is dead and still have enough mana to go and do the same to the next group of mobs.
As for PVP that's a person by person decision. You can move while using it though but because it's not great in PVP is exactly why no one has been asking for a nerf...

You just agreed that the ability is not useful in PvP, but too good in PvE. So the problem here isn't the ability itself, rather the situation, the enemies or AI, the context its being used in. Like I said before, just teach NPC's how to block or dodge...

If you nerf it because of PvE it would be even more useless in PvP...

Dimar

randomriffyrocksprerb18_ESO wrote: »

Tannakaobi wrote: »

randomriffyrocksprerb18_ESO wrote: »

I agree with the poster
Before the patch, it wasn't OP. It dealt high damage but the magicka cost were high. And its not that useful in PvP, i've tried it, players tend to dodge, block or jump out before I can finish my 4 hits. So don't nerf it , just teach the NPCs how to block...

Righto! Now find me another skill that you can spam 3 times in succession and everything in range is dead and still have enough mana to go and do the same to the next group of mobs.
As for PVP that's a person by person decision. You can move while using it though but because it's not great in PVP is exactly why no one has been asking for a nerf...

You just agreed that the ability is not useful in PvP, but too good in PvE. So the problem here isn't the ability itself, rather the situation, the enemies or AI, the context its being used in. Like I said before, just teach NPC's how to block or dodge...

If you nerf it because of PvE it would be even more useless in PvP...

Looks like neither of you is a Templar. You spam BJ three times and the mobs aren't dead, but you are completely out of Magicka and running and dodging until you can regen some or more often than we'd like waiting to respawn at the nearest wayshrine. Yes it is a highdamage single target skill. The point is, it's the only high damage skill Templars have, so unless you want to be a priest healer, following some group around sponging off them for xp, then you may as well play something else.

kaijikanb16_ESO

In patch 1.1.2, we increased the internal cooldown of Biting Jabs from 0.5 seconds to 1.2 seconds. Unfortunately, this change was not documented in the patch notes. *This was not intended, and we do apologize.*

This change was made to balance the ability's high single target damage. However we have been reading your feedback, and agree that the ability feels too unresponsive now. We will be reverting this change for the next patch (as soon as possible), and instead will slightly increase the ability's resource cost."

I thought the whole point of this game was it wasn't a WoW cool down rotation system, but resource pool availability. The penalty for using this ability is it's already seep mana costs, necessitating you keep the mobs grouped other wise you can end up out of magica, which already happens very fast with this ability. Particularly when fighting archer and caster groups.

TRIP233

RoCoL wrote: »

Azphira wrote: »

Nerf this, nerf that. No one ever asks to be buffed. Is it because watching someone else suffer feels better than seeing yourself get improved? No wonder this game, and the world for that matter, is a mess. It's full of sadists.

Do folks engage their cognitive abilities before posting?

This post was to show the absurdity of the current nerf.

There are/were no cries to nerf this particular skill -yet they did-

There are thread after thread about particular skills being OP and this WAS NOT one of them, yet it got crushed, not nerfed, rendered unusable, absurd, clunky and broken to the point of creating an unplayable class

Now Templars know how it feels to be a Nightblade. -_- I'm a Vet 6 almost 7 Templar, I was a Nightblade in the beta. I didn't want to play a broken class again but zini is crule and has a bad sense of humor.

Zinmax, change it back and don't add a cost Increase for the skill either. I don't feel like making another character just yet.

TRIP233

Dimar wrote: »

If all this crap is a result of Zenimax trying to deal with farmers, then put things back the way they were, there's a simpler method. Hire 6 people to play the game 24/7. All they need to do is go from instance to instance. You'll see a dozen players standing at a boss mob spawn point, as soon as the mob spawns they kill it and go right back to just standing there, amazingly you've just located a farmer and his bots. Bane the account, your done.
You can run from one instance to the next, see a train of a dozen or so players moving as one, guess what? You've found another farmer and his bots, bane the account and you done. Do this for a couple of weeks and you've shut down the farmers. The in a week or two, do it again. LEAVE THE REST OF US ALONE! Paying some kids to play the game is cheaper than losing half your market to nerfs.

Not as simple as that. I do agree with you about the nerfs though: I don't like 'em.

Mortosk

Sakiri wrote: »

Kreager wrote: »

I believe the cool down was intended not the issue of not being able to do anything for 1.5 seconds after the cast. The total lock out is a bug and it is the only reason they are changing it. A GCD should not affect other skills

Thats... the very definition of GLOBAL cooldown... to affect EVERYTHING.

WoW has a gcd. This game has an ability reuse timer.

Always hated the GCD in WoW--Mashing keys or using keyboard macros that did it for me to get the highest DPS possible.

I can tell you that before, it did not seem like Biting Jabs even had an internal cooldown. I would have noticed that, and it's one of the reasons I liked the way the skill felt combat wise.

They are of course saying it used to be 0.5 seconds and they raised it to 1.2 seconds. But, there is obviously more going on here than 0.7 seconds added delay. It feels like more than twice that when you actually test it (something Zenimax didn't do obviously).

I'm concerned they changed something else in this patch, and they aren't telling us about it. We'll find out in the next patch if this is the case.

I think you will find the time it takes to chain cast them will still be increased in the next patch--even after they "revert" it and instead nerf the resource cost.

Mortosk

Kreager wrote: »

I believe the cool down was intended not the issue of not being able to do anything for 1.5 seconds after the cast. The total lock out is a bug and it is the only reason they are changing it. A GCD should not affect other skills

Think you meant an ICD should not effect other skills.